Trinity

[Jordon]

Because when it comes to the word of God?
You belittle it.

You are belittling the Word of God.
Belittling the Lord Jesus Christ. John 1:1 !

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.​

​

....... ​

You have God the Holy Spirit inside you.... Indwelling permanently.
That does not make you God.

antagonistic

 

[Genez]

Jesus isn't talking about the Holy Spirit here and you know it.

Yes... I know it.

So my question is....

How is the Spirit of the Holy Spirit different than the Father who is Spirit?
They are not the same.
Yet both share in the same Spirit of the Father.

Keep in mind:

The Holy Spirit is two natures in union.
Just like Jesus is two natures in union.

I am hoping to make a point here.

 

[Genez]

antagonistic

Funny... That is what I get from you.
In this format we can easily misread another.

 

[lrs68]

Yes... I know it.

So my question is....

How is the Spirit of the Holy Spirit different than the Father who is Spirit?
They are not the same.
Yet both share in the same Spirit of the Father.

Keep in mind:

The Holy Spirit is two natures in union.
Just like Jesus is two natures in union.

I am hoping to make a point here.

Ask Peter because he connected them as being the same. I think he knows better than we do.

 

[Jordon]

Funny... That is what I get from you.
In this format we can easily misread another.

Its hilarious you haven't seen your own medicine being dished back to you by now, but then again you always have been difficult to talk to, and that's putting it nicely, . It's called giving you a friendly jab, but you need to be careful as I could give you a right cross, but you need to keep in mind my left cross

Just my boxing discipleship lingo,

 

[Aaron56]

First and foremost the understanding of the trinity is in a gray light. Although all three are equal does not mean there is not a supreme authority. Jesus said and did only what the father told him. The Holy Spirit was sent by Jesus.
Jesus is the mediator between God and man. No man comes to the father except by me.
Jesus was given all authority.....to be given something means it was possessed by some one else.
The equality comes in the form of like mindedness. Total agreement, absolute perfect obedience in mind body and spirit.
Executing perfect judgment, mercy, grace, and love.
This can be only found in a divine person.who knows the end from the beginning both spiritual and physical.

I agree with everything you wrote.

So here’s a question: if the Father, Son, and Spirit are in total agreement (they are!) then what was the need for more than one?

 

[Aaron56]

Perhaps our obsession with hierarchy confounds our understanding of "One". We demand to know who is in charge, or, more likely, who gets to rule over whom.

In a parable, Jesus came to the following conclusion: "And the King will answer and say to them, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me.’"

We may extrapolate this understanding: those who are the Lord's should be treated as though they are actually Him, indeed.

This is further emphasized by the Lord's prayer in John 17:

20 “I do not pray for these alone, but also for those who will believe in Me through their word; 21 that they all may be one, as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us, that the world may believe that You sent Me. 22 And the glory which You gave Me I have given them, that they may be one just as We are one: 23 I in them, and You in Me; that they may be made perfect in one, and that the world may know that You have sent Me, and have loved them as You have loved Me."

This isn't Jesus wishing things into being. He is declaring what is true by His sovereignty (and all authority in heaven and on earth was given to Him) By this foundational principle, there is no argument against Him that may stand.

To carry this further, Paul revealed that we are indeed "..members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones."
If we pair this with Jesus' declaration that He and Father are One, can we conclude that anything done against one in Christ is done against the Father?

It would seem that God has made Himself vulnerable here as only God can do: by declaring Himself so. Just as the Living God has no need unless He says He does, He also is invulnerable unless He makes Himself otherwise.

Certainly nothing threatens God's agency. No. Nothing may diminish His power except Himself. But His Body, on this side of eternity, is not invulnerable. We may be killed and be hurt or injured. Knowing this, and to keep us from meting out revenge on others, He stops our hand of retribution with another declaration:

Paul wrote: "Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord."

Payment for the debt incurred against us is the Lord's to repay. We should understand this as the Lord's personal responsibility. Paul even exercised this grace, that of the Lord's repayment for harm against himself, against Alexander the coppersmith:

"Alexander the coppersmith did me much harm. May the Lord repay him according to his works."

Pro tip: you don't want to be that guy when the Lord settles the debt.

But the observance is this: even though we are one in Him, by His own declaration, some functions within Himself are reserved for Himself, alone.

Are we part of Him? Yep. Are we part of His Body? Absolutely. Can we do everything He can do? Nope. Only what He permits. That's the distinction between the Head and the Body: the Head commands the Body, not the other way around.

More in a bit...

My brothers and sisters, was this too obscure? I thought it might prompt some further discussion but alas.

 

[Aaron56]

Men are souls.

Not quite:

”Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you completely; and may your whole spirit, soul, and body be preserved blameless at He who calls you is faithful, who also will do it.”

 

[Genez]

Or you don't misrepresent Biblical Verses.

It may take believers several years to finally mature into, depending on their background influences in our early years.
Maturing is a process of learning... making mistakes.. and finding corrections.

Those who refuse correction fail the humility test.
We all need to be corrected to reach full maturity in Christ.
Humility is actually being teachable. .

Corrections must come, because?
His ways are not our ways.
Too often, false teaching has appeal to believers who are yet strongly geared towards their own ways of reasoning.

“For my thoughts are not your thoughts,​

neither are your ways my ways,”​

declares the Lord.​

“As the heavens are higher than the earth,​

so are my ways higher than your ways​

and my thoughts than your thoughts." Isaiah 55:8-9​

Those who will gravitate to false doctrines have an affinity for teachings that will agree with their not yet matured thinking.

Trust in the Lord with all your heart​

and lean not on your own understanding." Proverbs 3:5​

That is a problem that must be solved via prayer and seeking for sound doctrinal teaching.
Many teachings will not be over all sound doctrine.

For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. ​

Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number ​

of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 2 Timothy 4:3​

That is what we are facing today.

 

[Jordon]

It may take believers several years to finally mature into, depending on their background influences in our early years.
Maturing is a process of learning... making mistakes.. and finding corrections.

Those who refuse correction fail the humility test.
We all need to be corrected to reach full maturity in Christ.
Humility is actually being teachable. .

Corrections must come, because?
His ways are not our ways.
Too often, false teaching has appeal to believers who are yet strongly geared towards their own ways of reasoning.

“For my thoughts are not your thoughts,​

neither are your ways my ways,”​

declares the Lord.​

“As the heavens are higher than the earth,​

so are my ways higher than your ways​

and my thoughts than your thoughts." Isaiah 55:8-9​

Those who will gravitate to false doctrines have an affinity for teachings that will agree with their not yet matured thinking.

Trust in the Lord with all your heart​

and lean not on your own understanding." Proverbs 3:5​

That is a problem that must be solved via prayer and seeking for sound doctrinal teaching.
Many teachings will not be over all sound doctrine.

For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. ​

Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number ​

of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 2 Timothy 4:3​

That is what we are facing today.

I believe that is quite commons that people really to only mellow out the older they get, of course you could still pack a punch when your 80, but my guess is by then the chances of you being a knockout with God, would depend on whether you've been pleasant and kind, speaking about humility and being respectful, as well, if your looking for perfection in every way, could you not miss understanding for teaching, when your busy trying to find those few good perfect teachers are you to busy looking for it in everybody ?,

And who would those few good teachers be ? People that you don't know whether they run and honest church, or people that do run an honest church, ?

Would you say there's only a few good teachers when it comes to people who run honest churches ?

 

[God-fearing]

I agree with everything you wrote.

So here’s a question: if the Father, Son, and Spirit are in total agreement (they are!) then what was the need for more than one?

To know God as the father ......the only God.
To know God as a savior......Christ the expressed image of God...his mercy, kindness, and faithfulness, willingness to forgive, to give his life for ours.
To know God's spirit, .....gentleness meekness patience, long suffering. Above all else his love. To guide and teach you his holy ways.

The 3 bear witness of the truth.

 

[Genez]

Not quite:

”Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you completely; and may your whole spirit, soul, and body be preserved blameless at He who calls you is faithful, who also will do it.”

Men are souls.
Angels are spirits. (Hebrews 1:14)
Being a soul does not mean we do not also have a spiritual modifier for our soul (a human spirit) that gives ability to our soul for our spiritual perception.

And Jehovah God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; ​

and man became a living soul. Gen 2:7​

Man was created a soul.
A living soul.
A soul created with a human spirit intact to know God with.
Created spiritually alive.
Man became a living soul.
But, a soul, nonetheless.

When Adam ate the forbidden fruit?
He became a dead soul spiritually.
Hence... He ate, and died.
He lost his functional human spirit.

When we become born again, we receive from the Holy Spirit a human spirit to enable our soul to enter into spiritual realities that were not possible before regeneration.

​

Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit. You should not be surprised at my saying, ​

‘You must be born again.’ John 3:6-7​

​

John 3:6 - Giving birth to spirit".. is not to be confused with the indwelling Holy Spirit.
For the Holy Spirit does not give birth to Himself.
He gives birth to our human spirit for our soul's spiritual ability.

grace and peace ...........

 

[Genez]

I believe that is quite commons that people really to only mellow out the older they get, of course you could still pack a punch when your 80, but my guess is by then the chances of you being a knockout with God, would depend on whether you've been pleasant and kind, speaking about humility and being respectful, as well, if your looking for perfection in every way, could you not miss understanding for teaching, when your busy trying to find those few good perfect teachers are you to busy looking for it in everybody ?,

And who would those few good teachers be ? People that you don't know whether they run and honest church, or people that do run an honest church, ?

Would you say there's only a few good teachers when it comes to people who run honest churches ?

If they were truly honest?
They would not try to fake it and level with you, that they do not understand a passage.
Many are honest in one way, but fall short in the teaching itself.

We should not be busy seeking for a good pastor-teacher.
We should be working out our own salvation in fear and trembling when need be, and good teaching will eventually find you via God's guidance.

Impatience makes some to become determined and work themselves up, to make what they have been taught so far into something immovable. They can not handle the fear that comes from still having doubts that need to be shed by finding corrections and even deeper understanding than they had so far. Impatience can be a big enemy to growth in Christ.

 

[Genez]

Its hilarious you haven't seen your own medicine being dished back to you by now, but then again you always have been difficult to talk to, and that's putting it nicely, . It's called giving you a friendly jab, but you need to be careful as I could give you a right cross, but you need to keep in mind my left cross

Just my boxing discipleship lingo,

You box?

 

[Jordon]

Men are souls.
Angels are spirits. (Hebrews 1:14)
Being a soul does not mean we do not also have a spiritual modifier for our soul (a human spirit) that gives ability to our soul for our spiritual perception.

And Jehovah God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; ​

and man became a living soul. Gen 2:7​

Man was created a soul.
A living soul.
A soul created with a human spirit intact to know God with.
Created spiritually alive.
Man became a living soul.
But, a soul, nonetheless.

When Adam ate the forbidden fruit?
He became a dead soul spiritually.
Hence... He ate, and died.
He lost his functional human spirit.

When we become born again, we receive from the Holy Spirit a human spirit to enable our soul to enter into spiritual realities that were not possible before regeneration.

​

Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit. You should not be surprised at my saying, ​

‘You must be born again.’ John 3:6-7​

​

John 3:6 - Giving birth to spirit".. is not to be confused with the indwelling Holy Spirit.
For the Holy Spirit does not give birth to Himself.
He gives birth to our human spirit for our soul's spiritual ability.

grace and peace ...........

Well you can lean on this understanding completely if you want to,

But all life returns to God, when it says spirit gives birth to spirit, you don't get a new soul, the soul becomes transformed by the spirit, which is a clear indication that soul is spirit to,

And what is clear and just past by this understanding, is can anyone completely rule out a soul as something spiritual Especially when it's the unseen,

Because man became a living soul is because God breathes living life meaning his life ,into them, and life is always represented as spirit to in his word, however you can rule this out if you want, by whatever means, but I won't take your word for it.


And Psalms 139:13-16 also makes reference that each you born becomes knitted togeather in our mother's womb which means each new person become a living soul to, but only they inherit the fallen nature, and also all are days are planned by God before any of them exists.

So each new born gets a new born breath of life, called devine intervention, but because Judgment was passed we are still born needing a saviour.

 

[Jordon]

If they were truly honest?
They would not try to fake it and level with you, that they do not understand a passage.
Many are honest in one way, but fall short in the teaching itself.

We should not be busy seeking for a good pastor-teacher.
We should be working out our own salvation in fear and trembling when need be, and good teaching will eventually find you via God's guidance.

Impatience makes some to become determined and work themselves up, to make what they have been taught so far into something immovable. They can not handle the fear that comes from still having doubts that need to be shed by finding corrections and even deeper understanding than they had so far. Impatience can be a big enemy to growth in Christ.

so you can determine this of every honest church in England can you ?

 

[Genez]

Well you can lean on this understanding completely if you want to,

But all life returns to God, when it says spirit gives birth to spirit, you don't get a new soul, the soul becomes transformed by the spirit, which is a clear indication that soul is spirit to,

And what is clear and just past by this understanding, is can anyone completely rule out a soul as something spiritual Especially when it's the unseen,

Because man became a living soul is because God breathes living life meaning his life ,into them, and life is always represented as spirit to in his word, however you can rule this out if you want, by whatever means, but I won't take your word for it.


And Psalms 139:13-16 also makes reference that each you born becomes knitted togeather in our mother's womb which means each new person become a living soul to, but only they inherit the fallen nature, and also all are days are planned by God before any of them exists.

So each new born gets a new born breath of life, called devine intervention, but because Judgment was passed we are still born needing a saviour.

A soul is not spirit.

Angels are not souls.

 

[Jordon]

A soul is not spirit.

Angels are not souls.

This is called you believing what you want to.

 

[Genez]

so you can determine this of every honest church in England can you ?

I am in America. We take somewhat a different approach quite often.
Brits by cultural conditioning are too polite, almost as being a religion in itself, it seems.

In America, we view honesty possibly in another light according to our culture's norms.

 

[Jordon]

I am in America. We take somewhat a different approach quite often.
Brits by cultural conditioning are too polite, almost as being a religion in itself, it seems.

In America, we view honesty possibly in another light according to our culture's norms.

well that may true of some cultures but not if there brought up in God from honest people, I don't care where your from,.if you've been brought up honestly you will be honest.