Not By Works

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Noose said:
Don't you have a clue? People here have enrolled and are 'fighting against the forces of darkness', defending the 'truth' aka OSAS and anyone who doesn't have OSAS in their lips is an 'agent of satan'. :cool:
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Not necessarily true. If salvation if is irrevocable then the taking a works based salvation stance after getting saved would not revoke ones salvation. That would be a contradiction. Christians have already been forgiven for all our mistakes. A person can be sincere and mistaken without accidentally committing Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.

Men are often sincerely mistaken. Only God can see the spiritual dimentions of a men's hearts and or souls. There is clearly a difference between our life in the flesh and the lives of our souls. Many have disputed this with me however when the Lord said, "fear not men that can only take your life, rather fear him that can take both your life and you soul." that they are different.

I would expect those of us on OSAS side to defend this and not accuse the sincerely mistaken of being in league with the devil. Only the Holy Spirit can circumcise the heart and only God can see who is and who isn't.

Did anyone ever look up the English comprehension level average for US HS grads. I did and the average is 8th grade! A high reading and language comprehension level is not a requirement for Salvation.
 
FollowHisSteps said:
Thank you Smooth.
You summarise in this statement judgementalism. It attempts to simplify complexity, and then rubbish it.
Walking with Jesus anyone can do, and this walk is between Jesus and the individual.

I am not focusing as you suggest, I am making an observation on others and their words in a post.
Jesus and my walk is far greater than this, though you would presume to summarise it as if my words define
how I interact with the Lord. Intercessarory prayer is focused on individuals and bringing concerns and requests
before the Lord. But interceeding is part of our spiritual walk. We also have praise and worship, repentance and
sorrow, thanks and remembering how God has worked and walked with us. Then we have study of His word and
fellowship with believers and witnessing to unbelievers, like here on cc.

I would not presume to say I know anothers walk with Jesus or their past or even their future. I can share Gods
word and His testimony on these realities.

It does concern me that anyone who claims to know Jesus and not work through sin, is truly blind and lost.
It is like saying
"I murdered someone today, but its fine, Jesus gave me a pass twenty years ago, and he is cool with it."

Some will say this is such an extreme example, but it summaries 100% what they believe. The idea is any sorrow,
pain, remorse is just unbelief in the work of Christ and the cross. But in truth, anyone who can do this is a
psychopath and needs imprisoning or removing from the planet permanently.

But even with this clear illustration of the fruits of no sorrow, no repentance, some will call this the gospel we
should embrace as Gods good news to the world. No this is the delusions of guilt ridden ex-legalists who will
do anything to appease their consciences and ignore how bad they feel about themselves. It is pure self
indulgence and self pity, rather than accepting sin, repenting and believing they are forgiven and working it
through. It is really this simple, and why Jesus died upon the cross, Praise the Lord, Amen.
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Two short sentence rule applies to all your posts directed at me. I simply will not waste precious time scouring through your nonsensical drivel.
 
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Noose said:
This thread has quickly gone beyond limits but i can still use some help. Someone please help me understand OSAS.
Are the following statements correct as per OSAS?

1. 'We' are saved by Grace, a Grace that is sufficient
2. The Lord chose 'us' to be saved by this grace
3. The Lord works salvation in 'us' and 'we' can not loose it because He will never deny Himself
4. The Lord rewards those that are saved
5. Those that believe already have eternal life
6. But the Lord will harshly judge the others who are not saved, because they are not chosen, grace doesn't cover them, their reward is judgement because the Lord did not work salvation in them.
7. The Lord is a righteous judge
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If the above is correct, the opposite is terrifying for those that are not saved by Grace.
1. They are not saved by Grace therefore grace is not sufficient for them
2. The Lord did not choose them to be saved by grace, how can they be saved, ever
3. The Lord does not work salvation in them , they are eternally lost
4. No rewards, just punishment
5. If you don't believe, you are already in eternal death- you will never be saved no matter what
6. ;)
7. The Lord is a righteous judge
 
FollowHisSteps said:
Dear sister,

When someone is this skilled at winding people up, you can be sure some would attempt revenge
by hitting where it hurts. I have seen people truly hurt on the internet and go hunting others.
It is not a pretty sight. You do not get this skilled without incidents like this cropping up.

I intervene and attempt to shine a light on what people are doing emotionally and spiritually.
Look how I am treated just bringing peace and Gods word. Imagine something far worse.
Soldiers. When friends have died in your arms, and you have killed face to face it changes you.
Ptsd has some odd effects on people. It would not surprise me if this was not part of the mix.

God bless you
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I agree,but does this forbid us from this thread?
 
FollowHisSteps said:
Hi smooth,

Heretical views? Which views are these and what is the heresy?
Is this the soldiers approach of enemy, destroy, dominate? And the reason why or how or
damage done does not register?

A thug swings a club at anything, not knowing what they are hitting, but this just reflects
on the thug, nothing more.
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If you believe and teach that Jesus’ perfect life, sacrificial death and glorious Resurrection are not enough to save the repentant sinner of faith, then yes, you are heretical.
 
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gb9 said:
um, many of us calling you out for being banned at least twice, and being back is not " treating you bad " as you implied, it is pointing out truth,

telling you that you are not sinless and perfect is reality, not bad treatment.

so, get off your fake , whining moral high horse and be a man and address things, not attack the people who point out TRUTH to you.
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Lol. They hate us because we expose reality.
 
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Noose said:
This thread has quickly gone beyond limits but i can still use some help. Someone please help me understand OSAS.
Are the following statements correct as per OSAS?

1. 'We' are saved by Grace, a Grace that is sufficient
2. The Lord chose 'us' to be saved by this grace
3. The Lord works salvation in 'us' and 'we' can not loose it because He will never deny Himself
4. The Lord rewards those that are saved
5. Those that believe already have eternal life
6. But the Lord will harshly judge the others who are not saved, because they are not chosen, grace doesn't cover them, their reward is judgement because the Lord did not work salvation in them.
7. The Lord is a righteous judge
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Your close. However I see no statement or requirements regarding faith. Because Jesus died for all however faith in him is the only requirement.
 
Smooth said:
Two short sentence rule applies to all your posts directed at me. I simply will not waste precious time scouring through your nonsensical drivel.
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I spent over a year tryign to help him understand our faith. It is an endeavor. Just wish I did not take so long before I said enough was enough.

Some people just will never hear you
 
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Smooth said:
If you believe and teach that Jesus’ perfect life, sacrificial death and glorious Resurrection are not enough to save the repentant sinner of faith, then yes, you are heretical.
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All faith believers believe this, Amen. It is odd I find, "free grace" followers ( free grace theology )
are the ones who disown everyone and make enemies of others as workers for etc.
It is this acceptance of the words while disowning faithful believers in Jesus were the heresy lies.
But then no surprise there. God bless you.
 
gb9 said:
um, many of us calling you out for being banned at least twice, and being back is not " treating you bad " as you implied, it is pointing out truth,

telling you that you are not sinless and perfect is reality, not bad treatment.

so, get off your fake , whining moral high horse and be a man and address things, not attack the people who point out TRUTH to you.
Click to expand...

Hi gb9, nice to hear from you again. Good to know you are still around, God bless you.
 
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calibob said:
Your close. However I see no statement or requirements regarding faith. Because Jesus died for all however faith in him is the only requirement.
Click to expand...

1. 'We' are saved by Grace, a Grace that is sufficient
2. The Lord chose 'us' to be saved by this grace
3. The Lord works salvation in 'us' and 'we' can not loose it because He will never deny Himself
4. The Lord rewards those that are saved
5. Those that believe already have eternal life
6. But the Lord will harshly judge the others who are not saved, because they are not chosen, grace doesn't cover them, their reward is judgement because the Lord did not work salvation in them.
7. The Lord is a righteous judge

Already covered in #5 "Those that believe already have eternal life", i should have said "those that believe the Gospel of Christ"
But i have a problem with these ideas and especially with #6.
Why does the Lord judge (those that are not saved) people, for something He (Christ) did not do in them (salvation/choosing) and reward others (saved), for something HE (Christ) did in them and still be called a righteous judge? This idea nullifies everything about God.
 
Leastamongmany said:
I agree,but does this forbid us from this thread?
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Nothing forbids us. Loving and understanding anothers style, weakness and way of talking helps us
cope and measure our responses. Truth changes things, repetition of the same belief system is just
that, a tape on repeat. It helps us see how locked in some are, and also how our foundations need to
go deeper than frameworks and ideas into our hearts and let the Lord help us to grow.
God bless you
 
Leastamongmany said:
You really have to laugh at them it undermines their inflated egos,they can't stand it! Also ignore makes the forums easier to read without all the name calling and guff they spew! If ppl choose to not walk after Jesus as He says,it on them and you are right FHS,makes us press forward more!
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People who rely solely on Christ are not egotistical. People who rely on their own works on the other hand...
 
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FollowHisSteps said:
All faith believers believe this, Amen. It is odd I find, "free grace" followers ( free grace theology )
are the ones who disown everyone and make enemies of others as workers for etc.
It is this acceptance of the words while disowning faithful believers in Jesus were the heresy lies.
But then no surprise there. God bless you.
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Obviously not all people believe fully in Christ, including you. I’ll correspond with you when you decide to be completely honest about it. I and others only want to help you. Forgive us if we’re passionate about it.
 
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Noose said:
This thread has quickly gone beyond limits but i can still use some help. Someone please help me understand OSAS.
Are the following statements correct as per OSAS?

1. 'We' are saved by Grace, a Grace that is sufficient
2. The Lord chose 'us' to be saved by this grace
3. The Lord works salvation in 'us' and 'we' can not loose it because He will never deny Himself
4. The Lord rewards those that are saved
5. Those that believe already have eternal life
6. But the Lord will harshly judge the others who are not saved, because they are not chosen, grace doesn't cover them, their reward is judgement because the Lord did not work salvation in them.
7. The Lord is a righteous judge
Click to expand...

I would start with a different development
1. Saved through a faith encounter with Jesus
2. Nothing they believe or do changes the eternal nature of this encounter
3. Polarised world, believers in Jesus, and the self righteous
4. All sin is forgiven past, present and future today
5. Morality is just good deeds followed from the Holy Spirit and everything else is evil

A lot of lying and self deception is involved in the theology. Key is an instant rebirth with an
eternal spirit who is ones true self.
Everything spins off this and its affirmation as a reality, belief or its denial, unbelief.

Words, morality, spirituality change with this focus, verses are fulfilled by the eternal spirit
yet denied by the behaviour. Conviction of sin is evil because satan is denying the eternal
spirit, and guilt, conviction is a lie, because the believer is innocent, forgiven.

If you want a psychopaths emotional view of life, this is it.
So for us they can say our love is hate, we are doomed to hell and leading people there, we
are the worst of the worst, some go so far as to suggest believers are the biggest evil in the world.

Now as a believer, to find out of our own theology, someone has made people who hate us,
who say such evil against us, this is not a work of the Holy Spirit or God. It is dangerous because
though the language is absurd it is keenly felt and spoken, without even a flicker of opppps, hating
christians makes me an enemy of Christ. Not even a flicker, which shows how far they have gone.

I have noticed they are sensitive to others spotting the hatred, so it quickly becomes they are
loving us. Funny how being on the receiving end, it has never come across as love, just total
rejection and personal attacks to upset at whatever level they can get away with. God bless you.
 
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