Alcohol - a world wide phenomena
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That 'translation' carries an inherent bias. It does not say, "Do not join those who drink too much wine (alcohol)".
That is a terrible paraphrase and violates the Hebrew.
Pro. 23:20 HOT - אל תהי בסבאי יין בזללי בשר למו׃
Pro. 23:20 HOT Translit - al-T'hiy v'šov'ëy-yäyin B'zolálëy väsär lämô
Prov 23:20: "Be not among winebibbers; among riotous eaters of flesh:"
"Winebibbers" = alcohol drinkers
There are no words in the Hebrew which read, "drink too much wine".
To incorrectly translate the Hebrew to say that, implies then your a priori, that a little alcohol is fine, but that isn't what the Hebrew says at all, neither implies.
It says do not be mingling with those who fill themselves up with alcohol. The phrase "too much" is not present and is subjective nonsense. Many Diné (aka 'Navajo') on the 'Rez' when surveyed in study, see even only one drink of alcohol as a "bad thing to do" by both drinkers and non (May & Smith, 1988).
The very next verse basically repeats this verse.
Prov 23:21: "For the drunkard and the glutton shall come to poverty: and drowsiness shall clothe a man with rags."
Drunkard is old English, coming from two words, "drink" (swallow liquid) and "ard" (hardy, with their might, boldly (without shame)). A drunkard is literally someone who drinks (in this case, alcohol) with their strength of effort without shame. They fill themselves with alcohol.
That is a terrible paraphrase and violates the Hebrew.
Pro. 23:20 HOT - אל תהי בסבאי יין בזללי בשר למו׃
Pro. 23:20 HOT Translit - al-T'hiy v'šov'ëy-yäyin B'zolálëy väsär lämô
Prov 23:20: "Be not among winebibbers; among riotous eaters of flesh:"
"Winebibbers" = alcohol drinkers
There are no words in the Hebrew which read, "drink too much wine".
To incorrectly translate the Hebrew to say that, implies then your a priori, that a little alcohol is fine, but that isn't what the Hebrew says at all, neither implies.
It says do not be mingling with those who fill themselves up with alcohol. The phrase "too much" is not present and is subjective nonsense. Many Diné (aka 'Navajo') on the 'Rez' when surveyed in study, see even only one drink of alcohol as a "bad thing to do" by both drinkers and non (May & Smith, 1988).
The very next verse basically repeats this verse.
Prov 23:21: "For the drunkard and the glutton shall come to poverty: and drowsiness shall clothe a man with rags."
Drunkard is old English, coming from two words, "drink" (swallow liquid) and "ard" (hardy, with their might, boldly (without shame)). A drunkard is literally someone who drinks (in this case, alcohol) with their strength of effort without shame. They fill themselves with alcohol.
That's a strawman of the position taken. Alcohol represents in symbol sin and death. Drinking alcohol is the sin.
Job 15:16: "How much more abominable and filthy is man, which drinketh iniquity like water?"
Joel 1:5: "Awake, ye drunkards, and weep; and howl, all ye drinkers of wine, because of the new wine; for it is cut off from your mouth."
Isaiah 5:
20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!
21 Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight!
22 Woe unto them that are mighty to drink wine, and men of strength to mingle strong drink:
The wicked are bold to drink alcohol and are unashamed. Even 'Christians' who now reverse good and evil, sweet and bitter.
Deu 32:32: "For their vine is of the vine of Sodom, and of the fields of Gomorrah: their grapes are grapes of gall, their clusters are bitter:"
Job 15:16: "How much more abominable and filthy is man, which drinketh iniquity like water?"
Joel 1:5: "Awake, ye drunkards, and weep; and howl, all ye drinkers of wine, because of the new wine; for it is cut off from your mouth."
Isaiah 5:
20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!
21 Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight!
22 Woe unto them that are mighty to drink wine, and men of strength to mingle strong drink:
The wicked are bold to drink alcohol and are unashamed. Even 'Christians' who now reverse good and evil, sweet and bitter.
Deu 32:32: "For their vine is of the vine of Sodom, and of the fields of Gomorrah: their grapes are grapes of gall, their clusters are bitter:"
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The key words are too much and gorge. I concur with your estimation.
A wise person would consider the proverb you provided. A more spiritually mature person, in regards to drinking and eating would emulate the part about too much and gorge and avoid doing such a thing.
It is like abstaining eating food sacrificed to idols. A more spiritually mature person, in regard to idols, realizes that idols are not alive but just the representation of something intrinsically evil. The person with the more mature spiritual perception would then be free to eat such foot, but avoid gorging oneself in regards to drink and food.
A wise person would consider the proverb you provided. A more spiritually mature person, in regards to drinking and eating would emulate the part about too much and gorge and avoid doing such a thing.
It is like abstaining eating food sacrificed to idols. A more spiritually mature person, in regard to idols, realizes that idols are not alive but just the representation of something intrinsically evil. The person with the more mature spiritual perception would then be free to eat such foot, but avoid gorging oneself in regards to drink and food.
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