GOD'S ULTIMATE PURPOSE FOR BELIEVERS

Previously I said: [For many years I heard the term “I am a forgiven sinner”, so that’s not poor grammar but poor beliefs on the part of many Christians.]

You said: Are you saying that Jesus did not die for our sins? Our sins are not forgiven?

So, either we are adopted sons of God and heirs of the kingdom with Jesus Christ, or we are wallowing in our misery trying not to sin. Which one is it?

"This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am chief." 1 Timothy 1:15

Paul had the same problem as he said that he does what he doesn't want to do and neglects to do what he should. He most likely was an adopted son of God nevertheless and an heir to the kingdom with Jesus Christ. Apparently, he was a forgiven sinner who had a struggle at times stumbling and falling, as we all do at times as well.

Paul was giving us an example of what his life used to be trying to please God through his own efforts.

Paul was giving us an example of what his life used to be trying to please God through his own efforts.

My goodness, I gave you scripture to prove what I'm saying, and you say I see God from a human perspective?

Yes, because calling God narcissistic if He does things for His glory totally misses the mark.

No, he wasnt. He was giving an honest description of his life as a christian, as encouragement and admonishment to the Roman church. It really is sime reading comprehension; if one dont try and shoe horn ones own theology and ideas into the text.

Read it again. He was speaking about two natures, the sinful nature of trying to please God and his failure to do so. You are reading into the text, or you have been taught wrongly. If Paul was what you say, then he was no example to us or no one else.

You see God from a human perspective. God is the sum total of His attributes, not just one.
While it is true that when people promote themselves they do so generally to the detriment of others. But this is not true of God. Our highest estate and when we are most satisfied is when God is most glorified.
Was it narcissistic when God told Abraham that He would be his reward?

I don;t think so. It looked like Paul had a bit of a guilt problem over occasionally committing a sin.

No, it was not narcissistic. God if fully aware that He is the best there is, and to give Himself is to give the best He can give! We benefit from realizing how ultimately good God is for us! We lose nothing when we give ourselves to Him.

Much love!

Ive read it many times. Note present tense through out the text. No past tenses used.
The only way that it becomes of "no example" is that you cant get passed your own thinking.

I don;t think so. It looked like Paul had a bit of a guilt problem over occasionally committing a sin.

Paul was like all of us and at times committed sins -- wrong acts and deeds -- in his flesh. Thus he was like all of us a "sinner" in the flesh.

But, it is also true that no sin will get into heaven. All the sins that we commit as believers are forgiven through the blood of Christ. Thus God no longer views us as sinners (at our spirit level), but as saints and as sons of God.

I think the author of this thread is trying to tell us that out mindset and understanding of God's view of us is critical to how we live in this world. If we think God views us simply as dull, half-witted, sinners then we will tend to live that way. If we realize God views us as His children then we will tend to live that way.

God's ultimate desire is to be one with Him in the beauty of holiness.

Paul is considered the greatest theologian and saint of all time, and you are trying to stick his face into the mud? Tell me what sins did Paul commit that is written in the scriptures?