So in your opinion Jesus is revealing only human beings can be born again? That's a position I've never heard and surprised anyone would come to that conclusion. Sounds like grasping at straws.To us, if an entity is born with a human body, then born of water, meaning a human birth, seems superfluous. In God's world there are entities without bodies, with non-human bodies, and humans who have not been born yet.
Also, what you wrote in your post about both water and Spirit representing conditions for NT believers should read of NT believers.
I read somewhere that throwing the ashes of his bones into the river pictured something prophetic. In that, his life's work of translating God's word did not end with his death but actually flowed into all the nations to which his ashes were dispersed.Catholic Mistake #6
The RCC burned Wycliffe's bones
John Wycliffe was the most famous priest of his day. His learning was immense. He had been a leading scholar at Oxford and a chaplain to the king of England. More to the point, he spoke out boldly against the heirs of the popes, the organizational hierarchy of the RCC and the corruption of the clergy in his day. He argued for a return to the scriptures. If the people in England were to know the truth, Wycliffe reasoned that they must have the word of God in their own language. Under his direction, the bible was translated into English for the very first time. Copies of Wycliffe's bible were repeatedly condemned and burned by the RCC authorities. The RCC hated Wycliffe with such ferocity that 44 years after his death, they dug up his body, smashed it to pieces, burned his remains and threw the ashes into the swift river. What were his crimes? Preaching the bible? Translating the bible into English?
So in your opinion Jesus is revealing only human beings can be born again? That's a position I've never heard and surprised anyone would come to that conclusion. Sounds like grasping at straws.
As to your other comment, people are considered believers at the point of belief in Jesus. However, they must meet God's conditions in order to experience the NT rebirth. See Acts 2:36, at that point the people became NT believers in Jesus. However, it was only after meeting the conditions that they were added to the body of Christ. (Acts 2:37-42)
John 3: 5-6 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh: and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. What is obvious to most people from these two verses is that verse six explains verse 5. Verse 5 talks about the two types of birth: water and Spirit. Verse 6 explains the same two types of birth as flesh and Spirit. That is why born of water is taken to mean born of the flesh.
JESUS separates the two, in verse 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh: and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
So why is water taken to mean born of flesh?
Because when a baby is born fluid flows out of the womb.
Do you honesty think there is no relationship between the water and Spirit Jesus spoke of, and that all believers are commanded to submit to water baptism in the name of Jesus and promised the gift of the Holy Spirit?John 3: 5-6 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh: and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. What is obvious to most people from these two verses is that verse six explains verse 5. Verse 5 talks about the two types of birth: water and Spirit. Verse 6 explains the same two types of birth as flesh and Spirit. That is why born of water is taken to mean born of the flesh.
@decipher, Another Catholic Mistake should be added to the list: Removal of the name above all names; JesusCatholic Mistake #17
Repetitive Prayers
The rosary prayer also breaks the word of God by using vain repetitions. Matt 6: 7 But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do; for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking. But catholics will say that the rosary is not repetitive praying. Really? The repetition in the rosary is meant to lead one into restful and contemplative prayer. The gentle repetition? How many Hail Marys are there in a complete rosary prayer? It is repeated 53 times with only six Our Father prayers. It seems very strange that catholics are praying to Mary 9 times more than they are to God. Do catholics think that God is hard of hearing and can't hear the prayer the first time? The catholic prayers of vain repetition is not biblical and is another man-made tradition of the RCC.
Thank you for shining light on the history and doctrinal issues with the RCC. There is no doubt that many Catholics love the Lord Jesus. And those who do, when confronted with the truth are likely to re-evaluate whether to continue in man-made tradition or rely on the word of God to lead and guide them into all truth.Catholic Mistake #18
Mary is the Mediatrix and Co-Redemptrix
This is another one that catholics will deny and say that Mary's role as co-redeemer and mediatrix is not a formally defined dogma of the RCC. Really? It's right here in the catechism. 969 This motherhood of Mary in the order of grace continues uninterruptedly from the consent which she loyally gave at the Annunciation and which she sustained without wavering beneath the cross, until the eternal fulfillment of all the elect. Taken up to heaven she did not lay aside this saving office but by her manifold intercession continues to bring us the gifts of eternal salvation...Therefore the Blessed Virgin is invoked in the Church under the titles of Advocate, Helper, Benefactress, and Mediatrix. What's the definition of a mediatrix? A woman who is a mediator. And here is some more evidence that the catholics are of the opinion that Mary is the mediatrix of all graces is a title Roman catholics give to the blessed virgin Mary as the mother of God. It includes the understanding that she mediates the divine grace. This was given to us by pope Leo XIII in 1894. Catholic dictionary: mediatrix is a title of the blessed virgin as a mediator of grace. Fr. Dwight Longenecker in his article in the magazine Catholic Answers titled Mary, Mother of Salvation How to explain the Co-Redemptrix to Evangelicals 12/01/ 2007. How about don't explain it to us because it's a false teaching. The catholic magazine Catholic Planet describes Mary as co-redemptrix , mediatrix, and advocatrix. Catholicism.org May 31. 2000 titled Our Lady, Mediatrix of all graces says at he bottom of the page that God will not listen to any prayer that is not offered to him through the intercession of Mary. This leads us back to 1 Tim 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; Rom 8 : 34 Who is he that condemneth? Shall Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
Jesus " maketh intercession for us" by praying to the Father on our behalf. Are catholics trying to disobey the Bible on purpose? They are trying to put Mary on a pedestal to make her equal to Jesus. Mary being the mediatrix is a man-made tradition of the RCC that is found nowhere in the Bible.
Do you honesty think there is no relationship between the water and Spirit Jesus spoke of, and that all believers are commanded to submit to water baptism in the name of Jesus and promised the gift of the Holy Spirit?
"Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God" John 3:5
"...Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call." Acts 2:38-39
@decipher, Another Catholic Mistake should be added to the list: Removal of the name above all names; Jesus
The forerunners of the Roman Catholic Church instituted a man-made tradition concerning water baptism. Per Jesus' instruction, the apostles administered water baptism in the name of Jesus Christ.
HASTINGS ENCYCLOPEDIA OF RELIGION—Vol 2, pages 377, 378, 389. (Note: Justin Martyr was Catholic)
“The Christian baptism was administered using the name of Jesus. The use of the trinitarian formula of any sort was not suggested in the early Church history, Baptism was always in the Name of the Lord Jesus, until the time of Justin Martyr, when the trinity formula was used.
Volume 2, page 377, commenting on Acts 2:38, “Name was an ancient synonym for person. Payment was always made in the name of some person, referring to ownership, therefore, one being baptized in Jesus name became his personal property, (“Ye are Christ’s I Corinthians 3:23.)
HARPER’S BIBLE DICTIONARY—1952 Edition, page 60
“Though the trinitarian formula (Matthew 28:19) was a late addition by some reverent Christian mind, Christ did become the vital content of all Christian baptism after the resurrection (Acts 8:16, 10:48).”
CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA, VOLUME 8
“Justin Martyr was one of the early Fathers of the Roman Catholic Church who helped change the ancient baptism of “in the Name of Jesus Christ” to the titles of Father, Son and Holy Ghost”
“With regard to the form used for baptism in the early Church, there is the difficulty that although Matthew 28:19 seems to speaks of the Trinitarian formula which is now used, the Acts of the Apostles (2:38, 8:16, 10:48, 19:5) and Paul (I Corinthians 1:13, 6:11, Galatians 3:27, Romans 6:3) speak only of baptism “in the Name of Jesus.”
CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA, 1967 edition, volume 2, pages 56, 59.
“An explicit reference to the Trinitarian formula of baptism cannot be found in the first centuries.”
CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA, 1913 EDITION.
“There has been a theological controversy over the question as to whether baptism in the name of Christ only was ever held valid. Certain texts in the New Testament have given rise to this difficulty.
Thus St Paul (Acts 19 commands some disciples at Ephesus to be baptized in Christ’s Name: “they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.”
In Acts 10 we read that St Peter ordered others to be baptized “in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ”. Those who were converted by Philip (Acts 8 “were baptized in the name of Jesus Christ”, and above all we have the explicit command of the Prince of the Apostles: “Be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of your sins.” (Acts 2:38)
THE INTERNATIONAL STANDARD BIBLE ENCYCLOPEDIA—Volume 1 pages 392, 393, 396.
“the formula of Christian baptism, in the mode which prevailed, is given in Matthew 28:19, ‘I baptize thee in the name of the Father, of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost’
But it is curious that the words are not given in any description of Christian baptism UNTIL THE TIME OF JUSTIN MARTYR; and there, they are not repeated exactly, but in a slightly extended and explanatory form.
In every account of the performance of the rite in Apostolic times a much shorter formula is in use.
The 3,000 believers were baptized on the Day of Pentecost “in the Name of Jesus” (Acts 2:38), and the same formula was used at the baptism of Cornelius and those that were with him (Acts 10:48).
Indeed it would appear to have been the usual one, from St Paul’s question to the Corinthians: “Were ye baptized into the name of Paul?” (I Corinthians 1:13).
The Samaritans were baptized “into the name of the Lord Jesus” (Acts 8:16); and the same formula was used in the case of the disciples at Ephesus. (Acts 19:1-5)
Others think that the full formula was always used and that narratives in the book of Acts and in the Pauline Epistles are merely brief summaries of what took place; an idea rather difficult to believe in the absence of any single reference to the longer formula.
The evidence to show that the formula given by St Matthew became the established usage is overwhelming; but it is more than likely that the use of the shorter formula did not altogether die out, or, if it did, that it was revived.
The historian Socrates informs us that some of the more extreme Arians “corrected” baptism by using the Name of Christ only in the formula. “The practice of using the shorter formula existed in the 5th. and 6th. Centuries, at all events in the East”
Page 396. “No record of such use can be discovered in the Acts of the Epistles of the Apostles. The baptisms recorded in the New Testament after the Day of Pentecost are administered “in the Name of Jesus Christ” (Acts 2:38), “into the name of the Lord Jesus”(8:16), “into Christ” (Romans 6:3, Galatians 3:27). This difficulty was considered by the Fathers.”
When the third chapter of the Book of John is taken in context it sheds much light. The account begins with Jesus explaining everyone must be born again. (side note, being born involves coming out of water) The account then continues to verse 16 where it says those who believe in Jesus SHOULD not perish, and concludes with Jesus traveling with His disciples as they administer water baptisms. I don't believe it is a coincidence that water baptism is brought up immediately after Jesus discussing the necessity of being reborn. Do you?How about quoting John 3:16, which is in the same chapter! Or is that against your religion?