144,000: The first resurrection and rapture of the church

[ATG]

The part of spiritual Israel that is of natural Israel are natural branches.

That's better. Good correction. Spiritual Israel is not part of natural Israel...

The part of spiritual Israel that is of natural Israel are natural branches grafted again into the Israel of God. And the part of spiritual Israel that is of natural Gentiles are wild branches graffed into the Israel of God.

 

[ATG]

Mt Zion is on Earth near Jerusalem. Mountains are not in heaven. Rev 14 shows Christ on Earth.

Sort of correct. Mt Sion is never said to be in heaven, but only in the clouds, with the resurrected saints meeting the Lamb standing thereon in the air. Not yet standing on the earth.

Rev 7 is the resurrected saints on earth being sealed by angels with the Father's name in their foreheads, and then rise up into the air with clouds, to be escorted by the angels from the four winds to meet with the Lord of Mt Sion.

They will all then descend to the earth with war, for the Lord to roar from Mt Zion and rule with His resurrected saints from this Jerusalem.

Pretty simple and sensible when piecing all Scriptures together in detail as written.

 

[ATG]

Still, Sion and Zion are exactly the same word in Greek.

False. In the OT and NT the Greek is always Σιών, never Zιών.

Only once is the Hebrew Sion in the OT, and is not Zion in location, features, nor history.

Deu 4:48
From Aroer, which is by the bank of the river Arnon, even unto mount Sion, which is Hermon,

Psa 133:3
As the dew of Hermon, and as the dew that descended upon the mountains of Zion: for there the LORD commanded the blessing, even life for evermore.

God has blessed both the dew of Hermon and of Zion, but they are not the same mountain nor dew thereon...

 

[ATG]

Fair enough, then I'll pivot back to the OP post #1, the 144k.

Ok. Good.

Rev 7:
4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.
(PARSING: 144k from ALL the TRIBES of ISRAEL. Vrs 7:5-8 confirm 12,000 x 12 tribes - 144,000)

5 Of the tribe of Juda, Reuben & Gad .

6 Of the tribe of Aser, Nepthalim & Manassas

7 Of the tribe of Simeon, Levi & Issachar

8 Of the tribe of Zabulon, Joseph & Benjamin
(PARSING: Verses 5-8 confirm 12k ea x 12 tribes = 144,000 & NAMES the Israelite TRIBES they come from)

Gen 32:28 God changed Jacob's name to Israel. The 12 tribes of Israel are Jacob/Israel's sons. Each son received a land portion (except Levi/Levites they become the priesthood) Joseph receives a double portion of land (Gen 48) & it's divided between his 2 sons Ephraim & Manasseh.

Rev 14:
1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Zion, and with him a 144k, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.
(PARSING: These 144k are REDEEMED from the earth)

4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.
(PARSING: "Redeemed From Among Men" being the FIRSTFRUITS unto God & to the Lamb)

Parsing vs 4
(A) 144k ALL VIRGINS)
(B) These 144k were REDEEMED from AMONG MEN)
(C) Being FIRSTFRUITS onto God & to the Lamb.

The Rev 4 language is directly lifted from the Lev 23:9-11 wave offering. They're the 1st portion of a larger harvest, set apart & presented to God.

The category itself is Israelite, because the firstfruits offering was tied to Israel's land covenant.

The Israelites practiced the firstfruits (resurrection foreshadowing) wave offering every Passover week for over 1400 yrs. John calling the 144k "firstfruits" supports their identity as being literal Israelites.

1 Cor 15:20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
(PARSING: Christ is 1st to rise/resurrected from the grave)

Matt 27:
50 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.
(PARSING: Jesus dies)

51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;
(PARSING: Jesus rips the Temple veil in 1/2 on the way to paradise)

52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
(PARSING: Many saints are resurrected)

53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.
(PARSING: Jesus rises 1st, then others are resurrected. REREADING Rev 14:1-4, 144k = FIRSTFRUITS, "Redeemed From Among Men")

The Matt 27:52-53 cites these OT elect that rise after Jesus as firstfruits that rise from the grave & they're seen by many!

These firstfruits are resurrected BEFORE there is a church.

Jesus rises then 50 days later comes the Acts 2 Pentecost, where the CHURCH via the Holy Spirit outpouring BEGINS.

This is not pivoting back to my first post, but only repeating your later posts.

If you ever want to pivot back to my posted argument from the Scriptures, and maybe show in any error in it, then I'd be glad to look at it.

Otherwise, you're just bypassing Post #1, and only writing up your own stuff. Which I've already addressed in detail.

 

[FlyingDove]

In Rev 7, the 144,000 are sealed in the forehead on earth. In Rev 14 the 144,000 are sealed with the name of the Father, and they are now standing with the Lamb of God on Mt Sion. And so, we have the first resurrection, rapture, and congregation with the Lord at His return to earth.

Rev 7:
4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.
(PARSING: 144k from ALL the TRIBES of ISRAEL. Vrs 7:5-8 confirm 12,000 x 12 tribes - 144,000)

5 Of the tribe of Juda, Reuben & Gad .

6 Of the tribe of Aser, Nepthalim & Manassas

7 Of the tribe of Simeon, Levi & Issachar

8 Of the tribe of Zabulon, Joseph & Benjamin
(PARSING: Verses 5-8 confirm 12k ea x 12 tribes = 144,000 & NAMES the Israelite TRIBES they come from)

Gen 32:28 God changed Jacob's name to Israel. The 12 tribes of Israel are Jacob/Israel's sons. Each son received a land portion (except Levi/Levites they become the priesthood) Joseph receives a double portion of land (Gen 48) & it's divided between his 2 sons Ephraim & Manasseh.

Rev 14:
1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Zion, and with him a 144k, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.
(PARSING: These 144k are REDEEMED from the earth)

4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.
(PARSING: "Redeemed From Among Men" being the FIRSTFRUITS unto God & to the Lamb)

Parsing vs 4
(A) 144k ALL VIRGINS)
(B) These 144k were REDEEMED from AMONG MEN)
(C) Being FIRSTFRUITS onto God & to the Lamb.

The Rev 4 language is directly lifted from the Lev 23:9-11 wave offering. They're the 1st portion of a larger harvest, set apart & presented to God.

The category itself is Israelite, because the firstfruits offering was tied to Israel's land covenant.

The Israelites practiced the firstfruits (resurrection foreshadowing) wave offering every Passover week for over 1400 yrs. John calling the 144k "firstfruits" supports their identity as being literal Israelites.

1 Cor 15:20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
(PARSING: Christ is 1st to rise/resurrected from the grave)

Matt 27:
50 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.
(PARSING: Jesus dies)

51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;
(PARSING: Jesus rips the Temple veil in 1/2 on the way to paradise)

52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
(PARSING: Many saints are resurrected)

53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.
(PARSING: Jesus rises 1st, then others are resurrected. REREADING Rev 14:1-4, 144k = FIRSTFRUITS, "Redeemed From Among Men")

The Matt 27:52-53 cites these OT elect that rise after Jesus as firstfruits that rise from the grave & they're seen by many!

These firstfruits are resurrected BEFORE there is a church.

Jesus rises then 50 days later comes the Acts 2 Pentecost, where the CHURCH via the Holy Spirit outpouring BEGINS.

 

[ATG]

The PEOPLE of the 2 covenants aren't going to vanish because a doctrine says so.

The people of the old Testament have all vanished to their graves, with some to hell and some to the presence of the Lord.

Dittoes with many people of the new Testament, with many remaining alive on earth today.

Anyone preaching two different covenants with two different people on earth today, is preaching a two-headed false christ.

Rev 13:1
And I saw a beast rising out of the sea, with ten horns and seven heads, with ten diadems on its horns and blasphemous names on its heads.

It looks like the last great false christ will have seven covenants with seven different people. Now that's multi-tasking for the devil...

Ruth and Hosea illustrate the 2 wives.

You've mentioned this 'two wives' thing before. Why not just explain it, rather than leaving it such a mystery. Is it the present two different wives of the two different covenants of the two different people on earth? If so, then I can imagine where it's coming from:

Rev 17:5
And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.

 

[ATG]

7 Feasts of the Lord

1)Passover, 2)Unleavened Bread, 3)Firstfruits, 4)Pentecost, 5)Rosh Hashanah/Trumpets 6)Yom Kippur/Day of Atonement 7)Tabernacles

The 1st 4 Feasts are commonly referred to as the Spring Feasts & pointed to Messiah/Christ's 1st coming.

The final 3 Feasts are commonly referred to as the Fall Feasts: Trumpets-Day of Atonement-Tabernacles point to the Lords 2nd coming.

Israelites celebrated/practiced these Feasts yearly for over 1400 years.

3 Of these crop HARVEST feasts: Passover-Pentecost-Tabernacles carried a mandatory pilgrimage to Jerusalem. All Israelite males 20yrs & older were required to travel to Jerusalem (Deut 16:16)

These 3 special (Passover/Barley-Pentecost/Wheat Main Harvest-Tabernacles/fruits) crop HARVESTS were foreshadowing's of Soul HARVESTS to come.

Jesus died on Passover, was buried during Unleavened Bread & rose on Firstfruits. Jesus sent His indwelling Holy Spirit on Pentecost.

Find FIRSTFRUITS info here: https://www.christianforums.com/blogs/first-fruits-a-resurrection-foreshadow.62533/

The firstfruits harvest began with Jesus resurrecting from the dead, and ends with the first resurrection of His church at His second coming.

The whole fruits harvest begins and ends with the rest of the dead living again a thousand years later. Many will then be saints harvested from the Millennium, and found written in the Book of Life, and many will be the wicked tares from all the earth since Cain.

Only the OT and NT saints harvested unto life at the Lord's return, is the fullness of firstfruits harvest of God by the risen Lord from the air:

Rev 14:14
And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

Rev 14:15
And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe. And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

Scripture records the 1st (fristfruits) resurrection SOUL HARVEST. Here in Matt:
Matt 27:
50 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.
(PARSING: Jesus dies/on Passover/Nisan 14)51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.
(PARSING: After Jesus is RESURRECTED 1st/BTW on FIRSTFRUITS/Nisan 16. Then many saints are RESURRECTED!)

False. Coming out of graves to live again on earth, are not resurrections from the dead, anymore than others such as the Shunamite son, Jairus' daughter, Lazarus, etc...

The OT saints rising from the dead to live again on earth, were not resurrections from the dead before Jesus Christ, nor after His resurrection, including sister Dorcus...

1st, This recorded RESURRECTION event happens 50 days before the Acts 2 Pentecost. So, their are NO body of Christ/Church Saints in this FIRSTFRIUTS resurrection event.

Sister Dorcus wasn't a saint?

Scripture always knows how to rebuke false teaching, either by written doctrine or by recorded event.

And also, Jesus began to build His church the night of His resurrection, when He met with Mary Magdalene, and she confessed Him Lord risen from the dead.

Jhn 20:16
Jesus saith unto her, Mary. She turned herself, and saith unto him, Rabboni; which is to say, Master. Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

Rom 10:9
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Thomas finally came around by sight to faith in Jesus' resurrection 8 days later:

Jhn 20:27
Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing. And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God. Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me,

Jesus also breathed the Spirit upon many before His ascension. And of course, the apostles were already His chosen saints to receive the Lord's commandments for His church before His ascension:

Act 1:1
In the first book, O Theophilus, I have dealt with all that Jesus began to do and teach, until the day when he was taken up, after he had given commands through the Holy Spirit to the apostles whom he had chosen.

Pentecost was the first outpouring of the Holy Ghost upon Jesus' saints, and their first preaching of the gospel of Jesus Christ.

2ndly, The Rev 14: 144k are part of this recorded FIRSTFRUITS RESURRECTION event.

And of course now you're preaching the first resurrection is already past:

2Ti 2:17
And their word will eat as doth a canker: of whom is Hymenaeus and Philetus; Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.

Along with the true doctrine of Christ by His apostles, there have already been false doctrines, many of which are rebuked in NT Scripture.

This language is directly lifted from the Lev 23:9-11 FIRSTFRUITS wave offering. They are the first portion of a larger SOUL HARVEST to come. These OT saints are set apart & presented to God.

Except that the resurrection has not past, and so all old and new dead saints in Christ, shall be resurrected together at the Lord's return to earth.

Which Job prophecies for himself as well:

Job 19:25
For I know that my Redeemer lives, and at the last he will stand upon the earth. And after my skin has been thus destroyed, yet in my flesh I shall see God,

Resurrected Jesus Christ is not yet standing upon the earth for all to see, including resurrected Job. He must first come again with clouds for all to see from the earth.

Rev 1:7
Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

As I said, Scripture by doctrine and recorded event rebukes every falsehood about the Lord and His word. And it truly is a marvelous thing to see, such as here, where one Scripture from the Book of Job proves, that Paul is speaking of all OT and NT Saints that die, and are resurrected together at the Lord's coming again to earth:

1 Th 4:15
For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Rev 14:1
And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads. And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:

 

[ATG]

Not as part of his identity in Christ.

He was also a Pharisee of the Pharisees and persecutor of the church of Jesus Christ.

Not a Jew, that Christians want to follow...

 

[ATG]

And Christ was a Jew

And so was Caiaphas. And don't forget Judas Iscariot. And Pilate was a Roman.

And so we see how being a Jew or Gentile is nothing in following Christ and His Christian apostles. Nor has anything to do with being sealed servants of the living God and the Lamb...

 

[ATG]

Christians do but Jews of Judaism are also Messianic but reject Jesus because they believe someone else is the Messiah.

This is a good point.

'Messianic' Jews normally means Jews that believe in a coming Messiah. Not all Jews believed, nor believe in any Messiah, whether Jesus Christ or any other name.

The Jews that had Jesus crucified were Messianic Jews that reject Jesus the Christ of God, and still do:

Jhn 5:43
I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

Messianic Jews have been proclaiming their new Messiahs for ages...

 

[ATG]

Without understanding the two covenants, and the two wives of God and Jesus, escatology will only be a superficial understanding.

The bible ends with the bride and groom.
The words the Holy Spirit imparts at tge end are the weightless of tge bible.
The parting words are the bride and groom.

I am among a scary few that put that on the table.
The core, center, foundation, and obsession of heaven is the bride and groom.

The elephant in the room is the missing main ingredient.
Nobody even touches it.

The rapture is the gathering of the bride.
(RUTH)

SMH.

Still waiting for the two wives. Are they married to the two covenants of two different people on earth today? What are the two covenant husbands?

I am among a scary few that put that on the table.

So, this is all about personal new revelation of prophecy.

Don't overrate yourself. You're not at all scary.

 

[ATG]

He’s also a male, Roman citizen, and a mortal. None are true in Christ.

Saul of Tarsus was indeed a Roman by birth, and also a Jew by birth. The parental lineage is not clear.

Phl 3:5
Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;

This may imply a Jewish father in the tribe of Benjamin, but not necessarily so.

 

[ATG]

If the hyper differentiation existed he would not have called himself a Jew or the Jews " my brethren".

He would have said " I am not a Jew"

So Jesus dying for all men, and not the Jews only, and rising again for the justification of all that repent, is 'hyper-differentiation' between Jew and Greek.

That's pretty much says it all about the Judaizing spirit.

 

[ATG]

If the hyper differentiation existed he would not have called himself a Jew or the Jews " my brethren".

He would have said " I am not a Jew"

Not the 'hyper-differentiation', but denying his Jewish heritage is correct.

Phl 3:5
Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;

Phl 3:7
But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ. Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,

Paul did count being a Jew as nothing but dung, so far as being a Christian apostle in the body of Christ. That he may glorify Christ in his new spiritual birth of God.

Gal 2:20
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

Judaizing is simply Christians still hung up on OT Israel and the natural Israeli-Jews. Whether demanding outward circumcision, or separating super-elite sealed servants of God, from the rest of the lowly non-Jewish Christian schlubs.

I personally believe much of it is relatively harmless, with just nostalgia for old ancient days coming back again, or perhaps lack of self-esteem or confidence as just another natural born gentile among so many others...

 

[Beekeeper]

And I'll add even further, that the use of the word 'Gentiles' for nations in the NT, is now a doctrinal error. Unlike in the OT, Ethnos in the NT is now properly all nations on earth, which includes the natural nation of Israeli, Britain, American, S. African, etc...None of those nations on earth are themselves the holy nation and Israel of God. The redeemed of Christ Jesus, as you consistently quote, are from among all the nations of earth, whether Israeli, Britain, American, S. African, etc...

The natural Israelites and Jews having the God of Israel crucified, as you show, divorce themselves from the covenant promise of the Spirit, and make themselves uncircumcised to God. All nations of the earth and people, not born of Christ, are now Gentile to God,. Whether Israeli, Britain, American, S. African, etc...

Rom 11:25
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the nations be come in.

You make a good point regarding the translation of "Ethnous".
I can remember being taught that it can be translated "Gentiles" or "Nations" interchangeably, and depending on the context.
I am now considering that the use of the word "Gentiles" may have been just one big confusing mistake.

 

[ATG]

So if you are saved your drivers license says "saved in Christ" VS "male" or "female"
You are TOTALLY MISSING not only context but have no realization of the FACT I can say both.
There is DEFINATELY MALE AND FEMALE BORN AGAIN SAINTS IN EVERY CHURCH.

What you are trying to understand is that GOD SEES US AS SAVED IN CHRIST....NO MATTER IF YOU ARE MALE, FEMALE, JEW OR GREEK...ALL ARE WELCOME.
Neither ETHNICITY, OR SEX, ARE QUALIFIERS.

In failed arguments, changing the context is a simple ruse to deflect correction.

The context here is not about all men and women being saved, no matter natural heritage, but is all about claiming only natural born Jews can be a certain sect of 'elitely' sealed servants of the living God and the Lamb.

That is not preaching neither Jew nor Greek in the body of Christ, but is certainly preaching only Jew not Greek, in the body's service of Christ.

It's also makes difference between elite vs common service in the body of Christ:

1Co 12:12
For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ. For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

1Co 12:15
If the foot shall say, Because I am not the hand, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body? And if the ear shall say, Because I am not the eye, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body?

Gentile feet and ears certainly are not of the 144,000 Jewish body, that for sure.

1Co 12:21
And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you.

The 144.000 sealed Israeli-Jewish eyes sure can say they have no need of no gentile hand in serving the Living God and the Lamb.

1Co 12:17
If the whole body were an eye, where were the hearing? If the whole were hearing, where were the smelling?

Nor gentile hearing and smelling up the place around Mt Sion.

1Co 12:19
And if they were all one member, where were the body?

Well, standing on Mt Sion in all their glorious sealing and seeing down upon the common gentile Christian folk.

1Co 12:23
And those members of the body, which we think to be less honourable, upon these we bestow more abundant honour; and our uncomely parts have more abundant comeliness. For our comely parts have no need: but God hath tempered the body together, having given more abundant honour to that part which lacked:

1Co 12:25
That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another.

Jesus Christ is to be glorified as the one member of the body that matters more than all, as the Head of the whole body put together by the Spirit.

Preaching separation between Jew and Greek, as well as special service vs common, is glorifying certain members of the body, as being more honored by God, and closer to the Head than the rest.

1Co 4:6
And these things, brethren, I have in a figure transferred to myself and to Apollos for your sakes; that ye might learn in us not to think of men above that which is written, that no one of you be puffed up for one against another.

The 144,000 sealed servants of the living God and the Lamb, must only be natural born Israeli-Jews, is an open schism in the body, that dishonors other members, and makes the Head Jesus less glorious in their own eyes...

Mat 12:25
And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand:

 

[FlyingDove]

The firstfruits harvest began with Jesus resurrecting from the dead, and ends with the first resurrection of His church at His second coming.

The whole fruits harvest begins and ends with the rest of the dead living again a thousand years later. Many will then be saints harvested from the Millennium, and found written in the Book of Life, and many will be the wicked tares from all the earth since Cain.

Only the OT and NT saints harvested unto life at the Lord's return, is the fullness of firstfruits harvest of God by the risen Lord from the air:

Again your resurrection summary is incorrect:

There is a resurrection ORDER:

Firstfruits/Passover = the early portion: Matt 27 Jesus then the 144k, probably many more.

Pentecost/The Main Harvest = Church caught up 1 Thes 4:17. Those believers that slept/in death & then those believers that are alive. Meet the Lord in the air!

Tabernacles/The Gleanings: ALL Israelites still alive, tribulation martyrs etc. 1 Cor 15 & Rev 20.

All three ORDERS stand at the Bema seat. Not a sin judgment discussion. Everyone here has been washed in the blood. Rewards based discussion.

All 3 soul Harvests belong to the "ONE" 1st resurrection ORDER category.

The Second Resurrection: Is ONLY the unbelieving found at the White Throne Judgment. No believers, No rewards, Only judgment & eternal separation from God their creator.

 

[ewq1938]

That's better. Good correction. Spiritual Israel is not part of natural Israel...

It is because it is grafted onto natural Israel.

 

[ewq1938]

Sort of correct. Mt Sion is never said to be in heaven, but only in the clouds, with the resurrected saints meeting the Lamb standing thereon in the air. Not yet standing on the earth.

All mountains are Earth based. Some are tall enough to be near clouds but Sion is not.

 

[Psalm1]

In failed arguments, changing the context is a simple ruse to deflect correction.

The context here is not about all men and women being saved, no matter natural heritage, but is all about claiming only natural born Jews can be a certain sect of 'elitely' sealed servants of the living God and the Lamb.

That is not preaching neither Jew nor Greek in the body of Christ, but is certainly preaching only Jew not Greek, in the body's service of Christ.

It's also makes difference between elite vs common service in the body of Christ:

1Co 12:12
For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ. For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

1Co 12:15
If the foot shall say, Because I am not the hand, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body? And if the ear shall say, Because I am not the eye, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body?

Gentile feet and ears certainly are not of the 144,000 Jewish body, that for sure.

1Co 12:21
And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you.

The 144.000 sealed Israeli-Jewish eyes sure can say they have no need of no gentile hand in serving the Living God and the Lamb.

1Co 12:17
If the whole body were an eye, where were the hearing? If the whole were hearing, where were the smelling?

Nor gentile hearing and smelling up the place around Mt Sion.

1Co 12:19
And if they were all one member, where were the body?

Well, standing on Mt Sion in all their glorious sealing and seeing down upon the common gentile Christian folk.

1Co 12:23
And those members of the body, which we think to be less honourable, upon these we bestow more abundant honour; and our uncomely parts have more abundant comeliness. For our comely parts have no need: but God hath tempered the body together, having given more abundant honour to that part which lacked:

1Co 12:25
That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another.

Jesus Christ is to be glorified as the one member of the body that matters more than all, as the Head of the whole body put together by the Spirit.

Preaching separation between Jew and Greek, as well as special service vs common, is glorifying certain members of the body, as being more honored by God, and closer to the Head than the rest.

1Co 4:6
And these things, brethren, I have in a figure transferred to myself and to Apollos for your sakes; that ye might learn in us not to think of men above that which is written, that no one of you be puffed up for one against another.

The 144,000 sealed servants of the living God and the Lamb, must only be natural born Israeli-Jews, is an open schism in the body, that dishonors other members, and makes the Head Jesus less glorious in their own eyes...

Mat 12:25
And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand:

QUOTE
""he 144,000 sealed servants of the living God and the Lamb, must only be natural born Israeli-Jews, is an open schism in the body, that dishonors other members, and makes the Head Jesus less glorious in their own eyes...""

Most any doctrine promotes schism.
I am not moved by any of that.
The BIBLE Tells us who the 144,000 are and what they are.
Firstfruit Jews

Way too simple...I know.

I am so glad I am not Following a doctrine that complicates and changes who and what they are.