WHO IS REALLY BORN AGAIN?
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Has anyone in this forum suggested otherwise?
Again you use a faulty translation. Why?
The correct translation employs the present progressive tense:
1John 3:6a, "No one who lives in him keeps on sinning."
1John 3:9a, "No one who is born of God will continue to sin...".
That this translation is correct is obvious per 1John 1:8-9.
Those who say that Christians can never be lost no matter what behavior they practice certainly do.
This what a user recently wrote and my response:
User: "Works-based salvation saves nobody, and works of self-effort do not serve to retain a salvation that can never be lost. Scripture makes not even a hint at the idea that the saved can ever become unsealed from Holy Spirit and/or unborn again from having become a new creation."
Me: "This is what the Valentinian gnostics believed. They thought they could never be lost no matter what behavior they practiced because they were spiritual by nature. "
Amazing, yet we all have sinned and even after belief to he is risen. Now ask yourself. Do you want to not sin anymore? Do you or have you turned to God for your salvation given by Son for you?
Then continue in belief to get seen though it all, to stop sin and never of yourself doing it. What????????????? but I got to!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Yes, that is truth. Yet no other flesh could ever do perfect. None, but Son did that. Now Son was born of the Spirit of God through woman, Mary from the tribe of Judah!
To go to the cross and die once for us all as forgiven, reconciled, ready to get saved in the risen Life of Christ, not the death or any self effort to be perfect or do better, as is already done first by Son, done once for us all too either decide to believe God Father or not
Hebrews 10:10, John 19:30, John 1:29, All sin taken out of the way for us all to now enter the throne of grace with Father, Daddy, PaPa, and recieve great news, God loves us so deeply, Son went willingly in our deserved death for us first. To give us new life in his risen Life, once anyone decides to believe this truth from God for them.
God seals these, Eph 1:13, one, many see and learn from mistakes we all make and have made and might make again. Phil 1:6 Who carries on the work? Not me, thank you Father, Son Holy Spirit
Ephesians 3:18-19,
I am willing, not my flesh will anymore, your will Daddy, not mine. I know this is not easy to stand in, yet I am willing to learn from all things, anyone else?
There is a lot of people saying they are led of the Spirit, born again.
But they are not.
1Jn 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
1Jn 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
1Jn 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
1Jn 3:10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.
Those that are with God and those of the world are separated by their behavior.
Not saying faith alone not caring about acting Christlike although more than likely they will have toned it down.
But a little leaven leavens the whole bunch.
And if you break the least of the commandments you broke them all.
2Ti 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
The Lord knows them that are His having this seal that they have to abstain from sin.
Saying faith alone does not seal us but our behavior seals us.
2Ti 3:4 lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
2Ti 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
2Ti 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
Not all people come to that truth but deny the Spirit to lead them and love sin more than God but think they have salvation.
Saying faith alone and we cannot abstain from sin.
But they sin on purpose and then think they are alright.
But they had the choice not to sin so what is the excuse.
Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
If a person holds on to sin then the blood of Christ cannot wash it away.
If they say they cannot abstain from sin or sin does not affect their relationship with God then they are holding on to sin.
But this is a warning to people that did receive the knowledge of the truth.
The people that deny the power thereof and love sin more than God do not come to the truth.
And Jesus said He never knew them for they did not do the will of the Father to do righteousness.
Luk 12:47 And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes.
Luk 12:48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.
The world is in trouble for their sins but they think they can get away with it.
They should know better but not all people come to the truth for they will not let go of the flesh because they enjoy it.
Gen 19:25 And he overthrew those cities, and all the plain, and all the inhabitants of the cities, and that which grew upon the ground.
Gen 19:26 But his wife looked back from behind him, and she became a pillar of salt.
Luk 17:31 In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back.
Luk 17:32 Remember Lot's wife.
Luk 9:62 And Jesus said unto him, No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God.
A person that is saved cannot look back to their sinful lifestyle like Lot's wife was saved from Sodom and Gomorrah and looked back and was turned in to a pillar of salt.
And do not say it would not be so bad if she was turned in to a pillar of sugar trying to sugarcoat it like your denominations.
1Co 13:13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.
Gal 5:6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.
Charity, love in action, works, is greater than faith, and faith works by love.
Everything stems from love not faith.
No love then no faith.
1Co 13:5 thinketh no evil;
1Co 13:6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth.
Love does not sin.
1Co 13:2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
Jas 2:16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
Jas 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
Jas 2:22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
Jas 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
1Jn 3:17 But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?
1Jn 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.
Paul, James, and John say the same thing.
Love is only valid if it is done in works.
We are saved by faith, and not by works when we first confess Christ for that is all we can do.
But when we receive the Spirit we have to have works of love to have faith active.
For we must have the right perspective of faith that God's kingdom is love and act accordingly.
Gal 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Gal 5:23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
1Co 10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.
There is no excuse so that means it is required of us.
God is not going to say I gave you the power to abstain from sin but it is alright if you want to sin.
But we are in the flesh and have the capability to sin if we want.
If we sin we should repent not wanting the sin again and allow the Spirit to lead us.
Those that deny the power thereof do not come to that truth.
God knows the heart whether you are holding on to sin or not.
You were bought with a very costly price. If you think God makes purchasing mistakes .... ????
1 Corinthians 7:23
You were bought at a price; do not become slaves of men.
Maybe God is more gracious than us or maybe they never really believed and are not saved. Either way, I won't second guess God, He knows what He is doing. If you are in Christ, how can you die spiritually? Truth is you can't which, is why if you persist in sinning, you will die the sin unto death. God is not mocked.
1 John 5:16
If anyone sees his brother sinning a sin which does not lead to death, he will ask, and He will give him life for those who commit sin not leading to death. There is sin leading to death. I do not say that he should pray about that.
You'd think Paul would have warned them about losing their salvation if it were possible in the following, but he doesn't.
1Cor.11:29-31
29 For he who eats and drinks in an unworthy manner eats and drinks judgment to himself, not discerning the Lord’s body. 30 For this reason many are weak and sick among you, and many sleep. 31 For if we would judge ourselves, we would not be judged.
No, not the same belief. Your Valentinian's based their belief on their nature, ie being spiritual. OSAS people base their belief on what God has done and on His nature ie. adopted you and being gracious and merciful.
Minor detail. OSAS believe they can never be spritually unborn, which is no different than believing a spiritual nature saves.
You also missed the point of @Me_Clay in that the person had to be without remorse, conviction or change.
The argument that those who hold to the doctrine of eternal security also promote a 'license to sin" is pure fallacy. Anyone who knows what the doctrine is and why, knows with absolute confidence that anyone who tried to live a life of sin once they are saved, will end up in a worse position in this life than if they were never saved to begin with. They will become weak, sick and eventually die earlier than they needed.
No it doesn't, again that is your assumption. To be spiritual I must be led by the Spirit. If I live as a sinner, I am being led by my flesh and therefore are not spiritual.
It appears you do not understand the doctrine as well as you think.
No they didn't. Apart from the fact there were differences in belief among the gnostics, fundamentally they saw the physical as evil which is why they held the spiritual in the position they did.
“Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.”
1 John 5:1 KJV
“But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.”
John 1:12-13 KJV
“Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
John 8:31-32 KJV
“Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.”
John 18:37 KJV
“Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently: being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. For All flesh is as grass, And all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withereth, and the flower thereof falleth away: But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you.”
1 Peter 1:22-25 KJV
“For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
…So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.”
Romans 10:13-14, 17 KJV
“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;
but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
Mark 16:15-16