🖐️🔥 Laying hands for healing today?

[know1]

Hmmmm....so, you lack love and discernment. I guess your response is righteous anger, and you are the arm of the Lord?
Perhaps, rather than acting so hostile, you might learn to receive correction. Jesus was meek and lowly of heart. Learn of Him.

Frankly, I am not interested and pacifying anyone's fickle and petty feelings, and that includes yours.
You can't argue your point scripturally, so you have to try to put somebody on the defensive by pretending to be offended, just so you could win an argument, and deflect at the same time.
I came on cc to argue my point with scripture, but you have to make it about your feelings.
Let's get back to what this all started out from. How could I say that I demand healing from God? And from your point, why it would be wrong. And to do so with scripture. That would be nice.

 

[Cameron143]

Frankly, I am not interested and pacifying anyone's fickle and petty feelings, and that includes yours.
You can't argue your point scripturally, so you have to try to put somebody on the defensive by pretending to be offended, just so you could win an argument, and deflect at the same time.
I came on cc to argue my point with scripture, but you have to make it about your feelings.
Let's get back to what this all started out from. How could I say that I demand healing from God? And from your point, why it would be wrong. And to do so with scripture. That would be nice.

I'm not offended. Just because you are offensive doesn't mean I have to take offense. If you believe God has helped you I think that's great. But God didn't help you because you demanded it of Him. God isn't beholden to anyone. It would have been an exercise of His grace, if, in fact, He did. In other words, He exercised grace in spite of your actions, and not because of them.

 

[Lamar]

I'm not confusing the 2 of you. I responded to his post, not yours. Then you started asking me questions, so I answered them.

My error. I got the order wrong. Should have paid better attention.

 

[tourist]

We are not in agreement and I reject your words.
I'm not the one who needs healing, but it is you who is in desperate need, because you're curse goes back on you, in the name of Jesus.
Only a witch or warlock, posing as a child of God, would say such a thing, knowing full well, I never said anything of the sort.
It is written, suffer not the witch to live.
And as is sent against me, the same return into the gut and bones of the sender, in the name of Jesus.
As sickness is sent against me, so the same return to the sender with power and authority. And as death was sent against me by another warlock, the same returned to him.
There's nothing good in a witch, as they cannot bless others, but only seek to steal, kill, and destroy the same, for as the spirit is in them, so are they.
So no amount of prayer and fasting will help you, who is the one in desperate need of healing.

Actually, I am still wondering about that idiotic post you wrote about the M&M's.
(Post # 177)

Very disrespectful. It was almost like you were on drugs at the time you wrote it. Absolutely made no sense whatsoever.

Curse me all that you want but know that God's angels protect me.

I really don't care what you think about me. Doesn't bother me at all.

Spiritually, your perceptions are way off the mark.

OK, we are done here. Time to move forward in my life and not waste my precious time responding to someone with hostile perceptions.

 

[know1]

I'm not offended. Just because you are offensive doesn't mean I have to take offense. If you believe God has helped you I think that's great. But God didn't help you because you demanded it of Him. God isn't beholden to anyone. It would have been an exercise of His grace, if, in fact, He did. In other words, He exercised grace in spite of your actions, and not because of them.

Okay, I understand where you're coming from, as I too used to believe that way, and I did not get any prayers answered. And the reason for that was because I didn't know what God was going to do.
I found out after, you can't have faith in God if you don't know what he's doing to do, due to uncertainties. One of them being, is it his will or not?
I too believe it is by God's grace that he answers my demands, but for different reasons than what you believe.
I ask, how can you have faith in God if you don't know what he's going to do, or what his will is?
Your faith therefore is reduced to nothing more than hoping, wishing, and wondering.
God will not answer those kind of prayers, because they are not of or in faith.
The other part of this has to do with the word of God, or more in particular, the promises of God.
It is written that everything created was done so by the word of God, as well as, we are born again by the same, and that the same said word is the power of God. It is also written that Jesus himself is the living word of God.
And again it is also written that we are to follow jesus's example, and one of the things he did was he spoke the word of God in faith to the problem.
Which is what I do.
So I'm not speaking to God demanding he do this or that, but to the situation, circumstance, or problem.
So in the sense that I send God's word at a particular problem, and since the word of God is God, actually it is an offspring of God, in that sense, I am telling God what to do.
So basically I'm just demanding the situation to line up with the word of God.
So if it's sickness, I speak to said sickness, commanding it to leave in the name of Jesus and line up with the word of God.
I do a lot more than that but that's the gist of it.

 

[know1]

Actually, I am still wondering about that idiotic post you wrote about the M&M's.
(Post # 177)

Very disrespectful. It was almost like you were on drugs at the time you wrote it. Absolutely made no sense whatsoever.

Curse me all that you want but know that God's angels protect me.

I really don't care what you think about me. Doesn't bother me at all.

Spiritually, your perceptions are way off the mark.

OK, we are done here. Time to move forward in my life and not waste my precious time responding to someone with hostile perceptions.

I don't curse anybody. If no curse was sent, then no curse will return. It's that simple.

 

[Cameron143]

Okay, I understand where you're coming from, as I too used to believe that way, and I did not get any prayers answered. And the reason for that was because I didn't know what God was going to do.
I found out after, you can't have faith in God if you don't know what he's doing to do, due to uncertainties. One of them being, is it his will or not?
I too believe it is by God's grace that he answers my demands, but for different reasons than what you believe.
I ask, how can you have faith in God if you don't know what he's going to do, or what his will is?
Your faith therefore is reduced to nothing more than hoping, wishing, and wondering.
God will not answer those kind of prayers, because they are not of or in faith.
The other part of this has to do with the word of God, or more in particular, the promises of God.
It is written that everything created was done so by the word of God, as well as, we are born again by the same, and that the same said word is the power of God. It is also written that Jesus himself is the living word of God.
And again it is also written that we are to follow jesus's example, and one of the things he did was he spoke the word of God in faith to the problem.
Which is what I do.
So I'm not speaking to God demanding he do this or that, but to the situation, circumstance, or problem.
So in the sense that I send God's word at a particular problem, and since the word of God is God, actually it is an offspring of God, in that sense, I am telling God what to do.
So basically I'm just demanding the situation to line up with the word of God.
So if it's sickness, I speak to said sickness, commanding it to leave in the name of Jesus and line up with the word of God.
I do a lot more than that but that's the gist of it.

I'm not saying Christians shouldn't appeal to God for help and to bring about His promises. I believe we ask to little of God, not too much. Moses pleaded with God for the people based on the character of God. But God responds to His people who exercise faith in His promises, His character, and His actions.
A good example of what I'm referring to is found in 2 Chronicles 20. A number of armies are coming against God's people, and Jehosaphat gathers the people and makes an appeal to God. He basically asks God 3 questions:
...are You not...
...have You not...
...will You not...
His appeal to God was on the basis of God's character and promises. We all can likewise appeal to God in this manner. But none of us have the right or authority to demand anything of the Most High.

 

[tourist]

I don't curse anybody. If no curse was sent, then no curse will return. It's that simple.

It's all good. Let's go in peace now.

 

[Beckworth]

Hello.

I hear many Christians say that healing ended with the apostles.

I DISAGREE.

They say things like "but my pastor says..."

Or "They didn't teach that in my church", etc.

It just means that their pastor doesn't believe what he reads.

Truth is, the apostles healed the same way Jesus did...

BY THE SPIRIT OF GOD.

The Spirit now dwells in us, the believers.

That same Spirit works through us now.

I believe it.

I've done it.

I've seen pain go, sprains heal, devils leave, bones mend, peace come, etc. from laying hands on others.

Do I see 100% recovered?

NO.

I'm still learning and building my own faith.

I want to know your thoughts and hear about your experiences if you are doing this yourself.

It's time the believers believed.

If you don't lay hands, or don't believe you are able to heal others today, please post and let me know why.

Let's discuss this.

I have already thoroughly discussed this on another post called “How the New Testament church worshiped.” But I will be happy to go over it again.
The miraculous portion of the Holy Spirit was given by the apostles for a specific purpose. One reason is given in 1 Cor. 13:9. The Christians in the first century only had part of God’s revelation. They did not have the Bible written down so everyone could read it. That’s why Paul said we know “IN PART”. They did not have complete knowledge. The gift of miraculous knowledge and prophecy were essential in guiding the early Christian’s in all truth. 1 Cor. 13:10 says when THAT which is “perfect” comes then the miraculous spiritual gifts will CEASE. The word THAT is not referring to a person— that refers to a thing. If it was referring to a person he would have said , when HE WHO is “perfect” comes. He did not say that. Also. The Bible interpretes itself. Psalms 111:7 says the word of God is “perfect.” Roman’s 12:2 calls it the “perfect” will of God. James 1:25 calls it the “perfect” law of liberty.) so, in light of these scriptures, miraculous gifts were to last until the revelation from God was complete and in written form so everyone could know what God’s will was. If I remember correctly, they had the completed, written Bible by 150 AD.
The apostles could lay their hands on someone and give them the Holy Spirit but as far as we can tell FROM THE SCRIPTURES, people who got the Spirit from an apostle could not “pass it on” by giving it to others. That means when the last apostle died and the last person who received the Spirit from an apostle died— then Spiritual gifts “CEASED.”
Reason #2 for spiritual gifts was to CONFIRM THE WORD OF GOD. Mark 16:20 says that the apostles “ went out and preached everywhere, the Lord working with them, and CONFIRMING the word with accompanying signs.”
Hebrews 2:3-4 says that the word “ first began to be spoken by the Lord and was CONFIRMED to us….God bearing witness both with signs and wonders, with various miracles and gifts of the Holy Spirit…”
These were the purposes of spiritual gifts—speaking in tongues, healing and other miracles. We now have the completed word of God written down. There is no longer any need for miraculous knowledge. The word of God has already been CONFIRMED and it is written down so when we read about it we can know it is really from God. There is no need for more miracles to confirm the word. 1 Tim 3:16 tells us it is COMPLETE and furnishes us with ALL we need to be saved.
Spiritual gifts have ceased . We do not need them anymore. We have the completed , perfect word of God in written form.

One more thing. A miraculous baptism of the Holy Spirit was never used to SAVE people. A miraculous out pouring of the Spirit only happened twice in the New Testament. Once on the Jewish apostles in Acts 2. It was clearly used in getting the attention of the thousands of Jews there and CONFIRMED the things that the apostles said. The people listened and believed because of the miracles they saw and heard.
It happened again in Acts 10. It was poured out on the GENTILES. It was a “sign” to the Jews that God had granted salvation to the gentiles as well as the Jews. This is proven in Acts 11:1-18. Peter has to defend his actions concerning Cornelius to his Jewish brethren. But when they heard that God had baptized those gentiles with the Holy Spirit, just like He did the Jews in Acts 2, then they understood and were convinced by this “sign.”Cornelius and his house were not saved by the baptism of the Spirit—otherwise why would Peter COMMAND them to be baptized??
This just proves, again, that water baptism was NECESSARY for salvation.
But if that does not convince you then maybe Acts 8 will. In verse 5, Phillip went to Samaria and preached “Christ” to them. They believed the things Phillip preached (verse 6) and verse 12 says when they believed they were baptized both men and women. Notice how this harmonizes with Mark 16:16 where Jesus says, “ He that believes and is baptized shall be saved.” These people were saved, but they had not received a miraculous portion of the Holy Spirit. We know that because verse 15 tells us that they had not yet received the Spirit. Peter and John came to Samaria so that they could lay their hands on them and give them the Spirit. So they were saved without and before they received the Spirit. He Holy Spirit was not given to SAVE people according to The scriptures.

I have given you arguments FROM SCRIPTURE to prove what I believe about miraculous gifts— not from “my preacher, or my “parents, or what my church teaches—but as Paul did in Acts 17:2, reasoning from the scriptures.

 

[Prodigal]

There are those who say the right words....but have vastly different meanings behind those words.

Like "SERVANT"....
Who exactly is whose servant? Are these faith healers God's servants or does God work for them?

Since the time of signs and wonders is over....what purpose is healing today? Especially since modern medicine is available. (Just expensive)
For the comfort of slaves?
Especially ones that are unproductive and never will be?

God can and does as He wishes....but the miracles HE does these days get nowhere near a stage. Especially when propheteering is happening. "And for $40,000 you too can be healed"

I really can't believe you said that.
The purpose for healing is health.

Why go to the butchers, when you've got the Great Physician?

Here's some modern medicine for you.

https://slaynews.com/news/74-all-deaths-directly-linked-covid-shots-autopsy-data-shows/

 

[Lamar]

I hear many Christians say that healing ended with the apostles.

The miraculous ended when God said it was over. Just as God ended the miraculous years of manna.

Joshua 5:12
New International Version
The manna stopped the day after they ate this food from the land; there was no longer any manna for the Israelites, but that year they ate the produce of Canaan.

There was no warning that the manna was about to end, God just stopped it.

It would be foolish of the Hebrews to insist that it was still falling from heaven when it was clearly not.

Ideas like, "well we are just not looking in the right places or we don't have enough faith to see the manna would be childish.

The Hebrews were wise enough to see the forest for the trees.

Many Pentecostals today are too ashamed to admit that their emperor is naked. The others are too deep in the ditch to see it.

 

[Nehemiah6]

I hear many Christians say that healing ended with the apostles.

Not "healing" but human healers. Big difference. Divine healing never stopped. But is there a human healer in your church? If not then you already proved that there are none today. If so, present the evidence.

 

[Lee33]

I'm

The miraculous ended when God said it was over. Just as God ended the miraculous years of manna.

Joshua 5:12
New International Version
The manna stopped the day after they ate this food from the land; there was no longer any manna for the Israelites, but that year they ate the produce of Canaan.

There was no warning that the manna was about to end, God just stopped it.

It would be foolish of the Hebrews to insist that it was still falling from heaven when it was clearly not.

Ideas like, "well we are just not looking in the right places or we don't have enough faith to see the manna would be childish.

The Hebrews were wise enough to see the forest for the trees.

Many Pentecostals today are too ashamed to admit that their emperor is naked. The others are too deep in the ditch to see it.

I'm not sure of your point here. Do you believe healing and miracles ended because Manna did? I'm not Pentacostal. No denomination in fact. I don't go to a church (I do meet with brethren). I just read the bible and do what it says. Tell me what the manna given to the Israelites who would NOT see the promise land have to do with Believers in Christ? Has His Manna Stopped? Has His source of miracles (Our source of miracles) ceased? Of course not.

 

[Lee33]

Not "healing" but human healers. Big difference. Divine healing never stopped. But is there a human healer in your church? If not then you already proved that there are none today. If so, present the evidence.

Sir, I am healing others. Divine healing takes place through us. Sure, God can send angels, or heal by His presence, but He still uses His Disciples today also. You cannot say it ended when it still exists today. The same source of power that enabled Jesus and the disciples to heal others is available to us today. If you've been led astray by a pastor who doesn't believe, or if you yourself don't believe, then read the Gospels and Acts again. Believe what is written in there, brother.

 

[Lee33]

I have already thoroughly discussed this on another post called “How the New Testament church worshiped.” But I will be happy to go over it again.
The miraculous portion of the Holy Spirit was given by the apostles for a specific purpose. One reason is given in 1 Cor. 13:9. The Christians in the first century only had part of God’s revelation. They did not have the Bible written down so everyone could read it. That’s why Paul said we know “IN PART”. They did not have complete knowledge. The gift of miraculous knowledge and prophecy were essential in guiding the early Christian’s in all truth. 1 Cor. 13:10 says when THAT which is “perfect” comes then the miraculous spiritual gifts will CEASE. The word THAT is not referring to a person— that refers to a thing. If it was referring to a person he would have said , when HE WHO is “perfect” comes. He did not say that. Also. The Bible interpretes itself. Psalms 111:7 says the word of God is “perfect.” Roman’s 12:2 calls it the “perfect” will of God. James 1:25 calls it the “perfect” law of liberty.) so, in light of these scriptures, miraculous gifts were to last until the revelation from God was complete and in written form so everyone could know what God’s will was. If I remember correctly, they had the completed, written Bible by 150 AD.
The apostles could lay their hands on someone and give them the Holy Spirit but as far as we can tell FROM THE SCRIPTURES, people who got the Spirit from an apostle could not “pass it on” by giving it to others. That means when the last apostle died and the last person who received the Spirit from an apostle died— then Spiritual gifts “CEASED.”
Reason #2 for spiritual gifts was to CONFIRM THE WORD OF GOD. Mark 16:20 says that the apostles “ went out and preached everywhere, the Lord working with them, and CONFIRMING the word with accompanying signs.”
Hebrews 2:3-4 says that the word “ first began to be spoken by the Lord and was CONFIRMED to us….God bearing witness both with signs and wonders, with various miracles and gifts of the Holy Spirit…”
These were the purposes of spiritual gifts—speaking in tongues, healing and other miracles. We now have the completed word of God written down. There is no longer any need for miraculous knowledge. The word of God has already been CONFIRMED and it is written down so when we read about it we can know it is really from God. There is no need for more miracles to confirm the word. 1 Tim 3:16 tells us it is COMPLETE and furnishes us with ALL we need to be saved.
Spiritual gifts have ceased . We do not need them anymore. We have the completed , perfect word of God in written form.

One more thing. A miraculous baptism of the Holy Spirit was never used to SAVE people. A miraculous out pouring of the Spirit only happened twice in the New Testament. Once on the Jewish apostles in Acts 2. It was clearly used in getting the attention of the thousands of Jews there and CONFIRMED the things that the apostles said. The people listened and believed because of the miracles they saw and heard.
It happened again in Acts 10. It was poured out on the GENTILES. It was a “sign” to the Jews that God had granted salvation to the gentiles as well as the Jews. This is proven in Acts 11:1-18. Peter has to defend his actions concerning Cornelius to his Jewish brethren. But when they heard that God had baptized those gentiles with the Holy Spirit, just like He did the Jews in Acts 2, then they understood and were convinced by this “sign.”Cornelius and his house were not saved by the baptism of the Spirit—otherwise why would Peter COMMAND them to be baptized??
This just proves, again, that water baptism was NECESSARY for salvation.
But if that does not convince you then maybe Acts 8 will. In verse 5, Phillip went to Samaria and preached “Christ” to them. They believed the things Phillip preached (verse 6) and verse 12 says when they believed they were baptized both men and women. Notice how this harmonizes with Mark 16:16 where Jesus says, “ He that believes and is baptized shall be saved.” These people were saved, but they had not received a miraculous portion of the Holy Spirit. We know that because verse 15 tells us that they had not yet received the Spirit. Peter and John came to Samaria so that they could lay their hands on them and give them the Spirit. So they were saved without and before they received the Spirit. He Holy Spirit was not given to SAVE people according to The scriptures.

I have given you arguments FROM SCRIPTURE to prove what I believe about miraculous gifts— not from “my preacher, or my “parents, or what my church teaches—but as Paul did in Acts 17:2, reasoning from the scriptures.

I didn't even read all of this. It started out with Blah and ended with Blah, Blah. You sir have spent an awful lot of time trying to PROVE that healing isn't for today but I have been doing it for nearly a decade. It's not that I don't respect your opinion, but I will not read a long article telling me why something doesn't happen...ESPECIALLY WHEN I'M ALREADY DOING IT. I'm sorry it doesn't happen for you. That's because of your unbelief. Read the Gospels and Acts and try again brother.

 

[Lee33]

I have cerebral palsy but i told God if he wanted to use me to heal others to do it. I do however pray for others in private as moved though too.

He does want to use you. All disciples were given the command to Lay hands, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, and cast out devils. We all have the same Spirit of power in us and the authority of the blood and name of Jesus!

 

[Lamar]

I'm not sure of your point here. Do you believe healing and miracles ended because Manna did?

You read my comment and that's what you are confused by???

My point is very clear and you certainly know what the point of my comment was.

God decided that the miraculous was to end. We know that God ended the miraculous the same way the Hebrews knew that the manna ended. The Hebrews saw it end just as we today see that the physical supernatural manifestations of the Holy Spirit have ended.

Has His Manna Stopped? Has His source of miracles (Our source of miracles) ceased? Of course not.

These are simply weak dodges so as to not admit your emperor is naked.

Have the courage to accept that the Pentecostal narrative is a fallacy.

 

[Lamar]

Sir, I am healing others. Divine healing takes place through us. Sure, God can send angels, or heal by His presence, but He still uses His Disciples today also. You cannot say it ended when it still exists today. The same source of power that enabled Jesus and the disciples to heal others is available to us today. If you've been led astray by a pastor who doesn't believe, or if you yourself don't believe, then read the Gospels and Acts again. Believe what is written in there, brother.

You are lying. You do not have these powers or abilities. If you did, you would be doing them and certainly not telling us about how you can do them.

Falsely claiming that the Holy Spirit has given you supernatural talents is blasphemy.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Sir, I am healing others. Divine healing takes place through us.

Since no one other than you has made this claim on Christian Chat, why don't you ask someone you healed to post a summary about that healing directly on CC? And you may not try to influence them in any way. That person must honestly share the details, God being his witness.

"Divine healing" means that God directly heals without any human go-between. So it does not "take place through us". And He does heal in answer to prayers.

 

[Stokie]

I suffered from lower back pain for years. MRI scans revealed the damage but they were very reluctant to operate because of the risk of damaging other nerves in the process and me possibly ending up losing the use of my legs. Some days were manageable, some were a painful struggle but I continued working as much and as often as I could.
I’d had prayer but nothing changed for me and my battle wore on. My workmates all saw me in pain, they all saw my struggles and helped me whenever possible but I still had the pain and nothing helped.
One night my wife went to a ladies prayer meeting with a friend. She’d never been to that church as it was a bit out of our area. She sat and listened as the preacher that night announced that they would be praying for healing. My wife felt she should go forward on my behalf but was a little bit apprehensive. The preacher then said there was someone’s loved one at home that needed healing and to come forward if that’s you. Still she sat and watched others go. The guy leading the service said ‘ we are still waiting for someone else’ and she knew then it was her that needed to go forward. She’s not the kind of girl that puts herself forward and doesn’t like to be the centre of attention ever and so for the next minute she sat there, too apprehensive to go until a lady behind her who she’d never met tapped her on the shoulder to say ‘Gods waiting for you’. Before she knew what was happening she was at the front where they all prayed for my recovery.
She didn’t tell me anything when she returned but just watched as my pain lessened day by day. After a week or so I was moving pain free and she then told me what had happened.
So why wasn’t I healed earlier ? Well, at work the guys couldn’t believe it. I worked harder, faster and longer than them all and I’m the old guy of the bunch ! But that miracle they’ve seen has resulted in one of them and his family giving their hearts to Jesus and they are doing well on their Christian walk. The other often ask questions about my faith too. I believe my struggles and healing were a witness to them,
God heals in His time and in His way. Sometimes we can’t figure it out or understand why, maybe we never will in this lifetime but when Jesus takes us home all will be revealed 🙏🏻