Truth or Traditions of men

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posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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♪♫ where would my body be... ??
If the whole body were an eye where would be the hearing? If the whole body were hearing where would be the smelling?
But now God has set the members each one of them, in the body just as He pleased.
And if they were all one member, where would the Body be?
(1 Corinthians 12:17-19)
 

kenallen

Active member
Apr 8, 2022
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The problems of the church relate to the here and now, not to the future. There are many interpretations of future events. Not all can be right. One of the greatest problems of the church, far more troublesome than arguments about the rapture, is disunity. Paul said that those who continually sow discord should be removed from fellowship.

Psalm 133 tells us that unity is pleasing to God. It's "life for evermore". Paul rebuked the Corinthians for having cliques within the church. We will never get doctrinal in this life. People are prone to study God's word intellectually. Since Christians have different inclinations, biases and levels of understanding, we come up with different interpretations on many issues.

We must come to the place where we can agree to disagree. There are churches that split on issues that are so trivial that it's a joke. It does not honour God and it gives the world an excuse to mock and reject the truth. While Christians are splitting hairs, they are also at risk of splitting the church.

The truth about all these contentious doctrines will come out when Jesus returns. Being "right" is greatly overrated. Loving the brethren as Christ loves us, caring for one another, ensuring that no brother goes without food and clothing, praying and seeking God's kingdom, these things should be our aim, not doctrinal purity. God will reveal truth to us as we seek Him. If others don't agree, don't let pride rob you of fellowship.
That is a lot of psychobabble you might be right that churches split over crazy stuff marriages business all split for crazy reasons
 

kenallen

Active member
Apr 8, 2022
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This reply is not an attempt to reply to anyone post but a replay in general. We go back and forth about is there or is there not a rapture. I read Matthew 24, Mark 13, Luke 21, 1st Corinthians 15, 1st Thessalians 4, The parable of the wheat and the tares and 2nd Thessalians where Paul tries to make clear what He was talking about in the first letter.
People say what does it matter there are more important things to be concerned about ETC. I do not ever hear anyone going to the heart of the matter. There are 7 trumps, 7 seals, and 7 vials. 7= spiritual completeness. What happens at the 6th trump, 6th seal and the 6th vial? Satan returns "666" Revelation 9:4And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads. BUT ONLY THOSE MEN THAT HAVE NOT THE SEAL OF GOD IN THERE FOREHEAD. What is in or behind your forehead? Your brain the understanding of 666. Satan comes at the 6th trump 6th seal and 6th vial as the Antichrist setting himself up as God proclaiming himself to be God. What is his message going to be? I am God and I have come to fly you away. I am hear I am bringing peace to the world, I am going to pay off all your bills just jump into bed with me and commit spiritual adultery, worship me instead of God.
This is why it matters so much. You don't want to be the first on taken from the field or the one taken from the mill. Again read Jesus answer to the Parable of the wheat and the tares. Satan comes first the children of Satan are gathered first and then the wheat the children of God are gathered into the barn.
It is only important for you to understand the order of thing IF you want to enter The Kingdom of God.
 

TheLearner

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Jan 14, 2019
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A glorified body is what he looks like in Revelation 1. His resurrected body in those 40 days was still flesh and blood. The disciples didn't believe it, they thought they were seeing a ghost, they thought they were hallucinating, so Jesus asked for some food and ate in their presence -

But while they still did not believe for joy, and marveled, He said to them, "Have you any food here?" So they gave Him a piece of a broiled fish and some honeycomb. And he took it and ate in their presence. (Luke 24:41-43)

It's a matter of opinion that whether a glorified body still needs earthly food for sustanence. I think the answer is no, a glorified body is a heavenly body in another dimension. When Jesus rose from the dead, that was still an earthly body FOR DEMONSTRATION PURPOSE. He had not ascended to heaven YET. When he ascended to heavenly and sitting at the right hand of God, then he was in his glorified body as he appears to John in Rev. 1.
1 John 1:1
We want to tell you about the Word that gives life—the one who existed before the world began. This is the one we have heard and have seen with our own eyes. We saw what he did, and our hands touched him.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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1 Corinthians 15:17-18 plus 1 Thessalonians 4:14

From 1 Corinthians 15:50-54
:)
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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From 1 Corinthians 15:50-54
My apologies... I posted the wrong one the first time :)
 

TheLearner

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Jan 14, 2019
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Jesus glorified body bearing his scars from crucifixion, note his flogging scars aren't included in the description, show his amazed disciples that he is indeed not just their resurrected master but has conquered the death his crucifixion wrought upon him.

If we are to believe Jesus came to give his flesh, the bread of life, for the sins of the world, how would that be accomplished if he took back that sacrificed flesh when resurrected after giving his flesh as the sacrifice?
e this thought occurred to me I read Thomas' encounter carefully:

[John 20:24 ESV] Now Thomas, one of the Twelve, called the Twin, was not with them when Jesus came.

[25] So the other disciples told him, "We have seen the Lord." But he said to them, "Unless I see in his hands the mark of the nails, and place my finger into the mark of the nails, and place my hand into his side, I will never believe."

[26] Eight days later, his disciples were inside again, and Thomas was with them. Although the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said, "Peace be with you."

[27] Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here, and see my hands; and put out your hand, and place it in my side. Do not disbelieve, but believe."

[28] Thomas answered him, "My Lord and my God!"

[29] Jesus said to him, "Have you believed because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed."
 

TheLearner

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Au Contraire.

Insisting Jesus the man of flesh resurrected, contrary to what Jesus said in John 6, is denying Jesus words, mission, and sacrifice as he defined it to be and to come, and fulfilled.
I do not see how you got a non-physical body for Jesus in John 6

1 Timothy 2:5
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
 

TheLearner

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26-27 “Believe me,” replied Jesus, “you are looking for me now not because you saw my signs but because you ate that food and had all you wanted. You should not work for the food which does not last but for the food which lasts on into eternal life. This is the food the Son of Man will give you, and he is the one who bears the stamp of God the Father.”

28 This made them ask him, “What must we do to carry out the work of God?”

29 “The work of God for you,” replied Jesus, “is to believe in the one whom he has sent to you.”

30-31 Then they asked him, “Then what sign can you give us that will make us believe in you? What work are you doing? Our forefathers ate manna in the desert just as the scripture says, ‘He gave them bread out of Heaven to eat.’”

32-33 To which Jesus replied, “Yes, but what matters is not that Moses gave you bread from Heaven, but that my Father is giving you the true bread from Heaven. For the bread of God which comes down from Heaven gives life to the world.”

34 This made them say to him, “Lord, please give us this bread, always!”

35-40 Then Jesus said to them, “I myself am the bread of life. The man who comes to me will never be hungry and the man who believes in me will never again be thirsty. Yet I have told you that you have seen me and do not believe. Everything that my Father gives me will come to me and I will never refuse anyone who comes to me. For I have come down from Heaven, not to do what I want, but to do the will of him who sent me. The will of him who sent me is that I should not lose anything of what he has given me, but should raise it up when the last day comes. And this is the will of the one who sent me, that everyone who sees the Son and trusts in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up when the last day comes.”

41-42 At this, the Jews began grumbling at him because he said, “I am the bread which came down from Heaven”, remarking “Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose parents we know? How can he say that ‘I have come down from Heaven’?”

43-51 So Jesus answered them, “Do not grumble among yourselves. Nobody comes to me unless he is drawn to me by the Father who sent me, and I will raise him up when the last day comes. In the prophets it is written—‘And they shall all be taught by God,’ and this means that everybody who has heard the Father’s voice and learned from him will come to me. Not that anyone has ever seen the Father except the one who comes from God—he has seen the Father. I assure you that the man who trusts in him has eternal life already. I myself am the bread of life. Your forefathers ate manna in the desert, and they died. This is bread that comes down from Heaven, so that a man may eat it and not die. I myself am the living bread which came down from Heaven, and if anyone eats this bread he will live for ever. The bread which I will give is my body and I shall give it for the life of the world.”

52 This led to a fierce argument among the Jews, some of them saying, “How can this man give us his body to eat?”

53-58 So Jesus said to them, “Unless you do eat the body of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you are not really living at all. The man who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life and I will raise him up when the last day comes. For my body is real food and my blood is real drink. The man who eats my body and drinks my blood shares my life and I share his. Just as the living Father sent me and I am alive because of the Father, so the man who lives on me will live because of me. This is the bread which came down from Heaven! It is not like the manna which your forefathers used to eat, and died. The man who eats this bread will live for ever.”

59-60 Jesus said all these things while teaching in the synagogue at Capernaum. Many of his disciples heard him say these things, and commented, “This is hard teaching indeed; who could accept that?”

61-64a Then Jesus, knowing intuitively that his disciples were complaining about what he had just said, went on, “Is this too much for you? Then what would happen if you were to see the Son of Man going up to the place where he was before? It is the Spirit which gives life. The flesh will not help you. The things which I have told you are spiritual and are life. But some of you will not believe me.”

64b-65 For Jesus knew from the beginning which of his followers did not trust him and who was the man who would betray him. Then he added, “This is why I said to you, ‘No one can come to me unless my Father puts it into his heart to come.’”

66-67 As a consequence of this, many of his disciples withdrew and no longer followed him. So Jesus said to the twelve, “And are you too wanting to go away?”

68-69 “Lord,” answered Simon Peter, “who else should we go to? Your words have the ring of eternal life! And we believe and are convinced that you are the holy one of God.”

70 Jesus replied, “Did I not choose you twelve—and one of you has the devil in his heart?”

71 He was speaking of Judas, the son of Simon Iscariot, one of the twelve, who was planning to betray him.
 

TheLearner

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After he said this, he was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight.
Acts 1:9
When he had led them out to the vicinity of Bethany, he lifted up his hands and blessed them. While he was blessing them, he left them and was taken up into heaven.
Luke 24:50-51
They were looking intently up into the sky as he was going, when suddenly two men dressed in white stood beside them. “Men of Galilee,” they said, “why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven.”
Acts 1:10-11
After the Lord Jesus had spoken to them, he was taken up into heaven and he sat at the right hand of God.
Mark 16:19
I came from the Father and entered the world; now I am leaving the world and going back to the Father.
John 16:28
My Father’s house has many rooms; if that were not so, would I have told you that I am going there to prepare a place for you?
John 14:2
Beyond all question, the mystery from which true godliness springs is great:
He appeared in the flesh,
was vindicated by the Spirit,
was seen by angels,
was preached among the nations,
was believed on in the world,
was taken up in glory.
1 Timothy 3:16
Jesus said, “Do not hold on to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. Go instead to my brothers and tell them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”
John 20:17
Jesus said, “I am with you for only a short time, and then I am going to the one who sent me.”
John 7:33
Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father.
John 14:12
Then what if you see the Son of Man ascend to where he was before!
John 6:62
Exalted to the right hand of God, he has received from the Father the promised Holy Spirit and has poured out what you now see and hear.
Acts 2:33
 

BeeThePeace

Active member
May 2, 2022
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e this thought occurred to me I read Thomas' encounter carefully:

[John 20:24 ESV] Now Thomas, one of the Twelve, called the Twin, was not with them when Jesus came.

[25] So the other disciples told him, "We have seen the Lord." But he said to them, "Unless I see in his hands the mark of the nails, and place my finger into the mark of the nails, and place my hand into his side, I will never believe."

[26] Eight days later, his disciples were inside again, and Thomas was with them. Although the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said, "Peace be with you."

[27] Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here, and see my hands; and put out your hand, and place it in my side. Do not disbelieve, but believe."

[28] Thomas answered him, "My Lord and my God!"

[29] Jesus said to him, "Have you believed because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed."
Where does it say Thomas did as Jesus invited Thomas to do?
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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This is why it matters so much. You don't want to be the first on taken from the field or the one taken from the mill. Again read Jesus answer to the Parable of the wheat and the tares. Satan comes first the children of Satan are gathered first and then the wheat the children of God are gathered into the barn.
Assuming that this gathering of "the children of Satan" corresponds to all the severe divine judgments of the 6th and 7th seals (God's wrath), do you seriously believe that Christians will also be subject to God's wrath? If not, where exactly will they be in your imaginary "scheme"?

Was Noah placed in the Ark with his family before or after the Flood? Were Lot and his family left in Sodom until it was destroyed, or were they compelled to leave before its destruction? So what you are doing is forcing an interpretation out of a parable when there are plain Scriptures to show us the exact sequence of events.

So rightly dividing the Word of Truth matters, but you are trying to mislead people. Let's hope they do not believe your imaginary schemes.