Truth or Traditions of men

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

BeeThePeace

Active member
May 2, 2022
443
135
43
#81
.
A glorified body is what he looks like in Revelation 1. His resurrected body in those 40 days was still flesh and blood. The disciples didn't believe it, they thought they were seeing a ghost, they thought they were hallucinating, so Jesus asked for some food and ate in their presence -

But while they still did not believe for joy, and marveled, He said to them, "Have you any food here?" So they gave Him a piece of a broiled fish and some honeycomb. And he took it and ate in their presence. (Luke 24:41-43)

It's a matter of opinion that whether a glorified body still needs earthly food for sustanence. I think the answer is no, a glorified body is a heavenly body in another dimension. When Jesus rose from the dead, that was still an earthly body FOR DEMONSTRATION PURPOSE. He had not ascended to heaven YET. When he ascended to heavenly and sitting at the right hand of God, then he was in his glorified body as he appears to John in Rev. 1.
John 20

The resurrected Jesus appeared before his disciples when they were gathered together behind a locked door in the upper room.


I've never appeared in a room when its door was locked. Have you?
 

BeeThePeace

Active member
May 2, 2022
443
135
43
#82
Your explanation is that it wasn't empty; that His corpse was still there and the whole NT is a sham, all the disciples liars.

So yeah of course I reject that. I have read the Bible.
That's a lie. I never stated any such thing.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,957
13,615
113
#83
That was a re-enaction of Moses on Mount Sinai. Moses came down with God's shekinah glory, his face shone like the sun, he had to hide it behind a veil, that's where the original concept of the temple veil came from.
He was glorified. Revealed.
Just as in Revelation 1.
Before resurrection.
In the flesh.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,957
13,615
113
#84
That's a lie. I never stated any such thing.
It's the clear implication of your stated position.
So great, here is a chance to speak plainly:

Was the tomb empty?
Did He rise bodily?
 
Feb 24, 2022
1,346
288
83
#87
.
John 20

The resurrected Jesus appeared before his disciples when they were gathered together behind a locked door in the upper room.


I've never appeared in a room when its door was locked. Have you?
Well he supernaturally passed through the crowd when the mob tried to seize him. That was during his ministry.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,957
13,615
113
#88
.
John 20

The resurrected Jesus appeared before his disciples when they were gathered together behind a locked door in the upper room.


I've never appeared in a room when its door was locked. Have you?
Previously discussed. He walked on water, walked straight through people actively trying to grab Him and throw Him off a cliff, and raised the dead from their graves, bodily. What makes you think a mere wall can hold Him?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,957
13,615
113
#89
I won't repeat myself when the first posts are ignored.

Let's refresh:

Jesus' human form didn't resurrect from death
Where is His body?

What I am pointing out is that if you accept that He rose from the dead but you insist it wasn't bodily you are inexorably in contradiction.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,957
13,615
113
#90
That was usually called "transfiguration", not the same as "glorification". If that was glorification, then why was he turned back?
He hides Himself, so that the promise is by faith.

At what we typically call the transfiguration, He was revealed as the very Shekinah itself, the One in the pillar of fire and cloud, the glory that descended on the tabernacle and took Elijah up. This is testified to by two witnesses, the only two men in all scripture who had entered the Shekinah and seen Who is inside it, hidden. That is why it is Moses and Elijah.

Remember that in John 17 He prayed to be glorified with the glory He has had since the beginning, together with the Father Who `shares His glory with no one'


=]
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,957
13,615
113
#91
That was usually called "transfiguration", not the same as "glorification". If that was glorification, then why was he turned back?
This is the mystery of Philippians 2:7-10

What He set aside was His glory, the train of His robe that filled the temple. Not His deity. He is always God, never not God.
 
Feb 24, 2022
1,346
288
83
#92
He hides Himself, so that the promise is by faith.

At what we call the transformation, He was revealed as the very Shekinah itself, the One in the pillar of fire amd cloud, the glory that descended on the tabernacle and took Elijah up. This is testified to by two witnesses, the only two men in all scripture who had entered the Shekinah and seen Who is inside it, hidden.
That was a display to the inner circle of his three closest disciples - Peter, John and Jame, to show them that He is the living Son of God. As long as he had not ascended to heaven yet, he remained in his mortal form.

"Glorification" and "glorified body", on the other hand, is a theological term to describe the end point of salvation. All Christians are JUSTIFIED by their belief in Christ, then there's the lifetime process called Sanctification. At the end, after death, there's Glorification with a new body in heaven.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,957
13,615
113
#93
Where are the dead? Are they out here in a hole in the ground? No they are not. Are Father is the God of the living not of the dead. As of right now there is only one that has been sentenced to death; that is Satan. Has he been put to death? Not yet but his death sentence has been handed down and will be carried out at the appointed time by God. He is spiritually dead there is no hope for him.

**ahem**

Revelation 20:15


just a general overall comment, my dude:

if you are spiritually "unsure" and you don't quite know if you believe the gospel or not, especially if you aren't exactly sure what the gospel is -- you should not go about on theological forums speaking as though you have any authority. you should just be concentrating on asking probing questions.

JMO
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,957
13,615
113
#94
That was a display to the inner circle of his three closest disciples - Peter, John and Jame, to show them that He is the living Son of God. As long as he had not ascended to heaven yet, he remained in his mortal form.

"Glorification" and "glorified body", on the other hand, is a theological term to describe the end point of salvation. All Christians are JUSTIFIED by their belief in Christ, then there's the lifetime process called Sanctification. At the end, after death, there's Glorification with a new body in heaven.
yes & "His mortal form" is God-manifest-in-the-flesh ((1 Timothy 3:16, Hebrews 1:3, etc))
;)
 

Gideon300

Well-known member
Mar 18, 2021
5,441
3,222
113
#96
I

So I hope that helps put to rest of of the greatest lies of the church today the rapture and that dead bodies are going to come up out of the grave.

Look forward to the up coming discussion
1 Thessalonians 4:

…15By the word of the Lord, we declare to you that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who have fallen asleep. 16For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will be the first to rise. 17After that, we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord.…

There are far more destructive doctrines than nitpicking over what happens in the last days. You need to learn to study the whole of God's word instead of coming up with doctrines that are easily contradicted by other Bible passages.

It won't be dead bodies coming out of the grave. It will be resurrection, not some kind of zombie event.
Isaiah 26:19
Your dead will live; their bodies will rise. Awake and sing, you who dwell in the dust! For your dew is like the dew of the morning, and the earth will bring forth her dead.
 

BeeThePeace

Active member
May 2, 2022
443
135
43
#97
Well he supernaturally passed through the crowd when the mob tried to seize him. That was during his ministry.
He did. He was still about his fathers business.

After his resurrection he was glorified.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,957
13,615
113
#98
Jesus glorified body bearing his scars from crucifixion, note his flogging scars aren't included in the description, show his amazed disciples that he is indeed not just their resurrected master but has conquered the death his crucifixion wrought upon him.
possibly there is a simple explanation regarding the scars on His back: He would have to disrobe to show them. His hands and feet, on the other hand, are easily visible without taking off His clothes.

within that conversation in Luke 24, He specifically tells them it is He Himself - the scars prove it - not just a spirit. He eats fish and honey, further proving He is bodily risen, in the flesh - when they "
still did not believe"



If we are to believe Jesus came to give his flesh, the bread of life, for the sins of the world, how would that be accomplished if he took back that sacrificed flesh when resurrected after giving his flesh as the sacrifice?

and yet the tomb was empty: He, in His flesh, rose from the dead!
if Christ rose bodily, and we rise with Him, we also will rise bodily.


how will we have life from His flesh if His flesh has no life in it?
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
61,149
30,296
113
#99
possibly there is a simple explanation regarding the scars on His back: He would have to disrobe to
show them. His hands and feet, on the other hand, are easily visible without taking off His clothes.
Jesus invited Thomas to put his hand in the wound in His side...

Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here; see my hands. Reach out
your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe."
John 20:27

:)
 

BeeThePeace

Active member
May 2, 2022
443
135
43
Jesus invited Thomas to put his hand in the wound in His side...

Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here; see my hands. Reach out
your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe."
John 20:27

:)
Yet it is not recorded that Thomas did insert his hand,fingers,into the wounds.

Seeing them, Thomas believed.

Jesus admonished Mary after she encountered the risen Christ on the path not to touch him when she went to hug Jesus. Because he had not yet ascended to the Father.