Rapture true or false

[Psalm1]

The above is a good example of a "false prophet" of Rev 13, A shill for the RCC, - Antichrist, (knowing or unknowingly) ... "Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away. 2Tim 3:5 ( The "power" being the Holy Spirit of Jesus )

You give them a sound doctrinal, Bible verse, LOGICAL sequence ( reasoning ) countering their false accusations and it makes NO SENSE to them, ... I believe, because of their lack of the Holy Spirit, that guides us to all understanding.

"But the natural man does not welcome what comes from God's Spirit, because it is foolishness to him; he is not able to know it since it is evaluated spiritually. 1 Cor.2:14 HCSB

“Destruction is certain for my rebellious children,” says the LORD. “You make plans that are contrary to my will. You weave a web of plans that are not from my Spirit, thus piling up your sins” (Isaiah 30:1 NLT).

If we live by the Spirit, let us also walk by the Spirit (Galatians 5:25 ESV).

But if, in fact, our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing. Regarding them: the god of this age has blinded the minds of the unbelievers so they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God (2 Corinthians 4:3, 4 HCSB).

Yet they self-righteously claim, proclaim and pronounce Bible doctrine, ( rather than the Righteousness of Christ ) as if they are an authority on Truth, but are only vomiting the Antichrist's false religion, Dispensationalism, that leads gullable souls to perditon.

"For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned to fables." 2 Tim 4:3-4

These "fables" are ONLY grounded on Francisco Reberra, Jesuit priest's, corruption of Daniel 9:27 prophetic understanding, to create a 7 year period of tribulation, NOW at the End of Time, to push the Antichrist's agenda of false doctrines. There is NO Biblical Prophecy or mention of a 7 year period of time IN THE BIBLE, during these last days of tribulation that is NOW coming upon the Earth, that these dispensationalist are basing their FALSE RELIGIOUS BELIEFS.



So! Br. WW ... at what point do we stop trying to persuade these folks ? ... or should we ?
... these "false prophets" to the Truth, and Believing Jesus. ... by "turning away", per 2 Tim 3:5 ??

Blessed Sabbath Folks

You are a nasty nasty pretender friend.
You DO NOT know your Bible.

What a laugh your doctrine does to the 144k ETHNIC jews that are firstfruits.

Find yourself a decent teacher that knows little something about harvest, and WHO FIRSTFRUITS IS.
PSSSSSSST....IT AINT 144K ETHNIC JEWS.

You butcher the bible and accuse others of doing what you do.

 

[Psalm1]

And this is a good idea too. However, unless there is later Scripture proving otherwise, then it remains true until the coming of the Lord.



Which of course is not true for any prophet nor apostle of the Lord, writing His Scriptures.

However, it's still a good idea, that the Scripture was true at the time, and yet became 'amended' by the Lord. Other old prophecies, and even the OT itself was spoken of as everlasting, and yet it died with the God of Israel Jesus Christ on the cross.

So, do you see any Scripture later saying that all saints will surely die, from the last AC's persecution, before the Lord returns?

Mat 24:22
And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

This certainly implies some of the elect will be spared bodily death and remain alive at Jesus' coming. However, may not be definitive. It does mean for certain, that were will be flesh and blood people left alive. They are them that go through the Lord's own great tribulation of wrath, as well as gather to war against Him.

Shortening those days of the AC and Satan's wrath upon the elect, will no doubt spare some from being decieved and receiving the beast's mark. But, it's in context of flesh remaining alive on earth.

Mark 13:22
For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.

But, it's in context of flesh remaining alive on earth.


I still don't know why you think I'm not teaching pre-trib rapture?


Absolutely. The only thing that happens in a moment of time, is their resurrection and bodily immortal change. I believe the example of Jesus Himself in Acts 1, as well as the two witnesses of Rev 11, shows they will all rise together to meet the Lord in the air, in plain sight of all people left on the earth.

There will be no mistaking who has returned, the Lord Jesus Christ, nor what has happened with multitudes of the dead on earth, the first resurrection of His people from righteous Abel to the hour of His coming. And, if alive and remaining, then also many immortally changed that are alive at the time.

I'd be interested in anything on the prophecy of Thessalonians, being later changed.

Gideon300 said:
""Good idea. I agree that not everyone will be killed for refusing the mark of the beast. However, the events of the book of Revelation had yet to be fulfilled when Paul declared that he could be alive at the coming of the Lord.""
Atg said
""And this is a good idea too. However, unless there is later Scripture proving otherwise, then it remains true until the coming of the Lord""

Paul said "...we which are alive and remain...""

Is true both ways.
It is never meant to prove a past rapture.

I see this all the time.
Take one verse to cast down the 10 opposing verses , then make the false assertion "interpretation " written in stone.

 

[Psalm1]

Maybe some here are pushing 7th day advent false doctrine?
From Google;
"" some beliefs of 7th-day Adventists considered false by critics include the doctrine that Jesus is Michael the Archangel, the belief that Satan is the scapegoat in the Day of Atonement ritual, and their semi-Pelagian views on salvation. Other beliefs that differ from mainstream Christianity are their specific doctrines concerning the Sabbath, the heavenly sanctuary, the writings of Ellen White, and their eschatology regarding the second coming and the intermediate state of the soul after death ""

Cult big time.
False prophet festival.

 

[Psalm1]

From
"https://christianity.stackexchange.com/

""the SDA position on the subject, Adventists believe that:
1. Jews will not be saved "as a nation" (although individual Jews will be saved, as the Jews irreversibly lost their position as a "people of God" when they rejected their Messiah by giving up Jesus to be crucified under Pontius Pilate and failed to repent of that rejection during the apostolic ministry of the first century, the Jewish nation was consequently rejected by God which culminated in the destruction of Jerusalem in AD70 and scattering of the Jews among the nations in fulfillment of Daniel 9:26);

1. The blessing of being a "people/nation of God" was essentially "transferred" (though a different, "weaker" verb may be used here) to the Church of Jesus Christ where a person's ethnic background is no longer a factor in anything that has to do with obtaining/enjoying any special spiritual blessing or prophetic distinction. In other words, being a Jew (following national Jewish rejection that occurred nearly two millennia ago) makes no difference thenceforth (either now or in the future) as far as God's Kingdom in general and the economy of salvation in particular is concerned.""

UHH HUH.
SMH

 

[Psalm1]

SDA
No research ....just parrot out of a workbook.

 

[Rob7]

Ok
You are so steeped in delusion romans 11 means nothing to you.
Hosea with Gomer, and that ENTIRE STORY, completely escapes you.
The book of Ruth is like a false fairy tale to your silly doctrine.

False replacement theology taught you by men.
Just ridiculous, then you sling trash on anyone disagreeing with you personal insults.
Go play Jr.
Keep you nastiness.

Why do you keep side stepping, diverting from the important issue here. Your promoting a religion of disobedience and rebellion, to our God. Unbelief is one thing, lack of faith another, but pride and selfishness are at the bottom of it all. ( Isa. 12:14-15 )

Why are you ignoring what I said about there is no 7 year period here at the end of days .... right before the return of our Lord & King Jesus. You don't want to be surprised when you see Jesus coming with His cloud of angels, and you saying... " where's my 7 years, a "grace period" warning me of Christ's eminent Coming.. "Woe is to me" .. THERE'S NO MORE TIME.

FYI (The woes correspond to the fifth, sixth, and seventh trumpet judgments, which are described as escalating events of divine wrath upon those who remain unrepentant, and still disobedient to GOD. ) ( wrath not coming near to His people, Israel, the Church Rev 14:12

 

[ewq1938]

These "fables" are ONLY grounded on Francisco Reberra, Jesuit priest's, corruption of Daniel 9:27 prophetic understanding, to create a 7 year period of tribulation, NOW at the End of Time, to push the Antichrist's agenda of false doctrines. There is NO Biblical Prophecy or mention of a 7 year period of time IN THE BIBLE,

No, there is some periods of time involving 7 of something that can easily be interpreted as 7 years. Aside from that, Christ said the GT time length would be shortened, and in Rev 134 we see tribulation from satan's beasts in a period of 42 months which is half of 7 years o that fits perfectly with Christ saying it would be shortened.

during these last days of tribulation that is NOW coming upon the Earth, that these dispensationalist are basing their FALSE RELIGIOUS BELIEFS.

Teaching the GT is now is a FAR WORSE deceptive teaching than anyone claiming the trib is 7 years long! Dispensation/pretrib is deception but so is what you are claiming as truth. IOW, y'asll are false teaching but neither of you realize it. IMIO any denomination is going to lead people into deception and their teachings are evidence of that.

So! Br. WW ... at what point do we stop trying to persuade these folks ? ... or should we ?

Definitely stop. 99.999999999999999999999 percent of people (of all denominations) should stop persuading others of what they believe in except Christ dying on the cross for our sins and his resurrection.

 

[Psalm1]

Why do you keep side stepping, diverting from the important issue here. Your promoting a religion of disobedience and rebellion, to our God. Unbelief is one thing, lack of faith another, but pride and selfishness are at the bottom of it all. ( Isa. 12:14-15 )

Why are you ignoring what I said about there is no 7 year period here at the end of days .... right before the return of our Lord & King Jesus. You don't want to be surprised when you see Jesus coming with His cloud of angels, and you saying... " where's my 7 years, a "grace period" warning me of Christ's eminent Coming.. "Woe is to me" .. THERE'S NO MORE TIME.

FYI (The woes correspond to the fifth, sixth, and seventh trumpet judgments, which are described as escalating events of divine wrath upon those who remain unrepentant, and still disobedient to GOD. ) ( wrath not coming near to His people, Israel, the Church Rev 14:12

Just omit, Daniel 9.

Pretend there is No 7 yr covenant by the ac.
Pretend there is No desecration in the temple , by the ac, midway into the 7 year period.

Why do you sidestep it.
Pretty hard to wiggle out of prophecy.

 

[Rob7]

Just omit, Daniel 9.

Pretend there is No 7 yr covenant by the ac.
Pretend there is No desecration in the temple , by the ac, midway into the 7 year period.

Why do you sidestep it.
Pretty hard to wiggle out of prophecy.

Sorry ! I couldn't help you friend .. from walking "your way", rather than "The Way", believing Jesus.

Wherein in time past you walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now works in the children of disobedience: Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. Eph. 2:2-3

You've made your choice ... so .. Matt 10:14 "And whoever will not receive you nor hear your words, when you depart from that house or city, shake off the dust from your feet."

 

[ATG]

QUOTE
" "simple truth, that no Scripture says all saints die refusing the mark, escapes you because it's the first time you are being schooled on the Scripture, that says there will be some saints alive and remaining at His return..." "

Sigh
Rev 13
7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

huh?....he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads, that no man might buy or sell, unless he that had the mark

And so, everyone that is not a saint, will receive the mark. This has nothing to do with whether every saint will be killed, or not.

QUOTE
Huh?....
it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb

The beast will make war with the saints. Doesn't say he will kill every saint.

QUOTE
Rev20
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Hmmmm.....according to postribbers all the saints are protected during the trib.

Actually, pre-tribulation is the saints delivered from the Lord's tribulation and wrath, that is only upon His enemies on earth.

Beforehand, the saints are delivered to the tribulation and wrath of the beast, that is only upon the Lord's friends on earth.

The godly first suffer tribulation and wrath from the ungodly. Then the ungodly suffer tribulation and wrath from the Lord.

QUOTE
They all die that refuse the mark.

So you continue to say, but no Scripture says anywhere. It's your own prophetic mark, not the Lord's.

2Pe 1:20
Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

QUOTE
Every man, woman, and child, as the Bible explicitly, vividly, declares.

False. Never quoted explicitly nor vividly.

QUOTE
I thought the saints ran from cave to cave for 7 years ?

That's because your prophecy doesn't think straight. Saints don't flee the wrath of the Lamb:

Rev 6:15
And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

QUOTE
Nope ALL DIE WHO RECIEVE THE MARK.

You need to clarify your prophecy. Is it all the saints or the enemies of the Lord dying before His return?

 

[ATG]

The bible " all die"
Rev 13
7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

The Bible, "beast wars with all saints" "all receive his mark, that are not saints."

You, "all saints die"

You, "God is mistaken."

The Bible, "You are mistaken."

 

[GWH]

Why is it that so many churches, doctrines, people, want to follow the teachings of the rapture when in so many places God tell us it is a lie?
Matthew 13 (NIV)
The Parable of the Weeds Explained
36Then he left the crowd and went into the house. His disciples came to him and said, “Explain to us the parable of the weeds in the field.”
37He answered, “The one who sowed the good seed is the Son of Man. 38The field is the world, and the good seed stands for the people of the kingdom. The weeds are the people of the evil one, 39and the enemy who sows them is the devil. The harvest is the end of the age, and the harvesters are angels.
40“As the weeds are pulled up and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. 41The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will weed out of his kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil. 42They will throw them into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. 43Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Whoever has ears, let them hear.
Matthew 24
The Return of the Son of Man
(Mark 13:24-27; Luke 21:25-28)

26Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. 27For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 28For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.
29Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
You can also find this in Mark 13 and Luke 21.
To be continued .

"as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be"
seems consistent with those who are living at that time being raptured to me. Was that your point?

 

[ATG]

"The dead in Christ", must be changed huh?

The dead bodies do, in order to be resurrected immortal.

1Co 15:49
And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly. Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

If you don't believe in the bodily resurrection of the dead, then your faith is in vain.

1Cor 15:16
For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised: And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins. Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.

.paradise was empty at the writing of 1 thes.

All souls that have died in Christ are in the Lord's presence at His altar.

2Co 5:6
Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

Rev 6:9
And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

Rom 8:23
And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

The redeemed souls of them that die in Christ, as well as the redeemed saints alive on earth, are awaiting the redemption of their bodies, which is when the Lord returns to bodily resurrect and change the mortal body, and receive His own unto Himself in the air.

So your doctrine bit you again, trying to ascribe all ot saints as " the dead in Christ".

The God of Israel is Christ:
Gal 3:17
And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.

Heb 11:24
By faith Moses, when he was come to years, refused to be called the son of Pharaoh's daughter; Choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God, than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season; Esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt: for he had respect unto the recompence of the reward.

Heb 11:13
These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.

Christ made covenant with Abraham and Moses, and all them that die in faith of Christ, die in Christ.

 

[ATG]

Go to YouTube and watch ANY POSTRIBBER TEACHER.
NONE of them include Rev 14. None of them honestly address the 144k, the innumerable number in heaven with dirty robes washed, or the virgin parable, or acts 1 ( like manner)

The beginning of Rev 7 is the first resurrection of all Old and New Testaments saints. The whole earth is made still at Christ's coming, and the power of His resurrection is seen, when He changes all His saints to ascend and meet Him in the air.

The Beginning of Rev 14 is all the redeemed and resurrected Israel of God in the air singing their new song of glory from God:

Rev 15:2
And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire: and them that had gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name, stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God. And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying, Great and marvellous are thy works, Lord God Almighty; just and true are thy ways, thou King of saints.

They are doing so, while the last hour of the Lamb's wrath is upon all the inhabitants of the earth:

Rev 14:6
And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

The wholly redeemed and resurrected 144,000 saints of God, will be all the believers of the Old and new Testaments, given by Moses and the Lamb Jesus Christ.

The second half of Rev 7 is all the saints of God from righteous Abel, to the end of the Lord's reign on earth, that are found written in the Lamb's book of life, and will be without number, nor signified by any number, such as 144,000.

ALL of them..100%... Change Matt 24 "angles gather from heaven", into: "Jesus gathers from earth".

Jesus resurrects them from earth, and His angels gather them from heaven, to meet Jesus in the air:

Rev 14:14
And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle…And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

Mat 24:30
And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

ALL OF THEM omit matt24 " before the flood "

Before the Lord's return, as in the days of Noah, the unbelievers shall rejoice in ungodliness, while persecuting the godly.

Rev 11:9
And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves. And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.

And as the flood was disbelieved and sudden upon all the earth, so shall the coming of the Lord with glory. And as the ark was carried away above the waters of the flood over all the earth, so shall the resurrected saints ascend above the wrath of the Lamb upon the earth.

Ask them " what is the setting for EVERY RAPTURE VERSE"

Great tribulation and wrath upon the godly all over the earth, with great worshipping and rejoicing in the beast.

1Th 5:1
But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

Ask them to unpack rev 14:14 HONESTLY.

See above for Jesus resurrecting His saints unto Himself, at His return with clouds and glory.

ASK THEM TO unpack the virgin parable WHITHOUT CHANGING THE COMPONENTS of the parable.....(they can't do it)

The disobedient believers, that name Christ with the lips, will also be caught unawares by His coming. They will be appointed His wrath with the unbelieving evil-doers of the earth.
https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/mat/24/48/s_953048
Mat 25:13
Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh.

Mat 24:48
But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming, And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken, The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

 

[Psalm1]

Sorry ! I couldn't help you friend .. from walking "your way", rather than "The Way", believing Jesus.

Wherein in time past you walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now works in the children of disobedience: Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. Eph. 2:2-3

You've made your choice ... so .. Matt 10:14 "And whoever will not receive you nor hear your words, when you depart from that house or city, shake off the dust from your feet."

Desperately trying to destroy the messenger.
Juvenile false labeling anyone exposing your mess that you parrot as a follower.

What a silly little boy.

 

[Psalm1]

The dead bodies do, in order to be resurrected immortal.

1Co 15:49
And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly. Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

If you don't believe in the bodily resurrection of the dead, then your faith is in vain.

1Cor 15:16
For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised: And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins. Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.

All souls that have died in Christ are in the Lord's presence at His altar.

2Co 5:6
Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

Rev 6:9
And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

Rom 8:23
And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

The redeemed souls of them that die in Christ, as well as the redeemed saints alive on earth, are awaiting the redemption of their bodies, which is when the Lord returns to bodily resurrect and change the mortal body, and receive His own unto Himself in the air.






The God of Israel is Christ:
Gal 3:17
And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.

Heb 11:24
By faith Moses, when he was come to years, refused to be called the son of Pharaoh's daughter; Choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God, than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season; Esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt: for he had respect unto the recompence of the reward.

Heb 11:13
These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.

Christ made covenant with Abraham and Moses, and all them that die in faith of Christ, die in Christ.

Then Jesus preaching to the captives in paradise was a waste of timevsince they already were in christ before the cross.

Your deal is debunked.
You post verses that we all know and use, then spin it via your great leap to conclusions.

Try harder to connect the dots

 

[DallasMan]

Why is it that so many churches, doctrines, people, want to follow the teachings of the rapture when in so many places God tell us it is a lie?

There's your first mistake, not knowing that God's Word actually does teach the catching away of the church aka the rapture.

It's just a matter of when this even takes place.

 

[Me_Clay]

There's your first mistake, not knowing that God's Word actually does teach the catching away of the church aka the rapture.

It's just a matter of when this even takes place.

The state of unbelief is damnation.

 

[Cameron143]

The state of unbelief is damnation.

Actually, it's to be under condemnation. If someone is in unbelief and under damnation, they have exited this realm.

 

[ATG]

Gideon300 said:
""Good idea. I agree that not everyone will be killed for refusing the mark of the beast. However, the events of the book of Revelation had yet to be fulfilled when Paul declared that he could be alive at the coming of the Lord.""
Atg said
""And this is a good idea too. However, unless there is later Scripture proving otherwise, then it remains true until the coming of the Lord""

Paul said "...we which are alive and remain...""

Is true both ways.
It is never meant to prove a past rapture.

Correct. Paul is speaking of the one and only rapture of the church at the Lord's return.

The rest of the dead will not live again, until after Jesus' millennial reign on earth with His raptured saints.

The rest of the dead will include all the wicked not in the Lord's rapture, as well as all the just and unjust during the Lord's Millennium.

I see this all the time.
Take one verse to cast down the 10 opposing verses , then make the false assertion "interpretation " written in stone.

True. Or, twist 10 verses to cast down one opposing verse, then make the false assertion "interpretation " written in their own minds.

2Pe 1:20
Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.