Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

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So, in Calvinist terms, you can choose to put your morsel of bread into the Cup, but do not take this morsel except for the purpose of intinction.

Matthew 23:25-26, "What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you are so careful to clean the outside of the cup and the dish, but inside you are filthy -- full of greed and self-indulgence! You blind Pharisee! First wash the inside of the cup and the dish,* and then the outside will become clean, too."

Rightfully speaking, this is because His Name is on the altar and one does not bring Him corrupt gold.
 
rogerg said:
I tell them there is nothing anyone can do to make themselves saved - that Christ alone is the Savior, and that man is not. That is what Savior means - that He is the one who saves. If you believe you can do something to save yourself, then you simply don't believe Christ is the Savior - it ain't complicated and we've tried to explain this simple truth to you before .... but unfortunately, without success. You can't have it both ways - He is the Savior and is solely the one who saves, or you don't really believe that He is, no middle ground!
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Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ.....I will go with Paul. Not the calvie theory.
 
Yeah, what about scripture again? Where does Jesus say that he loves Presbyterians but only if they have ever been in the holy Catholic Church as a member?

I'm sorry, did you say Calvinism has theological weight that exceeds Luther?
 
rogerg said:
And who is it that gives true belief to someone? God! You didn't start at the beginning of the cause-and-effect chain - you went directly to its end.
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Like I said.......I will stick with Paul.

What must I do to be saved?

Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ......

You believe. I believe........You don't have the market cornered as you wish it to be.
 
Kroogz said:
Like I said.......I will stick with Paul.

What must I do to be saved?

Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ......

You believe. I believe........You don't have the market cornered as you wish it to be.
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So, there are things He tells us are pleasing to God. They are spiritual fruits. But you can't really donate your car for one service. That would be a conflict of interest bringing that spiritual fruit he mentioned to be sacrificed.
 
Kroogz said:
Like I said.......I will stick with Paul.

What must I do to be saved?

Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ......

You believe. I believe........You don't have the market cornered as you wish it to be.
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So, what function did Christ then perform regarding salvation since you say you saved yourself by believing?
 
lrs68 said:
The very next Verse tells us WHO (those given to Jesus) are.

25 Righteous Father, the world did not know You, but I knew You; and these knew that You sent Me


Clearly talking about the Disciples.
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Thank you! (y)

I tire of the continual ignoring of context.
One would think that by this point in the thread, they would recognize that #ContextKillsCalvinism, but obviously not.
 
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rogerg said:
So, what function did Christ then perform regarding salvation since you say you saved yourself by believing?
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Well, you believe. So you saved yourself.

How do you have the market cornered for this "special" belief?
 
Kroogz said:
Well, you believe. So you saved yourself.

How do you have the market cornered for this "special" belief?
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Nope. My belief is that I was saved and then from it, believed. You state it in the reverse of that.
So, the question remains: since by your belief you saved yourself, what part did Christ play in it?
 
HeIsHere said:
Actually, I consider my free will to be instructive on curbing my enthusiasm for bank notes.
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Exactly how? You cannot post a credit without a payment made to debit in the amount to which you are owed wages. God does not consider your spending to be necessary to the critical function that the bank does not hand over money for reasons other than claims and disputes.
 
rogerg said:
Nope. My belief is that I was saved and then from it, believed. You state it in the reverse of that.
So, the question remains: since by your belief you saved yourself, what part did Christ play in it?
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You saved yourself. You believe.
 
Tex_MidwesternerNW said:
Exactly how? You cannot post a credit without a payment made to debit in the amount to which you are owed wages. God does not consider your spending to be necessary to the critical function that the bank does not hand over money for reasons other than claims and disputes.
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Correct.

3“Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness.”
4Now the wages of the worker are not credited as a gift, but as an obligation.
5However, to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness.…
Romans 4:3-5
 
Kroogz said:
You saved yourself. You believe.
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Huh? I didn't save myself - I never said that. Christ, as the Savior, saved me, and from that, I believed.
You said you were saved by your belief. You started this out by stating you believe in Christ and that we, the Calvies, don't believe in
Christ - but we actually do. So, if you don't believe He is the Savior, then how is it that He saved you? Or is it that you don't believe He is the Savior and didn't save you, in spite of all Scripture states about Him actually being the only Savior?
 
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