Not By Works

I absolutely believe those who are saved were predestined before God began Creation. So yes, in that sense we were already going to accept God. But once we accept God, we must continue to Believe. And that part is on us. And to Believe is an action, therefore, it is a works. I saw some things in my life it caused me to Blame God and walk away. Had it not been for my Dad passing away and our final days talking, I had no intentions of ever trusting God or following God. But in those final moments, I made a declaration to God. It might have began simply so I could one day be with my Dad, but it eventually grew into my Love for God.

Now some would say, I was never saved to begin with. But that is pure Baloney!

From the age of 8 until 18, I had that childlike Faith and teachers would call my Grandfather into school because I was preaching they were lost and sinners and when Science began pushing evolution, I was the one who stood against that teaching. The School even decided to not have Science teach Evolution. So things were accomplished and I was sold out for God. But something happened and I left God for 20+ years.

I no doubt was Saved and I no doubt LEFT GOD because it is possible!
So I know that teaching I was never Saved is pure Horse Manure!

Our sins are forgiven, past, present and future. Our consequences from our sins are what we deal with while we are on earth.

Romans 5
12 Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned.

15 But the free gift is not like the trespass. For if many died through one man's trespass, much more have the grace of God and the free gift by the grace of that one man Jesus Christ abounded for many. 16 And the free gift is not like the result of that one man's sin.

18 Therefore, as one trespass led to condemnation for all men, so one act of righteousness leads to justification and life for fall men.

1 John 2:1-2 (KJV): "If any man sin, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous; and he is the propitiation for our sins."

Many Do, because the SAME errors in King James are found in every English Translated Bible.

You are saved according to some English Translation. I doubt you can read Hebrew/Yiddish/Aramaic/Ancient Greek!

My ancestors read the KJV because that was all they had. They did not study the "original language, syntax, etc". They were simple people who believed in the Word of God. I personally enjoy reading different versions side by side. The main point is that the Word of God in context is Truth.

Try running head first into a wall. Your Circular Logic is bent out of shape!

So you lost your salvation and now have it back?

Syntax and Parallel are still someone's opinion. Compare it to other similar versions and you find several differences.

Exactly!....you don’t even have the decency to apologise..when I posted scripture....you didn’t even acknowledge it....you just scrolled past it.

You have certainly lost my respect!....for what it’s worth!.

This statement does not explain the WHY one is saved. Specifically, you haven't shown here that faith is via FREE WILL or God's selecting whom would be saved.
John 6:44 No man comes unto me, except the Father which has sent me draw (1) to draw, drag off 2) metaph., to draw by inward power, lead, impel] him., he infers it to be an incontrovertible fact, that the hearts of believers are so effectually governed from above, that they follow with undeviating affection.

The Lord draws men by their own wills; wills, however, which he himself has produced - viz. that the grace offered by the Lord is not merely one which every individual has full liberty of choosing to receive or reject, but a grace which produces in the heart both choice and will: so that all the good works which follow after are its fruit and effect; the only will which yields obedience being the will which grace itself has made.

Arminians would say the Spirit's work of conviction is the same both in the converted and in unconverted, that which distinguishes the one class from the other is that the former yielded to His strivings whereas the latter resist them. But if this were the case then the Christian would have ground for boasting and self-glorying over his cooperation with the Spirit; but this would flatly contradict Ephesians 2:8 "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God."


The order of salvation is a logical order, not a chronological order. Perhaps that is the issue. I don't see this order being a deciding issue for either of us unless one can find scripture to backup the order. I believe I can do so as follows:
1 John 5:1 "Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ has been born [regenerated] of God" ...The verb tense make's John's intention unmistakable: Everyone who goes on believing [present, continuous action] that Jesus is the Christ has been born of God [perfect, completed action with abiding effects]. " Faith is the evidence of new birth, not the cause of it." “has been born” is a passive verb; they are caused to be born by another, that being God. Some Arminian exegetes might object to this interpretation. A means of testing the consistency of the exegesis offered of this passage would be to ask how such a person interprets these words: 1 John 2:29 If you know that he is righteous, you also know that everyone who practices righteousness has been fathered by him. Every consistent Protestant would say, “the reason one practices righteousness is because they have already been born of Him.

Shouldn't the verse read: Many are called, few are chosen chose (sorry, couldn't resist... minor cheap shot)

No need ... the examples were to ensure we have a common understanding of the FAITH aspect of salvation. I believe God changes our heart so we believe and you believe you are given a choice and that it is up to you to believe.

Aside1: I think you are a nice Christian guy with whom I disagree
Aside2: Despite your comment saying I do not answer your questions, I think I have done so for the most part.
Aside3: Our debate, in my opinion, has been civil .. thank you

Question:
Definition of work: activity involving mental or physical effort done in order to achieve a purpose or result.

Given: You believe that you of your own free will must believe (mental effort) to be saved (to achieve a result)
Question: How do you explain that you do NO WORK in order to be saved??????

Are you ok?....you sound rattled!

Living right for God through Christ in truth will ruin your Life. Which is why the scriptures say the following:

Matthew 16:25
[25] For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it.

Galatians 5:11
[11] ...why do I yet suffer persecution? then is the offence of the cross ceased.

2 Timothy 3:12
[12] Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.

Look at what happened to Paul; what ruined his life here on earth?

Galatians 4:16
[16] Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

I think I'm special, so I think because of this God chose me? Where have I taught this? Will you show me, or, will you stop falsely accusing?

My belief has always been that God chose me based on nothing good in me, 1 Corinthians 1:26-31, which I always quote, as unconditional election which is what I adhere to. (God chooses based on nothing good in us but only because of his purpose counsel, and will.) Also, that he died for the ungodly, Romans 5:8, which shows they are (I am) undeserving. This is grace, unmerited favor.

This is contrary to your belief that God chose you, because he saw you would choose him, which is merited favor, not grace. Grace is unmerited favor.

Because this is ridiculous, Biker.

They weren’t writers, they were translators.

I saw your quote regarding “the kings speech” and your conclusion was so bizarre and off the wall that I didn’t even bother to waste my time on it.

not to mention those aren't the Originals. 📖

^^^^ This is absurd.

I mean, where did you come up with this man!?

The Million Dollar Question:
Definition of work: activity involving mental or physical effort done in order to achieve a purpose or result.

Given: You believe that you of your own free will must believe (mental effort) to be saved (to achieve a result)
Question: How do you explain that you do NO WORK in order to be saved??????

... and that question is but one of many .... like ... how do you explain:

John 1:12 But to as many as did receive and welcome Him, He gave the right [the authority, the privilege] to become children of God[talking salvation here], that is, to those who believe in (adhere to, trust in, and rely on) His name— 13 who were born, not of blood [natural conception], nor of the will of the flesh [physical impulse], nor of the will of man [that of a natural father], but of God [that is, a divine and supernatural birth—they are born of God—spiritually transformed, renewed, sanctified].

John 6:29 Jesus answered, “This is the work of God: that you believe [adhere to, trust in, rely on, and have faith] in the One whom He has sent.” [works] Clearly this verse defines “faith” as a work. Thus faith must originate from God since God’s grace does not include man works (Galatians 5:2).

That's untrue. There are several here who teach faith is inherent. No need to try to accuse me of lying bro.

But He chose you over others correct?

Others are just at meritless?

No they did not!

They were telling us how all translations of the Bible are the word of God, though not all expressing the original in an eloquent way; as when one translates the kings speech into other languages; not all translators will effectively convey his words so eloquently.

They were using the translating of the king’s speech as an example, they were not saying that that’s what they were doing.

They wanted to translate the scriptures in a way as to accurately bring over from the original its eloquence: