getting dates about a young earth

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Sirk said:
I see....so God initiated the big bang and then created a single celled zygote that miraculously transformed over billions of years into human kind.
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No... No one knows anything about the very first living organism. As I said, there is some speculations. I doubt it was a zygote, and I don't know anything about it's cellular structure. It did not transform over billions of years into human kind, but there were splitting of lineages over and over and over that eventually gave rise to humankind. And there is nothing miraculous about this transition. The miracle is in life itself. Evolution happens very naturally, in fact. Darwin unsuspectingly discovered the route by which God allowed all of us here today.
 
Sirk said:
They tested it? How'd they do that?
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This is out of my field, but I know it's something to do with weighing the universe, testing the radiation, I guess they can actually "hear" the echoes of the Big Bang, also the fact that the universe is expanding, go back in time and it suggests a finite point at which it began.... Please consult a credible cosmologist though. I'm waaay out of my league here. I will talk to you about biology though.
 
Sirk said:
They tested it? How'd they do that?
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That is really not possible to elaborate in forum.
But if you google it, you will find many examples and scientific papers how it was proven and tested.

If you want to hear that rather from a christian astronomer than from random "google source", I can recommend you Dr. Hugh Ross, he has many youtube videos about this topic.
 
Kisses1990 said:
This is out of my field, but I know it's something to do with weighing the universe, testing the radiation, I guess they can actually "hear" the echoes of the Big Bang, also the fact that the universe is expanding, go back in time and it suggests a finite point at which it began.... Please consult a credible cosmologist though. I'm waaay out of my league here. I will talk to you about biology though.
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Okay....what came first? The chicken or the egg? Where are all the transitional species in the fossil record? Should there be a plethora of them? Where'd they go? We can find dinosaurs but there is nothing in between. Did a salamander lay a beaver egg? Did a fish give birth to an alligator.
 
Sirk said:
Okay....what came first? The chicken or the egg? Where are all the transitional species in the fossil record? Should there be a plethora of them? Where'd they go? We can find dinosaurs but there is nothing in between. Did a salamander lay a beaver egg? Did a fish give birth to an alligator.
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I dont want to step into your discussion, I am not a biologist, but from the theological perspective, how do you understand this sentence?

"Let the earth bring forth living creatures after their kind" How exactly do you imagine the earth to bring forth living creatures? I you dont see theistic evolution in it.
 
trofimus said:
I dont want to step into your discussion, I am not a biologist, but from the theological perspective, how do you understand this sentence?

"Let the earth bring forth living creatures after their kind" How exactly do you imagine the earth to bring forth living creatures? I you dont see theistic evolution in it.
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So is the earth done bringing forth living creatures?
 
Sirk said:
So is the earth done bringing forth living creatures?
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Have you noticed that all your answers are questions?

"Let the earth bring forth living creatures after their kind"
How exactly do you imagine the earth to bring forth living creatures? If you dont accept the explanation of science.
 
trofimus said:
Have you noticed that all your answers are questions?

"Let the earth bring forth living creatures after their kind"
How exactly do you imagine the earth to bring forth living creatures? If you dont accept the explanation of science.
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The same way I imagine..... let the waters teem with living creatures. Which happens to be the one preceding the one you have referenced here.
 
Tintin said:
Nope. The Gap Theory is an old earth compromise.
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When was water created? Was it not already there before the first day? There is no account in the six days of water being created. So where did it come from?
 
Firmament is verse 6 and the second day. Vesre 2 says "and the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters"
 
RobbyEarl said:
Then how did Earth become void and full of Darkness?
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Well, God had made the heavens and the earth but they didn't have any form yet. Then he formed them and created inhabitants for earth, both animal kinds and people.
 
Kisses1990 said:
This is not evidence of anything. Who knows what was intended by what was written. We should see what nature tells us and look at the overwhelming evidence for an old earth. It's multifarious.



It's not just total random assumptions. I admit there are some extrapolations, but again, there is multifarious evidence. It seems to fit the big picture pretty perfectly. But I'm not a geologist. I know more about evolution and biology.
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If we can't understand or trust the Bible in the seemingly little things (early Genesis), why do you propose we can understand and trust it in the big things (that Jesus is the Son of God and died to save us, that we even need to be saved?) That's disingenuous. If the Last Adam (Jesus) existed on earth, the First Adam (Adam) also had to exist. The Gospel is bollocks without early Genesis being true. After all, it sets the foundations for most of the beliefs that are explored in greater detail throughout the Bible.
 
Dan_473 said:
yes, that's a possible method... use data from nature to interpret the bible... used by many christians.

on the other hand, if the bible is supernatural in origin, then data from the natural world might be misleading.
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Especially, since nature is general revelation, not special revelation. And because creation is fallen. Nature (despite some peoples beliefs) is not the 67th book of the Bible.
 
Sirk said:
Okay....what came first? The chicken or the egg? Where are all the transitional species in the fossil record? Should there be a plethora of them? Where'd they go? We can find dinosaurs but there is nothing in between. Did a salamander lay a beaver egg? Did a fish give birth to an alligator.
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Sorry for taking so long to respond. I went out to dinner with some family. I'm back now. To answer your question, the egg came first. There is an abundance of transitional species in the fossil record. We are lucky to have any, by the way, and evolution does not rest on the fossil record. We would know it's true even if we didn't have a single fossil. But yes, there are many. Thousands upon thousands upon thousands. Pick your species. If you're interested in humans, check out the many Australopithecines, Homo Erectus, Homo Habilis, and the others. Then archaic humans and modern humans. It's pretty neat stuff actually.

Where did what go? The transitional species? I don't think you understand how evolution works... Most all species that ever lived is said to be extinct, but even if that were not the case, evolution happens in populations, not in the individual. I don't know if Homo Erectus is in our direct lineage. Those examples I gave are some likely candidates, but even if they aren't our direct descendants, they display many features of the type of creatures you would expect around that time which did indeed inevitably give rise to modern humans. If they "became" us through many many generations, why would you suspect them to still be around? Part of what changes populations are societal pressures in nature. Changing climate, new predators, drive for food, water, shelter, etc.. In a changing ecosystem, you can expect more rapid evolutionary change.

What do you mean when you say "we can find dinosaurs but there is nothing in between"? I'm not sure what that means. No, a salamander never laid a beaver egg lol. And no fish gave birth to an alligator Why would you suspect that? No two modern species will ever give birth to a modern species. No monkey will ever give birth to a human. No fish will ever give birth to a bird. You don't understand how it works.
 
Kisses1990 said:
No... No one knows anything about the very first living organism. As I said, there is some speculations. I doubt it was a zygote, and I don't know anything about it's cellular structure. It did not transform over billions of years into human kind, but there were splitting of lineages over and over and over that eventually gave rise to humankind. And there is nothing miraculous about this transition. The miracle is in life itself. Evolution happens very naturally, in fact. Darwin unsuspectingly discovered the route by which God allowed all of us here today.
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Darwin did nothing of the sort! He was an imaginative storyteller, a bitter old man and a competent plagarist. He helped send earth to Hell in a handbasket far quicker than is possible. His beliefs are beliefs that bring death. No good can come from Darwin and his teachings. He's responsible for so much agony in the world today.
 
Kisses1990 said:
This is out of my field, but I know it's something to do with weighing the universe, testing the radiation, I guess they can actually "hear" the echoes of the Big Bang, also the fact that the universe is expanding, go back in time and it suggests a finite point at which it began.... Please consult a credible cosmologist though. I'm waaay out of my league here. I will talk to you about biology though.
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Cosmology isn't science though, it's philosophy.
 
Kisses1990 said:
No... No one knows anything about the very first living organism. As I said, there is some speculations. I doubt it was a zygote, and I don't know anything about it's cellular structure. It did not transform over billions of years into human kind, but there were splitting of lineages over and over and over that eventually gave rise to humankind. And there is nothing miraculous about this transition. The miracle is in life itself. Evolution happens very naturally, in fact. Darwin unsuspectingly discovered the route by which God allowed all of us here today.
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I believe the Bible,

"All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds" 1 Cor 15:39
 
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