Have you ever heard of progressive revelation? The entire bible is written for us, but not all of it is written to us. Do you not believe that directions for man have changed throughout the course of human history? What God gave to Noah to obey was not the same directions he gave Abraham to obey. And so forth...
There Are Not Two Gospels — Peter and Paul Preached the Same Message
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Have you ever heard of progressive revelation? The entire bible is written for us, but not all of it is written to us. Do you not believe that directions for man have changed throughout the course of human history? What God gave to Noah to obey was not the same directions he gave Abraham to obey. And so forth...
OUCH is planting seeds.
First John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Since JESUS knows that all people are born naturally and they need to be reborn, why do you think HE'S speaking to the unborn?
We can't make a choice to follow HIM unless we have been born naturally and since JESUS knows that sins are remitted in the water he says "Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit".
Being baptized in water is something we have to do, being filled with the Holy Ghost is something JESUS does.
Acts 2:39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Want share something, Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:
Since JESUS hasn't filled you with the Holy Ghost you say things like it's an exception to the rule or something I want to share a past experience.
So, my church went to Georgia to get used church pews as they were building a new church. We asked what's up and was told that a group of app 10 men were seeking the LORD more and the Holy Ghost landed on them and they all spoke in tongues.
They couldn't wait to tell their pastor, they did and the pastor kicked them out of the church.
JESUS is not welcome in some churches, this one was a baptist church, so they were building a new church and they call themselves baptistcostels.
Seek and ye shall find, it's also a part of being reborn.
Please consider since it's FOR ALL.
Brother, I appreciate your zeal for God’s Word and your desire for people to experience the Holy Spirit. Let’s look carefully at what Jesus actually meant in John 3:5:
“Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.”
It’s important to let Scripture interpret Scripture. Notice what Jesus explains immediately after in John 3:6–7:
“That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.”
So Jesus Himself contrasts natural birth (“born of flesh”) with spiritual birth (“born of the Spirit”).
That helps us see that “born of water” refers to our first, physical birth — not to baptism — and that the new birth comes by the Holy Spirit’s regenerating work.
This understanding fits perfectly with the rest of the New Testament:
- Titus 3:5 — “Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost.”
(Notice: the cleansing is spiritual, done by the Spirit, not by literal water.) - Ephesians 2:8–9 — “For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God — not of works, lest any man should boast.”
- 1 Corinthians 1:17 — Paul clearly says, “Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel.”
If baptism were part of the saving act itself, Paul could never have made that distinction.
We’re baptized because we are saved, not in order to be saved.
Even the thief on the cross was saved without water:
“Today shalt thou be with me in paradise.” — Luke 23:43
Salvation is through faith in Christ’s finished work on the cross — His blood, not the water, washes away sin (Revelation 1:5).
So Basically:
“Born of water” = natural birth
“Born of Spirit” = spiritual rebirth by the Holy Ghost
Baptism = outward testimony of an inward reality
Let’s rejoice that Jesus offers new life freely to all who believe:
“Whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.” — John 3:16
Grace and Peace
I'm sorry your so happy thinking the way you think makes me sad, but I know so many people think the same way you do.
My job as a JESUS follower is to share HIS word with others, storing treasures in Heaven.
GOD can ONLY word with the humble.
“Born of water” = natural birth
“Born of Spirit” = spiritual rebirth by the Holy Ghost
Baptism = outward testimony of an inward reality
Your way of thinking, NONE OF IT IS BIBLE.
We have to be born naturally which is why we have sin.
We have to received the Holy Ghost which you say you never got.
We get baptized for show.
So we can go to heaven with sin.
No need to be filled with the Holy Ghost.
And GOD does things for show.
“Whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.” — John 3:16
IF YOU BELIEVE YOU SHOULD NOT PARAISH.
Mark 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
YOU WAY OF THINKING leaves so many pieces of GODS puzzle out all together, we really need to look at al of HIS word and its says what it says.
SO MANY REBIELIOUS PEOPLE REFER TO THE THIEF.
WE NEED TO BE HUMBLE.
We need to rightly divide the word.
When the thief on the cross died, he died OT laws. Where people had to take a sacrifice to the high priests ones a year to have their sins forgiven GOD RULES.
JESUS is our high priest and he became our sacrifice our lamb.
When JESUS was on this earth and forgave sins as he wished like the thief.
JESUS preach app 3 years, died on the cross, buried and rose again. Then he ascended to Heaven to put his blood on the mercy seat.
Hebrews 9:12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
He then returned to earth and was here app 40 days and ascended again commanding his disciples to wait because they will be filled with the Holy Ghost. Acts 2:3-4
He ascended the second time and this was the first message of how to be reborn.
Acts 2:38-39
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Since then until he returns again, we live in NT laws and how to be saved we need to repent, get baptized in JESUS name to get rid of our sins and receive the Holy Ghost like JESUS gave his disciples in Acts 2:4.
If you really want to be my brother, OBEY HIS WORD.
OUCH is not trying to reason through Scripture — he’s arguing from a “oneness/Pentecostal” or “Acts 2:38 salvation” framework, which teaches that a person is not saved unless they:
- Repent,
- Are baptized in Jesus’ name only (not the Trinitarian formula), and
- Speak in tongues as proof of receiving the Holy Spirit.
So when he says things like:
“Your way of thinking, NONE OF IT IS BIBLE… We live in NT laws… we need to repent, get baptized in JESUS name to get rid of our sins and receive the Holy Ghost…”
—he’s defending that works-plus-ordinance view and trying to push me into his system, not to have an even exchange of Scripture.Here’s what he’s doing rhetorically:
1. Shifting from exegesis to accusation
Rather than addressing my verses, he calls your interpretation “not Bible.” That’s a control move to make his view sound like the only faithful one.
2. Equating humility with agreeing with him
“GOD can only work with the humble” = if you disagree, you’re proud. That shuts down dialogue.
3. Mixing covenants but calling it “rightly dividing”
He admits the thief on the cross was under the Old Covenant but still uses Acts 2:38 as a new “law of salvation,” even though Acts 10, 15, and Ephesians 2–3 show salvation by grace through faith apart from ritual works.
4. Cherry-picking one verse (Mark 16:16)
He ignores that the second half of that verse condemns only unbelief, not failure to be baptized: “he that believeth not shall be damned.”
Brother, salvation’s foundation is Christ’s finished work, not a sequence of human actions.
Acts 2 describes how the first hearers expressed faith; Paul later explains what saves: “By grace… through faith… not of works” (Eph 2:8-9).
The water points to the blood; the blood saves. (Heb 9:14; 1 Pet 3:21).
We obey because we’re saved, not to be saved (Romans 6).
So Basically: OUCH is upholding a works-based, modalistic interpretation of salvation rooted in the Oneness Pentecostal tradition, not trying to engage in mutual study.Grace and Peace
OUCH is not trying to reason through Scripture — he’s arguing from a “oneness/Pentecostal” or “Acts 2:38 salvation” framework, which teaches that a person is not saved unless they:
- Repent,
- Are baptized in Jesus’ name only (not the Trinitarian formula), and
- Speak in tongues as proof of receiving the Holy Spirit.
OUCH is upholding a works-based, modalistic interpretation of salvation rooted in the Oneness Pentecostal tradition.
Jesus warned plainly:
And Paul said:
Notice—they don’t always snarl. Sometimes they come polished, calm, even “biblical,” but the test is whether they uphold the full gospel of grace in Christ alone (Galatians 1:6–9).
Wolves don’t always snarl — sometimes they smile and quote Scripture. But you’ll know them by whether they exalt Christ’s finished work or add to it.
Grace and Peace
“Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.”
— Matthew 7:15 (KJV)
And Paul said:
“For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.
Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.”
— Acts 20:29–30 (KJV)
Notice—they don’t always snarl. Sometimes they come polished, calm, even “biblical,” but the test is whether they uphold the full gospel of grace in Christ alone (Galatians 1:6–9).
Wolves don’t always snarl — sometimes they smile and quote Scripture. But you’ll know them by whether they exalt Christ’s finished work or add to it.
Grace and Peace
HEY FOLKS, OUCH is SHARING HIS WORD PEOPLE SHOULD LOOK AT IT, NOT ME.
So you're going to stick with you personal believes and just because I will not follow you, your angry.
FYI, JESUS IS GOD, so glad I can say today without being burned at the stake.
Please don't tell me what the so called "oneness Pentecostal" is the only ones who follow JESUS and HIS WORD?
All I can do is share HIS word, not all will see.
TELL ME WHAT WERE THESE PEOPLE MISSING, AS JESUS SENT THEM TO HELL?
Matthew 7,
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.
26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
28 And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine:
29 For he taught them as one having authority, and not as the scribes.
NOTICE HE SPEAKS OF FOUNDATION AFTER HE SENDS THEM TO HELL.
You HAVE NO FOUNDATION, BEST OF LUCK.
OUCH is doubling down on emotion and authority, not Scripture in context. What he’s “up to” here is shifting the conversation from biblical interpretation to personal accusation—suggesting that if you disagree with his view, you lack “foundation” or humility.
What He’s Actually Doing:
- Deflection through accusation
He sidesteps my point about Oneness theology and reframes it as if you’re “angry” or attacking him personally. That’s a rhetorical tactic to avoid dealing with the doctrine itself. - Misuse of Matthew 7
He quotes Jesus’ warning about false professors (“Lord, Lord”) but applies it to me—implying that anyone who doesn’t hold his Acts 2:38 formula is condemned.
The passage, though, condemns works-based righteousness.
“Many will say… have we not done many wonderful works?”
Jesus rejects them because they trusted their works, not because they failed a baptism formula. Ironically, this passage rebukes his own view. - Claim of exclusive truth
He implies that his group alone “has foundation.” That’s a red flag for sectarian or cult-like thinking: “We alone are the true church.”
Jesus says the wise man builds on His words—not on our deeds or rituals.
The foundation is Christ Himself (1 Cor 3:11).
You’re right that Jesus is God—that’s the beautiful truth of the Trinity, not a denial of the Father or Spirit.
But the same Bible teaches that salvation is by grace through faith, not of works (Eph 2:8-9).
The ones Jesus never knew in Matthew 7 were those who boasted, “Have we not done many works?”
They built on sand—their own efforts—instead of the solid rock of His finished work on the cross.
I’m not angry at all; I’m thankful for God’s mercy, insight and wisdom ..
Let’s both keep Christ, not our performance, as the cornerstone.
Grace and Peace
Jesus warned plainly:
“Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.”
— Matthew 7:15 (KJV)
And Paul said:
“For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.
Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.”
— Acts 20:29–30 (KJV)
Notice—they don’t always snarl. Sometimes they come polished, calm, even “biblical,” but the test is whether they uphold the full gospel of grace in Christ alone (Galatians 1:6–9).
Wolves don’t always snarl — sometimes they smile and quote Scripture. But you’ll know them by whether they exalt Christ’s finished work or add to it.
Grace and Peace
“Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.”
— Matthew 7:15 (KJV)
And Paul said:
“For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.
Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.”
— Acts 20:29–30 (KJV)
Notice—they don’t always snarl. Sometimes they come polished, calm, even “biblical,” but the test is whether they uphold the full gospel of grace in Christ alone (Galatians 1:6–9).
Wolves don’t always snarl — sometimes they smile and quote Scripture. But you’ll know them by whether they exalt Christ’s finished work or add to it.
Grace and Peace
What ouch is really doing is pointing out scripture.
Image the foke in Matthew working for JESUS maybe their whole like casting out demons, healing people and HIM telling them I NEVER KNEW YOU.
What were they missing if JESUS NEVER KNEW THEM?
Summary:
the message of faith and repentance was the same, but the covenantal setting was different.
Before the cross, Israel was still under the Law (Galatians 4:4–5). The Gospel of the Kingdom called them to faith in their Messiah, but they were still bound to the Mosaic system — circumcision, temple worship, and sacrifices — until the ultimate sacrifice was offered:
“For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.” — Hebrews 10:4“But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God.” — Hebrews 10:12
When Jesus died and rose again, the Law was fulfilled and completed in Him (Matthew 5:17; Romans 10:4). That’s when the Gospel of Grace was fully revealed — salvation by faith in Christ apart from the works of the Law, now offered equally to Jew and Gentile (Ephesians 2:14–16; Galatians 3:28).
In short:
The message of salvation has always been by faith in God’s promise.
Can you please clarify what you mean. The law that you quoted was the sacrificial system which I agree is the law that ended as it always pointed to Christ.
But when you say Christ freed us from the law, are you saying Christ freed us from the Law that says to only worship God and not steal from our neighbor.
We are saved by grace through faith, but does faith void the voice of God and His law or establish it? Rom3:31 Luke 6:46
Just curious if this is from your own Bible study or if you are using AI. Thanks.
What I am talking about would be like Noah and Abraham "inspired" to lead men astray with false doctrine.
Mormons would fit progressive revelation in false doctrine.
You know better than that. Christ said to love our neighbors, which precludes stealing from them
Thats, good, the poster said we were freed from the law, why I asked for clarification.
We should not forget the greatest commandment either to love God with all our heart, soul and mind which would not include worshipping another god or breaking any of God's commandments or Testimony.
In Acts the last chapter, it says twice, that Paul preached the gospel of the kingdom.Summary:
The Gospel of the Kingdom was preached while Israel was still under the Law — so circumcision continued.
The Gospel of Grace came after the cross — when Jesus fulfilled the Law, making circumcision no longer required.
Grace and Peace
Summary:
In short:
- The Gospel of the Kingdom was proclaimed while Israel was still under the Law. During that period, circumcision and other covenant signs were still observed.
- After the cross and resurrection, Jesus fulfilled the Law completely (Romans 10:4; Galatians 3:24–25).
- From that point forward, the Gospel of Grace extended to both Jew and Gentile alike — with no distinction in how anyone is saved. Salvation is now by grace through faith in Christ alone (Ephesians 2:8–9), apart from the works of the Law or rituals like circumcision.
Yes — after the crucifixion, the Gospel of Grace envelops both Jew and Gentile into one body, the Church.
“For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles.” — 1 Corinthians 12:13
the message of faith and repentance was the same, but the covenantal setting was different.
Before the cross, Israel was still under the Law (Galatians 4:4–5). The Gospel of the Kingdom called them to faith in their Messiah, but they were still bound to the Mosaic system — circumcision, temple worship, and sacrifices — until the ultimate sacrifice was offered:
“For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.” — Hebrews 10:4“But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God.” — Hebrews 10:12
When Jesus died and rose again, the Law was fulfilled and completed in Him (Matthew 5:17; Romans 10:4). That’s when the Gospel of Grace was fully revealed — salvation by faith in Christ apart from the works of the Law, now offered equally to Jew and Gentile (Ephesians 2:14–16; Galatians 3:28).
In short:
It’s one gospel revealed in two phases of God’s redemptive plan — not two different messages of salvation.
it’s not two gospels.
Before the cross, the same message of faith pointed forward to what Christ would accomplish. After the cross, that same message points back to what He already accomplished.
“For by grace are ye saved through faith…” — Ephesians 2:8“For what the law could not do… God sending his own Son… condemned sin in the flesh.” — Romans 8:3
Under the Law, believers trusted God’s promise of redemption — though the sacrifice hadn’t yet been made. Once Jesus became the Lamb of God who taketh away the sin of the world (John 1:29), that promise was fulfilled, and the Law’s purpose was completed (Galatians 3:24–25).
So yes — the people before the cross were still under the Law, but the saving message was always centered on faith in God’s provision, now fully revealed through Christ.
Grace and Peace
Says it twice.
The law is part of the gospel message. Sin is breaking God's laws 1John3:4 James2:11
Mark 1:15 and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe in the gospel.”
We are to repent from sin (breaking God's law1John3:4) and repent means not to continue in that path of disobedience but turn from, a change of heart, change of direction walking in new life in Christ Rom 6:1-4 John 15:4-10
This is the everlasting gospel, repent and turn from sin, and worship God, the only God who has the power to Create Exo20:11 the only God who has the power to Sanctify us Eze 20:12 we need to get back and worship this God.
Rev 14:6 Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach to those who dwell on the earth—to every nation, tribe, tongue, and people— 7 saying with a loud voice, “Fear God and give glory to Him, for the hour of His judgment has come; and worship Him who made heaven and earth, the sea and springs of water.”
Mark 1:15 and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe in the gospel.”
We are to repent from sin (breaking God's law1John3:4) and repent means not to continue in that path of disobedience but turn from, a change of heart, change of direction walking in new life in Christ Rom 6:1-4 John 15:4-10
This is the everlasting gospel, repent and turn from sin, and worship God, the only God who has the power to Create Exo20:11 the only God who has the power to Sanctify us Eze 20:12 we need to get back and worship this God.
Rev 14:6 Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach to those who dwell on the earth—to every nation, tribe, tongue, and people— 7 saying with a loud voice, “Fear God and give glory to Him, for the hour of His judgment has come; and worship Him who made heaven and earth, the sea and springs of water.”
But we must let Scripture interpret Scripture.
Acts 28:23 (KJV)
“And when they had appointed him a day, there came many to him into his lodging; to whom he expounded and testified the kingdom of God, persuading them concerning Jesus, both out of the law of Moses, and out of the prophets, from morning till evening.”
Acts 28:31 (KJV)“Preaching the kingdom of God, and teaching those things which concern the Lord Jesus Christ, with all confidence, no man forbidding him.”
So yes — it does mention “the kingdom of God” twice in that final chapter.
But notice carefully what Luke (the writer) emphasizes:
Paul’s message: He was still preaching the kingdom of God, but always through Christ — “concerning Jesus” (v.23) and “those things which concern the Lord Jesus Christ” (v.31).
This shows continuity, not a different gospel. The “gospel of the kingdom” Paul preached was the same good news about Jesus’ lordship and salvation, now revealed in full after the resurrection.
In Acts 28:
- “Kingdom of God” = God’s reign through Christ.
- Paul’s “gospel of grace” = the same message, showing how God’s kingdom has come through Jesus’ death, resurrection, and exaltation.
- The repetition at the end of Acts underscores that the kingdom message never stopped—it simply became fully centered on the risen Christ.
There are two key ways Paul’s message is described in Acts:
- “The gospel of the grace of God”
Acts 20:24 (KJV)
“But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God.” - “The kingdom of God”
Acts 28:23, 31 (KJV)
“He expounded and testified the kingdom of God…”
“Preaching the kingdom of God, and teaching those things which concern the Lord Jesus Christ…”
Step 2: Not Two Different Gospels — But Two Angles of One Message
These aren’t two separate gospels (as some ultra-dispensationalists teach).
They are two descriptions of the same gospel, from two different perspectives:
Phrase Focus Meaning Gospel of the grace of GodHow salvation enters the individualGod’s free gift of salvation through faith in Christ’s finished work (Ephesians 2:8–9)Gospel of the kingdom of GodHow God’s rule spreads in the worldThe reign of Christ over all who receive Him by faith and live under His lordship
Paul preached the same Christ-centered message — grace brings you into the kingdom, and the kingdom is the sphere where that grace reigns.
Step 3: The Kingdom and Grace Unified
Paul actually ties these two together himself:
“Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son, in whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins.”
— Colossians 1:13–14 (KJV)
So...
- Grace (forgiveness through His blood)
- Kingdom (our new citizenship under Christ’s reign)
So when Acts ends by saying Paul was preaching “the kingdom of God”, it’s not a shift in message — it’s the culmination of the gospel he’d preached all along.
Step 4: Why Acts Ends That Way
Luke closes Acts (28:31) by showing:
- Paul’s mission was still advancing (“no man forbidding him”)
- The gospel of grace = the kingdom of God advancing through the church
- It’s an open-ended ending — the kingdom still grows today wherever Christ is proclaimed.
The gospel of the grace of God (Acts 20:24)
= the gospel of the kingdom of God (Acts 28:31)
because the King reigns by grace and grace brings you under His reign.
Grace and Peace
Hyperpaulines diminish Jesus, James, John and Peter for supposedly preaching the law.
They claim only Paul preached the true gospel.
They claim Jesus preached the gospel of the kingdom, but Paul preached the gospel of grace.
And yet we see Paul preaching the gospel of the kingdom in Acts the last chapter.
What that is, is the Holy Spirit intercepting a perceived error, by future hyperpaulines, and through truth, exposing error by declaring truth.
It is comical, the fickleness of mens doctrines.
You're just trying to sneak in the law of Moses to replace the law of Christ, which supersedes and replaces the law of Moses.