Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

[Genez]

What would the basis for such favoritism by God, since all men are sinners? NO FWer has yet offered an answer to question that I have asked more times than Carter has little liver pills. If you can find your spine, why don't you take a shot and answer?

And Reformed folks do NOT believe God shows any favoritism, as the bible defines it. (See my 32,321.) So quit with your lies already.

Let's see what you are saying?

God sovereignly picks (chooses) some (equally bad) sinners to make saved, and sovereignly throws out the rest.

Your God is an all powerful spoiled child.

 

[Jordon]

Nonsense. Complete rubbish. The reformed theory is a GIANT dumpster fire.

Rom 10
15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!

16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

18 But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.

Ps 19
1 The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands. 2 Day after day they pour forth speech; night after night they reveal knowledge. 3 They have no speech, they use no words; no sound is heard from them. 4 Yet their voice[1] goes out into all the earth, their words to the ends of the world.

Yep these are people who know the lord

 

[Jordon]

Let's see what you are saying?

God sovereignly picks (chooses) some (equally bad) sinners to make saved, and sovereignly throws out the rest.

Your God is an all powerful spoiled child.

Your not in Egypt now just sayin

 

[Genez]

Yes it does. Creation doesn't reveal Christ.

Yes it does...

A masterpiece reveals the artist.

What kind of fantastic genius mind created that????!

 

[Jordon]

Yes it does...

A masterpiece reveals the artist.

What kind of fantastic genius mind created that????!

He could of meant the father reveals Christ to you by handing you to the son, you should ask first before spouting of

 

[Rufus]

I spoke of God's desire, not His intention. If Jesus had prayed for those who would not accept the Father's word, He would have been a hypocrite.

God has never intended to save the unbeliever, only believers, those who accept His word.

He desires all to be saved but refuses to fulfill his own desire? What sort of God cannot get what He wants? Worse still, divides his own counsel against himself.

How would Jesus have been a hypocrite since according to you FWers Christ died for every human being on the planet (Jn 3:16), which includes a gazillion of unbelievers! IF that were true then why wouldn't Jesus pray for all those whose sins He allegedly atoned for?

God has three wills, as discussed often: Decretive, Preceptive and Dispositional. However, 2Pet 3:9 is mangled badly by your FWers for the text does not say that God is not willing than anyone in the universe or world should perish. Nor did Peter say that is patient towards the world. You guys read these things into the text. The "any" in the text refers back to the "you" -- the nearest antecedent. Therefore, if the passage had read instead: God is not willing than any of you should perish that would make eminently good sense since God is patient toward Peter's audience -- not the world!

If you really want to answer the question "For whom did Christ die?", then you should stick with the numerous passages in scripture that explicitly provide that answer. But FWers meticulously avoid those passages because they most definitely limit the extent of the atonement quantitatively. Here are just some of them:

Deut 32:39-43; Isa 53:5-6,8, 11-12; Mat 1:21; 20:28; 26:28; Lk 1:54-55; Jn 10:14-16; 15:13; Act 20:28; Rom 5:8-9; Eph 5:25; 1Cor 6:19;15:3; Tit 2:14; Heb 9:28; 1Pet 2:24-25.

(There many other OT passages that talks about God's relationship to the NATIONS. If you want to see those, let me know.)

And I make no apologies for using common sense and sound hermeneutical principles by giving top priority to clear, didactic, explicit truth claims over the more ambiguous or obscure passages.

Also, if you're going to claim that Christ for every human being on the this little green planet, then since God is a Covenant God you'll need to come up with Universal Redemptive Covenant that He cut with the entire world. But we both know there is no such covenant in all the bible!

 

[Genez]

Your not in Egypt now just sayin

 

[Rufus]

Yes it does...

A masterpiece reveals the artist.

What kind of fantastic genius mind created that????!

A masterpiece, though, doesn't reveal everything about the artist. God's Creation reveals his goodness, his majesty, his wisdom, his power, his knowledge and his common grace. Where in Rom 1 is the Gospel revealed?

 

[Genez]

He could of meant the father reveals Christ to you by handing you to the son, you should ask first before spouting of

Creation does reveal Christ! Just as the essence of an artist is revealed by His artwork!

The Father hands you over to His son, so that the Creator of Creation (whom men sense about) can be seen.
We can see much about Christ is by the very creation He designed!

For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, ​

visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—​

all things have been created through Him and for Him. ​

​

He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together.​

​

Colossians 1:16-17​

 

[Rufus]

[Luk 14:21-23 NKJV]
21 "So that servant came and reported these things to his master. Then the master of the house, being angry, said to his servant, 'Go out quickly into the streets and lanes of the city, and bring in here [the] poor and [the] maimed and [the] lame and [the] blind.'
22 "And the servant said, 'Master, it is done as you commanded, and still there is room.'
23 "Then the master said to the servant, 'Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel [them] to come in, that my house may be filled.

So...you actually discovered this parable?. Did you learn anything? Did you learn that the outer calls alone of the gospel don't quite cut it? Did you learn that the Master had his servant (SINGULAR) go out and "force" people to enter therein?

And by the way, you shouldn't be surprised at this truth about the gospel. The New Birth REQUIRES two vitally important components for this to happen: The Word and the Spirit.

 

[Jordon]

ha ha he looks like me a man who knows his mountain he has to climb, to make you see im the little monkey stuck in the middle, ,

 

[Jordon]

Creation does reveal Christ! Just as the essence of an artist is revealed by His artwork!

The Father hands you over to His son, so that the Creator of Creation (whom men sense about) can be seen.
We can see much about Christ is by the very creation He designed!

For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, ​

visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—​

all things have been created through Him and for Him. ​

​

He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together.​

​

Colossians 1:16-17​

I believe many people have seen Christ in the clouds

 

[rogerg]

A masterpiece, though, doesn't reveal everything about the artist. God's Creation reveals his goodness, his majesty, his wisdom, his power, his knowledge and his common grace. Where in Rom 1 is the Gospel revealed?

Nor does it give spiritual discernment.

 

[Jordon]

I believe many people have seen Christ in the clouds

you will see him coming in the clouds remember @Genez.

But you can also see a super monkey in the clouds to

 

[BillyBob]

FTFY!

And I understand you duplicitous FWers perfectly, thank you! Do you ever let your brain catch up to your fingers? You FWers don't believe that grace actaully saves! You believe that God's ineffectual grace merely makes salvation possible. In your world Jesus is reduced to a mere potential savior -- a concept that is totally foreign in scripture.

Jacob Arminius, the founder of what is known as, Arminianism, taught, "The lost sinner needs the Spirit’s assistance, but he does not have to be regenerated (made alive) by the Spirit before he can believe, for faith is man’s act and precedes the new birth". Clearly, Arminius, and those who follow his teachings, did not and do not believe that a man prior to salvation is dead in sins. They are all part of a cult that denies the spiritual death of mankind, for in believing that a man does not need to be made alive by God, they agree with Satan when he said to Eve she would not surely die if she ate of the forbidden fruit, because they say we are not truely dead.
**MDB**

 

[sawdust]

yep your free will can look at that way, not all all doctrines are creeds

Doctrines are general teachings

Creeds are more precise tenets of those beliefs and tulip is not central to the reformed church

Tulip is only central to smelly people


Here's the true Calvie creed

And your free will likes to ignore dictionary definitions. Creeds are usually a set of doctrines in one statement like the Apostles Creed.

The video you posted said nothing about Calvin doctrine or creed. It was an introduction to a Christian University that happens to be named after John Calvin.

Here it is again.

doctrine British

/ ˌdɒktrɪˈnælɪtɪ, ˈdɒktrɪn, dɒkˈtraɪnəl /

noun

1. a creed or body of teachings of a religious, political, or philosophical group presented for acceptance or belief; dogma
2. a principle or body of principles that is taught or advocated

And also ...

creed 1 British

/ kriːd /

noun

1. a concise, formal statement of the essential articles of Christian belief, such as the Apostles' Creed or the Nicene Creed
2. any statement or system of beliefs or principles

And the question was not whether TULIP was central to Reformed doctrine. I asked if you could explain TULIP, even if you just do the "L" as you replied it was nonsense that those who believe in TULIP believe God only saves/loves/favours the Elect.

 

[Genez]

Tulip is just a doctrine it should only be seen as an doctrine that can lead to understanding, of how to come to terms with the truth, and that's all it is really. You could paint everyone with the same brush if you want to mate, but I would rather not have a Grinch meal thanks

Merry Christmas

TULIP is a monstrosity.
You do not take the Word of God seriously.

Those who choose to defend false doctrine only take themselves seriously, and are out to prove themselves ultimately by how well they can fend off correction. For, when they can? It proves to themselves how smart they are.

 

[Genez]

you will see him coming in the clouds remember @Genez.

But you can also see a super monkey in the clouds to

In the end?
God will make a monkey out of you.

 

[Jordon]

In the end?
God will make a monkey out of you.

That would be a silver back to you

 

[Jordon]

TULIP is a monstrosity.
You do not take the Word of God seriously.

Those who choose to defend false doctrine only take themselves seriously, and are out to prove themselves ultimately by how well they can fend off correction. For, when they can? It proves to themselves how smart they are.

Well if they ware smarty pants with there doctrine they can be a clever smart ass like u