Catholicism vs Protestantism
- Thread starter Roughsoul1991
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Did that expression of the Word end on earth?
At least not under the Sun. No.
I would say the living word still abides in mankind .But God is no longer bringing new prophecies. The witness of his word is complete .There are no loving laws missing by which we could know Him more adequately. We have the perfect (face to face)
The effects are innumerable multiplying . By it we try the spirits to see if of men seen(oral traditions) or of God not seen .If any man later that John on the island of Patmos say "Lo is Christ" we are commanded not to believe. He warned us before the closing of new prophecy
The easy way yoked with Christ to separate. false prophets as false apostles .
Just use the year of the last revelation of prophecy .Within a fifty year period
No Jehovah witnesses, no Mormons, no Mohamed's, no eastern religions etc/. One true prophet the living abiding word of God.
B
I didn't change anything. Paul says he has preached the gospel
"from Jerusalem and as far round as Illyricum I have fully preached the gospel of Christ, thus making it my ambition to preach the gospel, not where Christ has already been named, lest I build on another man’s foundation"
It his ambition not an utterly fixed rule.
Then he goes onto explain "This is the reason why I have so often been hindered from coming to you." In other words he has been stopped from coming because then he would have been building on another man's foundation. Thus it proves that another apostle (i.e Peter) was there first. And then he says "But now, since I no longer have any room for work in these regions, and since I have longed for many years to come to you, I hope to see you in passing as I go to Spain, and to be sped on my journey there by you, once I have enjoyed your company for a little." In other words he is not intending to preach the gospel to them but just pop in for a social visit on his way to Spain.
No it wasn't started by Paul. It was started long before Paul got there as I have shown you..
Paul finally preached the gospel in Rome because he was under house arrest for 2 years. He wasn't going to sit around twiddling his thumbs for 2 years doing nothing.
"from Jerusalem and as far round as Illyricum I have fully preached the gospel of Christ, thus making it my ambition to preach the gospel, not where Christ has already been named, lest I build on another man’s foundation"
It his ambition not an utterly fixed rule.
Then he goes onto explain "This is the reason why I have so often been hindered from coming to you." In other words he has been stopped from coming because then he would have been building on another man's foundation. Thus it proves that another apostle (i.e Peter) was there first. And then he says "But now, since I no longer have any room for work in these regions, and since I have longed for many years to come to you, I hope to see you in passing as I go to Spain, and to be sped on my journey there by you, once I have enjoyed your company for a little." In other words he is not intending to preach the gospel to them but just pop in for a social visit on his way to Spain.
No it wasn't started by Paul. It was started long before Paul got there as I have shown you..
Paul finally preached the gospel in Rome because he was under house arrest for 2 years. He wasn't going to sit around twiddling his thumbs for 2 years doing nothing.
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B
Apples and Pears
Roman Church is referring to a particular church (congregation) in Rome.
Catholic Church is referring to the whole worldwide Church that includes not only Latin (Roman) rite Catholics but Syro-Malabar, Syriac. Maronite Catholics plus the other 20 rites.
Why cannot you just call the Catholic Church by the name that the Catholic Church calls itself.
It is both correct and respectful.
Roman Church is referring to a particular church (congregation) in Rome.
Catholic Church is referring to the whole worldwide Church that includes not only Latin (Roman) rite Catholics but Syro-Malabar, Syriac. Maronite Catholics plus the other 20 rites.
Why cannot you just call the Catholic Church by the name that the Catholic Church calls itself.
It is both correct and respectful.
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A few points.
1. For affordable mass produced Bibles you need not only the printing press but cheap mass produced paper. The first commercially successful paper mill in England was built by John Spilman in Dartford in 1588.
2. It is true that until relatively recently the Mass prayers said by the priest were un Latin, the readings from the Bible were given in English (or whatever the local language was).
3. It is a myth that the Catholic Church kept the Bible from people by only allowing it in Latin. Venacular versions were available from very early. And don't forget in the first few centuries Latin was a common language in the West, just as Greek was in the East.
1. For affordable mass produced Bibles you need not only the printing press but cheap mass produced paper. The first commercially successful paper mill in England was built by John Spilman in Dartford in 1588.
2. It is true that until relatively recently the Mass prayers said by the priest were un Latin, the readings from the Bible were given in English (or whatever the local language was).
3. It is a myth that the Catholic Church kept the Bible from people by only allowing it in Latin. Venacular versions were available from very early. And don't forget in the first few centuries Latin was a common language in the West, just as Greek was in the East.
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exactly!
I don't think that as a group Samaritans, Jews, or Muslims are truly worshipping God.
19“Sir,” the woman said, “you must be a prophet. 20So tell me, why is it that you Jews insist that Jerusalem is the only place of worship, while we Samaritans claim it is here at Mount Gerizim,c where our ancestors worshiped?”
21Jesus replied, “Believe me, dear woman, the time is coming when it will no longer matter whether you worship the Father on this mountain or in Jerusalem. 22You Samaritans know very little about the one you worship, while we Jews know all about him, for salvation comes through the Jews. 23But the time is coming—indeed it’s here now—when true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and in truth. The Father is looking for those who will worship him that way. 24For God is Spirit, so those who worship him must worship in spirit and in truth.”
https://biblehub.com/nlt/john/4.htm
it all falls into place.
unless, a person has to engage in black and white, all-or-nothing thinking.
if a person does wish to engage in all-or-nothing thinking, I believe they will have difficulty with certain Bible passages, for example 2nd Kings 17.
I don't think that as a group Samaritans, Jews, or Muslims are truly worshipping God.
19“Sir,” the woman said, “you must be a prophet. 20So tell me, why is it that you Jews insist that Jerusalem is the only place of worship, while we Samaritans claim it is here at Mount Gerizim,c where our ancestors worshiped?”
21Jesus replied, “Believe me, dear woman, the time is coming when it will no longer matter whether you worship the Father on this mountain or in Jerusalem. 22You Samaritans know very little about the one you worship, while we Jews know all about him, for salvation comes through the Jews. 23But the time is coming—indeed it’s here now—when true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and in truth. The Father is looking for those who will worship him that way. 24For God is Spirit, so those who worship him must worship in spirit and in truth.”
https://biblehub.com/nlt/john/4.htm
it all falls into place.
unless, a person has to engage in black and white, all-or-nothing thinking.
if a person does wish to engage in all-or-nothing thinking, I believe they will have difficulty with certain Bible passages, for example 2nd Kings 17.
I'm fine with using the name "Catholic Church".
at the same time, since the Catholic church is headquartered in Rome, I don't see that it is a negative thing to add Roman in front of Catholic Church.
I did an image search for "Roman Catholic Church sign".
found loads of examples, like
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/3717054/posts
And
http://www.cityofmiramarflorida.com/2010/06/blessed-john-xxiii-roman-catholic.html?m=1
I don't think Roman is in itself a negative term, though I'm sure it has been used with that intent.
Mexican is not a negative term in itself, though I definitely have heard it used that way.
at the same time, since the Catholic church is headquartered in Rome, I don't see that it is a negative thing to add Roman in front of Catholic Church.
I did an image search for "Roman Catholic Church sign".
found loads of examples, like
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/3717054/posts
And
http://www.cityofmiramarflorida.com/2010/06/blessed-john-xxiii-roman-catholic.html?m=1
I don't think Roman is in itself a negative term, though I'm sure it has been used with that intent.
Mexican is not a negative term in itself, though I definitely have heard it used that way.
That according to catholic history but I don't believe it.
Read this link brother
http://www.aloha.net/~mikesch/peters-jerusalem-tomb.htm
Peter tomb in jerusalem
Read this link brother
http://www.aloha.net/~mikesch/peters-jerusalem-tomb.htm
Peter tomb in jerusalem
did some research that might be of interest
found this page
https://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=1357
it seems to be an article from
The Catholic University of America Press
"The second way in which the basic teaching that the Roman Catholic Church is the one and only kingdom of God on earth according to the dispensation of the New Testament has been denied in our era has been through the tactic of implying that, in one way or another, the Roman Catholic Church was not exactly identical with the Mystical Body of Jesus Christ, or with the Communion of Saints, or with the Kingdom or the City of God."
this publication seems to be intended for scholars, and that is one long sentence!
but if I'm reading it right, the article in general and that sentence in particular relates to things we've been talking about.
found this page
https://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?recnum=1357
it seems to be an article from
The Catholic University of America Press
"The second way in which the basic teaching that the Roman Catholic Church is the one and only kingdom of God on earth according to the dispensation of the New Testament has been denied in our era has been through the tactic of implying that, in one way or another, the Roman Catholic Church was not exactly identical with the Mystical Body of Jesus Christ, or with the Communion of Saints, or with the Kingdom or the City of God."
this publication seems to be intended for scholars, and that is one long sentence!
but if I'm reading it right, the article in general and that sentence in particular relates to things we've been talking about.
You add Peter here brother
And you believe it start by Peter, Peter is the apostle president, why act 28 not mention about Peter make welcoming party when Paul arrived there, while you read in Paul,journey to Rome every time he arrived to a town where there is Christian, they welcomm him, they love each other.
And you believe it start by Peter, Peter is the apostle president, why act 28 not mention about Peter make welcoming party when Paul arrived there, while you read in Paul,journey to Rome every time he arrived to a town where there is Christian, they welcomm him, they love each other.
Thank you for your reply. When I would go to mass when I was younger because of family, I would always feel weird about the Nicene Creed. I am just sharing what my heart's instinct is, and someone may feel completely different which is okay. But, I always felt like the Nicene Creed and other prayers said during mass just sounded so empty and almost lifeless. It always seemed like people were saying it just to say it; they weren't saying it because they believed what it was saying in their hearts. The statement "we believe in one holy catholic and apostolic church" always bothered me; we aren't called to follow a church, we are called to follow Jesus. Plain and simple.
I worry because I think a LOT of people say the Creed, go to mass, and list off a set of prayers as a part of the Catholic "tradition" and think that is enough for them and it is not. I ALWAYS think of what Christ told us in the Gospels regarding those who are will make it into the Kingdom:
"Not everyone who says to me 'Lord, Lord' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. On that day many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many might works in your name'? And then I will declare to them, 'I never KNEW you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness." [Matthew 7:21-23]
WOW! This passage has always stuck with me. It has the fear of God infused in it. I am not trying to categorize a group of people, but this [to me] applies to the situation I am talking about. People think they can just say what is "required" and "put in place" by the authority of the church and they assume that it will produce good fruit and save them. It won't. And it scares me for people. Now, there very well could be people who recite this prayer and genuinely believe the meaning. What this means, I cannot judge or say.
I can say though that God wants to KNOW us. He wants to KNOW the deepest part of hearts and our souls. Matthew 6:7 warns us not to "heap up empty phrases" when we pray and those who do think they will be heard for their MANY words... but they won't. Again, I am not judging the hearts of a Catholic who recites this prayer; HOWEVER, I think that the Nicene Creed is only one example of many things [pertaining to Catholicism] that has conditioned people to think that is what faith is meant to consist of, and I just don't agree.
God bless!
I worry because I think a LOT of people say the Creed, go to mass, and list off a set of prayers as a part of the Catholic "tradition" and think that is enough for them and it is not. I ALWAYS think of what Christ told us in the Gospels regarding those who are will make it into the Kingdom:
"Not everyone who says to me 'Lord, Lord' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. On that day many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many might works in your name'? And then I will declare to them, 'I never KNEW you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness." [Matthew 7:21-23]
WOW! This passage has always stuck with me. It has the fear of God infused in it. I am not trying to categorize a group of people, but this [to me] applies to the situation I am talking about. People think they can just say what is "required" and "put in place" by the authority of the church and they assume that it will produce good fruit and save them. It won't. And it scares me for people. Now, there very well could be people who recite this prayer and genuinely believe the meaning. What this means, I cannot judge or say.
I can say though that God wants to KNOW us. He wants to KNOW the deepest part of hearts and our souls. Matthew 6:7 warns us not to "heap up empty phrases" when we pray and those who do think they will be heard for their MANY words... but they won't. Again, I am not judging the hearts of a Catholic who recites this prayer; HOWEVER, I think that the Nicene Creed is only one example of many things [pertaining to Catholicism] that has conditioned people to think that is what faith is meant to consist of, and I just don't agree.
God bless!
