My Walk with Christ, as an Evangelical Christian.

[VCO]

Believe the next verse which you did not quote also,
21 Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,
(ESV)

'Us' is a bigger group than Noah and his immediate family.

Non-denominational Evangelical Christian.

That still does not mean that is the BAPTISM THAT SAVES, which happened before TIME BEGAN. That Baptism in Water, is only part of our walk in OBEDIENCE, because WE LOVE HIM.

 

[presidente]

Non-denominational Evangelical Christian.

That is THREE, and therefore you have earned YOUR WAY TO My IGNORE LIST, and nothing you type will ever show up on my Screen.

I don't really like the ignore function. Another poster can write all kinds of junk about you, and you don't know it. I suppose it can reduce the stress of reading someone else's post.

I prefer sites to have a block feature. After posting on Facebook in a discussion with atheists, there was a middle-aged atheist woman who kept posting pictures of herself in a bikini on my Facebook and hounding me with constant posts that were just plain weird. I sent her a friend request, and she threatened to tell my wife. I said I didn't care. Facebook wouldn't find her in the system for me to let me block her unless I sent a friend request. After I did that, I just blocked her, and she couldn't send me anything or post on my feed.

 

[presidente]

Non-denominational Evangelical Christian.

I know this is extremely hard to read, but you need to read through the Original 1611 KJV PREFACE, which the changed shortly after the 1611 KJV came out. In that Original 1611 KJV Preface, their Translation Team, admitted IT was a Paraphrase Version, updated the language from 5 older English Versions, Correcting KNOWN ERRORS, and making sure it was the language variables THAT KING JAMES regularly SPOKE. That KNOWN ERRORS also means there Had to be UNKNOWN errors, still in that Version. That is a fact, but read it for yourself. I had to read it THREE TIMES, to make sure I understood it all.

If the KJV is completely inspired, then one should note the dedication to the king, which is part of the document, praises the virtues of other translations.

A good thing about the KJV was since a king sponsored it with their legal system, they didn't have to worry about violating copyright. If another version said it well, they could use it. Now, if a translation isn't far enough away from other translations, they cannot copyright it. So they end up coming up with suboptimal grammar and awkward or not-so-accurate wording to make the translation distinct from others. I think at some point, we exceeded the optimal number of translations, and using later translations is higher risk. Commentaries book that offer some alternative translations of passages here and there that most translations do not do the best job at might be helpful.

In places, the KJV reads word for word like the Geneva, and in other places it does not. The notes from the Geneva Bible are said to have not been very friendly to monarchies, which may have been King James' big problem with it. But I haven't found the anti-monarchical notes they speak of.

 

[presidente]

Non-denominational Evangelical Christian.

That still does not mean that is the BAPTISM THAT SAVES, which happened before TIME BEGAN. That Baptism in Water, is only part of our walk in OBEDIENCE, because WE LOVE HIM.

I Peter 3:21
"...doth also now save us " (KJV)

"...Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you...(CSB)

"Baptism is like that. It saves you now..." (CEB)

"Those flood waters were like baptism that now saves you...."(CEV)

"Corresponding to that, baptism now saves you..." (NASB)

There are many, many other translations.

 

[Thewatchman]

Peter said 'baptism now saves you...'. Do you think I am a heretic for repeating Peter's teachings?



Let's set aside your assertion there for a second, and let me ask you, did Jesus say everything in the Bible to Nicodemus? Are the parts of the New Testament that Jesus did not say to Nicodemus true?

What about Mark 16?
15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.


16 Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them.

Matthew 28
17 And when they saw him, they worshipped him: but some doubted.
18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Jesus has authority, and He went them with instructions to teach and to baptize. Peter was one of them. A few weeks later, he is preaching, and we read how he responds to the crowd.

Acts 2
37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Consider this passage:
John 3
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

I had a conversation with a friend who was a seminary student who would later become a Bible college professor in Hebrew. He said that according to the Greek the way it is constructed it indicates that baptism of water and the Spirit refer to the same baptism. But I am not sure about that. I don't know enough Greek yet to confirm this for sure.

I see the Greek
ἐξ ὕδατος καὶ Πνεύματος

ex hudatos kai Pneumatos

Maybe it is because 'ex' is only there once. Matthew 20:23 uses ek/ex for each phrase when it says 'sit on My left or My right'.

He also looked up all the references to the verse he could find in the works known as the 'church fathers' and the ones that commented on it took the verse about being born of water and the Spirit to refer to water baptism. I think there were 18 or so references, and there were speakers/readers of Greek not that far removed in time from when John was written.


You left out the part where he baptized the household of Stephanas and he couldn't remember if he baptized any other. Let's look at Acts 18:8.

And Crispus, the chief ruler of the synagogue, believed on the Lord with all his house; and many of the Corinthians hearing believed, and were baptized.

If Paul didn't baptize them, they were still baptized.



The idea of disembodied spirits going to heaven is inferred from passages like II Corinthians 5, and isn't directly stated or emphasized in scripture. Jesus and the apostles spoke about the resurrection of the dead. But be that as it may, God judges such things.

Let me give you a what if. Your pastor preaches a sermon on salvation and gives an altar call. Two men hear and want to respond. They walk down to the front, but before they can repeat a prayer or confess Jesus as Lord, this atheistic Antifa neoNazi Communist LGBT activist Muslim terrorist guy walks into the building with a shot gun, runs to the front, and shoots these two men in the back of the head and says, "Hahaha! I got them before they got saved. They're goin' to Hell." Would those who men go to Hell?




This is written to readers who are already Christians. It isn't a book about how to become a Christian.





That's a straw man argument. Peter says baptism now saves us... by the resurrection of Jesus Christ.



I quoted Peter and Paul in my last message and you respond like this. Which of these quotes from Peter and Paul that are found in the Bible do you consider to be heretical?

Presidente:

Here is what God said about his people in the old testament Jeremiah 4:22

English Standard Version
“For my people are foolish; they know me not; they are stupid children; they have no understanding. They are ‘wise’—in doing evil! But how to do good they know not.”

Berean Standard Bible
“For My people are fools; they have not known Me. They are foolish children, without understanding. They are skilled in doing evil, but they know not how to do good.”

King James Bible
For my people is foolish, they have not known me; they are sottish children, and they have none understanding: they are wise to do evil, but to do good they have no knowledge.

God says his people are foolish, they have not known me, they are sottish children(sottish means stupid) they have no understanding: they are wise to do evil but to do good they have no knowledge.

You clam to be a child of God does that make you foolish, a little stupid, know how to do evil, but to do you have no knowledge?

Here is what you said to me

Thewatchman said:

Presidente are you saying that it through baptism that we are saved?

Then you said

Peter said 'baptism now saves you...'. Do you think I am a heretic for repeating Peter's teachings?

As I read John 3 Jesus never told Nicodemus he must be baptized in order to enter the kingdom of heaven.

Let's set aside your assertion there for a second, and let me ask you, did Jesus say everything in the Bible to Nicodemus? Are the parts of the New Testament that Jesus did not say to Nicodemus true?
What about Mark 16?
15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
16 Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them.

Then you moved on to Matthew 28

Here is my reply

From reading your posts here is how I thank you would interoperate
Lets look at the verses you just used. You sent this to me: What about Mark 16?
15And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. 16Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. 17And these signs will accompany those who believe: In My name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues;d 18they will pick up snakes with their hands, and if they drink any deadly poison, it will not harm them; they will lay their hands on the sick, and they will be made well.”

Lets look at it 15 And he(the He being Jesus so Jesus is speaking) said unto them( who are the them the 11 disciples,) Go into the world and preach the gospel (“the good news of Jesus”I thank that to mean Jesus came He died on the cross, rose from the dead and is seated at the right hand of God and He will return again to gather His people and set up the millennial temple here on earth) to every creature.(So Jesus is sending out the 11 disciples to preach to gospel to the cats, the dogs, the cow, the horses, snake fish worms: they are creatures right.) Verse 16-18 Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.17And these signs will accompany those who believe: In My name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues;18they will pick up snakes with their hands, and if they drink any deadly poison, it will not harm them; they will lay their hands on the sick, and they will be made well.” And all of them (the creatures) are going to become believers, get baptized and do some or all these sings and wonders.

That is what it says right.

 

[The_Watchers_2017]

If the KJV is completely inspired, then one should note the dedication to the king, which is part of the document, praises the virtues of other translations.

no need to worry about it being Inspired:

from the Christian Publishing House:
FACTS on the TEXTUS RECEPTUS and the KING JAMES VERSION


Allan A. MacRae and Robert C. Newman
Allan Alexander MacRae was an evangelical Christian scholar

Robert C. Newman is Emeritus Professor of New Testament at Biblical Theological Seminary, and Director of the Interdisciplinary Biblical Research Institute.




How many manuscripts agree exactly with Erasmus' edition of the Greek New Testament?
There is no Greek manuscript that agrees exactly with it. Erasmus made it by combining the readings of several manuscripts, none of them earlier than the tenth century A.D., and most of them still later. In some parts of the New Testament he had no manuscript at all, but simply retranslated from the Latin Bible.

Then why bother to hunt for early manuscripts? Why not simply follow the textus receptus?
God inspired the manuscripts that came from the hands of the original writers.

^
the TR nor the KJV are Inspired according to the Scholars/Theologians who know the truth and have shared that truth with everyone!

 

[Blade]

LOL! if being an "evangelical" Christian means putting my name behind that long a man-written doctrinal statement then I will just stick to being a Christian or a follower of Jesus and I will read the Word, and let the theologians wrestle with their theological wordings.

Hmm one way to look at it I guess but he said "I Chose to Get Dr. Charles Stanley as an example of Evangelical Statement of Faith". I fully understand what he as saying and what he agrees with praise God.

wow welcome to the family... lol right from the start.

 

[Thewatchman]

President: I know I got out there a bit, got on you, but it is all done in love. Look at verse 16; I have copied it in several different versions:

New International Version
Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

New Living Translation
Anyone who believes and is baptized will be saved. But anyone who refuses to believe will be condemned.

English Standard Version
Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

Berean Standard Bible
Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

Berean Literal Bible
The one having believed and having been baptized will be saved, but the one having disbelieved will be condemned.

King James Bible
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.



The very first thing this verse says is not get baptized: But that is what you are saying it says.

The verse says: Whoever, Anyone, The one having, and He that. Believes, Believed or Believeth and is Baptized shall be saved.

What it does not say is be baptized and you shall be save. Then what does it go on to say? but he that believeth not shall be damned.

He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; The verse does not stop there does it, it goes on to say: he that IS NOT baptized shall be damned. No that is not what it says but again that is what you are trying to make verses say. It does say “He that believeth not shall be damned”




John 3:18
Whoever believes in Him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe has already been condemned, because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.

John 3:36
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life. Whoever rejects the Son will not see life. Instead, the wrath of God remains on him."

Acts 16:31
They replied, "Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved, you and your household."

Mark 1:15
And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

Luke8:12
Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.
John8:24
I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.
No where does it say you must be baptized to be forgiven your sins. i.e. saved

 

[presidente]

President: I know I got out there a bit, got on you, but it is all done in love. Look at verse 16; I have copied it in several different versions:

New International Version
Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

New Living Translation
Anyone who believes and is baptized will be saved. But anyone who refuses to believe will be condemned.

English Standard Version
Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

Berean Standard Bible
Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

Berean Literal Bible
The one having believed and having been baptized will be saved, but the one having disbelieved will be condemned.

King James Bible
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.



The very first thing this verse says is not get baptized: But that is what you are saying it says.

1. No. The verse doesn't say that.
2. Your first sentence is so oddly worded, I don't think anyone is quite sure what you mean.
3. I think you are just guessing at what I am 'saying it says.'

The verse says: Whoever, Anyone, The one having, and He that. Believes, Believed or Believeth and is Baptized shall be saved.

What it does not say is be baptized and you shall be save.

I did not say that either. The verse I quoted from I Peter says that baptism now saves us, not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God by the resurrection of Jesus Christ. In Colossians 3, Paul says we are buried with him in baptism, wherein we are also raised with him through faith in the operation of God who raised him from the dead.

Then what does it go on to say? but he that believeth not shall be damned.

He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; The verse does not stop there does it, it goes on to say: he that IS NOT baptized shall be damned. No that is not what it says but again that is what you are trying to make verses say.

No, I am not trying to make it say that. I quoted the verse, and you asserted that I am trying to make it say things I did not post or hint at.


It does say “He that believeth not shall be damned”

Acts 16:31
They replied, "Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved, you and your household."

If you quote a bit more of this passage, this man and his household believed and were baptized also.

31So they said, “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household.” 32Then they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to all who were in his house. 33And he took them the same hour of the night and washed their stripes. And immediately he and all his family were baptized. 34Now when he had brought them into his house, he set food before them; and he rejoiced, having believed in God with all his household.
(NKJV)

No where does it say you must be baptized to be forgiven your sins. i.e. saved

But Peter does say this in Acts 2
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

So was Peter wrong to present this to them in this way? If not, why am I wrong for quoting scriptures that shake up people's dogma a bit?

 

[VCO]

I don't really like the ignore function. Another poster can write all kinds of junk about you, and you don't know it. I suppose it can reduce the stress of reading someone else's post.

I prefer sites to have a block feature. After posting on Facebook in a discussion with atheists, there was a middle-aged atheist woman who kept posting pictures of herself in a bikini on my Facebook and hounding me with constant posts that were just plain weird. I sent her a friend request, and she threatened to tell my wife. I said I didn't care. Facebook wouldn't find her in the system for me to let me block her unless I sent a friend request. After I did that, I just blocked her, and she couldn't send me anything or post on my feed.

Non-denominational Evangelical Christian.

I agree, but this site will not let us BLOCK someone, so we use what they have Provided. Certain individuals seem to live for irritating others, or Attack someone with a different point of view, and, what is baffling is then think they have done what God wants them to do. The IGNORE rule, only forces them to change individuals they feel obligated to attack. That Type of person, will almost NEVER want to tell us what Church type they go to, probably to protect their desire to remain anonymous lest their Pastors or Elders councils them that they were Wrong, on their online chats. I do not know what causes them to think like that. The one we got here, is not as bad as they come. In fact I used to post on the Christian Forum, on another site, where they let every one in, to the Christian Forum, that wanted to come in, even Athiests, Satanist, and the Cults, WITH NO SUPERVISION. I got called all kinds of names, even filthy names, and Nasty Hecklings, so yes, the world HATES, those who want to Love the Lord. I guess that is why I was Hoping everyone would like Posting their denomination or Religious affiliation, because I have seen How Bad It Can Get.

I guess they never heard of this Verse:

Philippians 4:5 (NKJV)
5 Let your gentleness be known to all men. The Lord is at hand.

 

[VCO]

Hmm one way to look at it I guess but he said "I Chose to Get Dr. Charles Stanley as an example of Evangelical Statement of Faith". I fully understand what he as saying and what he agrees with praise God.

wow welcome to the family... lol right from the start.

Non-denominational Evangelical Christian.

I like your Avatar.

 

[VCO]

I Peter 3:21
"...doth also now save us " (KJV)

"...Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you...(CSB)

"Baptism is like that. It saves you now..." (CEB)

"Those flood waters were like baptism that now saves you...."(CEV)

"Corresponding to that, baptism now saves you..." (NASB)

There are many, many other translations.

Non-denominational Evangelical Christian.

It still is talking about the Holy Spirit is HE who emersed us into the spiritual Body of Christ.

Revelation 13:8 (HCSB)
8 All those who live on the earth will worship him, everyone whose name was not written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who was slaughtered.

Revelation 13:8 (NCV)
8 And all who live on earth will worship the beast—all the people since the beginning of the world whose names are not written in the Lamb’s book of life. The Lamb is the One who was killed.

You can NEVER convince me, because HE revealed that Spiritual Truth to me several decades ago.

You see, I used to believe water baptism saved, THEN THE LORD HIMSELF, REVEALED HE WAS TALKING ABOUT SPIRITUAL BAPTISM.

1 Corinthians 12:13 (HCSB)
13 For we were all baptized by one Spirit into one body—
whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free—and we were all made to drink of one Spirit.

Even the Thief on the Cross, before the beginning of the world.

 

[VCO]

Non-denominational Evangelical Christian.

Here is why I prefer to read the Holman's Christian Standard Bible.

It gives me a sufficiently modern English Translation, while maintaining a High Degree of Reverence for GOD.

Here is what I mean, I increased the size of the portion of the Verse that I want you to see:

Malachi 3:6 (HCSB)
6 “Because I, Yahweh, have not changed,
you descendants of Jacob have not been destroyed.

Genesis 4:26 (HCSB)
26 A son was born to Seth also, and he named him Enosh.
At that time people began to call on the name of Yahweh.

Genesis 15:7 (HCSB)
7 He also said to him, “I am Yahweh who brought you from Ur of the Chaldeans to give you this land to possess.”

Ezekiel 6:7 (HCSB)
7 The slain will fall among you, and you will know that I am Yahweh.

Ezekiel 37:6 (HCSB)
6 I will put tendons on you, make flesh grow on you, and cover you with skin. I will put breath in you so that you come to life.
Then you will know that I am Yahweh.”

Isaiah 43:10-11 (HCSB)
10 “You are My witnesses”— ⌊this is⌋ the LORD’s declaration— “and My servant whom I have chosen, so that you may know and believe Me and understand that I am He. No god was formed before Me, and there will be none after Me.
11 I, I am Yahweh, and there is no other Savior but Me.

 

[mustaphadrink]

Non-denominational Evangelical Christian.

That is THREE, and therefore you have earned YOUR WAY TO My IGNORE LIST, and nothing you type will ever show up on my Screen.

Here is one verse you don't even know you Violated, and it is sin:

1 Timothy 5:1 (ESV)
1 Do not rebuke an older man but encourage him as you would a father, younger men as brother

Bye, Bye.

So how old are you? If you are not 81 plus, I am not rebuking an older man. And it doesn't bother me one little bit if you want to isolate yourself.

 

[presidente]

So how old are you? If you are not 81 plus, I am not rebuking an older man. And it doesn't bother me one little bit if you want to isolate yourself.

But your toothy Pac-Man smiley face avatar looks so young.

 

[Thewatchman]

Presidente:

You are so hung up on 1Petter 3:21 that you can not see the forest of the trees. Your forest must be cherry trees the way you pick. Do you even know the subject that is being talked about? I hope you will take the time to read this and if it is for you good if not I hope it helps someone else

Verse 18
New Living Translation
Christ suffered for our sins once for all time. He never sinned, but he died for sinners to bring you safely home to God. He suffered physical death, but he was raised to life in the Spirit.
Berean Literal Bible
because Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, so that He might bring you to God, having been put to death indeed in the flesh, but having been made alive in the spirit,
King James Bible
For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

Jesus suffered and died for each and everyone of us, He paid the price for our sins in the flesh and then was made alive in the spirit.

Verse 19

New International Version
After being made alive, he went and made proclamation to the imprisoned spirits—

Berean Standard Bible
in whom He also went and preached to the spirits in prison

Berean Literal Bible
in which also having gone, He preached to the spirits in prison

King James Bible
By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;

These are the spirits of those that die before Jesus came to to earth and died without the opportunity to have there sins forgiven from the time of Noah to Jesus death on the cross. This is how good and fair God is He gives each and everyone of us the opportunity to repent and believe in Him.


Verse 20

English Standard Version
because they formerly did not obey, when God’s patience waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were brought safely through water.

Berean Standard Bible
who disobeyed long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In the ark a few people, only eight souls, were saved through water.

Berean Literal Bible
at one time having disobeyed, when the longsuffering of God was waiting in the days of Noah, of the ark being prepared, in which a few--that is, eight souls--were saved through water,

King James Bible
Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

God saved Noah and his family from the effects of the fallen angles by the water of the flood.

Verse 21

English Standard Version
Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

Berean Standard Bible
And this water symbolizes the baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body, but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God—through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

Berean Literal Bible
which also prefigures the baptism now saving you, not a putting away of the filth of flesh, but the demand of a good conscience toward God, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

King James Bible
The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

You are not going to get rid of the filth of the flesh body and it's nature until you pass away. However, just as the water floated the ark to give salvation to Noah from the flood, so also your baptism of a good conscience toward God, which is by your faith in the resurrection of Jesus Christ shall save us today. The one is a type of cleansing, but don't loose sight of the fact that it is only a type. The only thing that can cleanse you from your sins is the shed blood of Jesus Christ on the cross. Jesus was the only pure one that could pay the price because wee all fall short of God's law. You can't get rid of the flesh as long as you are in it, and flesh is sin.

 

[presidente]

English Standard Version
Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

Berean Standard Bible
And this water symbolizes the baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body, but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God—through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

Berean Literal Bible
which also prefigures the baptism now saving you, not a putting away of the filth of flesh, but the demand of a good conscience toward God, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

King James Bible
The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

You are not going to get rid of the filth of the flesh body and it's nature until you pass away. However, just as the water floated the ark to give salvation to Noah from the flood, so also your baptism of a good conscience toward God, which is by your faith in the resurrection of Jesus Christ shall save us today. The one is a type of cleansing, but don't loose sight of the fact that it is only a type. The only thing that can cleanse you from your sins is the shed blood of Jesus Christ on the cross. Jesus was the only pure one that could pay the price because wee all fall short of God's law. You can't get rid of the flesh as long as you are in it, and flesh is sin.

When they baptized, they used water. Jews were used to this. If a man had an ejaculation, or a woman had a period, or if someone touched a dead body, or there were issues of blood or various other things, they washed their bodies with water, a baptism. John said to be baptized for the forgiveness of sins. Many of them took the prophet up on the offer. Then the disciples baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins.

It is clear that Peter used water when he baptized, or in this case they used water when they baptized according to Peter's instruction

Acts 10
Then Peter answered, 47 “Can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?” 48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to stay a few days.
(NKJV)

Look at Jesus' words at the end of Luke and the end of Matthew. The apostles had a message, that the Messiah had to suffer and be raised from the dead on the third day, and that repentance and remission of sins must be preached in his name to all nations. The Lord wanted them to teach the nations and to baptize them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. When he preached salvation through the name of Jesus in Acts 2, Peter says to repent and be baptized-- the sufferings of the Messiah, the resurrection, repentance, and faith through his name like Jesus said in Luke 24, and baptism like Jesus said in Matthew 28. See also Mark 16. So here Peter is preaching for the first time among nations and baptizing them (first time--with the possible exception of the almost quasi-Jewish Samaritans). So when he commands for the to be baptized in the name of the Lord, they use water, which we know because he says 'Can anyone forbid water...' Wasn't it good of God to allow us to have this information in these verses?

Also notice in the verses you quote above about baptism, Peter was just talking about the waters of the flood, and how that symbolizes baptism. If he were talking about the Spirit baptizing into the body, why would he mention water? The Spirit baptizes into the body. The scripture does not say that the Spirit baptizes us in water. God told men to do that. Jesus baptizes in the Holy Spirit. The Spirit baptizes into the body. God's human servants baptize other people in water.

You are not going to get rid of the filth of the flesh body and it's nature until you pass away.

I don't agree with your interpretation here. Peter was Jewish, and his Jewish readers familiar with baptism would have been familiar with using a mikveh to wash away ceremonial uncleanness after a woman's period, touching a dead body, etc. Baptism does not save us by washing away fleshly filth. This is again more evidence that he has water baptism in view (@FlyingDove) since why would someone thinking the Spirit baptizing believers into the body washes away dirt off the body or even think of that when it comes to ceremonial uncleanness? It is not the washing away of the filth of the flesh in water baptism that saves, but rather the answer of a good conscience toward God by the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

And notice 'by the resurrection of Jesus Christ.' Compare to Colossians 2 where Paul says that in baptism were are buried with Christ, wherein we are also raised with Him through faith in the operation of God who raised Him from the dead. See also Romans 6:3-5.

 

[ResidentAlien]

Non-denominational Evangelical Christian.

You don't get it, do you ? ? ?

It has been my Experience, the only people who cannot explain BORN AGAIN, are those who are YET, to be BORN AGAIN. No, it is not what you may think, with all the Bells and Whistles. I will wait and tell you, after the Lord humbles you. The Lord had drive great sobing TEARS for hours, over my utter Sinfulness.

I'll save you the trouble. . .three. Bye-bye.

 

[Thewatchman]

1. No. The verse doesn't say that.
2. Your first sentence is so oddly worded, I don't think anyone is quite sure what you mean.
3. I think you are just guessing at what I am 'saying it says.'



I did not say that either. The verse I quoted from I Peter says that baptism now saves us, not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God by the resurrection of Jesus Christ. In Colossians 3, Paul says we are buried with him in baptism, wherein we are also raised with him through faith in the operation of God who raised him from the dead.



No, I am not trying to make it say that. I quoted the verse, and you asserted that I am trying to make it say things I did not post or hint at.


It does say “He that believeth not shall be damned”



If you quote a bit more of this passage, this man and his household believed and were baptized also.

31So they said, “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household.” 32Then they spoke the word of the Lord to him and to all who were in his house. 33And he took them the same hour of the night and washed their stripes. And immediately he and all his family were baptized. 34Now when he had brought them into his house, he set food before them; and he rejoiced, having believed in God with all his household.
(NKJV)



But Peter does say this in Acts 2
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

So was Peter wrong to present this to them in this way? If not, why am I wrong for quoting scriptures that shake up people's dogma a bit?

Here is copies of the verse lets look at just what it says

Berean Literal Bible
The one having believed and having been baptized will be saved, but the one having disbelieved will be condemned.

King James Bible
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

The very first requirement in both verses is believing in Jesus.

I have asked this type question of you before;and never got an answer but I am going to put it a different way. I was in the Navy when I got saved, We were underway it could be weeks or even months before we got into port. There was not a bathtub, there was not a place on board that ship to get baptized the day I got saved and it was a Sunday morning service no one even talked to be about baptism. Thank God this did not happen to me but what would have happened if the ship would have been attacked (I am a Vietnam Vet) I was killed and was never baptized would I end up like the person in the second half of this verse? Would I be sentenced to hell for ever because I was unable to get of the ship go to the beach and get dunked in the ocean, or a pool,lake etc.

Death bed confession same thing unable to be baptized good or not?

You go to church one Sunday because you feel you need to get right with Jesus. You live in Fargo N.D. It is 25 below 0 you go to church anyway, you hear a good sermon and they give an alter call you are ready to go .I want to give my live to Jesus. You pray you tell God I believe in you, Jesus I know you came to earth you died for me please forgive me of my sins. There is one problem it is 25 below and the water pipes froze there is no water so no baptism to day. I am on my way home I am singing to Jesus and hit a patch of black ice I go over the 30 ft bank head long into the rocks and die. Where do I go Heaven of hell. According to you it is hell. I just do not believe that. My God is kinder than that, more loving than that. There would not be a maybe yes maybe no it would be YS HEAVEN NO QUESTIONS ASKED!

As I have said before I believe that you should be baptized. You read the passage you find out He is talking about 8 people Noah and his family.

 

[FlyingDove]

When they baptized, they used water. Jews were used to this. If a man had an ejaculation, or a woman had a period, or if someone touched a dead body, or there were issues of blood or various other things, they washed their bodies with water, a baptism. John said to be baptized for the forgiveness of sins. Many of them took the prophet up on the offer. Then the disciples baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins.

It is clear that Peter used water when he baptized, or in this case they used water when they baptized according to Peter's instruction

Acts 10
Then Peter answered, 47 “Can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?” 48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to stay a few days.
(NKJV).

Water was the OT physical purification shadow of the ultimate NT Spiritual purification process to come. Seen at the 1st post Pentecost Acts 2:4 (JEWS ONLY)

Then several years later Acts 10 at the Italian gentile Cornelius house

Acts 10:
44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.

45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

(MY NOTE: As Peter speaks (vs44) The Holy Spirit indwells the believing gentiles. Witnessing Jews are astonished to see, Gentiles that believed in Christ/s death & resurrection receive God's gift of the Holy Spirit/eternal life. No repentance of any kind was done, No water baptism (it comes later), No circumcision, they brought no sin sacrifice to the Temple, No Mosaic law keeping etc!

1 Cor 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

(MY NOTE: Only Christ baptizes with the Holy Spirit [Matt 3:11, Lk 3:16, Mk 1:8, Jn 1:33]. Christ's Holy Spirit baptism is salvations ETERNAL SEAL [Eph 1:13, 2 Cor 1:22 & Eph 4:30]

Col 2:11 In Him you were also circumcised with a circumcision not made with hands, but by the [spiritual] circumcision of Christ in the stripping off of the body of the flesh [the sinful carnal nature]

(MY NOTE: OT covenant circumcision was physical & done/performed with hands. The NT circumcision is Spiritual & performed/done by the Lord Jesus without hands. (Also see Deut 30:6)

Eph 4:
4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;

(MY NOTE: One body/church, one Spirit/Holy Spirit. The King James translators capitalized Spirit showing deity)

5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism,

(MY NOTE: One Lord = Jesus, one baptism = Holy Spirit & one faith = the faith OF Christ [Gal 2:16, 2:20, 3:22, Rom 3:22] & those that place their faith in Christ)

Emblem definition: a symbolic representation of a particular quality or concept.

Water baptism is an emblem of the true NT spiritual baptism/circumcision/covenant seal. Done only by Christ & without hands.

Water baptism is an outwardly public declaration of the inner spiritual change & identifying oneself with the death, burial & resurrection of Chris.

Today water baptism is neither a conduit nor a requirement for salvation. As you see in Acts 10.