Loss of salvation???
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Actually MM....
I DO believe the words of JESUS are most aurhoratative.
Not that the other writers taught anything differently from Jesus.
However, if I'm writing about loss of salvation and JESUS has a teaching on it , which He does...
I WILL prefer that to that of, Paul, let's say.
You don't have to agree.
check out post 7600.Though I didn't use the smile emoji much if at all, it could be useful with some of these posts.
Tried to tag you in but it wouldn't funtion.
Piers is really THICK.
Bill
I don't know what you're talking about.
And the above is not a known post to me.
Sorry.
That's what others state.
I'm very clear in what I state.
WE MUST OBEY GOD.
Perhaps you do not agree.
That's fine with me.
But one should not say they agree when they DO NOT.
Why don't you just state what you want to say instead of sending me to different posts and having to go back and forth.
I tried that.
It didn't work.
Not trying it again.
Sorry.
Loss of Salvation?
God's Most Important Doctrine, eh?:
I see that there are Two choices:
1) "faith [ in their Messiah ] And works" for the 12 tribes of Israel to
Prophecy / Law
Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15 AV) From “Things That Differ!” (online):
Mystery / Grace:
2) "Grace Through faith" In The Lord Jesus Christ, The Head Of His Body, for
Of course, instead of "Rightly Dividing" these:
--------
And, precious friend(s), Please Be Very Richly Encouraged and Edified
In The Lord Jesus Christ and In His Precious Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided:
The Bible: The BIG Picture
Amen.
Great Question, Precious friend, @BillG, Considering all the Confusion about
God's Most Important Doctrine, eh?:
I see that there are Two choices:
1) "faith [ in their Messiah ] And works" for the 12 tribes of Israel to
"enter their earthly kingdom, according to the gospel of the kingdom
Prophecy / Law
Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15 AV) From “Things That Differ!” (online):
Mystery / Grace:
2) "Grace Through faith" In The Lord Jesus Christ, The Head Of His Body, for
Jews And Gentiles, Today Under Grace, To Be "translated Into His Heavenly Body":
+
For the answer to "Loss of Salvation?", study "works for rewards or lack thereof":
Bema Seat Judgment for all faithful And Unfaithful believers in
-------------------Of course, instead of "Rightly Dividing" these:
There is also homogenizing / blenderizing 1 + 2 Into Massive Confusion,
Concerning "God's Most Important Doctrine" For Redemption of mankind, eh?
Further study: God's Three Tenses Of His Eternal Salvation--------
And, precious friend(s), Please Be Very Richly Encouraged and Edified
In The Lord Jesus Christ and In His Precious Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided:
The Bible: The BIG Picture
Amen.
I'd go so far as to say that we will receive our salvation IN THE END.
I believe you'll know the verse - will not look it up unless asked.
IOW,,, we can know RIGHT NOW that we are saved because we believe...not a mental belief...but a belief that leads to action, as Jesus taught, and that requires good works/deeds however one wants to understand that (which is NEVER discussed but always denied by some)...
But how can we know we will be saved in the future?
Can we be 100% certain we will hold on to our faith?
or even The Faith?
Jesus said WHOEVER BELIEVES IN ME....
that's a present tense statement.
We must believe at the time of our death.
And does no one care about what BELIEVE means?
Believe has built into it the concept and necessity of obeying, which is doing, according to Jesus.
If we really understood THAT,,,there would not be reason to debate.
Which is why I believe that some are purposefully vague...
because they do NOT believe obedience is necessary or action.
They believe in only faith....with nothing else.
That's a good discussion - half-way through at the moment - and covers a lot of bases beyond analogies, It was interesting to see Morgan do the typical derailing of the analogy via about 4 fallacies in one breath.
Bill,
maybe you don't know how to copy and paste?
I don't know what the problem is but I came back because I don't want to leave you
on a sour note:
Here is the post I THINK you're alluding to....
it's my post no. 7423...the original post to the other member.
-------------------------------------------------
my post no. 7423 to Gideon
Talk is cheap Gideon.
How about posting some scripture instead of your OPINION?
What I'm hearing right now is that:
1. Obedience is nice,,,but not really necessary.
2. No difference between justification and sanctification.
3. Jesus has done it all...nothing is required of us.
If you care to address the above,,,please use the NT which you claim to understand.
---------------------------------------------------------------
You could reply or not....
I just want a clear conscience.
I rather enjoyed how Pierce was accusing Saad of stating that Islam is a disease.
I think we're pretty much in the same place. Interestingly, I do believe in security - I just think it has certain criteria baked into it that are developed in a lasting cooperative relationship with God in well defined faith-obedience under grace in Christ in Spirit. IOW, there are some "musts' built into this relationship that some seem intent on negating.
Yes that’s what I said,
That’s the post where i
believe you made assumptions about Gideon.
said it a couple of times already.
Yes post 7423
I Agree with you, yes, and the rest of scripture is from that same Lord.
Writers? Yes, the
rd used many men wo write down what He inspired them to write, so the Author (singular) is one and the same, not many.Understood. You will believe what you want regardless of an inability on your part to show where loss of salvation is at all possible after being sealed by Holy Spirit under the Gospel of Grace. Your works-based salvation system of false theology remains pathetically feeble in standing under the weight of evidence to the contrary.
MM
Been on here 9 years.
I know how to copy and paste.
I also believe in eternal security.
But what is it?
We have eternal security as long as we are IN CHRIST.
Nothing can take us out of God's hand....correct...
but we can jump out of our own free will.
We do not lose free will when we become saved.
Obedience,,,yes, we can only do our best,
but to say that the word MUST should not be spoken is
a clear sign to me that maybe God's nature is not properly understood.
Difficult to know why that word disturbs some.
Do we not all know someone that has fallen away?
Ah.
Right.
But they were never saved to begin with !
How does one argue with that??
Bart Ehrmann was certainly saved...
or was he?
LOL
You require verses on the loss of salvation?I Agree with you, yes, and the rest of scripture is from that same Lord.
Writers? Yes, the
Understood. You will believe what you want regardless of an inability on your part to show where loss of salvation is at all possible after being sealed by Holy Spirit under the Gospel of Grace. Your works-based salvation system of false theology remains pathetically feeble in standing under the weight of evidence to the contrary.
MM
OK
I'll give you as many as possible till I have to leave:
1 Timothy 4.1
1But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will [a]fall away from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons,
Hebrews 6:4-6
4 For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 and then have [a]fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, [b]since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.
2 Corinthians 11:3
3 But I am afraid that, as the serpent deceived Eve by his trickery, your minds will be led astray from sincere and pure devotion to Christ.
Revelation 2:4-5
4 But I have this against you, that you have left your first love. 5 Therefore, remember from where you have fallen, and repent, and do the [a]deeds you did at first; or else I am coming to you and I will remove your lampstand from its place—unless you repent.
Romans 11:19-22
19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” 20 Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; 21 for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either. 22 See then the kindness and severity of God: to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; for otherwise you too will be cut off.
Matthew 24:10-13
19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” 20 Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; 21 for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either. 22 See then the kindness and severity of God: to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; for otherwise you too will be cut off.
James 1:12
12 Blessed is a man who perseveres under trial; for once he has [a]been approved, he will receive the crown of life which the Lord has promised to those who love Him.
1 Timothy 4:16
16 Pay close attention to yourself and to the teaching; persevere in these things, for as you do this you will save both yourself and those who hear you.
James 5:19-20
19 My brothers and sisters, if anyone among you strays from the truth and someone turns him back, 20 let him know that the one who has turned a sinner from the error of his way will save his soul from death and cover a multitude of sins.
1 Corinthians 9:27
27 but I strictly discipline my body and make it my slave, so that, after I have preached to others, I myself will not be disqualified.
John 15:1-5
1“I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser. 2 Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit, He takes away; and every branch that bears fruit, He [a]prunes it so that it may bear more fruit. 3 You are already [b]clean because of the word which I have spoken to you. 4 Remain in Me, [c]and I in you. Just as the branch cannot bear fruit [d]of itself [e]but must remain in the vine, so neither can you unless you remain in Me. 5 I am the vine, you are the branches; the one who remains in Me, and I in him [f]bears much fruit, for apart from Me you can do nothing. 6 If anyone does not remain in Me, he is thrown away like a branch and dries up; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned.
Many, many more...
but the above should suffice.
Loss of salvation is indeed possible...
and all should know this and heed the teaching.
Hi,
Do you happen to be Fran?
Come back after a few years?
your posts are very similar.
I did like Fran though.
She helped me through a tough time.
We agreed to disagree.
she came/lived lives in Italy just like you
And same avatar.