Netanyahu

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

I believe what you have written here ^ is contrary to all of the biblical evidence stating otherwise (regarding "us" / "the Church WHICH IS HIS BODY"... and "our Rapture [/ SNATCH; G726]"... which pertains SOLELY TO "the Church WHICH IS HIS BODY" and not to all other saints of all OTHER time-periods: not to OT saints, not to Trib saints, not to MK saints... none of whom were promised "rapture [/SNATCH; G726]" )

I get it. You don't want to go through the great tribulation. No one wants to. I don't even. But I'd rather not stick my head in the sand and fantasize that God is going to physically take us out of harm's way before the antichrist become the one-world ruler. That's not what the plain reading of the Bible says. You don't even need to study ancient Greek or any of the other original Bible languages, no need for a particular translation even - they all say the same thing: That the Lord Jesus is going to pick us up AFTER the great tribulation.

Why fantasize about pre-trib rapture that isn't going to happen, when you should be building up your faith to be able to endure. If you do that, God will keep your saving faith intact and not fall away to take the mark of the beast.

Anyway, just please prepare - go ahead and fantasize about pre-trib all you want, but please prepare for post-trib. Please cover all your bases. You will not regret doing so.


🎂

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

But I'd rather not stick my head in the sand and fantasize that God is going to physically take us out of harm's way before the antichrist become the one-world ruler. That's not what the plain reading of the Bible says.

2 Thessalonians 2 verses 1 & 2 DOES plainly state it.

It's just that many teachers completely CONFLATE what is being stated in these two verses (verse 1 and verse 2), and thus misconstrue what it is that Paul is actually conveying here (basically because they do not grasp what it is that the "false claim" IS ABOUT in verse 2 that Paul is cautioning the Thessalonians regarding... so they inadvertently EQUATE the two [the Subjects in v. 1 and in v.2], and thus come up with an incorrect idea about Paul's point here, which is unfortunate)

no need for a particular translation even - they all say the same thing: That the Lord Jesus is going to pick us up AFTER the great tribulation.

Well, for one thing, Matthew 24:29-31 = Isaiah 27:9,12-13 [/Romans 11:27]<--and "WHO" are those verses ABOUT? ("Israel" who has been JUDICIALLY "SCATTERED" [not to mention, of "WHOM" the time-prophecy of Dan9:24-27 SPECIFICALLY PERTAINS!!])...

...and THAT is about ISRAEL (the believing remnant of ISRAEL / the 'elect' of ISRAEL [after they are SAVED in the Trib yrs]) being gathered ("one by one") into ONE PLACE upon the earth (TO JERUSALEM; Compare "GREAT" trumpet, in these two passages); It has ZERO to do with "our SNATCH [/rapture G726]"


Up to the time Jesus spoken His Olivet Discourse (and INCLUDING it), Jesus had NOT YET spoken ANYTHING regarding the Subject of "our Rapture"--In and throughout His Olivet Discourse (except for about 12-15 verses about the 70ad events, in Lk21:12-24a.b and Mt24:2 / Mk13:2 / Lk21:6), Jesus was covering the Subject of His Second Coming TO THE EARTH (FOR the promised and prophesied EARTHLY Millennial Kingdom age, and the limited time-period which precedes and LEADS UP to THAT), in response to their Q re: "the end [singular] of the age [singular]" which question was BASED ON what He had ALREADY spoken to them about in Matthew 13:24,30,39,40,49-50
(... re: "the end [singular] of the age [singular]" and what they already know FOLLOWS that, per Jesus' words in the previous chpt to that, about "the age [SINGULAR] to come" [aka the earthly MK age, commencing upon His "RETURN" to the earth--For example COMPARE the PARALLEL passages: Lk12:36,37-38,40,42-44 "when he will RETURN FROM the wedding"... THEN "the meal [G347]" with its PARALLEL passage in the Olivet Discourse Matthew 24:42-51... These are ALL ABOUT "His Second Coming TO THE EARTH"])

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

^ and another common misunderstanding is the idea that the "10 Virgins" parable (Matt25:1-13) is supposedly conveying who it is that Jesus is coming with the PURPOSE of "MARRYING" (and the "5 Virgins" are the WISE).


But this passage is NOT about whom it is He is "MARRYING".


This is about "10 [or 5] VirginS [PLURAL]"... like what we today call "bridemaidS" (NOT "the Bride [SINGULAR]"!!);

and about "the wedding-FEAST/SUPPER [earthly MK age]" (NOT "the MARRIAGE" itself, which pertains solely to "the Bride/Wife [SINGULAR]")







[COMPARE with Psalm 45 and the phrase found there: "the virgins [PLURAL] her companions that follow her" -

https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/psa/45/14/t_concl_523014 - See the LXX where the word "virgins [G3933; plural]" is used ]





Bottom line: the "Bride / Wife [SINGULAR]" is NOT the "10 [or even 5] virginS [PLURAL]"

 

[BOY]

You need to stop being jealous or envious toward them. There's no reason for it. God loves all His people both Jews and Gentiles equally in the same amounts.

God did promise that He will protect us too:

Revelation 3:10 Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come on the whole world to test the inhabitants of the earth.

Pre-tribbers think that God will just whisk us physically away to safety, but this promise given to the church at Philadelphia actually went through severe persecution with no physical rescue whatsoever. So what was actually promised is that if they endured, God will keep their saving faith intact. Eleven of them were martyred and none of them fell away from the faith. After all, that is the most important thing to God to have our saving faith intact, not our physical bodies.

So that's how God chooses to protect the rest of us. It's not any less than what God wants to do for the 144,000. Their protection just looks more spectacular and special is all, but that shouldn't matter. The fact that a gentile Christian still remains with the Lord despite the loss of all things and receive execution will glorify God and draw some unbelievers to get saved. It is also a testimony to the world so when they are judged by the Lord, they can't say they were innocent.





That isn't true. The Holy Spirit is our seal! Remember, the Lord collects His people AFTER the tribulation but before God commences His wrath on His enemies. That is the post-trib stance.

If the 144,000 are still here during God's wrath, it's a good reason for God to place His seal on them.





I'm not the only one who sees it this way. Many people godlier then me, with more knowledgeable authority also see it as physical too. Oftentimes if people spiritualize a thing in the Bible, it's because they don't want to accept it as physical. Like with the mark of the beast for example. That spiritualized belief can hurt them in the end if they don't recognize the actual mark of the beast when it's enforced.

However, can spiritualizing away the 144,000 hurt one? I don't think so. I'm not even sure if you'll actually meet the 144,000 in this age. However, you WILL see them definitely after this age when this whole ordeal is over. So be nice to them!


🐸

It's got nothing to do with being envious or jealous. It's all about the doctrine. but you can put it into the physical realm if you like.

Jesus changed the name of the disciples and left. their old names behind.

It opened up for everyone. and moved into the spiritual realm. and spiritually we became God's people. And as for the comparison of. the mark of the beast, obviously. that is physical in the. hand in the forehead. can't buy or sell. Of course it's. physical. So that's no comparison..
I think the 144,000 Christians. of any nationality because we're all grafted in.

and that's me delivered my soul. I have done my job. I have done what the Lord put on my heart. And that's all it counts. You can take it however you like. It's not my business.

PS 144000 are not Here for the vale wrath. We all go at the same time.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

I think the 144,000 Christians. of any nationality because we're all grafted in.

Then who are the "a great multitude... OF ALL THE NATIONS" v.9 (who are shown "coming out of GREAT tribulation [the SECOND HALF]" v.14)... chopped liver?!


(lol)

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

It's got nothing to do with being envious or jealous. It's all about the doctrine. but you can put it into the physical realm if you like.

Jesus changed the name of the disciples and left. their old names behind.

It opened up for everyone. and moved into the spiritual realm. and spiritually we became God's people. And as for the comparison of. the mark of the beast, obviously. that is physical in the. hand in the forehead. can't buy or sell. Of course it's. physical. So that's no comparison..
I think the 144,000 Christians. of any nationality because we're all grafted in.

and that's me delivered my soul. I have done my job. I have done what the Lord put on my heart. And that's all it counts. You can take it however you like. It's not my business.

PS 144000 are not Here for the vale wrath. We all go at the same time.

I'm glad you are pouring your heart out for everyone to see.

But nowhere does it say in the Bible that it is 144,000 Christians of any nationality. God was very specific about them being Jewish. You're not arguing with me - you're arguing with God. You really can't do anything about it anyway. It will happen the way God wants. You'll just have to accept that they're Jewish and you can't be a part of that group. Everyone else has. 🤷‍♀️


You also said:

and that's me delivered my soul. I have done my job. I have done what the Lord put on my heart. And that's all it counts. You can take it however you like. It's not my business.

How did you deliver your soul? What job did you do? What have you done that the Lord put on your heart?

I'm starting to agree with @cv5 very much!


🎂

 

[BOY]

I'm glad you are pouring your heart out for everyone to see.

But nowhere does it say in the Bible that it is 144,000 Christians of any nationality. God was very specific about them being Jewish. You're not arguing with me - you're arguing with God. You really can't do anything about it anyway. It will happen the way God wants. You'll just have to accept that they're Jewish and you can't be a part of that group. Everyone else has. 🤷‍♀️


You also said:



How did you deliver your soul? What job did you do? What have you done that the Lord put on your heart?

I'm starting to agree with @cv5 very much!


🎂

Yes, they are Jewish and who. do you think you are grafted into?

I don't want to argue with you. I just. stated how I see it. not arguing with God That is silly. And I'm not arguing with you. You see the 144,000 being Jews of the flesh. I see the 144,000 being and Jews of the spirit.

And God's people of. all nations. formed into one nation. Spiritual Israel.

I have delivered my soul.
Or I have preached the gospel.
Or. I feed His sheep
Or I have warned the wicked of their wicked ways.
Or I have done what the Lord has told me to do.. That's what it means. an old saying back in the 70s. Take your pic

Now I'd like to move on to your other post. I'll find it and bring it up.

 

[daisyseesthesun]

Yes, they are Jewish and who. do you think you are grafted into?

I don't want to argue with you. I just. stated how I see it. not arguing with God That is silly. And I'm not arguing with you. You see the 144,000 being Jews of the flesh. I see the 144,000 being and Jews of the spirit.

And God's people of. all nations. formed into one nation. Spiritual Israel.

I have delivered my soul.
Or I have preached the gospel.
Or. I feed His sheep
Or I have warned the wicked of their wicked ways.
Or I have done what the Lord has told me to do.. That's what it means. an old saying back in the 70s. Take your pic

Now I'd like to move on to your other post. I'll find it and bring it up.

Boy, what is you interpretation of Revelation 11:1-2 then?

 

[BOY]

You need to stop being jealous or envious toward them. There's no reason for it. God loves all His people both Jews and Gentiles equally in the same amounts.

God did promise that He will protect us too:

Revelation 3:10 Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come on the whole world to test the inhabitants of the earth.

Pre-tribbers think that God will just whisk us physically away to safety, but this promise given to the church at Philadelphia actually went through severe persecution with no physical rescue whatsoever. So what was actually promised is that if they endured, God will keep their saving faith intact. Eleven of them were martyred and none of them fell away from the faith. After all, that is the most important thing to God to have our saving faith intact, not our physical bodies.

So that's how God chooses to protect the rest of us. It's not any less than what God wants to do for the 144,000. Their protection just looks more spectacular and special is all, but that shouldn't matter. The fact that a gentile Christian still remains with the Lord despite the loss of all things and receive execution will glorify God and draw some unbelievers to get saved. It is also a testimony to the world so when they are judged by the Lord, they can't say they were innocent.





That isn't true. The Holy Spirit is our seal! Remember, the Lord collects His people AFTER the tribulation but before God commences His wrath on His enemies. That is the post-trib stance.

If the 144,000 are still here during God's wrath, it's a good reason for God to place His seal on them.





I'm not the only one who sees it this way. Many people godlier then me, with more knowledgeable authority also see it as physical too. Oftentimes if people spiritualize a thing in the Bible, it's because they don't want to accept it as physical. Like with the mark of the beast for example. That spiritualized belief can hurt them in the end if they don't recognize the actual mark of the beast when it's enforced.

However, can spiritualizing away the 144,000 hurt one? I don't think so. I'm not even sure if you'll actually meet the 144,000 in this age. However, you WILL see them definitely after this age when this whole ordeal is over. So be nice to them!


🐸

4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.

It's pretty Pacific. I would like to hang around one of these 144,000 During the tribulation because they're protected for sure. They're the ones that listen to God. or have been listening to God. They're the ones that have been obedient and followed the lamb wherever he goes, the servants of our God . And they are the ones that have been rewarded. with the seal of protection from the wrath That God reigns down upon the wicked. I'm talking about the trumpets. They are the elect of God.

And I'd like to hang about one of them. Because under their shadow I'd feel safer. because his pretty Pacific that only those men that have the seal of God in their forehead are protected from the wrath.

Now, the Antichrist is a different ball game. He is going to be trying to kill us. We can flee like the woman in revelation12. And if we've got the faith, he will provide. And do we have the faith enough to be beheaded.

Now, somewhere, you said. the 144,000 go through the wrath. Are you talking about the vials? And where did you get that from? Point it out in the Bible for me Please. I know that book pretty well.

 

[BOY]

Boy, what is you interpretation of Revelation 11:1-2 then?

Measure the temple. but outside the temple don't bother for its given to the Gentiles.
You'll have to be more specific if you want more. of an answer.

 

[daisyseesthesun]

Measure the temple. but outside the temple don't bother for its given to the Gentiles.
You'll have to be more specific if you want more. of an answer.

11 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.

2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

The counted (jews) and the uncounted (gentiles)

 

[daisyseesthesun]

11 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.

2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months

The counted (jews) and the uncounted (gentiles)

Boy that's so direct even a child could understand it.

 

[BOY]

Boy that's so direct even a child could understand it.

Ok then

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

Now, the Antichrist is a different ball game. He is going to be trying to kill us. We can flee like the woman in revelation12. And if we've got the faith, he will provide. And do we have the faith enough to be beheaded.

You can always ask God what will happen to you. Sometimes, if God thinks it would be good for you to know to prepare you for what's to come, He will tell you. I already know I will die, but I'm fine with that. With studying what will happen in the great tribulation, I don't really care to be one of the people who are "alive and remain" all the way to the end when the Lord Jesus comes back.

Oh and this is something I've always wondered: Why beheadings? Aren't there more efficient means of execution like in the Holocaust where they gassed everyone?

Now, somewhere, you said. the 144,000 go through the wrath. Are you talking about the vials? And where did you get that from? Point it out in the Bible for me Please. I know that book pretty well.

The God's wrath portion of the end times is still unclear and confusing to me when I try to read those parts. But maybe this is why God sent you my way? I'm not sure when wrath happens. All I know is that the Lord will come back for us after the tribulation. Some people say we may see some of God's wrath falling on His enemies (but we won't experience this ourselves) before the Lord return. And then there are some who say that we won't. The Lord will collect us after the tribulation but before God's wrath begins. So you can explain it to me if you like!


🎂

 

[BOY]

You can always ask God what will happen to you. Sometimes, if God thinks it would be good for you to know to prepare you for what's to come, He will tell you. I already know I will die, but I'm fine with that. With studying what will happen in the great tribulation, I don't really care to be one of the people who are "alive and remain" all the way to the end when the Lord Jesus comes back.

Oh and this is something I've always wondered: Why beheadings? Aren't there more efficient means of execution like in the Holocaust where they gassed everyone?




The God's wrath portion of the end times is still unclear and confusing to me when I try to read those parts. But maybe this is why God sent you my way? I'm not sure when wrath happens. All I know is that the Lord will come back for us after the tribulation. Some people say we may see some of God's wrath falling on His enemies (but we won't experience this ourselves) before the Lord return. And then there are some who say that we won't. The Lord will collect us after the tribulation but before God's wrath begins. So you can explain it to me if you like!


🎂

Revelation 20:4
“And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

That is so weird that you bring that up. God gave me this verse many years ago.
Rev3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

It was in 1983. and my heart was very much broken. as broken as one can be. and I heard this verse in my head. and I have had many different thoughts about it. as you could imagine,

And as for the wrath bit you can. read it for yourself The trumpet wrath we are here for and we leave on the last trumpet. Then the 7 vials are poured out upon the wicked. that are gathering themselves together, for the battle at Armageddon. We are not here for that nor. is anybody else that belongs to God?

Believe it or not.
I. think you are one of God's best. and the Holy Spirit will teach you.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

That is so weird that you bring that up. God gave me this verse many years ago.
Rev3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

It was in 1983. and my heart was very much broken. as broken as one can be. and I heard this verse in my head. and I have had many different thoughts about it. as you could imagine,

So that means you'll make through alive to the end? That's going to be a real adventure for sure! I can't wait to find out how God keeps you through it! That will be after this age ends of course.

And as for the wrath bit you can. read it for yourself The trumpet wrath we are here for and we leave on the last trumpet. Then the 7 vials are poured out upon the wicked. that are gathering themselves together, for the battle at Armageddon. We are not here for that nor. is anybody else that belongs to God?

Ah okay, I will try to read the pertinent Revelation chapters over! Sooner or later God will help me to understand it!

Believe it or not.
I. think you are one of God's best. and the Holy Spirit will teach you.

I'm really NOT one of God's best. And I'm not just being humble. That is the truth. And yes, I desperately need the Holy Spirit to keep teaching me. I still have a long way to go!


🎂

 

[BOY]

So that means you'll make through alive to the end? That's going to be a real adventure for sure! I can't wait to find out how God keeps you through it! That will be after this age ends of course.




Ah okay, I will try to read the pertinent Revelation chapters over! Sooner or later God will help me to understand it!




I'm really NOT one of God's best. And I'm not just being humble. That is the truth. And yes, I desperately need the Holy Spirit to keep teaching me. I still have a long way to go!


🎂

That's one way of looking at it living until the end. I hope that's true. But another way of looking at it is I will be dead before. the Great Tribulation. I am getting old and I am not well. but we will see

It's a hard one but so excited. No matter which way it goes. I love to think I would make it to the end. That's the kind of faith I have. for God to supply all my needs. and I mean all my needs. Just like he did with Jesus and. the disciples. we will be forced. to have that kind of faith. Maybe forced is kind of a strong word. but you get the drift. No money, no job, not allowed to buy or sell and People trying to kill you lol.


He is strong when you are weak
I think you are I. watched you on Christian chat for a long time before I joined. A couple of other people stuck out. too