Saved by Water

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Wansvic said:
Jesus said,

"Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.
And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it."
Matt 7:24-27
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“Beloved, if our heart does not condemn us, we have confidence before God; and whatever we ask we receive from him, because we keep his commandments and do what pleases him. And this is his commandment, that we believe in the name of his Son Jesus Christ and love one another, just as he has commanded us. Whoever keeps his commandments abides in God, and God in him. And by this we know that he abides in us, by the Spirit whom he has given us.”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭3:21-24‬ ‭ESV‬‬
https://bible.com/bible/59/1jn.3.21-24.ESV
 
eternally-gratefull said:
you need to look in the mirror man I am not doing anything you yourself are not doing,

I am discussion your doctrine not attacking you.

If you don;t like it. Your presence in a Bible DISCUSSION forum is prety much a sham.
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Then tell us why scriptures posted is not a controlling commandment?
 
FreeGrace2 said:
If 1.5 billion people plus others put their faith in water for salvation, they will be in for a huge shock!!

Both the accounts of Noah and Moses show that water KILLS, not saves.
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Please explain why the scriptures listed are not commandment for baptism. Don't just brush it off.
 
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Wansvic said:
I didn't realize when the actual distortion about the truth of water baptism started. I am very interested in taking a look at some of the research sources if you would point me in the right direction. Thanks!
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Sources have included 20-25 associates world wide that have done a local search for any info denying baptism and found none prior to the 1960's.
This is not laboratory research but, we are so convinced we are waiting for the opponents of baptism to show we are wrong.
The search is ongoing.
NOTE...we have invited but not received one opponent of baptism listing any valid (none...in fact...not one)....documents which shows such Bible teaching before the 1960's.
Why?
 
SophieT said:
true

but yourself and mr wonderful think it is by water...hope you use a good deodorant type soap

the rest of us say that is not true

interestingly, the Bible says that is not true

“I, I am he who blots out your transgressions for my own sake, and I will not remember your sins. no water...all God's doing, why? BECAUSE HE DECIDED TO FOR HIS OWN SAKE which sounds like what we call grace Isaiah 43:25


4 But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, 5 even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved— 6 and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus,
7 so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.
Ephesians 2


In him we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of his grace, which he lavished upon us, in all wisdom and insight Ephesians 1:7-8

how are we saved?

THROUGH JESUS BLOOD.

but you ride that lie about water right to the bitter end while telling others they are not saved.

you tell others to read a verse and compare verses and go on about your integrity and you are pointedly and completely wrong and you will never admit it short of an intervention by God Himself. sadly though, it is my experience that having gone down this error over and over and over in your mind, you have created deep ruts of deception that you need help to climb out of

God can do this for you. You don't even have to apologize to anyone. Although once you are set free from the deception of believing in water regeneration, you probably will want to do that anyway.
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That is false scripture teaching.

Please show where the Bible...KJV please..... says baptism is not required?
 
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Wansvic said:
It's one thing to reply with my actual comment and include your objection afterward. What I have a problem with is you modifying what I actually posted. Since you are not able to prove me wrong with scripture you resort to deceptively making others believe I agree with you. And to that I can say, I do not.
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Scripture does not show that baptism is not required. If it did...believe me...the new age religion types would be plastering it on every post.
 
HisKid said:
You are equating this with your belief in water regeneration? Even you must know that's a stretch at best.
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It's about foundation of which water baptism is a part. (Matt 7:24-27) Scripture speaks to this truth. (Acts 2:38) And, as stated in Hebrews 6:1-2 compliance to the God-given commands that relate specifically to the spiritual rebirth is required one time. (If complied with correctly) Afterward the born again Christian should continue on with an aim toward perfection.
 
FreeGrace2 said:
You have missed the point again.

Cornelius was saved AND indwelt with the Holy Spirit BEFORE being water baptized.
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As I've pointed out numerous times, the bible makes it clear that remission of sin takes place upon obedience to the command to be water baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

The spiritual rebirth only becomes a reality after all of the following have taken place; belief in Jesus, repentance, water baptism and receiving the Holy Ghost. (Acts 2:38-41, 8:12-18, 9:17-18, 10:44-48, 19:1-6, 22:16)
 
FreeGrace2 said:
Continue on with the next 2 verses. They show what this crowd is basing their entrance into heaven on: their own works. No mention at all of faith in Christ for salvation.


And context is key, of course.


Jesus said that those who believe possess (have) eternal life in John 5:24.
Then Jesus said that recipients of eternal life (I give them eternal life) shall never perish in John 10:28.

What a person needs to obey for salvation is simply receiving the free gift of eternal life by faith. Those who do shall never perish.

Jesus said that. Do you believe Jesus?
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Jesus statement that he never knew them points to one thing. They had not been born again. Believing in Jesus includes obeying the foundational steps he said are needed to bring about one's spiritual rebirth. (Acts 2:38) Remember Jesus is the word.
 
peldom10 said:
Sources have included 20-25 associates world wide that have done a local search for any info denying baptism and found none prior to the 1960's.
This is not laboratory research but, we are so convinced we are waiting for the opponents of baptism to show we are wrong.
The search is ongoing.
NOTE...we have invited but not received one opponent of baptism listing any valid (none...in fact...not one)....documents which shows such Bible teaching before the 1960's.
Why?
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Thank you. I appreciate your bringing it up. It's something I'm going to study out.
 
peldom10 said:
Then tell us why scriptures posted is not a controlling commandment?
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What scritpture? All I see you do is attack people who do not agree with you.

Water baptism IS a command i have never denied that

ITS NOT a means to salvation.

thats where your in error my friend.
 
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peldom10 said:
That is a pure play on words and is miss leading. It is a distortion of scriptures and God's intent.
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Nope. Its a pure play on scripture

I have been baprized INTO CHRIST

I have been baptized INTO HIS DEATH, (the cross)

You have been baptised INTO WATER

see the difference?
 
peldom10 said:
Scripture does not show that baptism is not required. If it did...believe me...the new age religion types would be plastering it on every post.
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I agree with you. However, the comment you responded to was directed toward someone who actually modified a post of mine. Not good.
 
KelbyofGod said:
I can explain. (sorry to but in)

"Indwelling" means it's in there. "FULL" means there's so much of it in there that there's (at that time) no room for anything else..like sin.
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That is not the biblical understanding. You are correct that to be indwelt means that the Holy Spirit is IN every believer.

However, to be filled is a command, not an amount. The whole Holy Spirit is IN each believer. The issue is whether the believer is being filled or not.

So, let's examine the command to be filled:

Eph 5:18 - Do not get drunk on wine, which leads to debauchery. Instead, be filled with the Spirit,

So, we see a comparison here. Don't be "filled with wine" but instead be "filled with the Spirit".

What does wine to to people when consumed to excess? It changes them. It INFLUENCES them.

The same is true of the filling of the Holy Spirit. When good deeds are done when FILLED with the Spirit, the works are worthy of God's reward. But, otoh, when good deeds are done in the power of the flesh they are odious to God. Jer 64:6 - All of us have become like one who is unclean, and all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf, and like the wind our sins sweep us away.

The red words in "filthy rags" actually refers to used menstrual rags in that verse.

Unbelievers, even atheists, are able to produce good deeds from their will power. And all that offends God.

Even believers can produce good deeds from their will power. And all that offends God.

ONLY when the believer is filled with the Spirit are the good deeds (fruit of the Spirit) acceptable to God and rewardable.

So, now the question: how is the believer filled with the Spirit?
 
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