Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

[HeIsHere]

1. The Heart is Deceitful (Jeremiah 17:9)

Yes, the heart is deceitful, and that is why we need God’s conviction and light. But this verse does not say man cannot respond when God convicts. God says elsewhere, “Ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart” (Jeremiah 29:13 KJV). The same prophet shows that men can seek God when enlightened by Him.

2. No Man Can Come to Me Except the Father Draw Him (John 6:44)

The drawing here is not a secret irresistible act limited to a few. It is the Father’s instruction that enlightens and calls through His Word. Jesus explained this clearly in the next verse:

“It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.” (John 6:45 KJV)​

Those who have heard and learned from the Father are drawn by Him through His Word. Jesus spoke the very words that the Father commanded Him to speak:

“For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.” (John 12:49–50 KJV)​

Therefore, those who receive and believe the words of Christ are responding to the Father’s teaching. This is how the Father draws. It is through His revealed Word, which Jesus spoke and which is now recorded in Scripture.

Jesus confirmed that this drawing is universal:

“And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.” (John 12:32 KJV)​

This means that all men are drawn through the light of God’s truth found in Scripture. Yet some resist that light and perish because they refuse to receive the truth that could save them:

“And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.” (2 Thessalonians 2:10 KJV)​

Jesus prayed, “Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.” (John 17:17 KJV). Those who reject the truth of God’s Word reject the Father’s drawing through the Scriptures. Their perishing is not because they were excluded from grace, but because they hardened their hearts against the truth that was given to them.

The Father draws through His Word, and His Word is truth. When men receive that truth in love, they come to Christ. When they reject it, they turn from the very light that could have led them to salvation.


3. None Seeketh After God (Romans 3:11)

Paul describes the condition of mankind as it stands apart from God’s revealed truth. No one seeks after God on his own initiative, for man’s natural tendency is to turn away from Him. Yet throughout Scripture God continually calls men to seek Him. Acts 17:27 says, “That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him.” Paul, the same writer, declares that God “is not far from every one of us.” This shows that when people are confronted with God’s revelation, they have the real opportunity to seek and find Him. The problem is not that seeking is impossible, but that most refuse to do so. Those who respond to the light of God’s Word and truth are the ones who come to Him.


4. Dead in Trespasses and Sins (Ephesians 2:1)

Being dead in sin is spiritual separation, not the inability to hear or respond. Jesus said the dead will hear His voice (John 5:25). So even in death, God’s call enables the hearing. The question is whether the person responds. That is Prevenient Grace in action.

Even though the world lies in sin, Jesus said that when the Holy Spirit comes, “he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment” (John 16:8 KJV). This shows that spiritual death does not mean total inability to respond. The Holy Spirit convicts the entire world, awakening the conscience and confronting every person with the reality of sin and righteousness. Those who yield to that conviction are led to repentance and faith, while those who resist it remain in unbelief.


5. Blinded by Satan (2 Corinthians 4:4)

Satan blinds, but God removes blindness through the light of the gospel (2 Corinthians 4:6). The light shines to all, and men can resist or receive it (John 1:9 and John 3:19 through 21).


Summary

These passages describe the fallen condition of man apart from divine truth, not a total inability to respond when God’s Word draws. God draws all men through His Word, teaches through the words given to His Son, and enlightens through the Spirit. Those who receive the love of the truth come to Christ and are saved. Those who reject it remain in darkness, not because God refused them, but because they refused His Word.




....

Calvinists assert a person can ONLY deny the Gospel, unless god directly, uniquely, particularly intervenes and regenerates first,

the person has an inward work done before they believe, so in essence they have been sanctified before belief.

Error from start to finish.

 

[Bible_Highlighter]

Don't tell me you are one of those who denies that God has commanded things that are not possible
for man to do? Oh my, it is shocking how little of the Bible you believe or understand. I never would
have expected it of you, since you put yourself forward as quite the expert, although admittedly of
a cult. And if you do believe you can do all God commanded, please tell me how you circumcised
your heart. And also your ears, as I have never heard anything about that.

Philippians 3 verse 3; Colossians 2 verse 11; Romans 2 verse 29b ~ For it is we who are the circumcision, we who worship by the Spirit of God, who glory in Christ Jesus, and who put no confidence in the flesh. You were also circumcised, in the putting off of your sinful nature, with the circumcision performed by Christ and not by human hands. Circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code.

Don't tell me you are one of those who denies that God has commanded things that are not possible
for man to do? Oh my, it is shocking how little of the Bible you believe or understand. I never would
have expected it of you, since you put yourself forward as quite the expert, although admittedly of
a cult. And if you do believe you can do all God commanded, please tell me how you circumcised
your heart. And also your ears, as I have never heard anything about that.

Philippians 3 verse 3; Colossians 2 verse 11; Romans 2 verse 29b ~ For it is we who are the circumcision, we who worship by the Spirit of God, who glory in Christ Jesus, and who put no confidence in the flesh. You were also circumcised, in the putting off of your sinful nature, with the circumcision performed by Christ and not by human hands. Circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code.

I do not deny that God has given commands which man cannot obey by his own power alone. What I affirm is that God also provides the means to obey through His Word and Spirit. He never commands something that He refuses to help man fulfill. As Deuteronomy 30:11–14 says, “For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off... But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it.”

Regarding circumcision of the heart, Scripture shows both man’s responsibility and God’s work. God commands, “Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked” (Deuteronomy 10:16), and later promises, “The Lord thy God will circumcise thine heart” (Deuteronomy 30:6). The first shows man’s call to humble himself; the second shows that God completes the inward work in response. This balance reveals God’s cooperation with human will—He calls, convicts, and enables, but man must still respond.

When Paul said, “circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter” (Romans 2:29 KJV), the “letter” refers to the written code of the Mosaic Law. The Law demanded outward obedience and carried penalties of death for disobedience. This is why Paul said, “the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life” (2 Corinthians 3:6 KJV). Under the old covenant, breaking certain commandments could lead to capital punishment, but under the New Covenant, the focus is on spiritual life through repentance, faith in Christ, and faithful obedience to the teachings and commandments of Jesus and His apostles as recorded in the New Testament Scriptures.

Jesus said, “If ye love me, keep my commandments” (John 14:15 KJV). We still obey the Word of God, but not under the threat of physical death written in the letter of the Law. We obey through the Spirit who gives life and power to walk in righteousness.

Therefore, the “letter” represents the old covenant that brought condemnation and death to those who disobeyed, while the “Spirit” represents the new covenant that brings life and transformation through faith in Christ. God’s commands are not impossible; He enables what He commands. Those who yield to His Word and Spirit experience the inward change of heart that fulfills the very righteousness God requires.



....

 

[Magenta]

These passages describe the fallen condition of man apart from divine truth, not a total inability to respond when God’s Word draws. God draws all men through His Word, teaches through the words given to His Son, and enlightens through the Spirit. Those who receive the love of the truth come to Christ and are saved. Those who reject it remain in darkness, not because God refused them, but because they refused His Word.

A person who cannot receive or understand the spiritual things of God is not drawn by them but repulsed until made alive in Christ. He is opposed to them, in the flesh he serves the law of sin which does not bring forth fruit unto life, but death. You keep ascribing to the natural man what only the spiritual man is capable of. You are ok calling me a Calvinist even when I tell you I am not because my beliefs are solidly based on what Scripture teaches, but you want me to stop calling you what you are, a Pelagian heretic, simply because you say you are not, when all evidence points to the fact that you are. Your double standard does not fly with me.

It is God Who works in you to will and to act on behalf of His good purpose. Apart from Me you can do nothing. No word from God will ever fail. “It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.” Those who heard this asked, “Who then can be saved?” But Jesus said, “What is impossible with man is possible with God.”

 

[Jordon]

1. The Heart is Deceitful (Jeremiah 17:9)

Yes, the heart is deceitful, and that is why we need God’s conviction and light. But this verse does not say man cannot respond when God convicts. God says elsewhere, “Ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart” (Jeremiah 29:13 KJV). The same prophet shows that men can seek God when enlightened by Him.

2. No Man Can Come to Me Except the Father Draw Him (John 6:44)

The drawing here is not a secret irresistible act limited to a few. It is the Father’s instruction that enlightens and calls through His Word. Jesus explained this clearly in the next verse:

“It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.” (John 6:45 KJV)​

Those who have heard and learned from the Father are drawn by Him through His Word. Jesus spoke the very words that the Father commanded Him to speak:

“For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.” (John 12:49–50 KJV)​

Therefore, those who receive and believe the words of Christ are responding to the Father’s teaching. This is how the Father draws. It is through His revealed Word, which Jesus spoke and which is now recorded in Scripture.

Jesus confirmed that this drawing is universal:

“And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.” (John 12:32 KJV)​

This means that all men are drawn through the light of God’s truth found in Scripture. Yet some resist that light and perish because they refuse to receive the truth that could save them:

“And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.” (2 Thessalonians 2:10 KJV)​

Jesus prayed, “Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.” (John 17:17 KJV). Those who reject the truth of God’s Word reject the Father’s drawing through the Scriptures. Their perishing is not because they were excluded from grace, but because they hardened their hearts against the truth that was given to them.

The Father draws through His Word, and His Word is truth. When men receive that truth in love, they come to Christ. When they reject it, they turn from the very light that could have led them to salvation.


3. None Seeketh After God (Romans 3:11)

Paul describes the condition of mankind as it stands apart from God’s revealed truth. No one seeks after God on his own initiative, for man’s natural tendency is to turn away from Him. Yet throughout Scripture God continually calls men to seek Him. Acts 17:27 says, “That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him.” Paul, the same writer, declares that God “is not far from every one of us.” This shows that when people are confronted with God’s revelation, they have the real opportunity to seek and find Him. The problem is not that seeking is impossible, but that most refuse to do so. Those who respond to the light of God’s Word and truth are the ones who come to Him.


4. Dead in Trespasses and Sins (Ephesians 2:1)

Being dead in sin is spiritual separation, not the inability to hear or respond. Jesus said the dead will hear His voice (John 5:25). So even in death, God’s call enables the hearing. The question is whether the person responds. That is Prevenient Grace in action.

Even though the world lies in sin, Jesus said that when the Holy Spirit comes, “he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment” (John 16:8 KJV). This shows that spiritual death does not mean total inability to respond. The Holy Spirit convicts the entire world, awakening the conscience and confronting every person with the reality of sin and righteousness. Those who yield to that conviction are led to repentance and faith, while those who resist it remain in unbelief.


5. Blinded by Satan (2 Corinthians 4:4)

Satan blinds, but God removes blindness through the light of the gospel (2 Corinthians 4:6). The light shines to all, and men can resist or receive it (John 1:9 and John 3:19 through 21).


Summary

These passages describe the fallen condition of man apart from divine truth, not a total inability to respond when God’s Word draws. God draws all men through His Word, teaches through the words given to His Son, and enlightens through the Spirit. Those who receive the love of the truth come to Christ and are saved. Those who reject it remain in darkness, not because God refused them, but because they refused His Word.




....

your forgetting one very importing thing sir, his will has to have enough enabling grace in order to judge there rejection

 

[Jordon]

Make sure you watch that video @Magenta , I want you to feel richly encouraged

 

[Genez]

I'm thinking you do not have a grip on reality

I think you just targeted me for your own personal reasons.....

Have a nice Day.

 

[Rufus]

Not proud, I know the Lord well enough not to get sucked into your errors.



Didn't ask about your Federal Head, asked how you fit into the categories considering God loved you enough to include you in the headship. Unless of course he hasn't included you and you're still on the outside looking in.



I did what you asked. Me not complying with your request is not the problem, the problem is you don't believe what I gave fulfills your demands.

God demonstrated His love while we were still sinners. He was demonstrating that love to us, not to His Son. His Son did not need the demonstration, He never doubted.

Who are the "we"? Each and every person in the world?

If when I was still not saved and still in the flesh, could have "fit into the categories", why would I need Jesus? As I said, you don't understand Federal Headship. But...since Christ chose me in Christ before the world began, then I was indeed predestined (as one of God's elect descendants of Abraham) to be conformed to Christ's image. God in me and through Christ fulfilled his promises that he made to his chosen covenant people, for he circumcised my heart so that I could love Him and He instilled the Fear of the Himself into my own heart to humble me. Both of these promises are unconditional and unilateral.

And you did not answer my question.

 

[Genez]

I believe God can force insight upon men:

Genesis 20:3–7 (KJV)

3 "But God came to Abimelech in a dream by night, and said to him, Behold, thou art but a dead man, for the woman which thou hast taken; for she is a man's wife.​

4 But Abimelech had not come near her: and he said, Lord, wilt thou slay also a righteous nation?​

5 Said he not unto me, She is my sister? and she, even she herself said, He is my brother: in the integrity of my heart and innocency of my hands have I done this.​

6 And God said unto him in a dream, Yea, I know that thou didst this in the integrity of thy heart; for I also withheld thee from sinning against me: therefore suffered I thee not to touch her.​

7 Now therefore restore the man his wife; for he is a prophet, and he shall pray for thee, and thou shalt live: and if thou restore her not, know thou that thou shalt surely die, thou, and all that are thine."​

​

Granted, this is not like forcing salvation upon others, like in Calvinism.
But I do see God forcing insight into understanding the gospel to all men or the majority of mankind under His drawing, or temporary enlightenment. We see God open the heart of Lydia before she heard the gospel. I believe this opening of the heart is to help the sinner to understand the gospel, to make a free will choice in either accepting the gospel or freely rejecting it.

I believe when Jesus said that this is the work of God to believe in the one whom He sent was a reference to how it is God's work and not our work upon our hearts that gives us the capacity to truly believe. So when Paul says we are saved by God's grace through faith and not works, that still holds true (Ephesians 2:8-9).

Do you believe in Prevenient Grace?



.....

You are confusing a premonition for insight.

 

[Genez]

He is our example. He is the perfect example of how believers can and should live.

If The Lord Jesus Christ "cheated" and used His deity......All of us would be exempt of His example.

Yes.

Fixing our eyes on Jesus, the pioneer and perfecter of faith. ​

For the joy set before him he endured the cross, scorning its ​

shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God." Heb 12:2​

That is why Satan was tempting Jesus to cheat with his suggestion he turn the stones into bread...

Jesus would had to resort back to operating as God to do so, and no longer be as a man he was required to be, to pioneer our faith.

In Christ.....

 

[Rufus]

And the Lord has mercy on ignorance.

1 Timothy 1:13
Even though I was once a blasphemer and a persecutor and a violent man, I was shown mercy because I acted in ignorance and unbelief.

Paul knew the letter (of the Law) but He didn't know the Spirit.

But the Lord does DETEST the proud. And pride was Adam's downfall.

I suppose you think that Adam's daddy Lucifer was also an ardent admirer of God which is why he wanted to sit right next to God on his throne, right?

 

[Rufus]

It's now $100.00 an hour.

More like $1.00 an a hour, and even then, that isn't any bargain.

 

[BillyBob]

Read again my post here. If you still don't get it, put yourself and your loved ones in that scenario (as if in a hypothetical parallel universe). Could you then really say that the rescuer in my scenario was being loving and good?
Would you not be personally outraged if it happened to you (if you imagined yourself in this parallel univers)?
This would be a violation of basic morality.
Then connect the dots with the Calvinistic version of God that you believe in.




....

So, when we are told in Rom 9:15 that God will have mercy on whom He chooses, then that makes Him an unjust God?
I personally do not think so, when there are none who deserve His mercy........

 

[Rufus]

God DEFINITELY did not "save" Pharaoh because Pharaoh DEFINITELY did not want to be saved. Such is the pattern throughout the Bible from Cain onwards.....

Rahab, the Gibeonites, the Ninevites? Yea, they DEFINITELY wanted to be saved. So God saved them.
Such is the pattern throughout Scripture....

And Pharaoh didn't want to be saved because God hardened his heart, proving that the doctrine of Compatibilism is valid, since subsequent to God's decree (prediction in Ex 3), Pharaoh complied by hardening his own heart.

 

[Rufus]

You are misunderstanding my point. I am not saying that man can save himself apart from God. I agree that no one can come to Christ unless God first draws him (John 6:44 KJV). My issue is with your claim that God must override a person’s will to save him. That removes any real relationship or love between God and man.

If salvation is entirely forced, then God could just as easily force everyone to be saved. But He does not, and that reveals the moral problem in your system. It portrays God as arbitrary, choosing some and rejecting others without any genuine choice or response from the person. That is not love, that is control.

Jesus Himself showed otherwise when He said, “How often would I have gathered thy children together… and ye would not” (Matthew 23:37 KJV). He genuinely desired their repentance, but they refused. Their will mattered. God’s drawing does not negate man’s responsibility to respond.

If human will has no value, as you claim, then all the commands of Scripture such as “repent,” “believe,” and “come unto Me,” are meaningless. God does not command robots. He calls people to freely respond to His grace. Love requires choice, and God desires love, not forced obedience.



....

Did God FORCE the ancient Hebrews to leave Egypt or did God rescue them?

 

[cv5]

So, when we are told in Rom 9:15 that God will have mercy on whom He chooses, then that makes Him an unjust God?
I personally do not think so, when there are none who deserve His mercy........

No Calvinist here rightly comprehends Romans 9.
Despite the many fine exegetical treatments offered on a silver platter.

The way they carry on, you would think that they actually think that the Bible was written in English in the 17th century.....

 

[BillyBob]

Fairness. The ONLY truly unprejudiced ultimately fair system of salvation is......free will belief.
Rich or poor, Jew or Greek, great or small, great sins or little, great labor or little.
Doesn't matter.

The angelic host (good and evil) behold the spectacle of salvation, and no accusation shall stand.

[Mat 20:8 KJV]
So when even was come, the lord of the vineyard saith unto his steward, Call the labourers, and give them [their] hire, beginning from the last unto the first.

[Mat 20:9 KJV]
And when they came that [were hired] about the eleventh hour, they received every man a penny.

[Mat 20:10 KJV]
But when the first came, they supposed that they should have received more; and they likewise received every man a penny.

[Mat 20:11 KJV]
And when they had received [it], they murmured against the goodman of the house,

[Mat 20:12 KJV]
Saying, These last have wrought [but] one hour, and thou hast made them equal unto us, which have borne the burden and heat of the day.

[Mat 20:13 KJV]
But he answered one of them, and said, Friend, I do thee no wrong: didst not thou agree with me for a penny?

[Mat 20:14 KJV]
Take [that] thine [is], and go thy way: I will give unto this last, even as unto thee.

Questioning God's fairness is probably not a good idea!

 

[Rufus]

It is as simple as an "unbeliever" in scripture is a person who has rejected the Gospel, otherwise how could they be unbelievers?

Of course @Cameron143 tells us that no person can believe unless they are regenerated first, but that
notion is completely absent from scripture.

Simple explanation. The world is filled with pagan idolaters who believe in their idols and not the one true Creator.

 

[BillyBob]

No Calvinist here rightly comprehends Romans 9.
Despite the many fine exegetical treatments offered on a silver platter.

The way they carry on, you would think that they actually think that the Bible was written in English in the 17th century.....

Your platter looks a little tarnished, just as your understanding.

 

[Kroogz]

Fairness. The ONLY truly unprejudiced ultimately fair system of salvation is......free will belief.
Rich or poor, Jew or Greek, great or small, great sins or little, great labor or little.
Doesn't matter.

The angelic host (good and evil) behold the spectacle of salvation, and no accusation shall stand.

Right on Brother!
And this is exactly why we see all the differing dispensations in His word. God living with man. God and signs and wonders. God and the Church. God and the 1000years to name a few.......Satan and mankind will be without excuse. Every possibility of "blaming God" is covered by Him.

Everybody will have had their opportunity.

And I argue that God places each and every individual in the perfect dispensation and perfect local to best suit their free choice for God.

 

[Rufus]

2 Peter 3:9
“The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.”

Calvinists reject the plain, straightforward meaning of this verse because it does not fit the picture of God they prefer to hold in their minds.

....

Does the text say that God is patient (longsuffering) to the entire world or to Peter's audience to whom he was writing?