TITHES
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This is a common error: conflating giving and tithing. They are quite distinct in Scripture. There isn't a single record in Scripture of anyone "tithing" money, let alone voluntarily. The only "voluntary" tithe recorded was that of war spoils, not income, not money, not personally-owned goods.
It is satan who urges humans to choose the forbidden knowledge of good & evil. Will he let people address that & be delivered from it?
Adam and Eve stayed unclothed in God's most holy presence which is evil when seen through the forbidden knowledge of good & evil (kge). Same as babies.
So don't confuse between kge & evil acts.
That's why God gave the criteria for elders... "not lovers of money". It's also why the following verses in ch 5 say "do not be hasty to lay hands on anyone". Because if you appoint elders too quickly, without prudently examining their character, they will be hired at the expense of the flock (no pun intended).
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Oblio
Guest
"Do not be hasty in the laying on of hands, and do not share in the sins of others. Keep yourself pure. - 1 Tmothy 5:22
I used to think this verse was about leadership. Then I received deliverance ministry and learned that the Holy Spirit isn't the only spirit that can be transferred by the laying on of hands.
I used to think this verse was about leadership. Then I received deliverance ministry and learned that the Holy Spirit isn't the only spirit that can be transferred by the laying on of hands.
Side note: in case you not aware of what it means to be a "worthy" elder, it means to meet the qualifications of 1 Tim 3 and Titus 1.
If churches hire worthy elders, the double price/wages aren't even a minor concern.
Elders should be free from the love of money and be paid amply for their work in the body. It's that simple.
There is no Scriptural conflict.
You seem to think these verses negate the commands of 1 Tim 5 concerning elders. They do not negate them. In fact, these verses you bring up about the heart attitude toward finances describe "the elders who rule well". So we're in agreement about the heart attitude verses. But they do not negate the command to pay the elders who are worthy.
If churches hire worthy elders, the double price/wages aren't even a minor concern.
Elders should be free from the love of money and be paid amply for their work in the body. It's that simple.
There is no Scriptural conflict.
I'm glad you brought that one up. Let's take a look...
22 Be sure to set aside a tenth of all that your fields produce each year. 23 Eat the tithe of your grain, new wine and olive oil, and the firstborn of your herds and flocks in the presence of the Lord your God at the place he will choose as a dwelling for his Name, so that you may learn to revere the Lord your God always. 24 But if that place is too distant and you have been blessed by the Lord your God and cannot carry your tithe (because the place where the Lord will choose to put his Name is so far away), 25 then exchange your tithe for silver, and take the silver with you and go to the place the Lord your God will choose. 26 Use the silver to buy whatever you like: cattle, sheep, wine or other fermented drink, or anything you wish. Then you and your household shall eat there in the presence of the Lord your God and rejoice.
That passage is essentially irrelevant for Christians, because we aren't required to tithe goods, therefore we have no need to exchange those goods for money for ease of transport. Further, this passage is about using the tithe for celebration, not (primarily) for supporting the church.
Oh goodness...
Abraham gave a tenth of the war spoils to Melchizedek. He gave nothing of his own.
Malachi 3:8 - “Will a mere mortal rob God? Yet you rob me. “But you ask, ‘How are we robbing you?’ “In tithes and offerings. 9 You are under a curse—your whole nation—because you are robbing me. The whole nation of Israel. Malachi is written to Israel under the old covenant.
What spirit was transferred to you with the laying on of hands...by whom?
If you are referring to the attack by satan after repentance and baptism...get use to it. The more you become righteous...the more satan will attack. Especially if one allows satan to miss lead you here and there...he will visit more often to test your level of temptation.
The Bible tells us ....maintain (righteousness) until the end....also....Christ tells us that we may pay a price for following Him. Further, the Bible tells us ...when attacked we are to declare satan unwelcome and be gone ...in the name of Jesus, Amen.
That works.
O
Oblio
Guest
I used to think I understood these things...then at the right time, He straightened me out. The Lord has done work in me through the teaching of Derek Prince, Bruce Thompson, Floyd McClung, and Howard Ellis.
There was a practice of body ministry in certain parts of the church, which while I applaud it, the indiscriminate laying on of hands is a problem. Where things are at today, I don't know as I've been house-bound, for the most part, due to health issues, for many years.
I know my authority, and I know Him who dwells in me, and His power. As the word says, I rejoice that my name is written in heaven.
I am on the road...to my home...in the New Jerusalem! And when I get there, there will be...no more death...no more mourning...no more crying...or pain. Hallelujah! My Hashem-Elohim is there!
God be with you.
The 1611 KJV edition of the Bible is the only teacher you need. The HS will guide you sufficently.
Most All MEGA TV leaders today are ..suspect. Be careful. You see it here on this forum.
Laying on the hands is a Benny Henn type thing and is void of sufficient biblical support.
O
Oblio
Guest
I read many translations as I find I get a better picture of what's said.
Benny Hinn, Rodney Howard Brown, Kenneth Copeland are outside of my experience, though when I talk of my time with the Vineyard, they are often brought up.
I hooked up with the Vineyard Christian Fellowship 6 months after the Toronto Blessing started. I understand the details of why the Airport Vineyard was disassociated. For a time, John Arnott was my fellowship's regional overseer.
I was with the Vineyard from 94 to 98 and I testify that what I experienced was God. It was an awesome time! I can't help what others think about it.
Benny Hinn, Rodney Howard Brown, Kenneth Copeland are outside of my experience, though when I talk of my time with the Vineyard, they are often brought up.
I hooked up with the Vineyard Christian Fellowship 6 months after the Toronto Blessing started. I understand the details of why the Airport Vineyard was disassociated. For a time, John Arnott was my fellowship's regional overseer.
I was with the Vineyard from 94 to 98 and I testify that what I experienced was God. It was an awesome time! I can't help what others think about it.
O
Oblio
Guest
Well, i have provided reference a tithing thing of money, course, pieces of silvers or a coin perhaps being conversion as a rule due to proximity