Romans 3:29-31 Is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of gentiles too? Yes, of gentiles too, since there is only one God, who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through that same faith. Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law.
Not By Works
- Thread starter dcontroversal
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Blessings Bill,
I am humbled by your sharing.
Thank you for being so open, in an area I know little about.
I need to work through how I share better with people such as you describe,
because for me it is too easy to miss the signals and hurt more than help.
In the world, it is position and facts that matter more, rather than support and service.
I too often have only seen in people position and facts rather than a living soul in need of life.
We need the Holy Spirit so much to guide in all situations, as well as just listening,
Grace to you in Jesus, Amen.
I am humbled by your sharing.
Thank you for being so open, in an area I know little about.
I need to work through how I share better with people such as you describe,
because for me it is too easy to miss the signals and hurt more than help.
In the world, it is position and facts that matter more, rather than support and service.
I too often have only seen in people position and facts rather than a living soul in need of life.
We need the Holy Spirit so much to guide in all situations, as well as just listening,
Grace to you in Jesus, Amen.
A
i believe it depends on how you define the term "fall away"
does it mean that a believer can lose their salvation and that God will abandon them to their sin and darkness, like hardening of Pharoah's heart?
if you define it as thus, then I agree that believers won't ever "fall away" to a point where God will abandon them to their depravity.
however if you define "falling away" as moving away from God due to sin. then I do believe that people "fall" often and are in need of repentance and renewal of mind to the things of God.
gtg
The Jews were the ones given the Law not the Gentiles like us.
Romans 11:17-24 If some of the branches have been broken off, and you, though a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others and now share in the nourishing sap from the olive root, do not boast over those branches. If you do, consider this: You do not support the root, but the root supports you. You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I could be grafted in.” Granted. But they were broken off because of unbelief, and you stand by faith. Do not be arrogant, but be afraid. For if God did not spare the natural branches, he will not spare you either. Consider therefore the kindness and sternness of God: sternness to those who fell, but kindness to you, provided that you continue in his kindness. Otherwise, you also will be cut off. And if they do not persist in unbelief, they will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again. After all, if you were cut out of an olive tree that is wild by nature, and contrary to nature were grafted into a cultivated olive tree, how much more readily will these, the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree!
Romans 11:17-24 If some of the branches have been broken off, and you, though a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others and now share in the nourishing sap from the olive root, do not boast over those branches. If you do, consider this: You do not support the root, but the root supports you. You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I could be grafted in.” Granted. But they were broken off because of unbelief, and you stand by faith. Do not be arrogant, but be afraid. For if God did not spare the natural branches, he will not spare you either. Consider therefore the kindness and sternness of God: sternness to those who fell, but kindness to you, provided that you continue in his kindness. Otherwise, you also will be cut off. And if they do not persist in unbelief, they will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again. After all, if you were cut out of an olive tree that is wild by nature, and contrary to nature were grafted into a cultivated olive tree, how much more readily will these, the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree!
Dear brother,
Please bare with me.
I can see if passages become a wiping post for preachers to intimidate congregations,
things are not good, and some obviously have this history with open wounds showing.
But I have none of this background, or knowledge, so do not know how
just talking about such passages may trigger responses in others.
It breaks my heart, and I mean this, to feel or see how people are hurt
inside, how such a gracious Lord could be used in this way.
Faith language is not a simple thing,
Peace and grace be with you.
Please bare with me.
I can see if passages become a wiping post for preachers to intimidate congregations,
things are not good, and some obviously have this history with open wounds showing.
But I have none of this background, or knowledge, so do not know how
just talking about such passages may trigger responses in others.
It breaks my heart, and I mean this, to feel or see how people are hurt
inside, how such a gracious Lord could be used in this way.
Faith language is not a simple thing,
Peace and grace be with you.
LLH,
Given your posts about love and how it works. Given your posts about fear and how God works in it.
Given that you already walking with people who fear, yet acknowledge you do not fully understand it.
To me God had given you a gentle kind loving Spirit.
This is why I said that I am glad for people like you.
One does not necessarily have to experienced what someone has gone through in order to help.
But if someone allows the Holy Spirit to guide them to those he has given then he will work.
Someone who really helped me had not gone through what I had.
When we met his prayer was always "Holy Spirit come work and reveal what's needed"
Given your posts about love and how it works. Given your posts about fear and how God works in it.
Given that you already walking with people who fear, yet acknowledge you do not fully understand it.
To me God had given you a gentle kind loving Spirit.
This is why I said that I am glad for people like you.
One does not necessarily have to experienced what someone has gone through in order to help.
But if someone allows the Holy Spirit to guide them to those he has given then he will work.
Someone who really helped me had not gone through what I had.
When we met his prayer was always "Holy Spirit come work and reveal what's needed"
Aah, grace.
That saved a wretch like me. I once was blind but now I see.
That grace that will lead us home.
I can't walk my way home.
If I try then I'm walking in darkness. And I will stumble all the way.
If I walk in the light, with the light then if I stumble I can still see the path.
The path that leads me home.
That light is Jesus
AMEN....each and every word was chosen and inspired by GOD.....so was context....both get ignored regularly and or swept under the rug (not implying Ariel does this or did this) just that many do this....same thing happens with orge and thilipsis (wrath and tribulation) yet some make both words equal the same thing and in so doing discredit the word and end up pushing that which is incorrect.....
My point is not important but the TRUTH IS SET FORTH PLAINLY that the Jews who received the law and the Gentles who are without the law were made as one man in Christ. He has become the Law placed in our hearts ( hebrews 10:16 ) , the Love poured out in our hearts( romans 5:5)thus Love is the fulfillment of the law. ( romans 13:10 )
To separate them again by injecting the law into the discussion is inappropriate andworse is rejection of God's words.
2 Corinthians 4:2 Rather, we have renounced secret and shameful ways; we do not use deception, nor do we distort the word of God. On the contrary, by setting forth the truth plainly we commend ourselves to every man’s conscience in the sight of God.
To separate them again by injecting the law into the discussion is inappropriate andworse is rejection of God's words.
2 Corinthians 4:2 Rather, we have renounced secret and shameful ways; we do not use deception, nor do we distort the word of God. On the contrary, by setting forth the truth plainly we commend ourselves to every man’s conscience in the sight of God.
Sure, but look how it is written.....I understood what she meant, but just responded for clarity.....
i believe it depends on how you define the term "fall away"
does it mean that a believer can lose their salvation and that God will abandon them to their sin and darkness, like hardening of Pharoah's heart?
if you define it as thus, then I agree that believers won't ever "fall away" to a point where God will abandon them to their depravity.
however if you define "falling away" as moving away from God due to sin. then I do believe that people "fall" often and are in need of repentance and renewal of mind to the things of God.
i believe it depends on how you define the term "fall away"
does it mean that a believer can lose their salvation and that God will abandon them to their sin and darkness, like hardening of Pharoah's heart?
if you define it as thus, then I agree that believers won't ever "fall away" to a point where God will abandon them to their depravity.
however if you define "falling away" as moving away from God due to sin. then I do believe that people "fall" often and are in need of repentance and renewal of mind to the things of God.
I'd like to go back to Holiness. Not literally
, but the understanding.
Eph 4:17 Therefore, I tell you and insist on in the Lord not to live any longer like the gentiles live, thinking worthless thoughts.
Eph 4:18 They are darkened in their understanding and separated from the life of God because of their ignorance and hardness of heart.
Eph 4:19 Since they have lost all sense of shame, they have abandoned themselves to sensuality and practice every kind of sexual perversion without restraint.
Eph 4:20 However, that is not the way you came to know the Messiah.
Eph 4:21 Surely you have listened to him and have been taught by him, since truth is in Jesus.
Eph 4:22 Regarding your former way of life, you were taught to strip off your old nature, which is being ruined by its deceptive desires,
Eph 4:23 to be renewed in your mental attitude,
Eph 4:24 and to clothe yourselves with the new nature, which was created according to God's image in righteousness and true holiness.
The new man is created in righteousness and Holiness. Verse 24.
Not by works, but the work of Holy Spirit has already made us righteous and Holy in Him. So we "be what we already are".
Renewing our mind to what the Lord says He has done.
This fact of being the one new man, a new generation of spiritual people seems to get lost at times. Jesus is our mantle. Looking at the Hebrew, a mantle means to sink back into the garment, so as to take on the person of the one who wore it.
We do forget these things but meditating daily on His promises, and putting faith in them, we grow up into Him.
This is where we begin to walk in the Spirit.
Not declaring anything about me, it's all about us declaring Jesus in words, and in living, then in demonstration.
, but the understanding. Eph 4:17 Therefore, I tell you and insist on in the Lord not to live any longer like the gentiles live, thinking worthless thoughts.
Eph 4:18 They are darkened in their understanding and separated from the life of God because of their ignorance and hardness of heart.
Eph 4:19 Since they have lost all sense of shame, they have abandoned themselves to sensuality and practice every kind of sexual perversion without restraint.
Eph 4:20 However, that is not the way you came to know the Messiah.
Eph 4:21 Surely you have listened to him and have been taught by him, since truth is in Jesus.
Eph 4:22 Regarding your former way of life, you were taught to strip off your old nature, which is being ruined by its deceptive desires,
Eph 4:23 to be renewed in your mental attitude,
Eph 4:24 and to clothe yourselves with the new nature, which was created according to God's image in righteousness and true holiness.
The new man is created in righteousness and Holiness. Verse 24.
Not by works, but the work of Holy Spirit has already made us righteous and Holy in Him. So we "be what we already are".
Renewing our mind to what the Lord says He has done.
This fact of being the one new man, a new generation of spiritual people seems to get lost at times. Jesus is our mantle. Looking at the Hebrew, a mantle means to sink back into the garment, so as to take on the person of the one who wore it.
We do forget these things but meditating daily on His promises, and putting faith in them, we grow up into Him.
This is where we begin to walk in the Spirit.
Not declaring anything about me, it's all about us declaring Jesus in words, and in living, then in demonstration.