What are the essential beliefs needed for salvation?

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ForestGreenCook

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Jul 8, 2018
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#41
To believe that Jesus has paid for ALL our past sins, but not for ALL our future sins.

Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men

Without holiness no one will see the face of the Lord.
Jesus paid for the sins of all of his elect, past present and future, for all of the elect before the cross and after the cross.
 

Didymous

Senior Member
Feb 22, 2018
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#42
Nehemiah6: "You can leave that safely in God's hands. And since the Gospel is NOT abstract theology, perhaps you should go back and read the Gospels and get a proper understanding."

Thank you:D, but unlike you, I can read the Gospels in the original Greek and even understand the nuances of the underlying Aramaic.
And yes, the basic premise of vicarious atonement is the ultimate in theological abstraction. For example, you have no clue about how to answer this underlying question: How can anyone's death, even the death of God's Son, possibly atone for my sin? How does it make sense to believe that another man can take responsibility for my guilt? You and I accept by faith that Jesus accomplished precisely that, but don't tell me it is not a theological abstraction!

MattfhrJesus: "Only people that accept the truth of God's word, the Old Testament saints whose blood was covered by animals, and looked forward to the Savior to come, and the New Testament saints can be with God, and Jesus, but that is right now."

The "Old Testament saints" had no clue that Jesus would suffer an atoning death on the cross for us! The Suffering Servant Song of Isaiah 53 was not even applied to the anticipated Messiah until Jesus.
Pharisee much?
 

ForestGreenCook

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Jul 8, 2018
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#43
If God did not pay it is full. No one will be saved.

And scripture makes it perfectly clear. We are saved BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH

God will not force you to recieve his gift..
The scripture you are quoting in large print is Eph 2:8 and the faith in that scripture is not man's faith, but the faith of Jesus Christ (Gal 2:16). He even tells us in the last of Eph 2:8 that it is not of man, lest any should boast as you are doing.
 

GHClarkII

Active member
Mar 20, 2019
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#44
Forest has hit the nail on the head. The essentials that one must believe are the Person and Work of Christ. Those whom God has given real saving faith are those that He has united to His Son. He opens their eyes to the reality of His person (who He is), and His Work (what He has done). Saving faith is that belief in the truth of the gospel, and those who do not believe that reality are not our brothers and sisters.

We are commanded in scripture to preach that gospel. That is, the deity of Christ and the perfection of His person, and His sovereign work of redemption in atoning for our sins and providing us with His righteousness, the righteousness that one must have to see God. All of our works are filthy rags before God. If He does not forgive all our sins in His work on the cross then we are lost. Those who has said that we must have good works, or that Christ does not forgive future sins are unbelievers who do not know the cross of Christ. We are made perfect by His once for all sacrifice and by that and that ALONE do we have true peace with God.

May God be the Judge
 

ForestGreenCook

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#45
Hmmm...I guess God it wrong when He inspired these to be written:

"And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the world. " (John 4:42)

"And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the world. " (1 John 4:14)

" For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe." (1 Timothy 4:10)

" For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved." (John 3:17)

"And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world." (John 12:47)

"And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world." (1 John 2:2)

"But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man." (Hebrews 2:9)

"Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life." (Romans 5:18)

" For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all. " (Romans 11:32)
ALL scripture must harmonize to be the teaching of Christ. How do you make John 6:38 harmonize with the scriptures you have quoted? The word "WORLD" has been interpreted from the Greek by "Thayer's Greek interpretations as "believers only" not the world of all mankind. The "all men" and "every man" would have to be in the group of believers to have the scriptures to harmonize.
 

GHClarkII

Active member
Mar 20, 2019
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#46
f God did not pay it is full. No one will be saved.

And scripture makes it perfectly clear. We are saved BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH

God will not force you to recieve his gift.. [/QUOTE]

By saying God will not force anyone, you show you do not know the scriptures. The Jews in the old testament regularly asked God to change their hearts, to cause them to walk in His ways. God tells us He controls all the pagan nations of the world and in His Word He tells us faith is a gift given to His sheep. Regeneration is not force. We are DEAD in sin before God gives us faith. You cannot force a corpse to do anything, it is a corpse.

Repent of your man-centered philosophy, friend. Trust in Christ's finished work alone, and the sovereign One who calls all His people to Himself.

May God be the Judge
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
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#47
Forest has hit the nail on the head. The essentials that one must believe are the Person and Work of Christ. Those whom God has given real saving faith are those that He has united to His Son. He opens their eyes to the reality of His person (who He is), and His Work (what He has done). Saving faith is that belief in the truth of the gospel, and those who do not believe that reality are not our brothers and sisters.

We are commanded in scripture to preach that gospel. That is, the deity of Christ and the perfection of His person, and His sovereign work of redemption in atoning for our sins and providing us with His righteousness, the righteousness that one must have to see God. All of our works are filthy rags before God. If He does not forgive all our sins in His work on the cross then we are lost. Those who has said that we must have good works, or that Christ does not forgive future sins are unbelievers who do not know the cross of Christ. We are made perfect by His once for all sacrifice and by that and that ALONE do we have true peace with God.

May God be the Judge
I appreciate your support, however, lust because some of his born again children do not understand the finished work of Christ does not mean that they are not our brothers and sisters in Christ and are lost eternally. They are just lost from a true fellowship with God.
 

GHClarkII

Active member
Mar 20, 2019
150
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#48
I appreciate your support, however, lust because some of his born again children do not understand the finished work of Christ does not mean that they are not our brothers and sisters in Christ and are lost eternally. They are just lost from a true fellowship with God.
With all due respect brother, it does. Now by this I do not mean this person is damned because of their false gospel. We all walked in that before regeneration. But that person cannot be said to be a brother or sister at present, meaning we cannot take their false gospel and conclude they are among us but only presently deluded.

Or responsibility is to preach to those who do not know so that God will call His people to Himself by the Word of the gospel. Faith in he true gospel of Grace is always accompanying regeneration. If someone is born again, they will believe the gospel. The gospel is the power of God unto salvation. It is how he calls us to Himself. Therefore, those who do not believe it are unregenerate and need to be evangelized, not treated as weaker siblings.

That said, I love your posts. It is a breath of fresh air to see the Gospel of Free and Eternal Grace preached on these forums. Bless you brother.

May God be the Judge
 

FlyingDove

Senior Member
Dec 27, 2017
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#49
What are the essential beliefs needed for salvation?
One must honestly believe & acknowledge to their creator. They are a sinner in need of reconciliation/salvation.

Then understand & believe/trust that their creator God. Sent a sinless Christ/Jesus to atone/pay sins required wage.

1 Cor 15:
3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
(NOTE: Christ died for our sins! Sins required wage Rom 6:23 PAID)

4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
(NOTE: Christ was buried/proof he died. And Christ ROSE from the grave/God's receipt/ sins required wage received & accepted.

Rom 10:

9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation

Rom 5:
1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

2 By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.
 

ForestGreenCook

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#50
I often do quote scriptures but since the belief in ragards to the atonement of the LORD Jesus Christ is such a core doctrine of salvational importance i assume that Christians do not need verses to confirm a doctrine that is at the core of the Faith.. This is really Christianioty 101 stuff..

Romans 4: KJV
24 "But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead; {25} Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification."

Isaiah 53: KJV
8 "He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken. {9} And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth. {10} ¶ Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand. {11} He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities."

Romans 10: KJV
8 "But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; {9} That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."
Isaiah 53 - When we see and understand that Christ was an offering to God, for God's acceptance and not an offering to man for man's acceptance. He bore the iniquities of God's elect on the cross as a sacrifice to God, which God accepted. Romans 10 is speaking of people who are already regenerated. The natural man will not have a zeal of a spiritual God nor will he repent of breaking a spiritual law that he cannot discern (1 Cor 2:14).
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
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#51
Jesus paid for the sins of all of his elect, past present and future, for all of the elect before the cross and after the cross.
Yes, and to profit from it, we must sign the check (accept the payment) and never turn back the way Lot's wife did.
 

TheDivineWatermark

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Aug 3, 2018
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#52
Two things to consider alongside this topic, when viewing it, and that is: how each of these two Greek words is used in the following two contexts:

G2564 - kaleó / kalesai / keklēmenous - "to call / invite / name"

G2822 - klétos / klētoi / klētois - "to call / invite / summon"

It is important to notice how EACH of these is used in BOTH the Matthew 22:1-14 passage AND the Romans 8:28,30 verses (see those passages, note how they are each used in both passages, and how)


[BTW, the Matthew 22:1-14 passage is referring to the "guests [plural]" of "the wedding FEAST/SUPPER" i.e. the promised and prophesied earthly Millennial Kingdom commencing upon His "RETURN" to the earth, whereas Romans 8:28,30 is referring to "the Church which is His body" (who is not "the guests [plural]") so there's that distinction to be noted along with these two distinct words and how they are used in each of these two contexts]
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
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#53
With all due respect brother, it does. Now by this I do not mean this person is damned because of their false gospel. We all walked in that before regeneration. But that person cannot be said to be a brother or sister at present, meaning we cannot take their false gospel and conclude they are among us but only presently deluded.

Or responsibility is to preach to those who do not know so that God will call His people to Himself by the Word of the gospel. Faith in he true gospel of Grace is always accompanying regeneration. If someone is born again, they will believe the gospel. The gospel is the power of God unto salvation. It is how he calls us to Himself. Therefore, those who do not believe it are unregenerate and need to be evangelized, not treated as weaker siblings.

That said, I love your posts. It is a breath of fresh air to see the Gospel of Free and Eternal Grace preached on these forums. Bless you brother.

May God be the Judge
No where did i say this.. I am not a universalist.. And it is really a bad idea to try and put words in the mouth of other people.. Words they never said.. Anyone can browse this thread for themselves and see that i never put forward the universalism doctrine.. Then they can see clearly that you have born false witness against another member.. Do you think this helps your credibility in this thread or anywhere else in this forum? Nope it undermines your credibility, it's a self destructive tactic..
My apology, my disagreement with your statement was that we do not have to trust in Christ's atonement for it to be effective in accomplishing the atonement.
 

ForestGreenCook

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Jul 8, 2018
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#54
Yes, and to profit from it, we must sign the check (accept the payment) and never turn back the way Lot's wife did.
Christ's sacrifice was for the sin's of God's elect but it was an offering to God for God's acceptance and not for man's acceptance. His atonement for the sins of God's elect was effective whether man accepts it or not.
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
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#55
Christ's sacrifice was for the sin's of God's elect but it was an offering to God for God's acceptance and not for man's acceptance. His atonement for the sins of God's elect was effective whether man accepts it or not.
God GAVE His only begotten Son, and, yes indeed, we DO have to accept this gift. It is not complicated. You have been shown the Truth so many times. Why do you continue to stumble? Just admit that you were in error and move on, my friend.
 
Dec 9, 2011
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#56
Would believing Jesus paid the full wrath of God on the cross and before the cross (in our place) and that He rose from the dead be enough for salvation?
If you believe that JESUS took the full wrath of GOD by HIS shed blood on the cross,this would also mean that you believe In JESUS and of course then you believe the words that HE spoke.

The part where you said
Would believing Jesus paid the full wrath of God on the cross and before the cross (in our place) and that He rose from the dead be enough for salvation?
In the part that I bolded I think you are talking about JESUS being obedient to GOD to the point of leaving heaven to come to earth to BE the lamb of GOD to shed HIS blood that GOD who loves righteousness would accept so that anyone who believes In GODs WORD might be saved.
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
8,441
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#57
Two things to consider alongside this topic, when viewing it, and that is: how each of these two Greek words is used in the following two contexts:

G2564 - kaleó / kalesai / keklēmenous - "to call / invite / name"

G2822 - klétos / klētoi / klētois - "to call / invite / summon"

It is important to notice how EACH of these is used in BOTH the Matthew 22:1-14 passage AND the Romans 8:28,30 verses (see those passages, note how they are each used in both passages, and how)


[BTW, the Matthew 22:1-14 passage is referring to the "guests [plural]" of "the wedding FEAST/SUPPER" i.e. the promised and prophesied earthly Millennial Kingdom commencing upon His "RETURN" to the earth, whereas Romans 8:28,30 is referring to "the Church which is His body" (who is not "the guests [plural]") so there's that distinction to be noted along with these two distinct words and how they are used in each of these two contexts]
Matt 22:1-14 has reference to the church that Christ set up, which is referred to by many names, such as, The church of God, the kingdom of God, the new Jerusalem, the church in the wilderness, and more. The wedding garment is the righteousness of Christ. Rom 10 speaks of those that have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. By having a zeal of God indicates they are regenerate children of God, but do not understand the finished work (righteousness of God) of Christ and were going about to establish their own righteousness by their good works. These are rejected from being a part of Christ's church, but they are saved eternally. There are many called but few chosen. Rom 8:28. to me, is referring to all of God's elect.
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
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#58
God GAVE His only begotten Son, and, yes indeed, we DO have to accept this gift. It is not complicated. You have been shown the Truth so many times. Why do you continue to stumble? Just admit that you were in error and move on, my friend.
ALL scripture must harmonize. How do you harmonize John 6:38 that says all that he died for will be raised up at the last day? Eph 2:5 - dead men cannot accept. We were at one time dead spiritually, unable to accept spiritual things (1 Cor 2:14).
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#59
The scripture you are quoting in large print is Eph 2:8 and the faith in that scripture is not man's faith, but the faith of Jesus Christ (Gal 2:16). He even tells us in the last of Eph 2:8 that it is not of man, lest any should boast as you are doing.
Your wrong

We are not saved by Jesuys faith. Or else Paul would not have spent his whole NT carrear writting about hoe we must chose to have faith in God. Not faiht in anything else.
 

TheDivineWatermark

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2018
10,887
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#60
Matt 22:1-14 has reference to the church that Christ set up, which is referred to by many names, such as, The church of God, the kingdom of God, the new Jerusalem, the church in the wilderness, and more. The wedding garment is the righteousness of Christ. Rom 10 speaks of those that have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. By having a zeal of God indicates they are regenerate children of God, but do not understand the finished work (righteousness of God) of Christ and were going about to establish their own righteousness by their good works. These are rejected from being a part of Christ's church, but they are saved eternally. There are many called but few chosen. Rom 8:28. to me, is referring to all of God's elect.
Many people view Matthew 22:2-14 the way that you are presenting it. I believe "the invitation" shown in vv.2-7 speaks of what was sent out BEFORE His death/resurrection [aka Matt3:2, etc] (an "invitation" to the promised and prophesied earthly Millennial Kingdom, aka "the wedding FEAST/SUPPER"... and V.7 speaks of the 70ad events [parallel with Lk21:23,20 and Lk19:41-44]; whereas v.8's "THEN SAITH HE to his servants" parallels the LATER 95ad Rev1:1/7:3/4:1 [regarding the "FUTURE aspects" of The Revelation that are slated to take place, it says, "IN QUICKNESS [NOUN]," v.1, note: NOT "immediately" and NOT that which will unfold over the course of some 2000 yrs, but "IN QUICKNESS [NOUN]"! It will conclude with His Second Coming to the earth, per Rev19:19,21/16:14-16/20:5 which parallels Isa24:21-22[23] with its TWO "PUNISH" words SEPARATED [time-wise] BY a very specific time period... (see both contexts for this)