Pisteuo, and John 3:16

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he does the same thing with taking communion another action that is taught by Jesus and his apostles that relates directly to our faith in his atonement. Paul now teaching the church what communion means to them when they take it and also instructing then about how to take it
Do you also believe that taking communion is the basis or means by which we obtain salvation? Do you teach transubstantiation?

“and when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me. After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me. For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord's death till he come. Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup. For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body. For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭11:24-30‬ ‭KJV‬‬

You shouldn’t be able to read that and then think “ communion is a ritual it doesn’t have vital significance regarding consequential matters like damnation and being judged guilty of the body and blood of Christ you can even see at the end Paul’s sayong “ Thisnos the reason some of you are sick and have fallen asleep

this should draw you more into communion and it’s meaning and doctrine make you want to be a partaker ect same with baptism look st the message
1 Corinthians 11:29 - For he who eats and drinks, eats and drinks judgment to himself if he does not judge the body rightly. 30 For this reason many among you are weak and sick, and a number sleep. 31 But if we judged ourselves rightly, we would not be judged. 32 But when we are judged, we are disciplined by the Lord so that we will not be condemned along with the world. Paul knows that the judgment of God can take on the form of physical illness and even physical death. The word "sleep" when referring to death, refers to the physical death of believers, not spiritual death or soul sleep (John 11:11-12; Acts 7:60; 1 Corinthians 15:6,18,20,51; 1 Thessalonians 4:13-15; 2 Peter 3:4).

“ be baptized for remission of your sins in Jesus name “ I mean gods offer to remit all my sins if o am baptized in the name of his son that I believe in?
Repentance is unto the remission of sins. (Luke 24:47; Acts 3:19; 5:31) Water baptism is done on the basis of remission of sins received upon repentance. In Mark 1:4 and Luke 3:3, we read that John was preaching a baptism of repentance for the remission of sins. Now was this baptism for (in order to obtain) remission of sins or was it for (in regard to/on the basis of) remission of sins received upon repentance? Obviously, the latter. In Matthew 3:11, we read - I baptize you with water FOR repentance.. (NASB) If translated "in order to obtain" the verse does not make sense. I baptize you with water FOR (in order to obtain) repentance? OR I baptize you with water FOR (in regards to/on the basis of) repentance? Obviously, the latter. Repentance precedes water baptism.

sorry I’m not seeing the issue …… unless someone starts saying out of the blue “ baptism isn’t that it doesn’t mean what it says it’s this other thing let me explain ….
But really they already explained all this stuff in scripture that’s what the epistles are apostles explaining things we’re supposed to believe and do as members of Christs body, because we believe. We don’t say I believe and then use that as the reason we’ll never do what he said and don’t need to.
Those texts that you have cited on baptism only prove that baptism is regularly associated with conversion and salvation, rather than absolutely required for salvation. Water baptism is a command that we are expected to obey, however, it's not obedience to this command that saves us, but rather believing in Jesus Christ for salvation. (John 3:15,16,18; Acts 10:43; 13:38-39; 16:31; Romans 1:16; 3:22-26; 4:5-6; 1 Corinthians 1:21; 15:1-4; 1 John 5:13 etc..).
 
Pisteuo is used 248 times in the NT.

Strongs: 4100 = "Pisteuo means not just to BELIEVE, but also to be persuaded of; and hence, to place confidence in, to trust, and signifies in this sense of the word, reliance upon, not mere credence, hence it is translated " commit unto", "commit to ones trust ", "be committed unto ".

Vines: pisteuo is "A personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender. "

Now I will simply replace the mistranslated word "believe" with the Vines definition of the Greek word pisteuo.

The mistranslation, John 3:16.
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever "believes" in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life. "

The correct translation, John 3:16.
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever "personally surrenders their life to Him and lives a life inspired by such surrender", should not perish, but have everlasting life."

I'd like to hear serious comments from those who are really seeking to know scripture and the way to follow Christ.

My question is, do you see a difference in these two translations?
God wants us to humble or submit to Him wholeheartedly. That's why we must go through sufferings because when we're at our lowest that's when we humble ourselves to Him by getting down on our knees and pray (plead) to Him because we have no alternative that will help us in that situation. And that's why the tax collectors and prostitutes are most likely to beg for help, because they're the outcast that will not receive any help by others at the time.
And the majority of people don't know how to pray. They just get down on their knees chant the same request every time as it's a daily ritual.
The only time we're supposed to pray is when we're at our lowest. That we just drop down to our knees or lay flat on the ground like David done pleading to God. And then after the prayer, you'll have faith that God will answer. But that takes a lot of faith to pray. That you can't even doubt while praying or it'll ruin the prayer. That's why we must grow into the Lord so we can have child-like faith.

2 Chronicles 30:8
Do not be stiff-necked, as your ancestors were; submit to the Lord. Come to his sanctuary, which he has consecrated forever. Serve the Lord your God, so that his fierce anger will turn away from you.

Job 22:21
“Submit to God and be at peace with him; in this way prosperity will come to you.

2 Samuel 22:28
You save the humble, but your eyes are on the haughty to bring them low.


Isaiah 29:13
The Lord says: “These people come near to me with their mouth and honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. Their worship of me is based on merely human rules they have been taught.

Mark 7:6
He replied, “Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you hypocrites; as it is written: “‘These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me.

John 4:23
Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.



 
Pisteuo is used 248 times in the NT.

Strongs: 4100 = "Pisteuo means not just to BELIEVE, but also to be persuaded of; and hence, to place confidence in, to trust, and signifies in this sense of the word, reliance upon, not mere credence, hence it is translated " commit unto", "commit to ones trust ", "be committed unto ".

Vines: pisteuo is "A personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender. "

Now I will simply replace the mistranslated word "believe" with the Vines definition of the Greek word pisteuo.

The mistranslation, John 3:16.
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever "believes" in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life. "

The correct translation, John 3:16.
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever "personally surrenders their life to Him and lives a life inspired by such surrender", should not perish, but have everlasting life."

I'd like to hear serious comments from those who are really seeking to know scripture and the way to follow Christ.

My question is, do you see a difference in these two translations?

AMEN, Thank you I like it.

It also adds to the wording "should not perish" which takes away the just believing part.

You "should not parish" because if you do surrender to HIM and OBEY HIM you will not parrish.

I have always said, if you believe what HE says in John 3:16 why don't you believed what HE said in the same conversation John 3:5?
 
What you are teaching is that faith alone is not sufficient for salvation.
One must also be baptized by a third party and one must live a surrendered life.
You are teaching that a God that created all is not strong enough to save a person by his own power, but He needs a third person to dunk you under water and needs you, by your own power to be surrendered to Him.
You are adding works to salvation, plain and simply rejecting the truth.
If that is what you are basing your eternal life on, I am very concerned for your standing before God.

Looks to me like he's not teaching nothing but sharing GODS word.

If you want to prove scripture wrong, you need scripture to do so.

Can you show in clear detail where believing gets your sins removed? and fills you with the Holy Ghost/
 
Looks to me like he's not teaching nothing but sharing GODS word.

If you want to prove scripture wrong, you need scripture to do so.

Can you show in clear detail where believing gets your sins removed? and fills you with the Holy Ghost/
The main purpose to everything, it's that God want His children to acknowledge who He really is in order to obey the greatest command of them all and that is Love the Lord your God with all your might and soul. But only trust in Him like it says on US coins.
And He's a jealous God that doesn't like it when we look up to others over Him.
God overlooked Jonah disobedient because Jonah knew Him.

And so, God wants us to acknowledge Him and stop pretending too.

Hosea 6:6
For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings.
 
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AMEN, Thank you I like it.

It also adds to the wording "should not perish" which takes away the just believing part.

You "should not parish" because if you do surrender to HIM and OBEY HIM you will not parrish.

I have always said, if you believe what HE says in John 3:16 why don't you believed what HE said in the same conversation John 3:5?
God wants us to humble or submit to Him wholeheartedly. That's why we must go through sufferings because when we're at our lowest that's when we humble ourselves to Him by getting down on our knees and pray (plead) to Him because we have no alternative that will help us in that situation. And that's why the tax collectors and prostitutes are most likely to beg for help, because they're the outcast that will not receive any help by others at the time.
And the majority of people don't know how to pray. They just get down on their knees chant the same request every time as it's a daily ritual.
The only time we're supposed to pray is when we're at our lowest. That we just drop down to our knees or lay flat on the ground like David done pleading to God. And then after the prayer, you'll have faith that God will answer. But that takes a lot of faith to pray. That you can't even doubt while praying or it'll ruin the prayer. That's why we must grow into the Lord so we can have child-like faith.

2 Chronicles 30:8
Do not be stiff-necked, as your ancestors were; submit to the Lord. Come to his sanctuary, which he has consecrated forever. Serve the Lord your God, so that his fierce anger will turn away from you.

Job 22:21
“Submit to God and be at peace with him; in this way prosperity will come to you.

2 Samuel 22:28
You save the humble, but your eyes are on the haughty to bring them low.


Isaiah 29:13
The Lord says: “These people come near to me with their mouth and honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. Their worship of me is based on merely human rules they have been taught.

Mark 7:6
He replied, “Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you hypocrites; as it is written: “‘These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me.

John 4:23
Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.




The first paragraph was great.

Real prayer is a connection, a conscious contact. Thats not possible without the mind of Christ.

And the absence of doubt that is required by you and others, that's not part of the salvation equation, that's just part of the trip.
Jesus fulfilled pisteuo "perfectly" . But of your absence of doubt theory is correct, His life of faith and faithing would not have been perfect.
 
AMEN, Thank you I like it.

It also adds to the wording "should not perish" which takes away the just believing part.

You "should not parish" because if you do surrender to HIM and OBEY HIM you will not parrish.

I have always said, if you believe what HE says in John 3:16 why don't you believed what HE said in the same conversation John 3:5?
enemies foot on your neck

If your on a battlefield, and your on your back with the enemies foot on your neck, when you surrender, is that "obedience " or just the correct response?

There's no such thing as "believing ".
 
enemies foot on your neck

If your on a battlefield, and your on your back with the enemies foot on your neck, when you surrender, is that "obedience " or just the correct response?

There's no such thing as "believing ".

That's what gnostic minds think. Christian gnostics believe they are saved by their spiritual nature, not by faith, which is essentially what you teach
 
The main purpose to everything, it's that God want His children to acknowledge who He really is in order to obey the greatest command of them all and that is Love the Lord your God with all your might and soul. But only trust in Him like it says on US coins.
And He's a jealous God that doesn't like it when we look up to others over Him.
God overlooked Jonah disobedient because Jonah knew Him.

And so, God wants us to acknowledge Him and stop pretending too.

Hosea 6:6
For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings.

Trust in Him for what!
That if we "believe" in what He did and says, you'll receive His Spirit and a path to eternal life? And at the same time, live a life of our own? Thats not Biblical saving faith.

Biblical trust is built on a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender! THEN! trust can become part of the process. Without the a genuine, personal, continual surrendering of our lives to Him, we're trusting in something that was never ours to trust in.

The elephant in the room!
We can't have Jesus, His spirit, His mind, and His promises , and still live a life that is our own.....

That means everything! Money, power, prestige, and especially the things we want.

Gods way, by faith and faithing, is living a life that is centered around everyone else but us.

Deny self, take up your cross, and follow Him.
1) Deny self: a daily personal surrender to Him.
2) take up your cross : take others burdens upon yourself, INSTEAD of our own.
3) follow Him : continue to surrender our lives to Him, to perfect that giving of Gods blessings with others.

So when we bring out the word "trust", it better be in the right context, in Gods way.
 
Trust in Him for what!
That if we "believe" in what He did and says, you'll receive His Spirit and a path to eternal life? And at the same time, live a life of our own? Thats not Biblical saving faith.

This is a straw man because no one here is advocating living a life of their own.
 
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Biblical trust is built on a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender! THEN! trust can become part of the process. Without the a genuine, personal, continual surrendering of our lives to Him, we're trusting in something that was never ours to trust in.

This is your gnosticism showing in which you trust in a spiritual nature that you think you have received by performing certain steps that you have encapsulated in this continually repeated mantra - " a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender"
 
The elephant in the room!
We can't have Jesus, His spirit, His mind, and His promises , and still live a life that is our own.....

That means everything! Money, power, prestige, and especially the things we want.

Gods way, by faith and faithing, is living a life that is centered around everyone else but us.

Deny self, take up your cross, and follow Him.
1) Deny self: a daily personal surrender to Him.
2) take up your cross : take others burdens upon yourself, INSTEAD of our own.
3) follow Him : continue to surrender our lives to Him, to perfect that giving of Gods blessings with others.

So when we bring out the word "trust", it better be in the right context, in Gods way.

This is the exact opposite of how your teacher, Gene Scott, lived.

The Shock Jock of Televangelism : With Savvy Philanthropy and an In-Your-Face Style, Dr. Gene Scott Has Generated a Lavish Lifestyle, Powerful Friends in Los Angeles and a Fiercely Loyal Global Following

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1994-07-10-tm-14042-story.html
 
Baptism for (in order to obtain) remission of sins equates to no baptism, no remission of sins. You did not need to specifically say "baptized or condemned" because it's already implied in what you actually did say and have been repeatedly saying.

You are trying to turn a sign into a savior.

again the whole “ water baptism thing “ here’s an apostle baptizing a believer

I already covered this in post #113. Did you read my post?

Faith is not baptism and faith precedes baptism and we are saved through faith. It's just that simple.

Yes, repentance and remission of sins (faith is implied or assumed) is what we read in Luke 24:47. *What happened to baptism? *Hermeneutics.

I already thoroughly covered this in post #113.

I already covered this in post #116.

What's to avoid? These Gentiles believed, received the gift of the Holy Spirit and spoke in tongues (spiritual gift that is ONLY for the body of Christ - 1 Corinthians 12) and were saved before water baptism. Certain Jews may have wanted to forbid these Gentiles from being baptized because of their unacceptance of the Gentiles, (Acts 10:47) but Peter clearly states that SURELY NO ONE CAN REFUSE. These Gentiles were clearly SAVED BEFORE WATER BAPTISM, and the Holy Spirit was proof of this. (Romans 8:9; 1 John 4:13)

CONTINUED..

i can’t continue lol I’m sorry bro here’s how your argument goes

“Baptism for (in order to obtain) remission of sins equates to no baptism, no remission of sins.”

heres what the Bible teaches

E


It's not about rejecting baptism as an important matter. Water baptism is important, but it's just not the basis or means by which we obtain salvation. We must believe in Him as the ALL-sufficient means of our salvation in order to be saved and not merely in His existence. You seem to believe in your baptism and not exclusively in Him.

I don't explain away scripture. I properly harmonize scripture with scripture before reaching my conclusion on doctrine. Again, Acts 2:38 must be read alongside verses like (Luke 24:47; Acts 3:19; 5:31; 10:43-47; 11:17,18; 13:38-39; 15:7-9; 16:31; 26:18) where forgiveness is explicitly tied to repentance/belief/faith and not the ritual itself. Water baptism is a sign of that reality but not the source of it.

Baptism is a symbol of salvation in that it pictures Christ's death, burial and resurrection and our identification with Him in these experiences. In reality, believers are literally saved by what baptism symbolizes--Christ's death, burial and resurrection. (1 Corinthians 15:1-4) Baptism would have no meaning without Christ’s death, burial and resurrection, but Christ’s death, burial and resurrection would still have meaning, even if there were no baptism. In other words, Christ’s death, burial and resurrection is the substance and baptism is the symbol/picture. Without the substance there would be no symbol/picture.

I already covered this in post #116.

Baptism is not even mentioned in Romans 6:17,18. Before they obeyed that form of doctrine in Romans 6:17 by choosing to believe the gospel (Romans 1:16), they had been slaves to sin. Romans 10:16 - But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, "Lord, who has believed our report?"

in 1 Peter 1:22 notice - "Purified your souls in obeying the truth" and notice in Acts 15:9 - "Purified their hearts by FAITH." "Obeying the gospel" and "obeying that form of doctrine" in these passages is really a synonym for BELIEVING the gospel. Being slaves of sin is put in the past tense. Paul goes on in Romans 6:18 - "You have been set free from sin and have become slaves to righteousness."

*Notice in Romans 10:10 - For with the heart one believes unto righteousness..

*Notice in Romans 4:5 - But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith (not works) is accounted for righteousness.

As Greek scholar AT Robertson said - a symbol is not the reality, but the picture of the reality.

CONTINUED..
“It's not about rejecting baptism as an important matter. Water baptism is important, but it's just not the basis or means by which we obtain salvation. We must believe in Him as the ALL-sufficient means of our salvation in order to be saved and not merely in His existence. You seem to believe in your baptism and not exclusively in Him. “

lol so your saying we need to believe in him so much we shouldt think we need to do anything that’s commanded ? And if a guy like me believes we need to be baptized for remission of sins in Jesus name like Jesus and his apostles taught them I believe too much in baptism 😂

air sounds like I need tomlewrn to believe so much in Jesus that I don’t worry about actually doing the things he said are important to do ? And if I think they are important then I believe too much in them and not enough in him who said to do them ?

I’m sorry bro I can’t continue this it’s another circle with you explaining why nothing that the scripture makes important or ties to salvation means what it says. All you seem to do is explain why things aren’t correct that are simple and plain like this

“Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins,

and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. For the promise ( of the spirit see Galatians 3) is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭2:38-39‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Then you begin explaining about different baptisms a baptism that is no baptism at all and water baptism …

There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭4:4-6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

then youll explain how I just can’t inderrrsnd what “ there is one baptism “ means lol because it’s so mysterious so you’ll then explain for a page or two a out different baptisms and what they mean . So then I’ll show you the apostles were commanding people to be baptized in Jesus name in water like here

“While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. ( that’s what brings the spirit )

For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. ( for remission of sins there’s only one baptism ) Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭10:44, 46-48‬ ‭KJV‬‬

You then explain why that just isn’t correct ester baptism is important but not about remission of sins though …..

Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins,

Same reason the gentiles in acts ten were baptized in Jesus name in water .

z it all you seem to do is explain why the things lain aren’t right and then after a long explaination I never even really know what you are saying I just kind of have to keep repeating the same basic verses so we’re just wasting time for each other .

to me it’s really simple but lol we have to actually learn what it says and let that be true rether than hearing it then explaining why it’s not true or doesn’t actually mean what it says ….

i don’t think there’s fruit in this particular discussion between us brother I respect you personally but I am not really making any sense of your arguments you won’t address what it says plainly and seem to argue against it at least that’s sort of my view of this topic between us but hopefully well
Be able to discuss other subjects as long as lol you aren’t explaining why what it says isn’t right 😂
 
Baptism for (in order to obtain) remission of sins equates to no baptism, no remission of sins. You did not need to specifically say "baptized or condemned" because it's already implied in what you actually did say and have been repeatedly saying.

You are trying to turn a sign into a savior.

again the whole “ water baptism thing “ here’s an apostle baptizing a believer

I already covered this in post #113. Did you read my post?

Faith is not baptism and faith precedes baptism and we are saved through faith. It's just that simple.

Yes, repentance and remission of sins (faith is implied or assumed) is what we read in Luke 24:47. *What happened to baptism? *Hermeneutics.

I already thoroughly covered this in post #113.

I already covered this in post #116.

What's to avoid? These Gentiles believed, received the gift of the Holy Spirit and spoke in tongues (spiritual gift that is ONLY for the body of Christ - 1 Corinthians 12) and were saved before water baptism. Certain Jews may have wanted to forbid these Gentiles from being baptized because of their unacceptance of the Gentiles, (Acts 10:47) but Peter clearly states that SURELY NO ONE CAN REFUSE. These Gentiles were clearly SAVED BEFORE WATER BAPTISM, and the Holy Spirit was proof of this. (Romans 8:9; 1 John 4:13)

CONTINUED..
“I already covered this in post #113. Did you read my post? “

yeah ny point is when you “ cover something “ you just spend your time explaining things that are incorrect and have no scriptural basis you instead explain why things aren’t what they are . That’s kind of your issue instead of learning and believing what’s there ….. you spend your time explaining why nothing is what it seems or says that’s not really an interest of mine I’m more about learning what’s there and believing what it says plainly and clearly

You just avoid things like baptism it’s always been for remission of sins that’s the only thing it says it’s for . Nothing in the Bible says “ baptism is just a sign “ only you say that the bi me teaches this stuff about baptism



John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins. And there went out unto him all the land of Judæa, and they of Jerusalem, and were all baptized of him in the river of Jordan, confessing their sins.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭1:4-5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭2:38‬ ‭KJV‬‬

before the cross and after the cross baptism is for the remission of sins . You aren’t able to acknowledge it it’s not a mystery . Mailman what’s the purpose of baptism according to the Bible ? You can’t say “ baptism is for the remission of sins in Jesus name “

It doesn’t matter if that’s what it says

you can’t acknowledge the apostles know better than you and they baptized in water in Jesus name for remission of sins but you can’t accept of acknowledge it . You just “ cover it “ by going in hige corcles that have nothing to do with scriptire explaining why nothing really is what it says it is


You “ covering things “ isn’t going to help me underersnd anything because I’m not looking to reason why “ we don’t really need to get baptized it’s just a sign and of anyone believes whatnot says well then they don’t believe in Jesus as savior bo no they are making baptism savior

all because he said to do something and be saved lol but then “ we don’t have to actually do anything he said “ of course arrives on the scene faith is when you start believing the doctrine God has given us like baptism for remission of sins in Jesus name that’s from God a gift for believers in his son