The Law

2ndTimothyGroup · Jun 29, 2021

TMS said:

Nice. Are you familiar with Ezekiel 7:13? Check out these translations:

[Eze 7:13 KJV] "For the seller shall not return to that which is sold, although they were yet alive: for the vision is touching the whole multitude thereof, which shall not return; neither shall any strengthen himself in the iniquity of his life."
[Eze 7:13 NKJV] "For the seller shall not return to what has been sold, Though he may still be alive; For the vision concerns the whole multitude, And it shall not turn back; No one will strengthen himself Who lives in iniquity."
[Eze 7:13 NLT] "Even if the merchants survive, they will never return to their business. For what God has said applies to everyone--it will not be changed! Not one person whose life is twisted by sin will ever recover."
[Eze 7:13 ESV] "For the seller shall not return to what he has sold, while they live. For the vision concerns all their multitude; it shall not turn back; and because of his iniquity, none can maintain his life."
[Eze 7:13 CSB] "The seller will certainly not return to what was sold as long as he and the buyer remain alive. For the vision concerning her whole crowd will not be revoked, and because of the iniquity of each one, none will preserve his life.
[Eze 7:13 NET] "The customer will no longer pay the seller while both parties are alive, for the vision against their whole crowd will not be revoked. Each person, for his iniquity, will fail to preserve his life."
[Eze 7:13 DBY] "For the seller shall not return to that which is sold, even though he were yet alive amongst the living: for the vision is touching the whole multitude thereof; it shall not be revoked; and none shall through his iniquity assure his life."

gb9 · Jun 29, 2021

and what are those Commands?

according to the same mane who wrote Revelations , in His 1st letter, John said that the Commands are to believe in the name of the Son and love one another.

Gideon300 · Jun 29, 2021

Blik said:

Try reading my post again, you know, the bit where I say we do not have a license to sin. I am not saying that it is ok to sin. What I am saying is that the Law is powerless to overcome the sinful nature of man. Read Romans 7. Paul, the apostle best qualified to know the law, explains the dilemma. There are over 600 commandments. Not all pertain to men, not all are even possible to keep these days. So which commandments do you keep and which are no longer relevant? Even if you select the right commandments, how do you keep them all? If you live by the law, you will die by it because no one can keep it apart from Lord Jesus. And that is the secret. All who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. It does not say, all who are led by the law are sons of God.

There are many unbelievers who live quite good lives and who are noble in character. They are just as much dead to God as the career criminal. The Law has a divine purpose - to bring us to Christ. Once it has done its job, it becomes redundant. We now have the Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ.

A bird flies because it is a bird, not because it reads a book on the principles of flight and tries to put them into practice. Christians are Christians because they have the nature of Christ, not because we've read the Bible cover to cover and all of the books by CS Lewis. When Christians wake up to this reality, they are released from legalism. One of the signs of a genuine conversion experience is that the individual hates sin. The question is how to overcome sin. Studying the law does not help. Walking in the Spirit is the way to overcome.

crossnote · Jun 29, 2021

TMS said:

All men have God's law written on their conscience...

For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another

(Rom 2:14-15)

The born again Christian has his heart renewed which includes the new nature (God's nature), but even at that fails at keeping the law. Rom 7:7-23

Brizz · Jun 29, 2021

Do you really believe that some are naturally privy to the laws of God and some are without? Or do we all have access to God?

2ndTimothyGroup · Jun 30, 2021

Brizz said:

This is an amazing question. I will give you the best possible answer that I think can be given.

Ezekiel 36:25-27 tells us that the Children of God will be given a new Heart and a new Spirit. This must happen if we are to be "awakened" by Christ. Here are the passages (all translations are amazing):

Ezekiel 36:25-27 KJV - "Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them."

These very Words and this very Process, or, Operation, are explained perfectly in Colossians 2:9-15. This is incredible . . .

Colossians 2:9-15 NLT - "For in Christ lives all the fullness of God in a human body. So you also are complete through your union with Christ, who is the head over every ruler and authority. When you came to Christ, you were "circumcised," but not by a physical procedure. Christ performed a spiritual circumcision--the cutting away of your sinful nature. For you were buried with Christ when you were baptized. And with him you were raised to new life because you trusted the mighty power of God, who raised Christ from the dead. You were dead because of your sins and because your sinful nature was not yet cut away. Then God made you alive with Christ, for he forgave all our sins. He canceled the record of the charges against us and took it away by nailing it to the cross. In this way, he disarmed the spiritual rulers and authorities. He shamed them publicly by his victory over them on the cross."

You should be shocked that your pastor has never shown you this. I'm shocked, and I've known about this for years. To date, and we're looking at nearly 50's of understanding English, I've never been shown how those passages are nearly one and the same.

To answer your question . . . we must be awakened by Christ, as in, receive the Circumcision of Christ. It is only until then that we can See, Hear, and Walk in His Ways. Our Hearts must be cleansed of the Sinful Nature, the Mind of the Devil, the Sinful Way, Adamic Curse, or whatever we want to call it, this element of the Fall of Man must be cut out and removed. We must be spared of this evil thinking so that we can even [begin] to Know the Lord. This is the foundation to understanding why Paul would say that Salvation is entirely the Work of the Lord, lest he should boast. And speaking of Paul . . . when he was Saul, he met the Lord on the Damascus Road, and from that Holy Day forward, Saul was lifted of his sinful thinking so that he would become willing to live (and die) for Christ. Paul was given the ability to Know and Understand God.

There is so much that could be said, and I hope that many others respond, but there is this Path of Holy People called the Remnant. These are of the Incorruptible Seed; and the Word of God says that this group of the Elect, are very few in number. So what does this say about the rest of us? Who are we? WHAT are we? So as you can see, it becomes vitally important that we become more Holy . . . more worthy of the Life of Christ as He died on the cross. If we do not change, it means that the Holy Spirit has not converted our bodies into a Living Temple. We must become that Holy Temple for which our Powerful Holy Spirit to live and permanently Indwell.

We cannot take the chance of not knowing for sure! We must change! We must become more like Abraham and Moses . . . Holy and mature men (and Blessed Women). If we do not change, it means that we are [not] controlled by the Holy Spirit.

I hope that what I wrote makes sense . . . this could have easily been a three hundred page response.

crossnote · Jun 30, 2021

Brizz said:

There is only one access to God and that is through the blood of Jesus Christ…

Hebrews 10:19-22 KJV
[19] Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus, [20] By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh; [21] And having an high priest over the house of God; [22] Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.

throughfaith · Jun 30, 2021

Blik said:

John 1:17

“For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.”

throughfaith · Jun 30, 2021

TMS said:

Not aimed at the Church.

throughfaith · Jun 30, 2021

Blik said:

I believe we are guided by the Holy Spirit . The law was to drive people to Christ .Its Grace that teaches us to deny ungodliness .

King James Version
Titus 2

11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
12 teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;

Evmur · Jun 30, 2021

Blik said:

Telling of scripture is certainly not rage. Here is some more scripture from the bible. Scripture says it is love, not rage.

To follow the law brings comfort, happiness, hope, and joy. It keeps us from being ashamed, and it keeps us in contact with the Lord.

The law is better than gold, better than all riches. It leads us to wonderful things. It is our counselor and gives understanding and wisdom. It leads us to our salvation in Christ. It gives strength and instruction.

The law is the way of truth, to follow law is to follow God. The law is given to us out of God’s love.

It is wicked to reject God’s instructions to us. We can trust in the law and rely on it. When we are forgiven and our sins are cleansed, the law teaches us how to live in that righteousness.

The law is forever. It lights our path. Disobedience is a false way, keeping the law keeps sin from dominating us. Psalm 119.

All that was true for the Jews, but they failed so God annulled the law of commandments as the way to life and blessing, He has ordained a new and living way ... that way is Jesus

Now whosoever believeth in Him shall be saved.

TMS · Jun 30, 2021

Evmur said:

Jas 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
Jas 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
Jas 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

TMS · Jun 30, 2021

throughfaith said:

You said Rev 22:14 is not aimed at the church. Okay you can think what you want.

Rev 22:11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
Rev 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
Rev 22:13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
Rev 22:15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.
Rev 22:16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Believe what you want but faith without works is dead.

eternally-gratefull · Jun 30, 2021

posthuman said:

It’s fine to live the law
it’s nit fine to take the law out of context. Which she does

eternally-gratefull · Jun 30, 2021

TMS said:

If not we are doomed and have no hope

eternally-gratefull · Jun 30, 2021

TMS said:

It still condemns you where you stand. That was its purpose. So no one could be puffed up telling everyone how righteous they are

eternally-gratefull · Jun 30, 2021

TMS said:

this is contradicting itself. No law to break = no condemnation, and that means no sin.

if there is no law to break you are not guilty of transgressing the law.

Rom 5:13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.
1Jn 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

You said, "Yes a christian can sin."

You quoted romans 4:15..
Rom 4:14 For if they which are of the law be heirs, faith is made void, and the promise made of none effect:
Rom 4:15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.
Rom 4:16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace;

No law = no transgression.
no transgression = no need for faith in Jesus, no need for grace.

That’s why the law is a tutor to bring us to Christ.
After this what need of we if a tutor?

eternally-gratefull · Jun 30, 2021

TMS said:

what parts if the law are not handwritten?

eternally-gratefull · Jun 30, 2021

TMS said:

His children do this
not because if the law of Moses. But because of the law of love
we love because he first loved us

eternally-gratefull · Jun 30, 2021

Brizz said:

"No one comes to the father but through me".... Jesus

The Law

Well-known member

Senior Member

Well-known member

Senior Member

New member

Well-known member

Senior Member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Senior Member

Senior Member

eternally-gratefull

Guest

eternally-gratefull

Guest

eternally-gratefull

Guest

eternally-gratefull

Guest

eternally-gratefull

Guest

eternally-gratefull

Guest

eternally-gratefull

Guest