What do we mean by 'the church'

[wattie]

'The church' needs to get back to the truth.

'The church' needs to stop being greedy.

'The church' is watered down.


What are we talking about when we say 'the church'?

Are you talking about the local church as an institution?

Or are you meaning all believers currently alive?

Thing is.. they are not both 'the church '!

I contend "the church' is always local and all believers living now.. is part of the Kingdom of God and Family of God, but not 'the church'

Matthew 18.. context is of a church that can be spoken to.. got to be local.

When Jesus talks of building His church.. Hes referring to continuing to build His churches He started with His His disciples.

The letters in the NT are to local churches. Either one in particular or a group of churches plural.

So .. where is this church of every believer? I dont find it in scripture.

The entity of every believer assembling as a church does eventually happen. That is in scripture.. but it's in prospect

Where in scripture is a church of every believer for now?

 

[Magenta]

God placed all things under His feet and appointed Him to be head over everything
for the church, which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills everything in every way.
Ephesians 1:22-23

 

[Webers.Home]

.

God placed all things under His feet and appointed Him to be head over
everything for the church, which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills
everything in every way. Ephesians 1:22-23

Which of his bodies is that talking about: his natural mortal body, or his
supernatural immortal body?
_

 

[SomeDisciple]

God placed all things under His feet and appointed Him to be head over everything
for the church, which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills everything in every way

Amen, and I would add 'we were all baptized by one spirit into one body'.
I don't think it's wrong to refer to the whole body of believers as "the church". Or when there's a mass assembly, like when church groups do what they usually call a "conference", is that not a "church" meeting?

 

[shittim]

The "ecclesia" is the body of believers, as in the early church before constantine twisted it into an earthly organization built in the model of Roman government.
Christ is the head of His church, not some dude or woman in a fish hat.

 

[GRACE_ambassador]

Where in scripture is a church of every believer for now?

Precious friend, hope These help:

Eph_1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, Who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
Eph_1:20 Which He Wrought in Christ, when He Raised Him from the dead, and Set Him at His Own Right Hand in the heavenly places,
Eph_2:6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

Col 1:18 And HE Is The Head Of The Body, the church: Who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things HE might have The Preeminence.

 

[Gideon300]

'The church' needs to get back to the truth.

'The church' needs to stop being greedy.

'The church' is watered down.


What are we talking about when we say 'the church'?

Are you talking about the local church as an institution?

Or are you meaning all believers currently alive?

Thing is.. they are not both 'the church '!

I contend "the church' is always local and all believers living now.. is part of the Kingdom of God and Family of God, but not 'the church'

Matthew 18.. context is of a church that can be spoken to.. got to be local.

When Jesus talks of building His church.. Hes referring to continuing to build His churches He started with His His disciples.

The letters in the NT are to local churches. Either one in particular or a group of churches plural.

So .. where is this church of every believer? I dont find it in scripture.

The entity of every believer assembling as a church does eventually happen. That is in scripture.. but it's in prospect

Where in scripture is a church of every believer for now?

The church is not an institution. It is the body of Christ. Ephesians 1:22

"And God put everything under His feet and made Him head over everything for the church, which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all." That is the universal church. I Corinthians Chapter 12 explains in more detail.

Every born again Christian is a member of the church. I long ago quit applying for membership. It makes as much sense as asking to join your own family! Every Christian has a role to fulfill. No one is inferior and no one is of no value. Some are more mature in the Lord, and that is what determines placement within the body.

There is the church generally. Then there is the local church. Contrary to the practice of man, God sees just one church in a locality. There is no Lutheran, Methodist, Pentecostal or Baptist or any other label you care to mention.

Practically, churches should be no more than 30 people. They should be self governing. They may meet with other fellowships from time to time for conferences or in depth teaching.

Too many churches have an "Open Door" policy. This is not Biblical. I believe that the Brethren have it right, although there are other teachings that I don't agree with. The Brethren have a gospel meeting to begin the Sunday worship. Then they break for fellowship. Where I attended that included lunch. Those who were not born again were advised that the next stage of the meeting was for believers only. It was handled well, not in an aggressive or insulting way.

 

[shittim]

the "church" could ands should be replaced with "the believers" perhaps.

 

[Webers.Home]

.
The "my church" that Jesus spoke of in Matt 16:18 is very interesting.

The Greek word for "church" in that passage is ekklesia (ek-klay see' ah)
which is a bit confusing for some folks. It never refers to a physical
structure, nor centralized power like the CCP and/or the US Congress.

Sometimes ekklesia refers to a gathering, and sometimes to a fraternity
(a.k.a. brotherhood) in which affiliation is restricted such as trade unions
and political movements (e.g. Antiva and Black Lives Matter) and service
organizations, e.g. Kiwanis, Lions, and Optimists, etc.

The Roman Catholic Church, on the whole, is a fraternity. But "the" Church
is usually understood to define the fraternity's supreme hierarchy situated in
the Vatican.

Gatherings need not be for worship purposes in order to qualify as an
ekklesia. For example Acts 19:32 which says:

"The assembly was in confusion: Some were shouting one thing, some
another. Most of the people did not even know why they were there."

That particular assembly wasn't the gathering of a fraternity. It was what we
might call a flash mob. Nevertheless, even in chaos, it was an ekklesia.

The seven ekklesia in the book of Revelation represent local clusters of
Christ's followers. Nevertheless, all seven are affiliated with each other, i.e.
they're unified by means of a common belief system.

The "my church" that Jesus spoke of in Matt 16:18 can be represented by as
few as the gathering of two people. (Matt 18:20)
_

 

[shittim]

And He promises to be in the midst of two or more of us who meet in His name, and I experience this daily

 

[wattie]

By local church, in reference to the bible.. its never a physical building, but it is the saved, baptized local assembly being addressed.

Jesus and His disciples had no roof over their head most of the time but did assemble together.. called out by Jesus.

 

[wattie]

Precious friend, hope These help:

Eph_1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, Who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
Eph_1:20 Which He Wrought in Christ, when He Raised Him from the dead, and Set Him at His Own Right Hand in the heavenly places,
Eph_2:6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

Col 1:18 And HE Is The Head Of The Body, the church: Who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things HE might have The Preeminence.

Okay.. yes the body of Christ is the church.

In 1 Corinthians 12.. the church at Corinth is this body. Local and visible.

All the wording is of an entity of close fellowship and connection.

'Body' as in assembly, group.. like a body of water.

 

[Webers.Home]

.

Which of his bodies is that talking about: his natural mortal body, or his
supernatural immortal body?

Rom 6:3 says (in so many words) that when folk are properly baptized for
Jesus, they are reckoned joined with him in his crucifixion.

Well; for that event; it was necessary that Jesus' body be a natural body,
i.e. mortal.

That being the case; then I would say his natural mortal body represents at
least one possible aspect of the "his body" spoken of by Ephesians 1:22-23
_

 

[oyster67]

What do we mean by 'the church'



All those who are born again believers.

 

[Nehemiah6]

So .. where is this church of every believer? I dont find it in scripture.

You need to look a little harder. Let's take just two verses: And hath put all things under His [Christ's] feet, and gave Him to be the Head over all things to the Church, which is His Body, the fulness of Him that filleth all in all. (Eph 1:22,23)

Now ask yourself a few questions:
1. Was the church at Ephesus the only part of Christ's Body?
2. What about the believers in all the other churches?
3. Did Christ have multiple bodies to correspond to multiple churches?
4. What about the millions of Christians since that time?

We read in 1 Corinthians 12:12,13 that the Corinthian believers were baptized into the Body of Christ. So was there a separate Body for the Corinthians?

There is only ONE BODY and all believers (Jews and Gentiles) since Pentecost are in that one Body, which is called "the Church". This Body is also the Bride and the Building of Christ.

 

[wattie]

You need to look a little harder. Let's take just two verses: And hath put all things under His [Christ's] feet, and gave Him to be the Head over all things to the Church, which is His Body, the fulness of Him that filleth all in all. (Eph 1:22,23)

Now ask yourself a few questions:
1. Was the church at Ephesus the only part of Christ's Body?
2. What about the believers in all the other churches?
3. Did Christ have multiple bodies to correspond to multiple churches?
4. What about the millions of Christians since that time?

We read in 1 Corinthians 12:12,13 that the Corinthian believers were baptized into the Body of Christ. So was there a separate Body for the Corinthians?

There is only ONE BODY and all believers (Jews and Gentiles) since Pentecost are in that one Body, which is called "the Church". This Body is also the Bride and the Building of Christ.

Well..

One body at Corinth.. one body at Phillipi ..one body at Ephesus etc..


Body as in 'group, assembly, gathering.' So there can be multiple.

One Jesus.. with many assemblies of His own.

Each a body of Christ.

Please note.. I am not saying someone is not saved if they don't belong to a church..

Body of Christ is n
ot every believer but family and Kingdom are

 

[Nehemiah6]

Each a body of Christ.

Christ does not have multiple "bodies". "Body" is singular in the passage quoted, and that is what you need to contend with.

 

[wattie]

Christ does not have multiple "bodies". "Body" is singular in the passage quoted, and that is what you need to contend with.

Yes, that's right.

'The dog'.. 'The cat' .. 'The bar'

Singular standing for plural.. so it is with 'the church' and 'the body' ..

Not as in Christ's literal body.. but body as in group, assembly. So you can have the one person Jesus being Head over mulitple assemblies, groups.

So .. Ephesians-- 'there is one body.. one faith.. one baptism'..

There is one body/assembly/group of saved baptised believers at Ephesus.

1 Corinthians 12:13-- baptised into one body..

Paul baptised by full immersion in reference to the local assembly he joined.. and so with the members at the church at Corinth. Being baptised after salvation by immersion as a pre-requisite to join the system of Jesus' churches.

Ephesians 1:22-23-

'Church' in this context.. like.. 'the dog' 'the cat'.. 'the bar' .. 'the bank'

The dog is a strong animal.. is this one universal dog? Or singular standing for plural?

So 'the church' .. as in the unit of the local church referred to generically rather than one in particular.. or depending on the context to one in particular.

 

[wattie]

What do we mean by 'the church'



All those who are born again believers.

So what happens when you refer to a church in your area? Or the one you belong to?

 

[oyster67]

So what happens when you refer to a church in your area? Or the one you belong to?

We call that the physical/local church-house. Not all who attend are actually in the Church. Many who are members of "a church" are not members of "The Church".

Matthew
13:24 Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field:
13:25 But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.
13:26 But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also.
13:27 So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares?
13:28 He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up?
13:29 But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them.
13:30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.