The Ten Commandments are the Covenant, did you know?
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Undergrace1
Guest
Im afraid you do not understand Paul:
The power of sin is the law 1Cor15:56
Sinfull passions are aroused in us by the law Rom7:5
Which law?
He tells us in verse 8. Sin took occasion of the command not to covet to arouse all manner of concupiscence in him
Rom8:1
We are to follow after the Spirit-yes. However:
But now, by dying to what once bound us, we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code. Rom7:6
Believers either follow after the Spirit or the law, it cannot be both!
You wrote:
‘’’This goes back to my previous post, that if we are walking in Christ through His Spirit, He can help us overcome, When we refuse to obey the law of God, and stay in our sins sadly that's the wrong path’’’
There is no watered down version of the TC in the bible, only the true version.
You relate obedience to obeying the TC. Please do not forget where the bar is set for obedience in those commands. If you cannot obey the law relating to the inner man, the law no one but you and God know you break, you transgress those laws.
So, if you do not fully obey the relating to the inner person, why don't you?do you refuse to obey the tenth commandment, or can you not obey it?
It was a large reason He kept a generation of Israelites out of their Promise Land Eze 20:13 Eze20:15-16. We are told plainly not to follow in their path of disobedience Heb3:7-19 Heb4:11If Sunday is wrong, why didn't God correct this?
God is giving everyone now an opportunity to decide who we want to obey. Whoever we obey is who we serve Rom6:16. In Bible times it was never the majority of people who were obeying God, it was a minority of people trying to get people back to God’s word. Most rejected it. We are really just repeating what happened in the Bible. His people has always been a remnant who obey God Rev12:17 We are told the path is narrow- He holds our hand until the very end, but sadly many are serving another by obeying mans traditions over being faithful to God. Mat:15:3-14 Mark7:7-13
God used the word Remember on the 4th commandment for a reason, we show love to our Father and hold dear what He asked us not to forget, but Remember. He is calling us back to true worship and to worship Him who made- everything- worship our Creator Rev14:7 Exo20:11. God will put an end to this. He promises Sabbath worship continues for eternity Isa 66:22-23. We just need to decide what voice we are going to listen to today. When He comes our decisions are sealed Rev22:11
I’m sorry I will never buy into the belief that the Holy Spirit who wrote the Ten Commandments is going to lead people away from keeping what He wrote as if only worshipping God is bad and stealing from our neighbor is good.
U
Undergrace1
Guest
Like I say, you dont understand Paul's message:
The believer is called to look away from themselves and to Christ. While you are doing this, you cannot be seeking to wilfully follow after the flesh, it is one or the other. Whilst you are looking to Christ, and trusting him to bring you to live an evermore holy life, via the sanctification of the Spirit, you will transgress the letter of the law for that letter kills(2Cor3:6) But, as long as we are looking to Christ, we will grow in holiness.
The more we look to Christ, and rely on the Spirit, the more the fruits of the Spirit grow in our lives(Gal5:22) Against that fruit there is no law(verse23) For that fruit is the embodiment of how God wants you to live your life.
For it is we who are the circumcision, we who serve God by his Spirit, who boast in Christ Jesus, and who put no confidence in the flesh Phil3:3
So do you think Paul is teaching us to sin by breaking the law of God Rom7:7 and to dishonor God by breaking God’s law Rom2:21-23 and be an enemy to God by not subjecting ourselves to the law of God Rom8:7-8
Do you think looking at Christ means not only worshipping Him, not using His name only in a holy manner, not bowing to idols and not spending sanctified time with Him? Is this what it looks like to look at Christ to ignore everything He asked of us if we love Him? I do not believe this is what Paul is teaching.
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Undergrace1
Guest
I have to be honest with you here, people who keep insisting ''you must obey the TC'' do not understand what is entailed in obedience to those commands, they do not have the conviction they should have regarding sin concerning them
I went to a church on a Saturday for a while to please a friend. The second week I was there I saw two women laughing and joking as they transgressed one of the TC they insisted must be obeyed. I really was shocked and stunned to witness such a thing, Id never seen that before in all the years I had been to church, and they were by no means the only ones doing that. I saw more flagrant transgressing of the TC in that church than any church I have been to.
Im sure you would say you would be most upset if you transgressed those commands. But would you be in anguish concerning your thoughts when they transgress those commands, or would you just brush it off as of little consequence?
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Undergrace1
Guest
For sin shall no longer be your master for you are not under law but under grace Rom6:14
It seems to me you are under a form of the old covenant
Sin is still breaking the law of God in the NC 1John3:4 James2:11 Rom7:7
Being under the law. means being guilty of breaking the law and standing before God as a sinner
Gal 3:19 Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God
So under the law does not mean keeping it, it means being under the condemnation of the law- the wages of sin is death even in the NC Rom6:23 but if we are subjecting ourselves to the Spirit will the Spirit be leading us away from His commandments to worship other gods or break the least of the commandments the opposite of what Jesus said Mat5:19 no my friend that's the other spirit we are warned about Isa8:20
Grace is not a license to sin Rom 6:1-4
U
Undergrace1
Guest
I agree:
Sin is the transgression of the law
Being under the law is being under righteousness of obeying it.
But here's your problem.
When people say:
You MUST obey the TC, that places a person back under righteousness of obeying the law. It is a blanket statement. And Im sure people who do make that statement would believe you could not be righteous in God's sight if you did not obey that law. So you may say you are not under righteousness of obeying the law, but you can only be in a righteous state if you do obey it.
But in truth, people who keep making that statemen t believe in a watered down version of the TC, there is no watered down version in the bible, only the true version
Christians have been using Sunday as the Sabbath for about 2,000 years though. Wouldn't you think God would have made it abundantly clear to us by now if it's wrong?
So that all can see, here is what God ACTUALLY said:
Eze 20:15 "Moreover, I swore to them in the wilderness that I would not bring them into the land that I had given them, a land flowing with milk and honey, the most glorious of all lands, 16 because they rejected my rules and did not walk in my statutes, and profaned my Sabbaths; for their heart went after their idols."
Three reasons. THREE.
"they rejected my rules";
"and did not walk in my statutes";
"and profaned my Sabbaths."
What do you claim that God said? Here it is:
YOU left out the other two reasons that GOD put BEFORE "profaning my Sabbaths". Then, when called on it, you respond with this gem:
This is not an "agree to disagree" issue; you misrepresented God's word.
I'm needing guidance to avoid sinning
I'm needing principles from heaven on this evil earth.. because I'm not holy. My flesh is evil.
Which categories do you fall into?
Typical strawman misrepresentation. We know your Judaizer playbook; every single one of you is using the same one.
He did in His word. He warned us it would happen Dan7:25 He showed us an example of what happens when we don't keep it Eze20:15-16, He tells us not to harden our hearts like those who never made it in the promise land Heb3:7-13 and told us not to follow in their same path of disobedience Heb4:11Christians have been using Sunday as the Sabbath for about 2,000 years though. Wouldn't you think God would have made it abundantly clear to us by now if it's wrong?
God wrote His commandments, He spoke them, He placed them inside His ark, He numbered them by design Deut4:13 and used the word Remember on the one comamndment He knew everyone would forget.
Sunday sacredness did not come from the Scripture, Jesus kept the Sabbath Luke4:16, He is our example no one else 1John2:6 His disciples kept the Sabbath Luke23:56 His apostles kept every Sabbath decades and decades after the Cross Acts 13:42 Acts 13:44 it was in the council for the Gentiles Acts 15:21 and both Gentiles and the Jews were keeping it Acts 18:4 just as Jesus predicted Isa 56:6-7
People have always done something different even in the Bible when they spent time with God.
Just like those who came before us, God gives us a chance to choose
Josh 24:15 And if it seems evil to you to serve the Lord, choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve, whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the River, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land you dwell. But as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.”
We choose who we serve by our obedience Rom6:16. God said keep the seventh day Sabbath holy, Exo20:8-11 it comes with God's blessings and sanctification Exo20:11 Gen2:3 Eze20:12 Rome says keep Sunday holy and if doing so we are obeying their authority who claims to have changed the Sabbath commandment just as it was predicted Dan 7:25
Biblically, God set the Sabbath on the seventh day (Saturday) at Creation (Genesis 2:2–3) and codified it in the Ten Commandments (Exodus 20:8–11). In the book of Acts, the apostles consistently observed the Sabbath on Saturday: Paul customarily went to the synagogue on the Sabbath (Acts 13:14, 13:42–44, 16:13, 17:2, 18:4). At the same time, believers also gathered on the first day of the week (Sunday), mainly to break bread and commemorate Christ’s resurrection (Acts 20:7; cf. 1 Corinthians 16:2). This shows a transitional period where Saturday Sabbath observance continued, while Sunday gatherings gradually developed alongside it.I have a question: Which day does God consider is the Sabbath? Most Christians consider it Sunday. It appears to be fine With God and I've never seen Him to correct or punish Christians for it.
Historically, the early church did not immediately replace the Sabbath with Sunday. Many Jewish Christians continued keeping the Sabbath for centuries. The shift toward Sunday as the primary day of worship developed gradually, especially among Gentile Christians, and was later reinforced by church leaders and imperial authority. While Clement of Rome wrote very early (late 1st century), he did not officially change the Sabbath; rather, later writers like Justin Martyr (2nd century) describe Sunday worship, and the first civil law enforcing Sunday observance was issued by Emperor Constantine in AD 321. So, Scripture shows Saturday as God’s Sabbath, Acts shows both days being observed, and history explains how Sunday eventually became dominant in mainstream Christianity. However I know that God does not change and What he set for us ( Saturday) still and will remain. Who has the authority to change God's law? Absolutely no one, I am certain of this. Jesus never changer it, Paul never did. some will argue about the sabbaths Paul spoke about that were in reality extra sabbath(S) included in the Levetical Laws with feast days...that law is no more. Personally I see no problem observing both.
Blessings!
I agree that love is the basis for all ten.
And with the loving Spirit of God we will obey..
But what about the times we are not following the Spirit? And walking in the flesh?
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Undergrace1
Guest
In truth, under the core terms of the new covenant, you would have to know in your heart and mind if you were living a life of ignoring what God places in the hearts and minds of believersChristians have been using Sunday as the Sabbath for about 2,000 years though. Wouldn't you think God would have made it abundantly clear to us by now if it's wrong?