Is God Good?

[Dave-L]

From where do we get the Law, but by the nature of God? Gordon Clark thinks God is above His Law, but God is not above His nature, and that Law is defined by His nature. Does not His word say to not be deceived for the righteous commit righteousness? God can no more commit evil than love can be defined as sin. Love is love, and God is love.

There are absolutes set in play here. God does not supersede righteousness, as if He can do what He pleases and call it good. For then morality is subjective and as is explained in His word of the evils of men, they call good evil and evil good. Good and evil are definite standards, absolute and objective.

What Clark fails to realize is that God is just and His wrath is impeccably pure. The penalty for sin is death, and He is the righteous judge. Yet, God is merciful. He is long suffering that all would come to repentance. He much rather have a man repent and change His ways than for Him to have to bring judgement. He wishes for men to choose good and not evil.

If God can sin, the Law is God. And he abolished the Law replacing it with the New Covenant showing he is not subject to it.

 

[Dave-L]

He modified the covenant of the law now that the work was done. It has always been by faith the unseen eternal . The mystery was hid in the old. By faith Abel became the first martyr according to the unseen spirit of the law. The law of faith. Cain died under the letter he was given no faith needed to believe God. lawlessness

He no more replaced the letter of the law then did the word Christian replace the name Israel. They complete each other one bride. The law of faith completes the letter of the law as one complete circuit from end to end no separation . The perfect law not in parts (Psalms 19:7-14)

He replaced it.

 

[garee]

He replaced it.

How is that? Did it make the letter of the Law: "all things written in the law and the prophets" without effect?

If so by what kind of law did he make the letter of the law (death ) without effect?

 

[Dave-L]

How is that? Did it make the letter of the Law: "all things written in the law and the prophets" without effect?

If so by what kind of law did he make the letter of the law (death ) without effect?

The Ten Commandments = the Old Covenant.

 

[Jimbone]

If God can sin, the Law is God, not him.

Okay, so like I was saying, the two are inseparable. When you say things like "God is above the law" YOU, YOU in the source you were directly quoting and recommending, not me, separates the two. What you're saying here is EXACTLY my point. the LAW is defined by His very nature. He cannot be above His own nature. Look I see way to many arguments on here that are two people that believe the exact same thing only see it two different ways yet behave as if there's some gigantic chasm between them that just cannot be bridged, when again it's just a difference in perspectives and not any doctrine. Like here. I don't know how your head thinks about these things, nor have I any clue how God works in anyone but me to bring us to truth, but I agree with this.

However I don't think that will have much effect on you. I have yet to see an ounce of humility or even much understanding towards anyone else's arguments on here. You like to "teach", and you love to be right about everything. All the time, and look I have not read every one of your comments, and I could be off base here, I also believe a lot of the things you say, but the way you present yourself is a major stumbling block to people from my point of view. Also know I am not talking at all about compromise, and I like your boldness to stand on your beliefs too. Praise Jesus name for that gift, we need much more of it, but we are to do so with love and compassion, especially amoungst the brothers and sisters. Jesus tells us this world will know us by our love for each other, and I am pointing out that I don't catch that vibe from you ever, and the world seeing us here sometimes. Whew.

To wrap up here, I don't think we are that far off from how we see out God and His law, bur I do highly disagree with the tone of those quotes, and do not believe God and His law to be separate things, God can't be "above" Himself, can't be "above" His own nature, so we disagree with this being a wise thing to say.

 

[Dave-L]

Okay, so like I was saying, the two are inseparable. When you say things like "God is above the law" YOU, YOU in the source you were directly quoting and recommending, not me, separates the two. What you're saying here is EXACTLY my point. the LAW is set by His very nature. He cannot be above His own nature. Look I see way to many arguments on here that are two people that believe the exact same thing only see it two different ways yet behave as if there's some gigantic chasm between them that just cannot be bridged, when again it's just a difference in perspectives and not any doctrine. Like here. I don't know how your head thinks about these thing, nor have I any clue how God works in anyone but me to bring us to truth, but I agree with this.

However I don't think that will have much effect on you. I have yet to see an ounce of humility or even much understanding towards anyone else's arguments on here. You like to "teach", and you love to be right about everything. All the time, and look I have not read every one of your comments, and I could be off base here, I also believe a lot of the things you say, but the way you present yourself is a major stumbling block to people from my point of view. Also know I am not talking at all about compromise, and I like your boldness to stand on your beliefs too. Praise Jesus name for that gift, we need much more of it, but we are to do so with love and compassion, especially amoungst the brothers and sisters. Jesus tells us this world will know us by our love for each other, and I am pointing out that I don't catch that vibe from you ever.

To wrap up here, I don't think we are that far off from how we see out God and His law, bur I do highly disagree with the tone of those quotes, and do not believe God and His law to be separate things, God can't be "above" Himself, can't be "above" His own nature, so we disagree with this being a wise thing to say.

But he's the lawgiver. If he is subject to the Law, it is God.

 

[garee]

If God can sin, the Law is God. And he abolished the Law replacing it with the New Covenant showing he is not subject to it.

God is subject to His own laws he magnifies them above his person. If not he would be a liar and not trustworthy

If his word is not magnified above his name as the authority by which we can believe and without no man could . Why would a person trust in the things not seen unless they were given a confidence that he who began the good work of salvation in us will finish it?

He empowers us to beleive as he works in us to both will and do his good pleasure. Some grumble and complain and could end up faithless like Adam and Eve desiring to do the will of another .(the pride builder father of lies)

Better things accompany salvation according to Hebrews 6 . As a law of God he promises us he will remember the good works we worked with him .He who grades on a scale has got the score card . On ressurection day all receive the same grade .(paid in full)

Psalm 138:2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name

 

[Jimbone]

But he's the lawgiver. If he is subject to the Law, it is God.

The law giver to "us", He gave us the law, not Himself. Again perfect example. No humility or understanding of any kind. Just fighting for "I'm right". Not a good look at all.

BTW who said God was "subject" to the law? Complete straw man.

 

[Dave-L]

The law giver to "us", He gave us the law, not Himself. Again perfect example. No humility or understanding of any kind. Just fighting for "I'm right". Not a good look at all.

BTW who said God was "subject" to the law? Complete straw man.

You are editing God into an Idol.

 

[Hungry]

Where is murder?! I don't see it.

We see what we want to see. Dave is not wrong in the fact that conspiracy to commit the death of Christ started with the Father. It’s not a malicious act. It was a sacrifice. How one cares to define murder is what the argument is. Conflict is something that challenges us. It causes chemicals to surge in this vessel. When we don’t have enough in life, we invent conflict. Some are able to watch television and live vicariously (mirror neurons) through action and drama. Others decide to start threads that know will incite conflict so they can intentionally debate the most insignificant detail.

 

[Dave-L]

God is subject to His own laws he magnifies them above his person. If not he would be a liar and not trustworthy

If his word is not magnified above his name as the authority by which we can believe and without no man could . Why would a person trust in the things not seen unless they were given a confidence that he who began the good work of salvation in us will finish it?

He empowers us to beleive as he works in us to both will and do his good pleasure. Some grumble and complain and could end up faithless like Adam and Eve desiring to do the will of another .(the pride builder father of lies)

Better things accompany salvation according to Hebrews 6 . As a law of God he promises us he will remember the good works we worked with him .He who grades on a scale has got the score card . On ressurection day all receive the same grade .(paid in full)

Psalm 138:2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name

You edit him into an idol. The scope of the law leaves out his many attributes.

 

[Jimbone]

You are editing God into an Idol.

Now you resort to this? You are so unclear with your direction, and you just start veering off into your own little "I'm right, I'm THE teacher zone". Again we haven't discussed anything about what you're bringing up here about Gods attributes. Nothing at all. We were talking about the Law deriving strait from the very nature of who God and being inseparable from God Himself, thereby making God being "above" the law, impossible. Had nothing at all to do with any attributes. Now you're just spitting nonsense trying to be right, but everyone can see through it. Just stop man.

 

[Dave-L]

Now you resort to this? You are so unclear with your direction, and you just start veering off into your own little "I'm right, I'm THE teacher zone". Again we haven't discussed anything about what you're bringing up here about Gods attributes. Nothing at all. We were talking about the Law deriving strait from the very nature of who God and being inseparable from God Himself, thereby making God being "above" the law, impossible. Had nothing at all to do with any attributes. Now you're just spitting nonsense trying to be right, but everyone can see through it. Just stop man.

Law does not allow for hatred. God hates the wicked. eg.

 

[cv5]

We see what we want to see. Dave is not wrong in the fact that conspiracy to commit the death of Christ started with the Father. It’s not a malicious act. It was a sacrifice. How one cares to define murder is what the argument is. Conflict is something that challenges us. It causes chemicals to surge in this vessel. When we don’t have enough in life, we invent conflict. Some are able to watch television and live vicariously (mirror neurons) through action and drama. Others decide to start threads that know will incite conflict so they can intentionally debate the most insignificant detail.

Completely disagree. With "council and foreknowledge", The Trinity calculated and devised a COUNTER-CONSPIRACY to thwart Satan's rebellion and Adams fall. This included of course the murder of his dear Son by wicked men who were under the control of Satan. The Trinity allowed this to happen without defense, making Jesus a Lamb to the slaughter, thereby fulfilling all prophetical types.

This blasphemy of calling God a murderer must stop immediately.

 

[cv5]

Completely disagree. With "council and foreknowledge", The Trinity calculated and devised a COUNTER-CONSPIRACY to thwart Satan's rebellion and Adams fall. This included of course the murder of his dear Son by wicked men who were under the control of Satan. The Trinity allowed this to happen without defense, making Jesus a Lamb to the slaughter, thereby fulfilling all prophetical types.

This blasphemy of calling God a murderer must stop immediately.

Here is an example of a successful counter conspiracy that God foreordained and planned.
For pity's sake people get it together you're drifting. Don't let this Dave-L seduce you into believing something that isn't true!

Gen 50:20
As for you, you meant evil against me, but God meant it for good, to bring it about that many people should be kept alive, as they are today.

 

[Hungry]

Completely disagree. With "council and foreknowledge", The Trinity calculated and devised a COUNTER-CONSPIRACY to thwart Satan's rebellion and Adams fall.

Sorry, I’m not picking up what you’re laying down. Are you saying you don’t think the Father’s plan when He sent His Son to the world was not to be a sacrifice for all sins? If you agree with that then nothing else is relevant. It’s not even an arguable point. God sent His Son to die horribly at the hands of men. It’s not the end of the story obviously, but it’s still part of the story. That’s why we repent. That’s why we love Him. It was an ultimate sacrifice for the undeserving. It’s doing what only He could do, and not because He had to do it.

 

[cv5]

“Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:” Acts 2:23 (KJV 1900)

See post #574. This should put a stake in the heart of your bizarre claims once and for all.

 

[Dave-L]

See post #574. This should put a stake in the heart of your bizarre claims once and for all.

Post the part you refer to.

 

[Hungry]

Now you resort to this? You are so unclear with your direction, and you just start veering off into your own little "I'm right, I'm THE teacher zone". Again we haven't discussed anything about what you're bringing up here about Gods attributes. Nothing at all. We were talking about the Law deriving strait from the very nature of who God and being inseparable from God Himself, thereby making God being "above" the law, impossible. Had nothing at all to do with any attributes. Now you're just spitting nonsense trying to be right, but everyone can see through it. Just stop man.

You do realize that he’s just trying to pick fights. The best way to stop people from showing off their ignorance is by not giving them an audience. Look, he’s controlling your emotions. That’s what he wants, attention.

 

[reneweddaybyday]

Psalm 146:

1 Praise ye the LORD. Praise the LORD, O my soul.

2 While I live will I praise the LORD: I will sing praises unto my God while I have any being.

3 Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.

4 His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish.

5 Happy is he that hath the God of Jacob for his help, whose hope is in the LORD his God:

6 Which made heaven, and earth, the sea, and all that therein is: which keepeth truth for ever:

7 Which executeth judgment for the oppressed: which giveth food to the hungry. The LORD looseth the prisoners:

8 The LORD openeth the eyes of the blind: the LORD raiseth them that are bowed down: the LORD loveth the righteous:

9 The LORD preserveth the strangers; he relieveth the fatherless and widow: but the way of the wicked he turneth upside down.

10 The LORD shall reign for ever, even thy God, O Zion, unto all generations. Praise ye the LORD.