Question about Moses

[Miri]

Behold, I will stand before you there on the rock at Horeb, and you shall strike the rock, and water shall come out of it, and the people will drink.” And Moses did so, in the sight of the elders of Israel. (Exodus 17:6 ESV) Oh, I was thinking about a different passage

Different rocks, different methods.

You have reminded me of something I heard years ago, how just because
one way of doing things works at certain times under the inspiration and guidance of the
Holy Spirit. It doesn't mean that we should continue to use that same way all the time.
To do so places more emphasise on the method as if it had some magical power than
the power behind the method.

Maybe that was why the method was different to ensure no superstition arose about the rod.

 

[eph610]

God did take Moses to the Promised Land, didn't He?

The mount of transfiguration was not in the Promised Land

That is one of my favorite brain grenades to throw at folks though

 

[Magenta]

Different rocks, different methods.

You have reminded me of something I heard years ago, how just because
one way of doing things works at certain times under the inspiration and guidance of the
Holy Spirit. It doesn't mean that we should continue to use that same way all the time.
To do so places more emphasise on the method as if it had some magical power than
the power behind the method.

Maybe that was why the method was different to ensure no superstition arose about the rod.

Reminds me of the guy who was rankled for being told to dip
himself in the Jordan river seven times, thinking it foolishness.

Elisha sent a messenger to say to him, "Go, wash yourself seven times in the Jordan, and your flesh will be restored and you will be cleansed." But Naaman went away angry and said, "I thought that he would surely come out to me and stand and call on the name of the LORD his God, wave his hand over the spot and cure me of my leprosy. 2 Kings 5:10-11

 

[Grandpa]

The Rock represents Jesus because he is the rock and the living water, Moses struck the rock twice, therefore he did not believe in God's way and he put crucified Christ again, through his disbelief.

I hadn't heard of this explanation before but it makes sense.

The first time he struck the Rock - crucifixion.
The second time he was supposed to talk to the Rock - prayer.

Is it easier for us to have faith now? Since the Lord Jesus has personified all these spiritual shadows?

Do you ever feel bad for people in the OT? Like if they could have just gotten over a couple hurdles they would have been absolutely fantastic.

 

[FreeNChrist]

The mount of transfiguration was not in the Promised Land

Who said it was?

 

[Grandpa]

Who said it was?

Well if Moses was in heaven talking to the Lord and to Elijah, he made it to the Promised Land, in my estimation.

 

[FreeNChrist]

Well if Moses was in heaven talking to the Lord and to Elijah, he made it to the Promised Land, in my estimation.

Exactly. God took him to his and our true Promised Land.

 

[Grace777x70]

I hadn't heard of this explanation before but it makes sense.

The first time he struck the Rock - crucifixion.
The second time he was supposed to talk to the Rock - prayer.

Is it easier for us to have faith now? Since the Lord Jesus has personified all these spiritual shadows?

Do you ever feel bad for people in the OT? Like if they could have just gotten over a couple hurdles they would have been absolutely fantastic.

I agree...except maybe the second time God told Moses to "speak" to the rock. In the New Covenant "we believe therefor we speak" and prayer is definitely speaking but so is speaking out our faith in Christ.

2 Corinthians 4:13 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] But having the same spirit of faith, according to what is written, "I BELIEVED, THEREFORE I SPOKE," we also believe, therefore we also speak,


And Romans 10:6 says "That the righteousness based on faith speaks..."

Philemon says it well too in that our faith will be effective by the "acknowledging" of every good thing which is in us in Christ.

Philemon 1:6 (KJV)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] That the communication of thy faith may become effectual by the acknowledging of every good thing which is in you in Christ Jesus.

Just throwing some thoughts out about this.

 

[Talishi]

Well if Moses was in heaven talking to the Lord and to Elijah, he made it to the Promised Land, in my estimation.

John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

 

[pottersclay]

Well if Moses was in heaven talking to the Lord and to Elijah, he made it to the Promised Land, in my estimation.

Well imo I don't think Moses went to heaven, or the o.t. saints untill the Christ was crucified that's when the Vail was tore but that's another thread. ....Abrahams bosom......you can throw rocks now

 

[Bladerunner]

Why didn't Moses make it into the Promised Land?


Was it because of disobedience or was it because of a lack of faith?

Are they one and the same thing?


I think Moses misrepresented God at the Rock by causing the water to flow by his own strength and understanding instead of relying on the Provision and Work of God. Which caused Israel (and everyone else who would attempt to emulate them) to think that is the way.

Is there more to it than this?

God told Moses to only strike the rock ONCE and Moses hit it twice. His sin here was not obeying God. By striking the rock only once then it was God's gift to the people and by striking it twice Moses made the Gift from himself Not God!

He saw the Promise land but did not cross the Jordan.

 

[NarrowRoadDisciple]

God told Moses to only strike the rock ONCE and Moses hit it twice. His sin here was not obeying God. By striking the rock only once then it was God's gift to the people and by striking it twice Moses made the Gift from himself Not God!

He saw the Promise land but did not cross the Jordan.

Didn't God tell Moses to speak to the rock, but in his anger he struck the rock?
Either way, Moses didn't make it in to the promised land due to disobedience yes.

 

[GandalfTheWhite]

The interesting thing about the exodus tale is that Moses and the Israelites could have entered the Promised Land almost immediately after they left Egypt, but because they doubted God they had to stay in the desert 40 years (1 year for every day they camped outside of Canaan originally). It was also then that God told Moses that only Joshua and Caleb will enter the promised land of every person older than 20 (if memory serve me correct) will die in the desert. The interesting thing is that Joshua (tribe of Ephraim which became a multitude of nations (gentiles)) was representing the 10 lost tribes and Caleb the Jews (he was from the tribe of Judah).

Both brides are represented entering the Promised Land, Judah and Israel.

 

[Miri]

The struggle of the Isrealites reminds me a lot about our lives.

The Isrealites were taken out of Egypt, but it was oh so hard to take Egypt out of
the Isrealites, that's why they ended up trudging for 40 years. (Good word trudge ).

Its like us isn't it, it takes time to grow, learn, stop grumbling, start believing etc.

I don't think we can point the finger at them without also pointing the finger at ourselves.

Moses on the other hand, left Egypt long before the Isrealites did - isn't that interesting that
he spent all that extra time in the wilderness first. In that sense he was miles ahead of the
Isrealites in his relationship with God - the Isrealites however had to play catch up but
the original adults never managed it.

If anything it's a warning to us to be quick learners.

 

[GandalfTheWhite]

The struggle of the Isrealites reminds me a lot about our lives.

The Isrealites were taken out of Egypt, but it was oh so hard to take Egypt out of
the Isrealites, that's why they ended up trudging for 40 years. (Good word trudge ).

Its like us isn't it, it takes time to grow, learn, stop grumbling, start believing etc.

I don't think we can point the finger at them without also pointing the finger at ourselves.

Moses on the other hand, left Egypt long before the Isrealites did - isn't that interesting that
he spent all that extra time in the wilderness first. In that sense he was miles ahead of the
Isrealites in his relationship with God - the Isrealites however had to play catch up but
the original adults never managed it.

If anything it's a warning to us to be quick learners.

Interesting points.

The word Egypt in Hebrew means that which bind you, so the Israelites were longing back to that which binded them when they were still in bondage.

The word for wilderness/desert in Hebrew is also translated as a time of teaching. So while Moses was in the wilderness it was a time of teaching for him.

Other interesting fact of about Moses is that he was only truly converted when he turned 80 years old. It basically took him 2 thirds of his life to understand God, but when they went to Pharaoh Aaron was the one doing the miracles the first three times and God the one doing the next two by Himself, but after that Moses was the one listening to ABBA Father, being His spokes person.

Moses wasn’t really “miles ahead” because he was almost killed by God just before he went back to Egypt because he didn’t circumcise his sons. He was learning on the job (so to speak).

 

[John146]

The rock from which living waters flow was only to be struck once
to represent the future one time death of Jesus, once for all.

Bingo, you're right on. The Rock, Jesus Christ, was to be struck once, then after we must needs simply to call upon Him. No need to crucify Him over again.

 

[Grandpa]

Well imo I don't think Moses went to heaven, or the o.t. saints untill the Christ was crucified that's when the Vail was tore but that's another thread. ....Abrahams bosom......you can throw rocks now

Ok. Heavens waiting room...?

Wherever he went it was a very good place to be talking to Elijah and the Lord simultaneously.

 

[FreeNChrist]

The interesting thing about the exodus tale is that Moses and the Israelites could have entered the Promised Land almost immediately after they left Egypt, but because they doubted God they had to stay in the desert 40 years (1 year for every day they camped outside of Canaan originally). It was also then that God told Moses that only Joshua and Caleb will enter the promised land of every person older than 20 (if memory serve me correct) will die in the desert. The interesting thing is that Joshua (tribe of Ephraim which became a multitude of nations (gentiles)) was representing the 10 lost tribes and Caleb the Jews (he was from the tribe of Judah).

Both brides are represented entering the Promised Land, Judah and Israel.

Right. They did not enter in because of their unbelief. Same thing today. People refuse to enter into the rest that God has provided in Christ Jesus because of their unbelief.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

The struggle of the Isrealites reminds me a lot about our lives.

The Isrealites were taken out of Egypt, but it was oh so hard to take Egypt out of
the Isrealites, that's why they ended up trudging for 40 years. (Good word trudge :smile.

Egypt symbolizes the world and pharaoh symbolizes the prince of this world.

When the children of Israel were called out of Egypt (the world), Pharaoh chased after them to bring them back into the bondage of Egypt (Ex 14:9).

However, God placed Himself between His people and pharaoh's men (Ex 14:19).

In 1 Cor 10:2 we read that the children of Israel were baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea and that through eating manna, they ate spiritual meat (manna represented Christ – John 6:27-59).

When we become born again, the prince of this world (the devil) chases after us to bring us back into bondage. We can no more look back on our former life and go back to it than the children of Israel could go back into Egypt. And we must trust that God places Himself between us and the devil and that, throughout our lifetime on this earth, He will lead us through the wilderness and into the promised land, just as He led the children of Israel through the wilderness.

And just as the children of Israel looked back and thought the fruit of Egypt was more desirable than the manna from heaven, and their bondage in Egypt was more desirable than their wandering in the wilderness, when the going gets tough as we abide in our Lord Jesus Christ, we sometimes look back ... just as the children of Israel did. And we can no more go back to our former life than they could go back into Egypt.

Its like us isn't it, it takes time to grow, learn, stop grumbling, start believing etc.

I don't think we can point the finger at them without also pointing the finger at ourselves.

So true, Miri. So true.

 

[Grace777x70]

Right. They did not enter in because of their unbelief. Same thing today. People refuse to enter into the rest that God has provided in Christ Jesus because of their unbelief.

And they will die in this life without experiencing their inheritance that is theirs in Christ.

God even provided for those wandering in the wilderness because of their unbelief so even having supernatural things happen to us does not mean we are in the "promised land" of resting in Christ's finished work accomplished at the cross and resurrection and ascension to the right hand of the Father.

The Lord through his great love, mercy and grace still looks after us even though we are wandering in the wilderness of our unbelief in Christ's finished work but we are not experiencing our real inheritance to it's fullest extent that we could be if we really believed the true gospel when it is proclaimed to us.