Because man can understand moral issues even if he doesn't comprehend the spiritual truths that underpin them.
Predestination is misunderstood...
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Because man can understand moral issues even if he doesn't comprehend the spiritual truths that underpin them.
Now you are denying the doctrine of original sin and do you somehow call yourself a Christian?
Are you able to answer the simple question or not?
Does God love those He casts into Hell?
Luk 12:5 But I will show you whom you should fear: Fear Him who, after He has killed, has power to cast into hell; yes, I say to you, fear Him!
I don't agree with this view.
God is not the origin of evil.
Let me give an inappropriate example.
The pleasure of having sex with your wife or husband, This pleasant feeling is the product of God's design.
But the side effect of this pleasure is that someone wants to have sex with anyone.This is the birth of evil.Like a robot out of control.Perhaps this metaphor is not very appropriate.So God made the law.We should act according to his law.Be an obedient robot.
Nor did I say you did. Quite the contrary, in fact. And it was not just knowing you are a sinner, either.
You left off the part about God's love, and knowing you are unworthy.
your a drama queen, you really are.
You can't take advice, and your not able to accept correction.
Will you accept that Jesus saying being wise as serpents may not mean to be wise as satan or not.
Can you do the descent thing and at least admit to this.
Or must you go down the path of no surrender first
You are the most brilliant theologian I ever encountered in a forum...
Satan was cast to down to the earth after his fall in Heaven but still able to come before God as seen in Job 1 as an accuser but when Christ bruised his head at the cross, he then fell like lightning (Luk 10:18) from being an accuser of the brethren again.
Rev 12:9 So the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
Rev_12:10 Then I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, "Now salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ have come, for the accuser of our brethren, who accused them before our God day and night, has been cast down.
Do you believe that God predestined this or was somehow caught by surprise?
That's not what I said. People always argue because man is spiritually dead he can't hear God, but he can hear God on moral issues of right and wrong, good and evil. This is how man can be awakened to his need for God and be drawn by Him to Christ where faith is found.
Then why are you arguing with me? Last I spoke to you you had falsely accused me of saying things I definitely had not.
The Protestant church was uniform in its belief that man after the Fall is in the image of the devil and can only have the image of God restored by grace in Christ as seen from quotes from the 16th century confessions below but I suppose you think they were all deceived and got it completely wrong?
1549 Valdes’s Cathechism
by the disobedience of Adam, he lost the image and likeness of God, and was banished from the earthly paradise. Through the obedience of Christ, he should strive to recover the image and likeness of God
1550 Magdeburg Confession
And since our first parents were now this way after their sin, they did not afterwards beget anyone else than those similar to themselves, in their own image, not in the image of God.
1551 Large Emden Catechism of the Strangers’ Church, London
Indisputably, the image and likeness of God, in which man was created in the beginning, along with all inclinations for good, was lost in him.
1560 Lattanzio Ragnoni’s Formulario
so he fell into utter misery and tragedy, and as for his soul and body (Job 14:1–2), he lost God’s image and was filled with darkness and ignorance
1560 The Scottish Confession
By which transgression, commonly called original sin, was the image of God utterly defaced in man.
1560/61 The Confession of the Spanish Congregation of London
at the same time was marred from the image of God, and all the benefits that make him like God. And from the state of being wise, good, just, truthful, merciful, and holy he was rendered ignorant, evil, impious, a liar, and cruel, clothed in the image and likeness of the devil
1562 Larger Catechism of Zacharias Ursinus
1. Q. What firm comfort do you have in life and in death?
A. That I was created by God in his image for eternal life; and after I willfully lost this in Adam, God, out of infinite and free mercy, took me into his covenant of grace that he might give me by faith, righteousness and eternal life because of the obedience and death of his Son who was sent in the flesh. And that he sealed his covenant in my heart by his Spirit, who renews me in the image of God and cries out in me, “Abba,” Father, by his Word and the visible signs of this covenant.
12. Q. What is this image?
A. A true knowledge of God and the divine will and the inclination and desire of the whole man to live according to God’s will alone.
19. Q. Why are we unable to fulfill it?
A. Because we lost the image of God.
1562 The Hungarian Confessio Catholica
condemned to eternal death on account of sin—as we have all lost the image of God
And if man was to be regenerated, i.e., to be put to death and made alive, everything had to be made new; man had to possess a new heart, a new spirit; to be stripped and rid of the image of Satan, the devil
1567 Documents of the Debrecen Synod
However, grace was satisfied in three ways. First, since the image of God was lost by Adam, it was restored through the image of the infinite God,
by sin have lost the image of God and are deprived of free will and the ability to know, desire and do good
1568 The Synod at Szikszó
because the image of God was lost through sin
1570 The Confession of the Synod of Csenger
and restore the lost image of God
1577 Solid Declaration of the Formula of Concord
That original sin (in human nature) is not only this entire absence of all good in spiritual, divine things, but that, instead of the lost image of God in man, it is at the same time also a deep, wicked, horrible, fathomless, inscrutable, and unspeakable corruption of the entire nature and all its powers
1578 The Nassau (Dillenburger Synod) Confession
just as God initially created and formed man in His image and likeness, so Satan has, as respects substance, imprinted, planted, and formed his very image and likeness in man after the fall of Adam.
1581 Craig’s Catechism
Q. What things did they lose through their fall? (Gen. 3:17)
A. The favor and image of God, with the use of the creatures.
Q. What succeeded the loss of the favor and image of God? (Gen. 3:14)
A. The wrath of God and original sin.
Q. In what did their salvation stand?
A. In the remission of their sin and repairing of God’s image.
Q. What followed upon the repairing of God’s image? (Rom. 7:5)
A. A continual battle both within and without.
Q. From whence does this battle proceed?
A. From the two contrary images in mankind.
Q. What are these images?
A. The image of God and the image of the serpent.
1596 The Second Confession of the London-Amsterdam Church
Yet are all since the fall of Adam begotten in his own likeness after his image (Gen.5:3);
Grace generally simply means unmerited favor. Simply creating someone meets this definition. Providing clothing, food, any possession is grace because every good gift comes from God. The grace that leads to hearing and engenders faith isn't provided to all, but that doesn't preclude other things God gives to all as less than grace.
That's one verse where satan was cast out, but it it doesn't suggest it was before the fall of Adam
I'm refering to other scriptures that suggest he fell after the fall, which clearly suggests satan made the wrong choice...which would suggest if he had made the right choice he would not of fell.
And there's many many scriptures that suggests God prewarns people before they fall,
Which means by making the right choice you can change your destiny
