Does anyone know of....
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Yes, true of all those who blather on about free will which is NOWHERE taught in the Bible.
By the way, I am still awaiting that apology from you. Or are you the hypocrite I believe you to be, expecting acknowledgements of wrongdoing, admissions of error, gratitude for correction, and apologies from others when they are corrected by you but refusing to extend that which you desire from others to them when appropriate? Because in my many years here, I have corrected you more times than I can count, and not once in any of those situations, some where you outright denied that Scripture said something it explicitly did, or blatantly falsely accused me of something I did not do or say, did you ever acknowledge you were wrong, express gratitude for correction, withdraw your false accusation or tender an apology. Nothing even close. You just run away as if nothing happened, just like now.
Does anyone know of.... - Christian Chat Rooms & Forums
By the way, I am still awaiting that apology from you. Or are you the hypocrite I believe you to be, expecting acknowledgements of wrongdoing, admissions of error, gratitude for correction, and apologies from others when they are corrected by you but refusing to extend that which you desire from others to them when appropriate? Because in my many years here, I have corrected you more times than I can count, and not once in any of those situations, some where you outright denied that Scripture said something it explicitly did, or blatantly falsely accused me of something I did not do or say, did you ever acknowledge you were wrong, express gratitude for correction, withdraw your false accusation or tender an apology. Nothing even close. You just run away as if nothing happened, just like now.
Does anyone know of.... - Christian Chat Rooms & Forums
Do you really think these texts cannot be deReformed.
Who is his audience?
What is meaning of this statement in context of the dialogue.
Is there a progression pre and post Calvary in how God is working in those around Jesus to bring about His divine plan of redemption.
What was the thinking of the Jews at the time towards Jesus.
Is this about the plan of salvation for all mankind for all time, (progression) or for those at the time so that He could fulfill His mission here on earth.
Tiresome indeed.
Traditional, biblical, reality based (non-Reformed) soteriology is coherent and consistent.
Who is his audience?
What is meaning of this statement in context of the dialogue.
Is there a progression pre and post Calvary in how God is working in those around Jesus to bring about His divine plan of redemption.
What was the thinking of the Jews at the time towards Jesus.
Is this about the plan of salvation for all mankind for all time, (progression) or for those at the time so that He could fulfill His mission here on earth.
Tiresome indeed.
Traditional, biblical, reality based (non-Reformed) soteriology is coherent and consistent.
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That is one of the poorest and most pathetic explanations of Scripture I've ever seen and is contradictory because the natural mind is UNABLE to submit and the saved person has already submitted. It's almost shocking how blind you are to your error. Almost. Why don't you just accept what Scripture says instead of twisting it to suit your unbiblical ear tickling doctrines???
“Consider that those who are wailing and gnashing teeth do not consider it good news to discover they were wrong all along.”
the news is good for every mortal
“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
John 5:24 KJV
It doesn’t change the good news because some reject it and receive the damnation in it does it ?
Does this make the word bad ?
“He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.”
John 12:48 KJV
It’s this same word
He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
The news is good.
“Do you think it much different for a person who is opposed to God to find out they were wrong?”
i dont understand what your asking sister.
“The LORD looked down from heaven upon the children of men, To see if there were any that did understand, And seek God. They are all gone aside, they are all together become filthy: There is none that doeth good, no, not one.”
Psalm 14:2-3 KJV
We we’re all Opposed to God until we repented and believed
“wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.”
Ephesians 2:2-3 KJV
“And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled”
Colossians 1:21 KJV
We were all at one time opposed to god we sort of need to inderersnd tbat or we won’t ever repent and let his words change our mind and heart .
“Some may submit readily, or in relief, after God has done His work in them. Others? Not so much.”
ye I think I agree I’d say tbis that God is being patient with mankind hoping we will listen to him believe and repent before it’s too late
“The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.”
2 Peter 3:9 KJV
“Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?
Romans 2:4 KJV
“BUT... afterwards? Extremely grateful that God rescued them. “
indeed paul comes to mind actually became a dedicated follower of Jesus after.
“Although some call it being kidnapped against their will and say God is a tyrant for acting unilaterally.
I mean... how dare He take possession of that which is His???”
yeah I don’t believe god acts against man’s free Will I believe he heals thier Will through the gospel changing it from sin to righteousness if they don’t reject his word
i don’t think what you said really equates to a kidnapping lol god works on us . So we will start acting right ourselves because we’re grateful and have actually heard and believed what he really is saying to us in the gospel what he said is what’s going to actually come to pass.
Do you notice a theme sister
At creation
“And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food;
the tree of life also in the midst of the garden,
and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
And the LORD God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it. And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.”
Genesis 2:9, 15-17 KJV
under the law
“I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:”
Deuteronomy 30:19 KJV
after Jesus fuflilled the law
“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;
but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
Mark 16:15-16
God doesn’t change we have to he always gives us a choice always offers us a way out
the news is good for every mortal
“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
John 5:24 KJV
It doesn’t change the good news because some reject it and receive the damnation in it does it ?
Does this make the word bad ?
“He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.”
John 12:48 KJV
It’s this same word
He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
The news is good.
“Do you think it much different for a person who is opposed to God to find out they were wrong?”
i dont understand what your asking sister.
“The LORD looked down from heaven upon the children of men, To see if there were any that did understand, And seek God. They are all gone aside, they are all together become filthy: There is none that doeth good, no, not one.”
Psalm 14:2-3 KJV
We we’re all Opposed to God until we repented and believed
“wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.”
Ephesians 2:2-3 KJV
“And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled”
Colossians 1:21 KJV
We were all at one time opposed to god we sort of need to inderersnd tbat or we won’t ever repent and let his words change our mind and heart .
“Some may submit readily, or in relief, after God has done His work in them. Others? Not so much.”
ye I think I agree I’d say tbis that God is being patient with mankind hoping we will listen to him believe and repent before it’s too late
“The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.”
2 Peter 3:9 KJV
“Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?
Romans 2:4 KJV
“BUT... afterwards? Extremely grateful that God rescued them. “
indeed paul comes to mind actually became a dedicated follower of Jesus after.
“Although some call it being kidnapped against their will and say God is a tyrant for acting unilaterally.
I mean... how dare He take possession of that which is His???”
yeah I don’t believe god acts against man’s free Will I believe he heals thier Will through the gospel changing it from sin to righteousness if they don’t reject his word
i don’t think what you said really equates to a kidnapping lol god works on us . So we will start acting right ourselves because we’re grateful and have actually heard and believed what he really is saying to us in the gospel what he said is what’s going to actually come to pass.
Do you notice a theme sister
At creation
“And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food;
the tree of life also in the midst of the garden,
and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
And the LORD God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it. And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.”
Genesis 2:9, 15-17 KJV
under the law
“I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:”
Deuteronomy 30:19 KJV
after Jesus fuflilled the law
“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;
but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
Mark 16:15-16
God doesn’t change we have to he always gives us a choice always offers us a way out
It is good news to those who receive it. To those who don't, it isn't.
God changes us...
No, the message does not change. But are you missing the point? When those who are going to pass into the second death receive the news, it is not good news to them. That is why they are wailing and gnashing their teeth!
Yeah, that is how others have presented it. Others who love to lie and misrepresent what is being said.
They impugn the character of God for acting unilaterally as if He has no right to do so, and never does or should.
Then they make up a slew of falsehoods and claim that is what we believe. Such behaviour is reprehensible.
God changes us...
No, the message does not change. But are you missing the point? When those who are going to pass into the second death receive the news, it is not good news to them. That is why they are wailing and gnashing their teeth!
Yeah, that is how others have presented it. Others who love to lie and misrepresent what is being said.
They impugn the character of God for acting unilaterally as if He has no right to do so, and never does or should.
Then they make up a slew of falsehoods and claim that is what we believe. Such behaviour is reprehensible.
I don't know, maybe "brother" or "sister". Do I have the right to define what you believe before I "teach you" why you're wrong, and if so how does that bring any glory to God? Again how do you KNOW what they believe without asking them any clarifying questions? Since they've so clearly stated it please show me where anyone endorsed Calvin, or any of the teachings of Calvinism. SHOW ME. That's my biggest point, I don't see ANYONE saying "God sends babies to hell", or "we have no choice and are robots", nowhere have I seen anyone teaching the 5 points, or any of the belief "caricatures" that are called out. So please SHOW ME where these comments are since you seem to have seen them so "clearly stated".
What are you doing, showing them they don't really love God right? You seem to be about dividing the body, not building it. What's your goal? Are you the one appointed to get all "Calvinist" in line, and YOU get to say who is and isn't one without a single question asked, or holding a trial?
I have honestly found that in most these matters they tend to be different ways of think about the same thing, and not really even worth arguing about too hard, much less dividing over, but that's what we Christians are best at isn't it? Cutting ourselves up?
I just don't think it's productive for us to sit a bicker about these things with each other when right now in our world we need to do what we are commanded and join together in unity for His glory. They are to know us by our love for EACH OTHER, and I want to be better at this for His sake.
Look I'm not LGBTIIARP++*_ I don't need you to confirm and agree with everything I think, say, and believe. But are you really questioning our salvation over this? I don't think you are and certainly hope not, but do you not believe that we follow Jesus, do you not believe we are being lead by His Spirit to all truth? Do you not trust Him to do it?
Look I am the worlds worst at being divisive within the body, I'm honestly talking to myself more than trying to "tell" anyone else how to be, but I see this country and world, I see the state it's in and I want to "do" something about it. Of course this always leads to thoughts of "what" do we do? Go group up and practice what the 2nd was given for? What do I do as a follower of Christ, born again of His Spirit to proclaim the Good News that Jesus is King, seated on His throne at the right hand of God, given ALL authority in Heaven, and ON EARTH, and He must reign until every enemy has been made a footstool for His feet!
Jesus is the only way, and we must be the body and come together, not stay divided, it shames Jesus to be divisive within the body and I'm sorry for being that way. I really want to try to stop engaging in this kind of pointless bickering myself. I'm actually embarrassed by myself as I write this thinking about how guilty I am of this myself. Dang.
Sorry if that offended you, I meant every word of it, but just see no point at all debating it with you. If you feel God is calling you to come get us non-Calvinist Calvinist, then you better do that with all you are. I think He just called me to do something different than this.
What are you doing, showing them they don't really love God right? You seem to be about dividing the body, not building it. What's your goal? Are you the one appointed to get all "Calvinist" in line, and YOU get to say who is and isn't one without a single question asked, or holding a trial?
I have honestly found that in most these matters they tend to be different ways of think about the same thing, and not really even worth arguing about too hard, much less dividing over, but that's what we Christians are best at isn't it? Cutting ourselves up?
I just don't think it's productive for us to sit a bicker about these things with each other when right now in our world we need to do what we are commanded and join together in unity for His glory. They are to know us by our love for EACH OTHER, and I want to be better at this for His sake.
Look I'm not LGBTIIARP++*_ I don't need you to confirm and agree with everything I think, say, and believe. But are you really questioning our salvation over this? I don't think you are and certainly hope not, but do you not believe that we follow Jesus, do you not believe we are being lead by His Spirit to all truth? Do you not trust Him to do it?
Look I am the worlds worst at being divisive within the body, I'm honestly talking to myself more than trying to "tell" anyone else how to be, but I see this country and world, I see the state it's in and I want to "do" something about it. Of course this always leads to thoughts of "what" do we do? Go group up and practice what the 2nd was given for? What do I do as a follower of Christ, born again of His Spirit to proclaim the Good News that Jesus is King, seated on His throne at the right hand of God, given ALL authority in Heaven, and ON EARTH, and He must reign until every enemy has been made a footstool for His feet!
Jesus is the only way, and we must be the body and come together, not stay divided, it shames Jesus to be divisive within the body and I'm sorry for being that way. I really want to try to stop engaging in this kind of pointless bickering myself. I'm actually embarrassed by myself as I write this thinking about how guilty I am of this myself. Dang.
Sorry if that offended you, I meant every word of it, but just see no point at all debating it with you. If you feel God is calling you to come get us non-Calvinist Calvinist, then you better do that with all you are. I think He just called me to do something different than this.
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no the only thing that must occur is the man has to hear the gospel in order to believe. We can’t believe something we haven’t heard. It’s orwsxhed to everyone because anyone can believe and be saved when they hear it
some won’t , not because god decided they wont and cannot , but because they enjoy the worldly things more than what they are hearing in the gospel
the more of the gospel one hears the more of one’s self the gospel requires
“It is good news to those who receive it. To those who don't, it isn't.”
its good news for anyone who’s mortal the fact that some don’t receive it does. NOt change the nature of what is said life is being offered to those condemned to death
The news doesn’t change based upon if a person accepts it or not. It’s the people that have to change the good news never will
If you tell any mortal how they can live forever it’s good news . Whether they accept it or not is a matter of faith
God changes us...
No, the message does not change. But are you missing the point? When those who are going to pass into the second death receive the news, it is not good news to them. That is why they are wailing and gnashing their teeth!”-
you are trying to base the news on the person receiving its perspective of course a man in hell isn’t going to be happy . The problem isn’t that he received bad news it’s that he rejected the good news
God only changes us if we accept his word sister
If we reject his word we’re never going to change the idea that a person can’t hear good news and choose to believe or reject it is o feel where the flaw in the idea is .
The nt is speaking to those who hears the gospel and believed this is why it says things about God changing us
He does that when we accept the gospel
Its like any information if I hear and believe it’s going to change what I think if I reject the information it’s going to leave me where I was before I heard it
whether I accept this great news of eternal life doesn’t change the news he spoke to mankind it’s good news even if some reject it that doesn’t make an offer of eternal Life bad news it makes thier judgement to come just because they had the same good news offer everyone did
some won’t , not because god decided they wont and cannot , but because they enjoy the worldly things more than what they are hearing in the gospel
the more of the gospel one hears the more of one’s self the gospel requires
“It is good news to those who receive it. To those who don't, it isn't.”
its good news for anyone who’s mortal the fact that some don’t receive it does. NOt change the nature of what is said life is being offered to those condemned to death
The news doesn’t change based upon if a person accepts it or not. It’s the people that have to change the good news never will
If you tell any mortal how they can live forever it’s good news . Whether they accept it or not is a matter of faith
God changes us...
No, the message does not change. But are you missing the point? When those who are going to pass into the second death receive the news, it is not good news to them. That is why they are wailing and gnashing their teeth!”-
you are trying to base the news on the person receiving its perspective of course a man in hell isn’t going to be happy . The problem isn’t that he received bad news it’s that he rejected the good news
God only changes us if we accept his word sister
If we reject his word we’re never going to change the idea that a person can’t hear good news and choose to believe or reject it is o feel where the flaw in the idea is .
The nt is speaking to those who hears the gospel and believed this is why it says things about God changing us
He does that when we accept the gospel
Its like any information if I hear and believe it’s going to change what I think if I reject the information it’s going to leave me where I was before I heard it
whether I accept this great news of eternal life doesn’t change the news he spoke to mankind it’s good news even if some reject it that doesn’t make an offer of eternal Life bad news it makes thier judgement to come just because they had the same good news offer everyone did
“They impugn the character of God for acting unilaterally as if He has no right to do so, and never does or should.”
maybe they read the Bible and see many repetetive examples of God giving man a binary choice between life and death and understsnd God doesn’t make me do evil , then punish me for evil after blaming me for doing evil . But instead maybe just maybe he’s been telling us all along if we don’t stop sinning we’re going to die for sure
In the Bible that’s what he always has done. From Adam to the law to the gospel he places life and death before man and says choose life and live
I simply believe God doesn’t change and that we have to and he came to call us to repentance so we don’t perish
but my only argument is that it’s biblical and pretty plain and simple and repetetive
Gods Will for mankind was accomplished in the life death and resurrection of Christ
We keep waiting for God to do his work in us but he’s saying repent and believe the gospel and follow me so I can do my work in you
This is how believers in Jesus change
“Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
John 8:31-32 KJV
Please, Magenta, define "the will" and "to will" biblically.
Please, ma
Romans 8:6-7
Scripture again and again affirms that the natural man rejects the things of God and is UNABLE to submit.
Please, Magenta, define "the natural man" biblically.
Please, ma
Romans 8:6-7
Scripture again and again affirms that the natural man rejects the things of God and is UNABLE to submit.
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Romans 9:19-21 One of you will say to me, “Then why does God still find fault? For who can resist His will?” But who are you, O man, to talk back to God? Shall what is formed say to Him who formed it, “Why did You make me like this?” Does not the potter have the right to make from the same lump of clay one vessel for special occasions and another for common use?
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That is not always obvious when they blatantly deny what is explicitly said and
instead insert what they want it to say, or assume it says things it does not.
You know very well many of these people deny that death is the end. For them the end
is eternal conscious torment. They repeat the lie of Satan as if it were God's own truth.
instead insert what they want it to say, or assume it says things it does not.
You know very well many of these people deny that death is the end. For them the end
is eternal conscious torment. They repeat the lie of Satan as if it were God's own truth.
I’m not sure who your talking about or what they said but God honors his own word always
He won’t violate what he said. It’s the one thing he can’t do
God can and has done this act as your saying but if you look carefully it’s based upon what he has told mankknd priorly and then what man did in response to what he said to then priorly it’s reactionary to mans state after the fall
“And GOD saw that the wickedness of man ( he looos and sees the state of man ) was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
( this isn’t God acting arbitrarily based on just him seeking like it it’s structured from what was said beforehand to the man )
And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.”
Genesis 6:5-6 KJV
God is all powerful indeed . He declares ahead of time life and death that is immutable the. He informs mankind of his unchangeable sovoreign Will and says “ this path leads to life come and follow me and live …..but this other way leads to certain death . choose life “
His soveriegn power is always and forever in what he has said to us about life and death . Salvation comes when we start accepting what it is he really actually did say will save us .
to simply say God acts as the soveriegn is true . It doesn’t remove his design for mankind though or mean nobody gets to choose the two options he places before them he doesn’t tell us one thing and then do another even though sure zgod can do anything he wants no one’s able to stop him but the Bible tells us what he actually has done and said so we can hear it and believe
We have a part in this we always have and will
He isn’t a dictator he’s trying to save as many of us as will listen
He won’t violate what he said. It’s the one thing he can’t do
God can and has done this act as your saying but if you look carefully it’s based upon what he has told mankknd priorly and then what man did in response to what he said to then priorly it’s reactionary to mans state after the fall
“And GOD saw that the wickedness of man ( he looos and sees the state of man ) was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
( this isn’t God acting arbitrarily based on just him seeking like it it’s structured from what was said beforehand to the man )
And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.”
Genesis 6:5-6 KJV
God is all powerful indeed . He declares ahead of time life and death that is immutable the. He informs mankind of his unchangeable sovoreign Will and says “ this path leads to life come and follow me and live …..but this other way leads to certain death . choose life “
His soveriegn power is always and forever in what he has said to us about life and death . Salvation comes when we start accepting what it is he really actually did say will save us .
to simply say God acts as the soveriegn is true . It doesn’t remove his design for mankind though or mean nobody gets to choose the two options he places before them he doesn’t tell us one thing and then do another even though sure zgod can do anything he wants no one’s able to stop him but the Bible tells us what he actually has done and said so we can hear it and believe
We have a part in this we always have and will
He isn’t a dictator he’s trying to save as many of us as will listen