Why I now believe that salvation can be lost.
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How can you not answer what james meant when he said CLAIMS to have faith yet has NO works, means (how many works is this?) and thenask how people can argue against plain words?
It appears your the one arguing against the pain words my friend. Claiming that James is preaching salvation can be lost with these words.
It appears your the one arguing against the pain words my friend. Claiming that James is preaching salvation can be lost with these words.
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Who is he taling to?
1. People who CLAIMED to do many great works in Jesus names
2. People JESUS claimed he NEVER KNEW (they were NEVER adopted, NEVER born again, NEVER made a part of Jesus family)
3. As children of the world. They acted like the world (sinners) and lived exactly like Jesus said, Lawlessness. Because a child of satan may be able to act righteous. Appear morally good. Even go to church and play church, But all they can do is PRACTICE unrighteousness.
You all love to focus on the lawlessness part. But do not heed the NEVER KNEW YOU part. Then claim WE are not listening.
1. People who CLAIMED to do many great works in Jesus names
2. People JESUS claimed he NEVER KNEW (they were NEVER adopted, NEVER born again, NEVER made a part of Jesus family)
3. As children of the world. They acted like the world (sinners) and lived exactly like Jesus said, Lawlessness. Because a child of satan may be able to act righteous. Appear morally good. Even go to church and play church, But all they can do is PRACTICE unrighteousness.
You all love to focus on the lawlessness part. But do not heed the NEVER KNEW YOU part. Then claim WE are not listening.
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Paul was fighting hard for his salvation?
Then how could paul say to be absent from body was to be present. That he did nt fear death,That all things were momentary light afflictions when he looks to his eternal hope How could he write books like ephesians where he writes about all he has in christ, ot tell titus that he HAS BEEN SAVED?
Wow man, I mean WOW, what bible are you reading?
Then how could paul say to be absent from body was to be present. That he did nt fear death,That all things were momentary light afflictions when he looks to his eternal hope How could he write books like ephesians where he writes about all he has in christ, ot tell titus that he HAS BEEN SAVED?
Wow man, I mean WOW, what bible are you reading?
Who is he taling to?
1. People who CLAIMED to do many great works in Jesus names
2. People JESUS claimed he NEVER KNEW (they were NEVER adopted, NEVER born again, NEVER made a part of Jesus family)
3. As children of the world. They acted like the world (sinners) and lived exactly like Jesus said, Lawlessness. Because a child of satan may be able to act righteous. Appear morally good. Even go to church and play church, But all they can do is PRACTICE unrighteousness.
You all love to focus on the lawlessness part. But do not heed the NEVER KNEW YOU part. Then claim WE are not listening.
1. People who CLAIMED to do many great works in Jesus names
2. People JESUS claimed he NEVER KNEW (they were NEVER adopted, NEVER born again, NEVER made a part of Jesus family)
3. As children of the world. They acted like the world (sinners) and lived exactly like Jesus said, Lawlessness. Because a child of satan may be able to act righteous. Appear morally good. Even go to church and play church, But all they can do is PRACTICE unrighteousness.
You all love to focus on the lawlessness part. But do not heed the NEVER KNEW YOU part. Then claim WE are not listening.
Jesus is saying claiming spiritual authority through casting out demons, prophecy and perform miracles
does not make you a believer or followers. Doing the things Jesus commands does, and being an evil
doer shows one does not know Jesus.
Turning "claiming spiritual authority in spiritual acts" into "spiritual authority through obedience" is absurd and
only makes sense if you condemn those who obey Jesus's commands as legalists, and therefore rejected by
Jesus. But this is not what Jesus is saying.
Doers of evil are enemies of Christ. In humbleness we were sinners once, now made saints, redeemed, cleansed
and purified but always one step away from a fall, so nothing can be taken for granted or dealt with lightly.
Knowing Jesus is knowing His heart. And His heart is that Gods will might reign on earth as it is in heaven.
I feel sorrow for anyone who says I am an evil doer but the blood of Jesus makes me safe, because those two
things are not compatible, ever. Only when the blood washes us clean are we safe. And we are are safe because
we stand in Him cleansed, not apparently clean but not in reality, because that is just pretend cleansing.
And cleansing comes through repentance, sorrow and walking in Gods ways, the fruit of repentance.
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10 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other,
11 and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people.
12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold,
13 but he who stands firm to the end will be saved.
14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.
Matt 24
The subject in this passage is problems coming upon the Lords people and society in general.
Many will turn away from faith, ie lose their salvation.
The society will lose direction with false prophets and deception, wickedness will increase and
love in society will grow cold.
But for the saints, if one stands firm salvation will be delivered.
Now in such a passage with people abandoning the faith, and things going very dark, the
encouragement is to hang on to receive the very thing we are hoping for, salvation.
Saving ones physical life has always been irrelevant to the faith, dying for ones faith a true
sign of commitment and focus on the heavenlies and not earthly reward.
But some will always excuse away things they cannot face, the we are mortals who need
to show Gods work in our hearts today, tomorrow and into eternity or else it is fake.
11 and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people.
12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold,
13 but he who stands firm to the end will be saved.
14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.
Matt 24
The subject in this passage is problems coming upon the Lords people and society in general.
Many will turn away from faith, ie lose their salvation.
The society will lose direction with false prophets and deception, wickedness will increase and
love in society will grow cold.
But for the saints, if one stands firm salvation will be delivered.
Now in such a passage with people abandoning the faith, and things going very dark, the
encouragement is to hang on to receive the very thing we are hoping for, salvation.
Saving ones physical life has always been irrelevant to the faith, dying for ones faith a true
sign of commitment and focus on the heavenlies and not earthly reward.
But some will always excuse away things they cannot face, the we are mortals who need
to show Gods work in our hearts today, tomorrow and into eternity or else it is fake.
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Hebrews 6 New International Version (NIV)
6 Therefore let us move beyond the elementary teachings about Christ and be taken forward to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from acts that lead to death,[a] and of faith in God, 2 instruction about cleansing rites, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. 3 And God permitting, we will do so.
4 It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age 6 and who have (fallen[c] away), to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace. 7 Land that drinks in the rain often falling on it and that produces a crop useful to those for whom it is farmed receives the blessing of God. 8 But land that produces thorns and thistles is worthless and is in danger of being cursed. In the end it will be burned.
9 Even though we speak like this, dear friends, we are convinced of better things in your case—the things that have to do with salvation. 10 God is not unjust; he will not forget your work and the love you have shown him as you have helped his people and continue to help them. 11 We want each of you to show this same diligence to the very end, so that what you hope for may be fully realized. 12 We do not want you to become lazy, but to imitate those who through faith and patience inherit what has been promised.
The Certainty of God’s Promise
13 When God made his promise to Abraham, since there was no one greater for him to swear by, he swore by himself, 14 saying, “I will surely bless you and give you many descendants.”[d] 15 And so after waiting patiently, Abraham received what was promised.
16 People swear by someone greater than themselves, and the oath confirms what is said and puts an end to all argument. 17 Because God wanted to make the unchanging nature of his purpose very clear to the heirs of what was promised, he confirmed it with an oath. 18 God did this so that, by two unchangeable things in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have fled to take hold of the hope set before us may be greatly encouraged. 19 We have this hope as an anchor for the soul, firm and secure. It enters the inner sanctuary behind the curtain, 20 where our forerunner, Jesus, has entered on our behalf. He has become a high priest forever, in the order of Melchizedek.
FALLING AWAY MEANS, A PERSON WHO NEVER COMES BACK. They have turned from the Faith.
1 Timothy 4:1
Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will (depart from the faith) by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons,
Some who were in the faith departed from the faith-.
Revelation 2:4-5
But I have this against you, that you have abandoned the love you had at first. Remember therefore from where you have (fallen); (repent), and (do the works you did at first). If not, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place, unless you repent.
Hebrews 6- only applies to us if we dont come back and repent and do the same works we did at first. If we leave God and dont ever Come back.
6 Therefore let us move beyond the elementary teachings about Christ and be taken forward to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from acts that lead to death,[a] and of faith in God, 2 instruction about cleansing rites, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. 3 And God permitting, we will do so.
4 It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age 6 and who have (fallen[c] away), to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace. 7 Land that drinks in the rain often falling on it and that produces a crop useful to those for whom it is farmed receives the blessing of God. 8 But land that produces thorns and thistles is worthless and is in danger of being cursed. In the end it will be burned.
9 Even though we speak like this, dear friends, we are convinced of better things in your case—the things that have to do with salvation. 10 God is not unjust; he will not forget your work and the love you have shown him as you have helped his people and continue to help them. 11 We want each of you to show this same diligence to the very end, so that what you hope for may be fully realized. 12 We do not want you to become lazy, but to imitate those who through faith and patience inherit what has been promised.
The Certainty of God’s Promise
13 When God made his promise to Abraham, since there was no one greater for him to swear by, he swore by himself, 14 saying, “I will surely bless you and give you many descendants.”[d] 15 And so after waiting patiently, Abraham received what was promised.
16 People swear by someone greater than themselves, and the oath confirms what is said and puts an end to all argument. 17 Because God wanted to make the unchanging nature of his purpose very clear to the heirs of what was promised, he confirmed it with an oath. 18 God did this so that, by two unchangeable things in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have fled to take hold of the hope set before us may be greatly encouraged. 19 We have this hope as an anchor for the soul, firm and secure. It enters the inner sanctuary behind the curtain, 20 where our forerunner, Jesus, has entered on our behalf. He has become a high priest forever, in the order of Melchizedek.
FALLING AWAY MEANS, A PERSON WHO NEVER COMES BACK. They have turned from the Faith.
1 Timothy 4:1
Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will (depart from the faith) by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons,
Some who were in the faith departed from the faith-.
Revelation 2:4-5
But I have this against you, that you have abandoned the love you had at first. Remember therefore from where you have (fallen); (repent), and (do the works you did at first). If not, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place, unless you repent.
Hebrews 6- only applies to us if we dont come back and repent and do the same works we did at first. If we leave God and dont ever Come back.
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PRODICAL SON LEFT HIS FATHER, and became LOST
Then returned to his father.
Luke 15:11-32 New International Version (NIV)
The Parable of the Lost Son
11 Jesus continued: “There was a man who had two sons. 12 The younger one said to his father, ‘Father, give me my share of the estate.’ So he divided his property between them.
13 “Not long after that, the younger son got together all he had, set off for a distant country and there squandered his wealth in wild living. 14 After he had spent everything, there was a severe famine in that whole country, and he began to be in need. 15 So he went and hired himself out to a citizen of that country, who sent him to his fields to feed pigs. 16 He longed to fill his stomach with the pods that the pigs were eating, but no one gave him anything.
17 “When he came to his senses, he said, ‘How many of my father’s hired servants have food to spare, and here I am starving to death! 18 I will set out and go back to my father and say to him: Father, I have sinned against heaven and against you. 19 I am no longer worthy to be called your son; make me like one of your hired servants.’ 20 So he got up and went to his father.
“But while he was still a long way off, his father saw him and was filled with compassion for him; he ran to his son, threw his arms around him and kissed him.
21 “The son said to him, ‘Father, I have sinned against heaven and against you. I am no longer worthy to be called your son.’
22 “But the father said to his servants, ‘Quick! Bring the best robe and put it on him. Put a ring on his finger and sandals on his feet. 23 Bring the fattened calf and kill it. Let’s have a feast and celebrate. 24 For this son of mine was dead and is alive again; he was lost and is found.’ So they began to celebrate.
25 “Meanwhile, the older son was in the field. When he came near the house, he heard music and dancing. 26 So he called one of the servants and asked him what was going on. 27 ‘Your brother has come,’ he replied, ‘and your father has killed the fattened calf because he has him back safe and sound.’
28 “The older brother became angry and refused to go in. So his father went out and pleaded with him. 29 But he answered his father, ‘Look! All these years I’ve been slaving for you and never disobeyed your orders. Yet you never gave me even a young goat so I could celebrate with my friends. 30 But when this son of yours who has squandered your property with prostitutes comes home, you kill the fattened calf for him!’
31 “‘My son,’ the father said, ‘you are always with me, and everything I have is yours. 32 But we had to celebrate and be glad, because this brother of yours was dead and is alive again; he was lost and is found.’”
Then returned to his father.
Luke 15:11-32 New International Version (NIV)
The Parable of the Lost Son
11 Jesus continued: “There was a man who had two sons. 12 The younger one said to his father, ‘Father, give me my share of the estate.’ So he divided his property between them.
13 “Not long after that, the younger son got together all he had, set off for a distant country and there squandered his wealth in wild living. 14 After he had spent everything, there was a severe famine in that whole country, and he began to be in need. 15 So he went and hired himself out to a citizen of that country, who sent him to his fields to feed pigs. 16 He longed to fill his stomach with the pods that the pigs were eating, but no one gave him anything.
17 “When he came to his senses, he said, ‘How many of my father’s hired servants have food to spare, and here I am starving to death! 18 I will set out and go back to my father and say to him: Father, I have sinned against heaven and against you. 19 I am no longer worthy to be called your son; make me like one of your hired servants.’ 20 So he got up and went to his father.
“But while he was still a long way off, his father saw him and was filled with compassion for him; he ran to his son, threw his arms around him and kissed him.
21 “The son said to him, ‘Father, I have sinned against heaven and against you. I am no longer worthy to be called your son.’
22 “But the father said to his servants, ‘Quick! Bring the best robe and put it on him. Put a ring on his finger and sandals on his feet. 23 Bring the fattened calf and kill it. Let’s have a feast and celebrate. 24 For this son of mine was dead and is alive again; he was lost and is found.’ So they began to celebrate.
25 “Meanwhile, the older son was in the field. When he came near the house, he heard music and dancing. 26 So he called one of the servants and asked him what was going on. 27 ‘Your brother has come,’ he replied, ‘and your father has killed the fattened calf because he has him back safe and sound.’
28 “The older brother became angry and refused to go in. So his father went out and pleaded with him. 29 But he answered his father, ‘Look! All these years I’ve been slaving for you and never disobeyed your orders. Yet you never gave me even a young goat so I could celebrate with my friends. 30 But when this son of yours who has squandered your property with prostitutes comes home, you kill the fattened calf for him!’
31 “‘My son,’ the father said, ‘you are always with me, and everything I have is yours. 32 But we had to celebrate and be glad, because this brother of yours was dead and is alive again; he was lost and is found.’”
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Here’s one speaking about God’s foreknowledge. God knows exactly who to choose. He has never made a mistake in choosing those He knows will repent unto eternal life.
Ephesians 1:4
4According as He hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
Ephesians 1:4
4According as He hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
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The prodigal son is a good parable.
It starts with being with the Father. The choice is then to rebel and do ones own thing or stay with
the Father. This part of the parable is talking about jews staying in the faith or going their own way.
The son takes the blessing and then blows it on illusions and pretend ends. He finds himself broken
lost and alone. Though being with the father is restricted and constrained it is so much better than
the failure he has reached. So the son returns.
In some weird world some claim the lost son was still in the father and under his protection.
But actually the son was lost and very much separated from the father and would die there with
nothing unless he returns.
The problem is taking a human parable and spiritualising it halfway into the heavenly dimension.
A full spiritualising, the prodigal son has rejected the Kingdom and is in the world and will die in
his sins, though he came from the father. Only if he returns will he be part of the Kingdom and
receive the wages of the Kingdom, eternal life.
Only the jews can truly spiritualise this parable as they are born into Israel, gentiles are not.
A christian could spiritualise losing ones faith and going into the world to blow it all on self
indulgence. This might fit being brought up in a christian home and having imputed holiness
through the believing parents which is later rejected and walked away from.
It starts with being with the Father. The choice is then to rebel and do ones own thing or stay with
the Father. This part of the parable is talking about jews staying in the faith or going their own way.
The son takes the blessing and then blows it on illusions and pretend ends. He finds himself broken
lost and alone. Though being with the father is restricted and constrained it is so much better than
the failure he has reached. So the son returns.
In some weird world some claim the lost son was still in the father and under his protection.
But actually the son was lost and very much separated from the father and would die there with
nothing unless he returns.
The problem is taking a human parable and spiritualising it halfway into the heavenly dimension.
A full spiritualising, the prodigal son has rejected the Kingdom and is in the world and will die in
his sins, though he came from the father. Only if he returns will he be part of the Kingdom and
receive the wages of the Kingdom, eternal life.
Only the jews can truly spiritualise this parable as they are born into Israel, gentiles are not.
A christian could spiritualise losing ones faith and going into the world to blow it all on self
indulgence. This might fit being brought up in a christian home and having imputed holiness
through the believing parents which is later rejected and walked away from.
There is indeed more than one way to look at this parable.
It it’s plainest sense the Father had two sons, they never ceased to be His sons, however the younger one lost his relationship, close fellowship with the Father. If the prodigal has died in a foreign land, the obituary would have said, “ The son of ................, died in a foreign land.”
Many folks get angry, like the older son, when they see how much God can truly forgive, they want to earn their way into their relationship with God and somehow pay, for their own sins.
Though this parable illustrates bigger truths, it should be understood in its plainest sense.
It it’s plainest sense the Father had two sons, they never ceased to be His sons, however the younger one lost his relationship, close fellowship with the Father. If the prodigal has died in a foreign land, the obituary would have said, “ The son of ................, died in a foreign land.”
Many folks get angry, like the older son, when they see how much God can truly forgive, they want to earn their way into their relationship with God and somehow pay, for their own sins.
Though this parable illustrates bigger truths, it should be understood in its plainest sense.
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