Salvation: A doctrinal dilemma
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Yes, and very real misunderstandings on many other issues surrounding the specifics of salvation also, as I am
sure you know, as we are constantly contested by those who do not know the Scriptures, those who deny the
Scriptures, those who directly contradict the Scriptures, and those who feel compelled to rewrite the Scriptures
as if Jesus Christ Himself were wrong. Quite remarkable, all told... and that is not even mentioning those who
repeatedly and deliberately misrepresent what we say and believe. Correction does nothing. They are not interested.
If faith and repentance are a “two sided coin” as you have made up, then you cannot possibly be saved by faith alone. I am amazed at how you make up these explanations —not from the Bible— but then refuse to accept the consequences of them. How can you be saved by “faith alone” if repentance is part of that? It’s impossible but I am sure you will insist on it anyway.
But now look at Acts 2:38. Verse 37 - they said, “ Men and brethren WHAT SHALL WE DO? ( to be saved)”. Now wouldn’t you think , I mean LOGICALLY, that Peter would have just said, “ You don’t have to do anything—just believe!”? That’s exactly what men tell people today they must do. Why would he use the word “repent” instead of the word “believe”? Does he just ASSUME that they know that Mailman says “repent” is just a two sided coin for “believe”? How can he be sure that they understand that? Especially if, repentance does not save them at all—they are ONLY saved by “faith”. It looks like Peter is purposely being confusing and not telling the truth. He tells them to repent, instead of “believe” and he knows repentance will not save them; and besides that, if as mailman says baptism will not save them either, then how has he helped these people to be saved? He hasn’t even answered their question. They can’t be saved by repentance and baptism ( according to Mailman) and he didn’t even tell them to “believe” which is the ONLY thing that will save them!! Why would Peter do that? Did he just let all of those Jews go to hell? Because he clearly did not tell them that “faith only” is all they need to be saved. I don’t see anyway that those Jews could have just KNOWN, without Peter saying so, that all they had to do to be saved was by faith alone. Let me be clear. Peter did not tell them to “just believe” because that is not how the Bible teaches people are saved—not then and not today. Peter did not teach “faith only” because “faith only” doctrine is Not the doctrine of Christ ( 1 John 9) and it will not save anyone. If you are trusting in “faith alone” to save you, please look at how people were saved in the New Testament. Please read Peter’s answer in Acts 2:38. It was NOT “believe only” that he told those people. If “faith only” is the only thing that will save them, then his answer to them is a cruel joke!!
Repentance was part of his answer and what he is saying is that repentance is necessary for salvation—because that was their question— what do we need to do to be saved? Peter gives “ as something they needed to to to be saved, “repentance” as well as baptism was something they needed to do to be saved. His answer dispels and refutes “saved by faith alone.” Peter did not teach salvation by “faith only.”
Concerning what name the church should be called by—-the BIBLE is clear about that. The congregations of the New Testament church were called “churches of Christ.” Romans 16:16. Why would they be called anything else? It’s Christ’s Church, He built it! It belongs to Him. The church that Christ built should HONOR HIM—not Martin Luther, not some “word” like “methods” or “baptism.” The name of Jesus is highly honored, and revered in the New Testament. Demons were cast out in His name. Baptism is “in the name of Jesus, and the church is called by His name. There is no other name under heaven, given among men by which we must be saved.” Acts 4:12.
“What ever you do in word or deed do all in the name of the Lord…” Col. 3:17.
Does your church’s name honor the name of Jesus? Somehow, I can’t imagine Jesus being anything but PLEASED that we honor Him in this way and obey His word.
You are either dishonest or maybe ignorant of the fact that just having the right name does not make a church right with God. You have mentioned this several times in your posts; I’m not sure why, unless it is an effort to discredit the church of Christ.
To be a duck, you must walk, talk, and even LOOK like a duck. And so, a church must LOOK like the church in the New Testament and “walk” like the church in the New Testament and “talk” like the church in the Bew Testament to be a “church of Christ.” I’m very much aware that some churches that “call” themselves churches of Christ do not look nor walk like the church in the New Testament. You cannot possibly know my heart nor what I think if those churches so please do not accuse me of thinking that just any church by that name is “right” with God. I will always try to represent you fairly; please extend to me the same courtesy.
As I already stated. Not faith alone in the "sense" that one has faith but they never repented. That would be impossible. We must first repent (change our mind) before we can place our faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation and become saved. Acts 20:21 - testifying both to Jews and to Greeks of repentance toward God and of faith in our Lord Jesus Christ.
I am amazed at how everything that I explain to you just continues to go right over your head. Again, it's not faith alone in the "sense" that we never repented. It's faith alone in the sense that we are saved the moment that we place our faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. Those who have done so have already repented in the process of changing their mind and choosing to place their faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. Simple.
Peter said repent (change your mind) and the new direction of that change of mind is believe which is already implied or assumed since they are two sides to the same coin. Acts 15:7 - And when there had been much dispute, Peter rose up and said to them: “Men and brethren, you know that a good while ago God chose among us, that by my mouth the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel and believe." After hearing, we must then repent (change our mind) before we can believe.
In Acts 11:17, we read - If therefore God gave them the same gift (Holy Spirit) as He gave us when we believed on the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could withstand God?” 18 When they heard these things they became silent; and they glorified God, saying, “Then God has also granted to the Gentiles repentance unto life.” Look what the apostle Paul said in Acts 16:31, after being asked the question, "what must I do to be saved?" Paul's answer was, "Believe in/on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved." Paul did not "add" baptism to "believe" in verse 31.
Where salvation is in view, when only repentance is used, believe/faith is implied or assumed and when only believe/faith is used, repentance is implied or assumed because we know from scripture they are two sides to the same coin. (Matthew 21:32; Mark 1:15; Acts 20:21) Repentance saves because the new direction of that change of mind is faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. Two sides to the same coin. Certain folks are confused about repentance and end up placing it "after" faith then redefine it as "moral self-reformation" which then culminates in salvation by faith + works. Such folks also confuse the fruit of repentance (Matthew 3:8) with the essence of repentance.
In regard to salvation, the new direction of the change of mind in repentance is believe. Peter understood this because in Acts 10:43, he said, "..whoever believes in Him receives remission of sins without mentioning repentance (Acts 10:43) which does not necessarily need to be mentioned because it already took place. In Acts 11:17,18 both believing and repentance are mentioned. Peter understands, they are two sides to the same coin. There is no confusion except for works-salvationists.
In verse 40, we read - With many other words he warned them; and he pleaded with them, “Save yourselves from this corrupt generation." Any confusion on the part of the Jews would have been clarified through these many other words.
Peter simply said believe in Acts 10:43 and in Acts 11:17-18, Peter said they received the same gift (Holy Spirit) when they believed in the Lord Jesus Christ and referred to that as repentance unto life. So, there it is. Salvation, through believing in Him, is the doctrine of Jesus Christ. (John 3:15,16,18; 6:29, 40,47; 11:25,26)
Don't confuse faith that trusts only in Jesus Christ for salvation and not in works (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9) with a bare profession of faith that only claims to be genuine, but demonstrates by the lack of works that it's dead. (James 2:14-20)My faith is trusting in Jesus Christ alone to save me. (Romans 3:24-26)
CONTINUED..
I read Peter’s answer in Acts 2:38 and in Acts 3:19 and in Acts 10:43 and in Acts 11:17,18. I then properly harmonized scripture was scripture before reaching my conclusion on doctrine. If you understood that repentance and faith are two sides to the same coin of conversion and consider the totality of scripture, then you would not see Peter's answer in Acts 2:38 as a cruel joke.
Peter clearly stated "repent" and the new direction of this change of mind in repentance is believe/faith (apart from water baptism) as we can see elsewhere when scripture is properly harmonized. (Luke 24:47; Acts 3:19; 5:31; 10:43-47; 11:17,18; 13:38-39; 15:7-9; 16:31; 26:18) Don't confuse faith that trusts in Jesus Christ alone for salvation (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9) with "faith only" per James 2:24, which is not genuine faith, but an empty profession of faith/dead faith. (James 2:14) *Says/claims to have faith. *Key word.
That is more of a description than a rigid title and elsewhere, we see "church of God" (Acts 20:28; 1 Corinthians 1:2; 10:32; 11:22) in scripture which is describing the same church and is not a rigid title either.
The name written on the front of a church building means nothing if that church teaches a false gospel.
In the name of Jesus points to His authority.
Abundant Life church honors Jesus. The church I attend not only correctly preaches the gospel of Jesus Christ but also strongly encourages believers to live the abundant life in Christ. Churches that promote a false gospel are neither honoring Jesus nor obeying His word, regardless of their name.
I fully understand that the name of a church does not automatically make that church right with God. Yet I've heard numerous folks over the years who attend the church of Christ proudly highlight they have the correct name (Romans 16:16) as if that makes them special. I have also heard Roman Catholics proudly highlight they have the correct name based on the part in apostle's creed that says, .."I believe the holy catholic church.." as if that makes them special as well.
Fair enough. I'm happy to hear you say that not all churches are right with God simply because of their name, which was my main point.
Believing is easy, and even the devil believes in the life, death and resurrection of Jesus.
Believing in Jesus is vital but it is only the beginning..
Faith and works can not be seperated in a true Christian.
The controversy started in heaven over worship... the issue today is over worship.
Who do we worship?
If we worship God through faith, that faith will results in true repentance and works. Baptism is a sign of the born again experience. A new life in Christ.
Worship God by following Him.
Worship Satan or self or others by following them. We choose.
Sin is the enemy. Sin is what seperates us from God. We can not save ourselves but we can push Jesus away by sinning.
If we allow Jesus to save us from past sins (justification) and give up known sins (sanctification) we will be glorified. This is only possible by faith in Jesus.
Ecc 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.
Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.
Mat 19:16-17
16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? 17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
1Jn 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
1Jn 5:2-3
2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
2Pe 1:4-7
4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust. 5 And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge; 6 And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness; 7 And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
2Pe 3:13-14
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness. 14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.
Believing is the beginning.
Faith leads to repentance and surrender.
Which leads to a transformed life.
Which leads to obedience and righteousness (Christs imparted righteousness).
All is achieved by faith in the power of Jesus in us.
Believing in Jesus is vital but it is only the beginning..
Faith and works can not be seperated in a true Christian.
The controversy started in heaven over worship... the issue today is over worship.
Who do we worship?
If we worship God through faith, that faith will results in true repentance and works. Baptism is a sign of the born again experience. A new life in Christ.
Worship God by following Him.
Worship Satan or self or others by following them. We choose.
Sin is the enemy. Sin is what seperates us from God. We can not save ourselves but we can push Jesus away by sinning.
If we allow Jesus to save us from past sins (justification) and give up known sins (sanctification) we will be glorified. This is only possible by faith in Jesus.
Ecc 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.
Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.
Mat 19:16-17
16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? 17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
1Jn 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
1Jn 5:2-3
2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
2Pe 1:4-7
4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust. 5 And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge; 6 And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness; 7 And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
2Pe 3:13-14
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness. 14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.
Believing is the beginning.
Faith leads to repentance and surrender.
Which leads to a transformed life.
Which leads to obedience and righteousness (Christs imparted righteousness).
All is achieved by faith in the power of Jesus in us.
There are many ways to honor Christ. Wearing the correct name is only one of them. For example, if someone asked me what I am religiously and I say “I am a Lutheran” that is NOT honoring Christ—that is honoring Martin Luther. It doesn’t matter that you don’t intend it that way—that is just the way it work.s. Names make a difference. Paul teaches this very fact in 1 Cor. 1 where disciples were calling themselves after men’s names. Whatever name you use, you either honor Christ by using HIS name or you honor something or someone else.
You used the example of “The Abundant Life” church. I don’t know anything about that church—what they believe, or whether they are right with God or not; but this one thing is true. They do not honor Christ by the name of their church. They are honoring the kind of life you live here on earth. The emphasis is on things earthly—not on the Christ. Just speaking of the name they use—not their doctrine. Even IF their doctrine was right their name is not. As you said, and I agree, just because you have the right name, your church can still be wrong. And the reverse of that is true, also; even if your church was right in doctrine, you can still wear the wrong name, just as those Christians in 1 Cor. 1 were doing. Paul shows that it is possible and happens.
The indwelling of the Spirit (Acts 2:38) and the baptism by the Spirit (Mark 1:8, Luke 3:16, Acts 2:2-4, Acts 10:44) are not the same thing. All baptized into Christ receive the gift of the Holy Ghost (Acts2:38), the indwelling of the Spirit, which is different than the falling of the Holy Ghost producing its manifestation.the indwelling of the Spirit or baptism by the Spirit spoken of in 1 Corinthians 12:13 is nonexperiential and not outwardly recognizable...
Just asking about this, dear brother...
Would this be regeneration? Being made alive in Christ?
Ephesians 2 v 4-7 ~ Because of His great love for us, God, Who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in our trespasses. It is by grace you have been saved! And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with Him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, in order that in the coming ages He might display the surpassing riches of His grace, demonstrated by His kindness to us in Christ Jesus.
The devils believe that the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus "happened" but they are not trusting in the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus for salvation. That is the difference between believing in our head and believing in our heart.
The beginning of what? We have been saved from the PENALTY of sin (justification) and we will be saved from the PRESENCE of sin (glorification). Romans 8:30 - Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified. *ALL of them. Notice how Paul uses the past tense for a future event to stress its certainty.
Faith is the root of salvation and works are the fruit. No fruit at all would demonstrate there is no root, yet we are still saved by grace through faith, not works. (Ephesians 2:8,9)
Repentance actually precedes faith (Acts 20:21) and works are the fruit of repentance (Matthew 3:8) which follow faith.
Yes, a sign but not the cause.
Acts 26:18 - to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.
1 John 3:9 -No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
This sounds like "type 2 works salvation" and sinless perfection. 1 John 1:8 - f we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us.
I can see what you have placed your faith in for salvation. Your best efforts to keep the commandments which culminates in salvation by works. In regard to Matthew 19:16-17, Jesus showed the rich young ruler how short he falls of keeping even the first commandment (Exodus 20:3) which is the first of the two great commandments. (Deuteronomy 6:5; Matthew 22:37) The rich young ruler confidently and (self-righteously) declared that he has kept the commandments from his youth up and qualified for heaven under those terms. Yet Jesus knew the man's wealth had become his idolatrous god, which kept him from believing in Jesus unto salvation (John 3:18) so he has not kept the commandments from his youth up.
The rich young ruler missed the point that Jesus was making, failed to place his faith in Jesus for salvation, and continued instead to trust in his riches (Matthew 19:21-23). He went away sad because he could not part from his great wealth, not even in exchange for eternal life. If keeping the commandments is the basis or means by which we receive eternal life, then why isn't this remark the pattern for all discussions concerning eternal life? Paul would have said to the jailer who asked, "what must I do to be saved?" by replying in Acts 16:31 - "keep the commandments and you will be saved," yet instead, Paul said - "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved.."
Jesus knows the hearts of all men and responds to each individual a little differently because He knows where their need is. He didn't respond to the woman at the well, or to Nicodemus or to the rich young ruler the exact same way, yet the consistent pattern in scripture is salvation by grace through faith, not works. (Ephesians 2:8,9)
CONTINUED..
By this we know that we have come to know Him, (already know Him/already saved/demonstrative evidence) if we "keep" (Greek word "tereo" - guard, observe, watch over) His commandments, which is descriptive of genuine believers. 4 The one who says, “I have come to know Him,” and does not "keep" (guard, observe, watch over) His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. That is descriptive of unbelievers.
Strong's Greek: 5083. τηρέω (téreó) -- to watch over, to guard (biblehub.com)
By cultivating the qualities listed in 2 Peter 1:5-7, Christians can be sure that God has called them and elected them. These fruits will confirm it. Make sure you have been called and elected - bébaios (an adjective, derived from bainō, "to walk where it is solid") – properly, solid (sure) enough to walk on; hence, firm, unshakable; (figuratively) absolutely dependable, giving guaranteed support (security, surety). To practice these qualities gives evidence of salvation, though they are not the basis (or cause) of salvation. They are the effect. Cause of being in Christ (FAITH) effect of being in Christ (FRUIT).
For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ (verse 8). For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins (verse 9). What is the object of the forgetting? Is this forgetting temporary because this believer had fallen into error or does this lack of fruit exist because this person’s "cleansing" was merely an external reformation that did not come from a truly changed heart?
The genuineness of their profession is demonstrated as believers express these virtues. These fruits confirm their divine source. 10 Therefore, brothers, be all the more diligent to make your calling and election sure, for if you practice these qualities you will never fall. Proverbs 24:16, we read - For a righteous man may fall seven times and rise again, But the wicked shall fall by calamity.
People cannot be found in Him in peace, without spot, and blameless apart from faith in Christ. He counts our sins as fully paid for by the blood and sacrificial death on the cross. All saved believers have peace with God in Christ (Romans 5:1) and He does view us in Christ as spotless and blameless. Eternal salvation is not something we work for or earn.
That is what Christians are to strive for in the process of ongoing sanctification and as you admit, we don't do this to earn our place in God's family; we do it because we already have one.
Believing results in justification and marks the beginning of ongoing sanctification.
Repentance actually precedes faith (Acts 20:21) and marks the beginning of surrender.
That is the result.
Believing results in obedience appropriate to repentance/faith. The Bible teaches imputed righteousness. (Romans 4:6, 22-24)
As long as you don't confuse justification with ongoing sanctification. God's grace cannot be earned by our actions/performance/works. Grace is based on the character of God and not on our sincerity, performance, or ability to keep the law. Otherwise, grace would not be grace.
Romans 11:6, "But if it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works, otherwise grace is no longer grace."
Galatians 2:21, "I do not nullify the grace of God; for if righteousness comes through the Law, then Christ died needlessly."
2 Timothy 1:9, "who has saved us, and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace which was granted us in Christ Jesus from all eternity."
God's grace operates sovereignly in the lives of believers.
1 Corinthians 15:10 - But by the grace of God I am what I am, and His grace toward me did not prove vain; but I labored even more than all of them, yet not I, but the grace of God with me.
2 Corinthians 1:12 - For our proud confidence is this: the testimony of our conscience, that in holiness and godly sincerity, not in fleshly wisdom but in the grace of God, we have conducted ourselves in the world, and especially toward you.
2 Corinthians 12:9 - And He has said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for power is perfected in weakness." Most gladly, therefore, I will rather boast about my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ may dwell in me.[/quote]
I think your just looking to find fault...
This verse. Act 20:21 Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ.
Does not say repentance precedes faith
Repentance and faith are listed together .
Just because one is listed before the other does not mean it precedes the other.
Faith is essential to repentance.
Faith must come first.
Without faith it is impossible to please God.
Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
How can our repentance be of any value without faith?
I cannot do anything good. It is only by the gift of Jesus's imparted strength that I am able to repent and overcome.
The imparted power comes by faith.
Over and over again in the New Testament people were told to believe. But what were they to believe? When Peter preached his sermon in Acts 2, it was to convince the unbelieving Jews that Jesus, the man they had killed was the Messiah divine, the Son of God. He was not trying to convince them to “trust” Jesus. They needed to believe that He was God’s Son.
The personal ministry of Jesus was spent trying to get the Jewish people and their leaders to “believe” He was the Messiah; to believe in His divinity. He asked Peter back in Matthew 16, “Who do men say that I am?” Some say Elijah, or Jeremiah, but the answer He was looking for was, “You are the Son of God.” Verse 16.
We have the perfect example that proves this in Acts 8:37. Phillip told the eunuch that “if you BELIEVE you may” be baptized. The eunuch said, “ I BELIEVE that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.” Phillip wasn’t asking him to “trust in Jesus” when he asked if he believed. Neither was he asking him to believe in the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus. Those things matter, but first things first, and that’s not what you do first. First you must believe in His divinity. Then, the trust and belief in the resurrection will automaticity follow.
In Acts 16 when Paul told that Roman jailer to “believe”, he could not have been saved at that moment in verse 31. That jailer had no idea what he was supposed to believe. The jailer was a Roman gentile a very long way from Jerusalem! He probably had no idea who Jesus was, and even if he had heard of him, probably knew nothing about him and had never heard the gospel. At that moment, what was he going to “believe?” Verse 32 is where he believes. “Then THEY SPOKE THE WORD OF THE LORD TO HIM and to all his house.” People must “hear” the gospel first, before they can believe. Romans 10:14. “…how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher?” That pretty much describes the Jailer and Paul. It is not reasonable nor logical that Paul would have told the jailer to keep the commandments of someone he did not know, maybe never even heard of. Also, there is no way you can make an accurate parallel between the Rich young JEWISH ruler and this HEATHEN jailer. That’s like comparing apples to Oranges.
Using those stories that way is a misuse of scripture and proves nothing.
The REST OF THE STORY in Acts 16 is in verse s 33-34 and will never be told by those who believe in a “ faith only” doctrine. They would have you believe that the story is over in verse 31. But that is NOT what the Holy Spirit says. He says in verse 33- after Paul teaches them about WHO they are to believe and WHAT they are to believe—the jailer took them the same hour of the night and WASHED THEIR STRIPES-a sign of repentance, and WAS BAPTIZED. this is NOT a story of “faith only” salvation( regardless of how much they want you to believe it). This is a beautiful story of “hear”, “believe”, “repent” and be “baptized.” Which is what is taught in other places in the Bible like Mark 16:16-“He that believes and is baptized will be saved,” and Acts 2:38, “Repent and be baptized..for the remission of sins…” it all harmonizes perfectly. The clincher is in verse 34. After his BAPTISM, it says he rejoiced, HAVING BELIEVED IN GOD with all his household. This is what it means to fully believe in Jesus. The Holy Spirit has defined it for us. It begins with “believing in His divinity and then OBEYING His commands. That’s “belief.” At least that’s what the Holy Spirit says in verse 34.
I found it.
Repentance and faith are listed together in Acts 20:21 yet repentance "precedes" faith in Acts 20:21. *Notice the order. *Also notice the order in Matthew 21:32 - For John came to you to show you the way of righteousness, and you did not believe him, but the tax collectors and the prostitutes did. And even after you saw this, you did not repent and believe him. Once again, notice the order in Mark 1:15 - and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe the gospel.”
I just proved otherwise.
You have this backwards. You may be confusing the fruit of repentance (works) with the essence of repentance (change of mind). The Bible tells us that true repentance will result in a change of actions. Acts 26:20 declares, "I preached that they should repent and turn to God and demonstrate their repentance by their deeds." This is the fruit of repentance bear fruit in keeping with/worthy of repentance (Matthew 3:8) and not the essence of repentance (change of mind).
Amen! Acts 20:21 - ..repentance toward God and faith in our Lord Jesus Christ. Two sides to the same coin.
It can't and the new direction of this change of mind in regard to obtaining salvation is faith in Jesus Christ.
Where do you find the word "imparted" in scripture? Are you talking about God's enabling power which works within believers through the process of ongoing sanctification? (Philippians 2:13) The Bible says we overcome by faith (1 John 5:4) and repentance "precedes" faith. (Acts 20:21) You have this backwards. So, what's your angle?
Amen! John 3:15,16,18; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26; Acts 10:43; 13:39; 15:7; 16:31; Romans 1:16; 4:5; 10:4; 1 Corinthians 1:21; 1 John 5:13 etc..).
IN JESUS. Trusting in Him alone for salvation.
Not only believe He was the Messiah and the Son of God (His divinity) but also place their faith in Him for salvation. (Acts 20:21)
Amen! John 20:31 - but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name.
Paul clearly stated in verse 31 that BELIEVE in the Lord Jesus Christ was the condition for salvation. If the jailer knew nothing about Jesus at the moment of being told to believe, he knew after the word of the Lord was spoke to him and he and his household will be saved the moment they believe (vs. 31) before baptism (vs. 33) which was not even mentioned in verse 31.
Amen! We must first hear the gospel before we can repent (change our mind) and believe the gospel.
Believers "keep" (guard, observe, watch over) the commandments AFTER they have been saved and not in order to become saved. 1 John 2:3 - By this we know that we have come to know Him, (already know Him/already saved/demonstrative evidence) if we "keep" (Greek word "tereo" - guard, observe, watch over) His commandments. We must not confuse "descriptive" passages of scripture with "prescriptive" passages of scripture. The end result is salvation by works.
Are you talking about what I shared in post #71? I proved my point that the rich young ruler confidently and (self-righteously) declared that he has kept the commandments from his youth up and qualified for heaven under those terms and that Jesus knew the man's wealth had become his idolatrous god, which kept him from believing in Jesus unto salvation. (John 3:18) The rich young ruler missed the point that Jesus was making, failed to place his faith in Jesus for salvation, and continued instead to trust in his riches (Matthew 19:21-23). The rich young ruler went away sad because he could not part from his great wealth, not even in exchange for eternal life.
Do you agree or disagree?
What is listed as the requirement for salvation is over in verse 31 (just as it is in Acts 10:43; 13:38; 15:7) yet works-salvationists try to force baptism into the equation based on their personal eisegesis from verses 33-34.
See 1 Corinthians 2:14.
In Acts 16:31, Paul said - "Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved.." NOT believe and get baptized and you will be saved. Water baptism "followed" believe unto salvation, just as it did in Acts 10:43-47, which remains your Achilles heel. Repentance is not mentioned in verse 31, but it's already implied or assumed because repentance precedes belief/faith. (Acts 20:21) This is a story of salvation through belief/faith in JESUS CHRIST ALONE FOR SALVATION no matter how much water salvationists want to believe otherwise and boast in their baptism.
This is a beautiful story of hear, repent, believe (saved) then "afterwards" baptized. You continue to reverse the scriptural order of repent and believe.
CONTINUED..
Jesus clarifies the first clause with the second in Mark 16:16 - ..but he who does not believe wll be condemned. Nothing mentioned here about baptized or condemned. If water baptism is absolutely required for salvation, then we would expect Jesus to mention it in the following verses. (3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26) Yet what is the ONE requirement that Jesus mentions NINE different times in each of these complete statements *BELIEVES. *What happened to baptism? *Hermeneutics.
John 3:18 - He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who (is not water baptized? - NO) does not believe is condemned already, because he has not (been water baptized? - NO) because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
Your stand-alone pet verses only appear to harmonize with your eisegesis, but your personal eisegesis does not harmonize with the totality of scripture. Salvation by water baptism does not harmonize with numerous passages of scripture which make it crystal clear that we are saved through belief/faith "apart from additions or modifications" (Luke 7:50; 8:12; John 1:12; 3:15,16,18,36; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26; Acts 4:4; 10:4; 10:43; 13:38,39; 15:7-9; 16:31; 26:18; Romans 1:16; 3:24-28; 4:5-6, 9: 5:1; 10:4; 1 Corinthians 1:21; Galatians 2:16; 3:6-14, 26; Ephesians 2:8,9; Philippians 3:9; 2 Timothy 3:15; Hebrews 10:39; 1 John 5:4, 13 etc..)
In Acts 2:38, "for the remission of sins" does not refer back to both clauses, "you all repent" and "each one of you be baptized," but refers only to the first. Peter is saying "repent unto the remission of your sins," the same as in Acts 3:19. The clause "each one of you be baptized" is parenthetical. This is exactly what Acts 3:19 teaches except that Peter omits the parenthesis.
The only Biblical conclusion when properly harmonizing scripture with scripture is that faith in Jesus Christ "implied in genuine repentance" (rather than water baptism) brings the remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Spirit (Luke 24:47; Acts 2:38; 3:19; 5:31; 10:43-47; 11:17,18; 13:38-39; 15:7-9; 16:31; 26:18). *Perfect Harmony*
So, according to your clincher, the jailer and his household went down into the waters of baptism as unbelievers and came out of the water as believers?
No, that is not what it means to fully believe in Jesus. If you fully believed in Jesus then you would be trusting in Him alone for salvation and not in Him + baptism or any other works. You believe in your baptism and not fully in Jesus.No, that is salvation by believing + works, which is not from the Holy Spirit. (Romans 4:5-6; 11:6; Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9) Faith is believing and obeying His commands "afterwards" is works. You error just like Roman Catholics. I was once in a discussion with a Roman Catholic who made this statement to me below:
We are saved by faith - as long as you properly define "Faith". Faith is not simply "believing". Faith includes: Being water baptized, eating His body and drinking His blood/partaking the Lord's Supper during Mass, works of mercy and charity, obeying his commandments etc.. THAT IS NOT SALVATION THROUGH FAITH BUT SALVATION THROUGH FAITH (THEIR VERSION OF FAITH) + WORKS.
Romans Catholics basically teach we are saved through faith "infused" with works and then those works become meritorious towards receiving salvation. Folks in the CoC basically teach the same thing, except they prefer to say we are saved through faith "conjoined" with works and although they try to deny it, those works become meritorious towards receiving salvation. Folks in the CoC will try to sugar coat it by turning these works into their own personal definition of non-meritorious works, but it's just smoke and mirrors.
When people in the New Testament were saved, the scriptures almost always say they REJOICED! Why wouldn’t they? Ecclesiastes says that God has put “eternity” in the hearts of men. Eternal salvation is the most important thing in this earthly world!! It means “peace”, “satisfaction,” we are “complete,” “secure”, and often feel a wonderful sense of “relief!” It is definitely a time to REJOICE! Many times, also, in the scriptures, people sat down to a meal and ATE after their salvation. I suppose celebrating with a meal was a way of “rejoicing”. Many times people won’t eat before having to make an important decision, or if things are weighing on their mind; but after the problem is solved—they are ready to eat! I believe we can benefit from looking at some scriptures where this is the case.
Acts 8, Phillip preaches “Jesus” to the eunuch. We do not have the words that Phillip said to him, but it would need to be things that the eunuch needed to do to be saved and it would need to be only the essential things because Phillip did not have a lot of time to teach him. Those essential things that Phillip taught the eunuch when he taught him about “Jesus”, included baptism, we know this because as soon as they “came to some water”, the eunuch asked to be baptized. How did he know about baptism if he didn’t even know who Jesus was? Because baptism was part of teaching him “Jesus.” Baptism must have been taught as being important for him to ASK for it immediately on hearing about Jesus. If baptism wasn’t necessary to his salvation, this would have been the time for the Holy Spirit to show us this, by having Phillip say” Oh, you don’t have to be baptized. All you have to do is believe. You can be baptized later when you get back home to Ethiopia. That’s the message Preachers tell People today. Just believe and you are saved and you can be baptized later if you want to. Does that sound like the message Phillip taught the eunuch? When did the eunuch “rejoice”? Verse 39– when they came up out of the water, the eunuch went on his way REJOICING!!
Acts 9, Saul of Tarsus. If Saul was saved on the road to Damascus when he met Jesus, then why wasn’t he rejoicing? He certainly BELIEVED at that moment!! Why did Jesus tell him there were “THINGS HE MUST DO”? Verse 6. If he was already saved because he believed, what was left TO DO? Why didn’t he go on his way REJOICING like the eunuch? If Sail was saved, he must not have known it, because instead of rejoicing, he WOULDNT EAT FOR 3DAYS!! He fasted and prayed for 3 days. Does this sound like a SAVED man? Is that normal behavior for a newly saved convert? No, it isn’t. Saul is NOT SAVED yet, even though he has believed in Jesus. Not only that, but no one has yet come to him and told him what “He MUST DO!” Finally, Ananias comes to him and tells him “TO ARISE AND BE BAPTIZED and wash away your sins!” 22:16. Is this what Jesus meant when he said there are things you MUST DO? Obviously it was, because that is all Ananias told him to do. And look at how Saul’s demeanor and behavior has changed once he has been baptized!! He immediately received food—he ate a meal—and was strengthened. See how Saul was saved—he “BELIEVED” on the road to Damascus when he met and talked to Jesus, he showed evidence of “REPENTANCE” when he fasted and prayed for 3 days. Don’t you know he was remembering how many Christian’s he had killed, imprisoned, and persecuted? I can only imagine how remorseful he must have been , thinking about that! And finally, the last step, he was BAPTIZED for the forgiveness of sins. Saul was NOT SAVED until he had his sins removed and that did not happen until he was baptized. He was not saved at the point of faith; his sins were not removed or washed away when he believed. He could not have been saved on the road to Damascus because 3 days later he still had His “sins”.. They had not been forgiven yet. That is exactly what the Holy Spirit says. I have not fabricated one thing in this story. This is exactly the way the Holy Spirit tells it. What is God telling you from this recorded account of Saul’s conversion? If you had never been taught “salvation by faith only” would you have read this story for the first time and come away thinking that all you had to do to be saved was “believe”? No, I don’t think so. If that is what you believe, then, just like Saul of Tarsus, you have been taught error. Saul changed what he believed. Will you be like Saul?
Acts 16, the jailer. The jailer was a Roman heathen. If he was religious at all, he would have been an idolater. He was a gentile, a long way from Jerusalem. Had he ever heard of Jesus? Probably not. Verse 31, he wants to be saved. This was based on his interaction with Paul and Silas. They tell him to BELIEVE and he will be saved ( future tense). They did not say believe and you ARE SAVED, That’s important and will be explained in the next few verses. The difference in those two statements is because of the TENSE of the verb. “Will be saved” is future tense-meaning something that will happen in the future. “Are saved” is present tense—meaning right now. The jailer was not saved in verse 31. Look at verse 32. They SPOKE THE WORD OF THE LORD to him and his house. ROMANS 10:14. The jailer did not know what or who to believe until they taught him about Jesus. And what happened after they spoke the word of the Lord to him? Verse 33- he washed their stripes ( where they had been beaten by the Roman officials), a sign of “repentance” and was baptized IMMEDIATELY!! How did he even know about baptism? It had to be when Paul “spoke the word of the Lord“ to him. Finally, read verse 34. The Jailer “heard” the word of the Lord, “believed” what he heard about Jesus , repented”, and was “ baptized” all in the same night! Then they all had a meal together! And verse 34 says all this was “HAVING BELIEVED IN GOD with all his household. This is what it means to believe” to be saved. Not my story, but the story the Holy Spirit tells. His story of how the jailer was saved is soooo different than what “faith only” doctrine teaches. They only teach verse 31. They will not tell you the “whole” story.
Now see the similarities in these stories. Acts 8, Phillip taught Him “Jesus” and as soon as they came to water, the eunuch wanted to be baptized. So baptism is included in the teaching of Jesus. Paul “spoke the word of the Lord” to the jailer and his house and immediately they were all baptized! So baptism is included in “speaking the word of the Lord.” And please note the “urgency” associated with baptism. It was not an after thought. It was not “put off” until a more convenient or later time. It was important! It was necessary to be saved. That’s why the The eunuch did it as soon as they came to water and that’s why the jailer and his house did it “immediately” in the wee hours of the morning. The Holy Spirit has told us “why” they did it immediately—because it is for the REMISSION OF SINS, , Acts 2:38.; it WASHES AWAY SINS, Acts 22:16, and it SAVES US, 1 Peter 3:21. We are not saved until we are baptized into Christ for the remission of sins. That’s why it was always done immediately when anyone was saved. The Holy Spirit has TOLD us this both by “command” Mark 26:16 and 1 Peter 3:21 and by ”example” Acts 2, 8, 9, 16.
God, Christ , and the Holy Spirit, have all made it abundantly clear that baptism is necessary to be saved. It is not the “only” thing necessary, but it is definitely in God’s plan of how the Bible teaches a person is saved.
Acts 8, Phillip preaches “Jesus” to the eunuch. We do not have the words that Phillip said to him, but it would need to be things that the eunuch needed to do to be saved and it would need to be only the essential things because Phillip did not have a lot of time to teach him. Those essential things that Phillip taught the eunuch when he taught him about “Jesus”, included baptism, we know this because as soon as they “came to some water”, the eunuch asked to be baptized. How did he know about baptism if he didn’t even know who Jesus was? Because baptism was part of teaching him “Jesus.” Baptism must have been taught as being important for him to ASK for it immediately on hearing about Jesus. If baptism wasn’t necessary to his salvation, this would have been the time for the Holy Spirit to show us this, by having Phillip say” Oh, you don’t have to be baptized. All you have to do is believe. You can be baptized later when you get back home to Ethiopia. That’s the message Preachers tell People today. Just believe and you are saved and you can be baptized later if you want to. Does that sound like the message Phillip taught the eunuch? When did the eunuch “rejoice”? Verse 39– when they came up out of the water, the eunuch went on his way REJOICING!!
Acts 9, Saul of Tarsus. If Saul was saved on the road to Damascus when he met Jesus, then why wasn’t he rejoicing? He certainly BELIEVED at that moment!! Why did Jesus tell him there were “THINGS HE MUST DO”? Verse 6. If he was already saved because he believed, what was left TO DO? Why didn’t he go on his way REJOICING like the eunuch? If Sail was saved, he must not have known it, because instead of rejoicing, he WOULDNT EAT FOR 3DAYS!! He fasted and prayed for 3 days. Does this sound like a SAVED man? Is that normal behavior for a newly saved convert? No, it isn’t. Saul is NOT SAVED yet, even though he has believed in Jesus. Not only that, but no one has yet come to him and told him what “He MUST DO!” Finally, Ananias comes to him and tells him “TO ARISE AND BE BAPTIZED and wash away your sins!” 22:16. Is this what Jesus meant when he said there are things you MUST DO? Obviously it was, because that is all Ananias told him to do. And look at how Saul’s demeanor and behavior has changed once he has been baptized!! He immediately received food—he ate a meal—and was strengthened. See how Saul was saved—he “BELIEVED” on the road to Damascus when he met and talked to Jesus, he showed evidence of “REPENTANCE” when he fasted and prayed for 3 days. Don’t you know he was remembering how many Christian’s he had killed, imprisoned, and persecuted? I can only imagine how remorseful he must have been , thinking about that! And finally, the last step, he was BAPTIZED for the forgiveness of sins. Saul was NOT SAVED until he had his sins removed and that did not happen until he was baptized. He was not saved at the point of faith; his sins were not removed or washed away when he believed. He could not have been saved on the road to Damascus because 3 days later he still had His “sins”.. They had not been forgiven yet. That is exactly what the Holy Spirit says. I have not fabricated one thing in this story. This is exactly the way the Holy Spirit tells it. What is God telling you from this recorded account of Saul’s conversion? If you had never been taught “salvation by faith only” would you have read this story for the first time and come away thinking that all you had to do to be saved was “believe”? No, I don’t think so. If that is what you believe, then, just like Saul of Tarsus, you have been taught error. Saul changed what he believed. Will you be like Saul?
Acts 16, the jailer. The jailer was a Roman heathen. If he was religious at all, he would have been an idolater. He was a gentile, a long way from Jerusalem. Had he ever heard of Jesus? Probably not. Verse 31, he wants to be saved. This was based on his interaction with Paul and Silas. They tell him to BELIEVE and he will be saved ( future tense). They did not say believe and you ARE SAVED, That’s important and will be explained in the next few verses. The difference in those two statements is because of the TENSE of the verb. “Will be saved” is future tense-meaning something that will happen in the future. “Are saved” is present tense—meaning right now. The jailer was not saved in verse 31. Look at verse 32. They SPOKE THE WORD OF THE LORD to him and his house. ROMANS 10:14. The jailer did not know what or who to believe until they taught him about Jesus. And what happened after they spoke the word of the Lord to him? Verse 33- he washed their stripes ( where they had been beaten by the Roman officials), a sign of “repentance” and was baptized IMMEDIATELY!! How did he even know about baptism? It had to be when Paul “spoke the word of the Lord“ to him. Finally, read verse 34. The Jailer “heard” the word of the Lord, “believed” what he heard about Jesus , repented”, and was “ baptized” all in the same night! Then they all had a meal together! And verse 34 says all this was “HAVING BELIEVED IN GOD with all his household. This is what it means to believe” to be saved. Not my story, but the story the Holy Spirit tells. His story of how the jailer was saved is soooo different than what “faith only” doctrine teaches. They only teach verse 31. They will not tell you the “whole” story.
Now see the similarities in these stories. Acts 8, Phillip taught Him “Jesus” and as soon as they came to water, the eunuch wanted to be baptized. So baptism is included in the teaching of Jesus. Paul “spoke the word of the Lord” to the jailer and his house and immediately they were all baptized! So baptism is included in “speaking the word of the Lord.” And please note the “urgency” associated with baptism. It was not an after thought. It was not “put off” until a more convenient or later time. It was important! It was necessary to be saved. That’s why the The eunuch did it as soon as they came to water and that’s why the jailer and his house did it “immediately” in the wee hours of the morning. The Holy Spirit has told us “why” they did it immediately—because it is for the REMISSION OF SINS, , Acts 2:38.; it WASHES AWAY SINS, Acts 22:16, and it SAVES US, 1 Peter 3:21. We are not saved until we are baptized into Christ for the remission of sins. That’s why it was always done immediately when anyone was saved. The Holy Spirit has TOLD us this both by “command” Mark 26:16 and 1 Peter 3:21 and by ”example” Acts 2, 8, 9, 16.
God, Christ , and the Holy Spirit, have all made it abundantly clear that baptism is necessary to be saved. It is not the “only” thing necessary, but it is definitely in God’s plan of how the Bible teaches a person is saved.
Amen! John 3:15,16,18; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26; Acts 10:43; 13:39; 15:7; 16:31; Romans 1:16; 4:5; 10:4; 1 Corinthians 1:21; 1 John 5:13 etc..).
IN JESUS. Trusting in Him alone for salvation.
Not only believe He was the Messiah and the Son of God (His divinity) but also place their faith in Him for salvation. (Acts 20:21)
Amen! John 20:31 - but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name.
Paul clearly stated in verse 31 that BELIEVE in the Lord Jesus Christ was the condition for salvation. If the jailer knew nothing about Jesus at the moment of being told to believe, he knew after the word of the Lord was spoke to him and he and his household will be saved the moment they believe (vs. 31) before baptism (vs. 33) which was not even mentioned in verse 31.
Amen! We must first hear the gospel before we can repent (change our mind) and believe the gospel.
Believers "keep" (guard, observe, watch over) the commandments AFTER they have been saved and not in order to become saved. 1 John 2:3 - By this we know that we have come to know Him, (already know Him/already saved/demonstrative evidence) if we "keep" (Greek word "tereo" - guard, observe, watch over) His commandments. We must not confuse "descriptive" passages of scripture with "prescriptive" passages of scripture. The end result is salvation by works.
Are you talking about what I shared in post #71? I proved my point that the rich young ruler confidently and (self-righteously) declared that he has kept the commandments from his youth up and qualified for heaven under those terms and that Jesus knew the man's wealth had become his idolatrous god, which kept him from believing in Jesus unto salvation. (John 3:18) The rich young ruler missed the point that Jesus was making, failed to place his faith in Jesus for salvation, and continued instead to trust in his riches (Matthew 19:21-23). The rich young ruler went away sad because he could not part from his great wealth, not even in exchange for eternal life.
Do you agree or disagree?
What is listed as the requirement for salvation is over in verse 31 (just as it is in Acts 10:43; 13:38; 15:7) yet works-salvationists try to force baptism into the equation based on their personal eisegesis from verses 33-34.
See 1 Corinthians 2:14.
In Acts 16:31, Paul said - "Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved.." NOT believe and get baptized and you will be saved. Water baptism "followed" believe unto salvation, just as it did in Acts 10:43-47, which remains your Achilles heel. Repentance is not mentioned in verse 31, but it's already implied or assumed because repentance precedes belief/faith. (Acts 20:21) This is a story of salvation through belief/faith in JESUS CHRIST ALONE FOR SALVATION no matter how much water salvationists want to believe otherwise and boast in their baptism.
This is a beautiful story of hear, repent, believe (saved) then "afterwards" baptized. You continue to reverse the scriptural order of repent and believe.
CONTINUED..
Mailman, the order of salvation in Acts 16 was by the Holy Spirit—not me. The way the Holy Spirit tells it, is they 1) “heard” the word of the Lord, 2) they believed what they heard, 3) he washed their stripes ( perhaps he was the one who had also beaten them) regardless, it is evidence of his remorse and “repentance.”, and 4) they were “BAPTIZED”. In that order. You are the one putting repentance in the wrong place. You keep insisting that repentance comes before faith but you know that is not logical or reasonable. You are not going to change your behavior ( or even feel sorrow) before you even believe in Jesus. Why would you? Which is why many people will not repent—they don’t believe. Faith is the reason for repentance and is the motivater for repentance. Acts 10:43 is not a problem. It puts salvation in future tense— will receive. And the story in Actsc16 proves it exactly. The jailer and his house were described as “HAVING BELIEVED IN GOd AFTER they had repented, and were baptized. That statement was not made about them BEFORE Baptism—AFTER they had done all that was required and clearly baptism was required—it was part of the “WORD OF THE LORD” ” spoken to them. This shows “belief” requires more than mental acceptance or even trust” as you like to define it. All those who “believe” will obey what the Lord has said about repentance, confession and baptism. That’s described by the Spirit as “having believed.”
The only way Acts 10:43 would be a problem for me is if it said, “ whoever believes in Him HAS RECEIVED remission of sins. That is the only way it would show salvation by faith alone. And that is not what it says, is it? As long as it is future tense, it means you HAVE NOT RECEIVED remission of sins yet. I believe acts 10:43 is a bigger problem for you than it is for me. The situation then is that Acts 10:43 does not prove salvation by faith only because they have not received it in that verse. It is not saying they are already saved because they believe. It is only saying that forgiveness of sins IS AVAILABLE to those who believe. It allows for the possibility. But that in no way teaches it is by faith alone. You still have not proven anything. Only the possibility of receiving the remission of sins. Don’t you think God was smart enough that if he wanted us to know remission of sins was by faith alone, he would have just said,” all those who believe have remission of sins (present tense)? Or all those who believe HAVE RECEIVED remission if sins? Past tense. Either way, THAT would show salvation by faith alone. But it does does not say THAT. It does not prove salvation by faith alone if you don’t have remission of sins yet. The question then becomes what does the Bible say about remission of sins? How do we receive it? The Holy Spirit tells us exactly how and when believers receive remission of sins—when they are baptized in the name of Jesus. Acts 2:38, Acts 22:16, 1 Peter 3:21. And that is in perfect harmony with Acts 10:43. It says believers Will receive. remission of sins and Acts 2:38 tells us WHEN AND HOW they receive remission if sins. Not a problem for me, but a big one for you.
You changed the order. I'll stick with the true order by Holy Spirit.
They heard the word of the Lord and in order to believe what they heard, they needed to repent (change their mind) first, then upon believing they were saved. Water baptism "followed," just as we see in Acts 10:43-47.
Oh, the irony. Matthew 21:32 - For John came to you to show you the way of righteousness, and you did not believe him, but the tax collectors and the prostitutes did. And even after you saw this, you did not repent and believe him. *Notice the order.
Mark 1:15 - and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe the gospel.” *Notice the order.
Acts 20:21 - testifying both to Jews and to Greeks of repentance toward God and of faith in our Lord Jesus Christ. *Notice the order.
You or confusing the fruit of repentance (change in behavior) with the essence of repentance (change a mind). You are also confusing mere "mental asset" belief in Jesus with saving belief/faith in Jesus which not only acknowledges His existence and certain facts about Jesus, but also trusts in Him as the ALL-sufficient means of our salvation.
You are confusing the fruit of repentance "works" (Matthew 3:8; Acts 26:20) with the essence of repentance "change of mind." (Acts 3:19; 20:21)
It's a problem for your erroneous view of repentance. Future tense salvation as in immediately after believing. Many translations render the verb in the present tense. Some Bible translations render Acts 10:43 in the future tense and many others in the present tense because of a difference in how they interpret the original Greek grammar.
We don't get baptized in order to become believers but because we are believers. Their repentance preceded believing in the Lord Jesus Christ and becoming saved. Water baptism "followed." Just as we see in Acts 10:43-47.
Baptism was not mentioned as a requirement for salvation in verse 43 "in addition to" believing in the Lord Jesus Christ" and neither was it mentioned in Acts 10:43 "in addition to" believes in Him" so try again. You are simply grasping at straws.
Saving faith in Christ involves belief, trust, reliance in Jesus Christ for salvation. (Romans 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9) Repentance "precedes" belief (Mark 1:15) confession confirms belief (Romans 10:8-11) and water baptism "follows" belief. (Acts 10:43-47) Through bad semantics and flawed hermeneutics, you are trying to "shoehorn" baptism "into" having believed but the shoe does not fit.
In Acts 10:43, the KJV reads shall receive remission of sins. Campbellites focus on the future tense of the verb "receive" and interpret it to mean that remission of sins is not received at the moment of belief but only at a future point upon subsequent acts of obedience, such as baptism. Yet believers generally interpret this verse differently. Many translations render the verb in the present tense. So, "receives" in the (ESV, NIV, NASB) in Greek, the infinitive can function with a present-tense meaning in this grammatical context. Based on this view, forgiveness is a present possession for those who believe. The present tense signifies and ongoing, immediate result of belief. The Greek word "pisteuo" (believes) is a present active participle, confirming this ongoing result of belief. In his Word Pictures in the New Testament, Greek scholar AT Robertson notes that the Greek participle for "believeth" is in the present tense, while the infinitive "receive" is a second aorist active infinitive. This grammatical combination is significant because as a present participle "believeth" indicates continuous or ongoing action.
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