Not By Works

[Lafftur]

So you are passive and bear no responsibility?

Please explain, I do not understand your question.....

 

[DorothyMae]

No, DorothyMae.......the contrast of Judas and Peter is an excellent example of how all that are “lost” NEVER believed; and some may deny Christ when their faith is being sifted as wheat by Satan but, Jesus prayed for Peter and us that our faith in Jesus will NOT FAIL us and after we are tested and tried we are to strengthen our brethren.

But none of the verses say that at all. Peter fell away and bitterly repented. Some fall away and don’t.

Jesus never promised he’s praying so you don’t fall away. I know you believe it. Why didn’t he tell ALL of them that he was praying for them equally too?

Let me ask you another question. If all of them knew they would go to heaven no matter if they deny him before others or fail to endure, why were there martyrs? Why endure that horrible suffering when you can simply do whatever your tormentors want as you know you’re saved no matter what? (Jesus actually says he who endures will he saved, but we’ll ignore that warning for now.)

 

[DorothyMae]

Please explain, I do not understand your question.....

You borrowed Paul’s statement to the Philippians regarding their generous giving and applied it your remaining faithful.

Let’s phrase it a different way, what part in your remaining faithful do you think you have?

Thanks for your kind answer.

 

[Lafftur]

But none of the verses say that at all. Peter fell away and bitterly repented. Some fall away and don’t.

Jesus never promised he’s praying so you don’t fall away. I know you believe it. Why didn’t he tell ALL of them that he was praying for them equally too?

Let me ask you another question. If all of them knew they would go to heaven no matter if they deny him before others or fail to endure, why were there martyrs? Why endure that horrible suffering when you can simply do whatever your tormentors want as you know you’re saved no matter what? (Jesus actually says he who endures will he saved, but we’ll ignore that warning for now.)

DorothyMae, I will answer you tomorrow......it’s midnight where I am and I got to work tomorrow....

By the way, Martyrs are incredibly special to God.....NOT EVERYONE gets a Martyrs crown.....

Good night, God loves you!

 

[dcontroversal]

Agree, there are many places where his true colours started to bleed through.

It is actually rather humorous and sad....they claim Judas was saved and lost it even though by the words of Christ it is obvious he was not.....Jesus even calls him a devil in the present tense using a "BE" verb and states HE WAS NOT CLEAN and the workers for which constantly harp on works proving salvation say a unclean thief called a devil was saved.....just one of their many contradictions.

Jesus answered them, "Did I Myself not choose you, the twelve, and yet one of you is a devil?"

 

[dcontroversal]

What this has to do with the original point that just because someone casts out a demon in Jesus Name doesn’t mean He EVER knew them, and they were NEVER born again, like Judas, I have no idea.

But whatever makes you feel better I guess.

Amen Pedophile Catholic Priests supposedly do exorcisms daily....!!

 

[dcontroversal]

No, I disagree. Judas was never surrendered to Christ. Judas was always in it for himself. Judas never believed.

But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.
John 6:64 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=John 6:64&version=KJV

Jesus had to fulfill ALL the Law and The Prophets. The Prophets had written in the Psalms of Jesus betrayed by Judas.

Yea, mine own familiar friend, in whom I trusted, which did eat of my bread, hath lifted up his heel against me.
Psalm 41:9 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=Psalm 41:9&version=KJV

Ironically, Peter denied Jesus 3 times yet, Peter did believe and had been given understanding by the Father that Jesus was The Christ.

Peter believed and never stopped loving Jesus, Peter wept bitterly over his denial of Christ and after Jesus rose from the dead, an angel told the women to especially tell Peter to go to Galilee to meet with Jesus.


But go your way, tell his disciples and Peter that he goeth before you into Galilee: there shall ye see him, as he said unto you.
Mark 16:7 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=Mark 16:7&version=KJV

The be verb "is" is clear enough.....

Jesus answered them, "Did I Myself not choose you, the twelve, and yet one of you is a devil?"

 

[jackrosie]

The devil can never gain access to my heart.
But he can and does enter the mind....he drove me crazy as a new babe.....by far and stronger was the Holy Spirit who was and is in my Heart.

One thing for sure he will never take my belief of OSAS again......those thoughts he placed in my mind,the Lord has kicked him out of my mind in that area.......Hallelujah Praise God!!

 

[dcontroversal]

Now, @oyster67 - You and I both know Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith, He will complete what He has started.

He does not believe that.....anyone that teaches a losable salvation does not believe that!

 

[VCO]

But none of the verses say that at all. Peter fell away and bitterly repented. Some fall away and don’t.

Jesus never promised he’s praying so you don’t fall away. I know you believe it. Why didn’t he tell ALL of them that he was praying for them equally too?

Let me ask you another question. If all of them knew they would go to heaven no matter if they deny him before others or fail to endure, why were there martyrs? Why endure that horrible suffering when you can simply do whatever your tormentors want as you know you’re saved no matter what? (Jesus actually says he who endures will he saved, but we’ll ignore that warning for now.)

When are you going to realize that we are telling you the truth.

The people who fell away, only had HEAD KNOWLEDGE about HIM, that is the same faith as demons have. MARK 5:6-13

WE who are Born Again, have HEART KNOWLEDGE and have surrendered to HIM in our Heart (Human Spirit).

Like the saying goes: The distance between being UNSAVED and a SAVED, BORN AGAIN BELIEVER is only 18 inches, the same distance as the HUMAN BRAIN is from the HUMAN HEART where the Human Spirit is.

THUS THIS VERSE IS ABSOLUTELY 100% TRUE.

1 John 2:19 (HCSB)
19 They went out from us, but they did not belong to us; for if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us. However, they went out so that it might be made clear that none of them belongs to us.


JESUS PREACHED to two kinds of Disciples. SAVED DISCIPLES, and UNSAVED DISCIPLES who could eventually become TRUE BORN AGAIN BELIEVERS. The ONLY ONES THAT EVER FELL AWAY were the UNSAVED DISCIPLES.


John 3:3 (HCSB)
3 Jesus replied, “I assure you: Unless someone is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

 

[jackrosie]

When are you going to realize that we are telling you the truth.

The people who fell away, only had HEAD KNOWLEDGE about HIM, that is the same faith as demons have. MARK 5:6-13

WE who are Born Again, have HEART KNOWLEDGE and have surrendered to HIM in our Heart (Human Spirit).

Like the saying goes: The distance between being UNSAVED and a SAVED, BORN AGAIN BELIEVER is only 18 inches, the same distance as the HUMAN BRAIN is from the HUMAN HEART where the Human Spirit is.

THUS THIS VERSE IS ABSOLUTELY 100% TRUE.

1 John 2:19 (HCSB)
19 They went out from us, but they did not belong to us; for if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us. However, they went out so that it might be made clear that none of them belongs to us.


JESUS PREACHED to two kinds of Disciples. SAVED DISCIPLES, and UNSAVED DISCIPLES who could eventually become TRUE BORN AGAIN BELIEVERS. The ONLY ONES THAT EVER FELL AWAY were the UNSAVED DISCIPLES.


John 3:3 (HCSB)
3 Jesus replied, “I assure you: Unless someone is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

Like me it may take time for her to come to realise.......So give her a break....I ask respectfully.

 

[jackrosie]

@jackrosie I designed this Romans 13:10 panel for you today

That touched my heart...thank you,Magenta.xx..God gave you a gift of creativity.

 

[DorothyMae]

I was just thinking also...
Maybe they believe they can lose their Salvation because they actually believe that Judas was once saved , just a thought...
...xox...

We believe salvation can be lost because Jesus, Paul, and Peter warn us to take care. That’s the reason we believe it.

 

[DorothyMae]

Like me it may take time for her to come to realise.......So give her a break....I ask respectfully.

Nice post my dear. You’re sweet.

 

[DorothyMae]

Judas, Who cast out demons, and healed the sick, like the guys in this passage, was NEVER born again. Jesus didn’t know Judas and these guys in the sense that they were never made new creations, with a new heart. Jesus says so Himself:
Matthew 7
22 Many will say to me on that day,‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I NEVER knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

Not that He knew them at one time, they did, or didn’t do something to cause them to no longer be His Child. THEY NEVER WERE!!

Jesus and Judas spent three years wandering around together while he taught very deep things and you say Jesus didn’t know Judas???

 

[Magenta]

That touched my heart...thank you,Magenta.xx..God gave you a gift of creativity.

You are welcome, jackrosie... until I put that @ before your name I had thought it was jackierose

I am actually still working on the panel, making alterations

I am glad you like it, and thank you

 

[Magenta]

Jesus and Judas spent three years wandering around together while he taught very deep things and you say Jesus didn’t know Judas???

God knows everyone. . . Surely you realize that does not mean everyone is saved?

I actually clarified this point earlier = not knowing him as one of His own.

 

[DorothyMae]

Yes I agree , because if they are blind to these simple truths , then there is no chance of them seeing the whole truth , and may God have mercy and bring them to His truth , because other wise , has Satan not blinded their eyes?
...xox...

Rosemary, I find t hard to believe that just because I believe salvation can be lost in time, you think God needs to grant us mercy and we’re horribly deceived. I don’t think God needs to grant you mercy and you’re doomed.

If a believer thinks they are heaven bound no matter what they do but still follows Jesus their whole life, great!

If a believer thinks they are heaven bound no matter what they do and starts to live a life of sin, and they are wrong, very bad.

If a believer thinks that while they are saved they need to
continue in the faith their whole life but we’re wrong, no problem.

If a believer thinks that while they are saved they need to continue in the faith but are right, good thing.

The only bad outcome is for the OSAS believer who was wrong and neglected their salvation until it didn’t exist anymore.

 

[DorothyMae]

God knows everyone. . . Surely you realize that does not mean everyone is saved?

Jesus says he didn’t know them. Do you question what he said? I mean that is what he said.

 

[Magenta]

Jesus says he didn’t know them. Do you question what he said? I mean that is what he said.

I guess you miss the context. Still, Jesus makes clear that those He knows give to others in need, not steal from them like Judas did.

Do you deny that Jesus is God?