Hell's Population Clock

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Webers.Home

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FAQ: Was Adam's disobedience a Hell-worthy transgression?

REPLY: No. According to Gen 2:17 it was a death-worthy transgression
rather than Hell-worthy. In other words; the proper penalty for Adam's
mistake was simply his loss of immortality; and of course loss of access to
the tree of life to make sure he'd die. (Gen 3:22-24) Now as for Adam's later
sins; that's another story.


Pop Clock Update: 3,080 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 180,429,480
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_
 

Webers.Home

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Eph 2:2-3 . . As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins, in
which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the
ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who
are disobedient. All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the
cravings of our sinful nature and following its desires and thoughts. Like the
rest, we were by nature objects of wrath.

It's believed by a pretty large percentage of modern Christians that the
sinful nature spoken of in that Ephesians passage is propagated by men.
Oh? From whence did Eve get it?

She was already alive and fully constructed with material taken from Adam's
body prior to the forbidden fruit incident. Since himself tasted the fruit after
his wife was already in existence; then it was impossible for Adam to pass
the fallen nature to her by means of his body, i.e. reproduction.

In the past, I was sure that the chemistry of the forbidden fruit had
something to do with the first couple's altered moral perception; but now I
seriously doubt it because Eve was the first to eat the fruit, and when she
did, nothing happened. She remained just as shameless in the buff as
before. It wasn't till Adam tasted the fruit that she began to feel exposed; so
I'm pretty sure that the underlying cause is far more serious than the
chemistry of that fruit.

If Eve's fallen condition wasn't due to the fruit, nor due to Adam's body,
then what? Well; obviously the Serpent did it to them, a.k.a. the Devil (Rev
20:2)

The ruler of the kingdom of the air-- i.e. the spirit world --has the power of
death (Heb 2:14) and the ability to tamper with the human body and the
human mind in ways not easily detected; e.g. Luke 13:16, Mark 5:1-5, and
Eph 2:2.

The Serpent was apparently all set and ready to wield his power the moment
that Adam crossed the line and ate that fruit. It amazes me how quickly it
takes effect. Not long after Adam tasted the fruit, he and his wife both
immediately set to work cobbling together some rudimentary aprons to
cover up their pelvic areas.

FAQ: Why wasn't the woman effected by the Serpent's power when she
tasted the forbidden fruit?

REPLY: It was apparently God's decision that if sin and death were to come
into the world, it would come via a lone male's actions just as righteous and
life would be made available to world via a lone male's actions. (Rom 5:12-
-21)

FAQ: When does the Serpent go to work on people. . . in the womb or out of
the womb?

REPLY: Adam and his wife demonstrate that it can be done on adults, but
I'm guessing that for most of us it's in the womb; and if not in the womb,
then certainly no later than when we're born. (Ps 51:5 & Ps 58:3)


Pop Clock Update: 3,085 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 180,722,385
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_
 

Webers.Home

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Consider a Jewish man; he's undergone circumcision the eighth day as
required, and successfully completed Bar Mitzvah. From that point on he is
obligated to comply with the covenant that Moses' people agreed upon with
God on oath per Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy.

Now supposing that same Jewish man begins to have second thoughts about
the covenant and thinks maybe he would like to try something else. Well; he
is not at liberty to just up and walk away from the covenant; no, not when
he is very likely indebted to it via one or more of the curses listed at Lev
26:14 39, Deut 27:15-26, and Deut 28:15-68. Those curses have to be
satisfied first before he can even surmise himself free to transfer his
affections to another religion. However; if that man would like; Christ can do
it all for him.

Isa 53:6 . .We all, like sheep, have gone astray, each of us has turned to
his own way; and The Lord has laid on him the iniquity of us all.

Gal 3:13 . . . Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a
curse for us, for it is written: Cursed is everyone who is hung on a
tree.


Pop Clock Update: 3,091 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 181,073,871
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_
 

Blade

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Hell's Population Clock....I expect this from the world from the enemy. Not "Heavens population clock".

You know when God told us how we are to talk and how to think... this goes against that :) The fact most are blind and if blind have no sin. Then just those coming out of the great tribulation in heaven a number no man could count. Then the fact God never uses fear.. He can't its not of Him. We here on this earth know fear can move anyone the way we want them to go. God by His sweet spirit pulls the lost to Him no us
 
Jun 2, 2023
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those who have chosen to obey our Lords commands are entering through the narrow gate. How many people in the world today do you see who are doing that?
 

Webers.Home

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The disturbing scene depicted at Rev 20:11-15 will be presided over by none
other than the sweet little babe away in a manger.

John 5:21-23 . . Moreover, the Father judges no one, but has entrusted all
judgment to the Son

Acts 17:31 . . He has set a day when He will judge the world with justice
by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by
raising him from the dead.

Misogyny was given quite a bit of negative press during former US President
Trump's administration; while misandry was treated as if acceptable. But
malice is unacceptable with God on any level; and I think we have to accept
the possibility that there are just as many, if not more, man haters in Hell as
there are woman haters.

Rom 2:9-11. .There will be trouble and distress for every human being
who does evil: For God does not show favoritism.

Women are not a protected species with God; nor is their gender a
mitigating factor. They will be judged solely on the basis of their lives just
the same as men.

Rev 20:12-15 . . I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the
throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the
book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as
recorded in the books. The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death
and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged
according to what he had done. . . And whosoever's name was not found
written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

* I would really hate to be a woman infected with militant misandry because
in the end, it will be a man that casts angry women into the lake of fire
and permanently ruining any chances they might have had for happiness in
the future. For all eternity, condemned man haters will grind their teeth with
hot tears and white knuckled fury that they ultimately lost out on everything
because of one lone male's obsessive control over their lives.


Pop Clock Update: 3,102 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 181,718,262
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_
 

Webers.Home

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2Tim 3:1-3 . . This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall
come. For people shall be . . .without natural affection

The Greek word translated "without natural affection" means hard-hearted
towards kindred; viz: lacking in sympathetic understanding i.e. unfeeling,
pitiless, thoughtless, insensitive, cruel, and inhumane.

There are actually kids growing up in homes right here in the USA where
their parents never give them even one atta-boy. As a result, they grow up
feeling ugly, unwanted, stupid, useless, marginal, expendable, and
unnecessary.

There are also kids growing up in homes where mothers never hug them nor
bother to take the time to forge a bond between mother and child. Thus they
grow up with reactive attachment disorder; feeling convinced that no one
could possibly ever love them or be their best friend forever. RAD kids grow
up to become adults with some serious trust issues.

Maybe you don't burn your kids with cigarettes, pour Tabasco sauce in their
eyes, or lock them in a hall closet without food and water for two days; but
do you ignore their opinions, demean them with denigrating labels, ridicule
them, threaten their lives, work them as slaves without compensation, deny
them things just so you won't appear to indulge them, and/or say "no" to
their requests for no good reason than that you don't want to seem weak
and under their control?

Do you routinely abuse their human rights, and/or relegate them to the level
of livestock rather than bona fide human beings with feelings and a mind of
their own? Do you nurture within them a feeling of importance, of belonging
in your home, or do you make them feel like an invasive species and/or an
uninvited guest? Kids pick up on things like that.


Pop Clock Update: 3,110 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 182,186,910
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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FAQ: Was Adam's disobedience a Hell-worthy transgression?

REPLY: No. According to Gen 2:17 it was a death-worthy transgression
rather than Hell-worthy. In other words; the proper penalty for Adam's
mistake was simply his loss of immortality; and of course loss of access to
the tree of life to make sure he'd die. (Gen 3:22-24) Now as for Adam's later
sins; that's another story.
The consequence God gave for sin is death, not loss of immortality.

Scripture states that God alone is immortal.

Man attains to life ever after by grace through faith in the shed righteous blood of Jesus Christ.

All others pass into the second death, which is everlasting.
 

Webers.Home

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The way I figure it: seeing as how God is an intelligent, mature adult (so to
speak) who's never petty, nor capricious, nor biased, nor fickle, nor
impulsive, nor unreasonable, and takes no kind of sick pleasure in causing
people harm; then God must be just as stuck with Hell and can't make it go
away with any more ease than we can.

For reasons I have yet to even guess, Hell is unavoidable even for God
because it's somehow the right thing to do; i.e. it has to be utilized for
punishment in order to satisfy a level of justice that our limited little minds
may never be able to fully grasp.

Ps 145:17 . .The Lord is righteous in all His ways


Pop Clock Update: 3,118 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 182,655,558
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_
 

Webers.Home

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FAQ: Doesn't 1Tim 2:4 say it is God's will that everyone be spared?

REPLY: It was likely God's will that no one perish in the Flood, but many
did anyway.

2Pet 2:4 . . God did not spare the ancient world when he brought the
Flood on its ungodly people; but saved only Noah plus seven others.

The destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah is a fair warning of terrors yet to
come.

2Pet 2:6 . . He condemned the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah by burning
them to ashes; making them an example of what is going to happen to the
ungodly.


Pop Clock Update: 3,125 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 183,065,625
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_
 

Webers.Home

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The Corona virus is potentially lethal but not necessarily fatal, viz: should
you contract the disease, the likelihood of your getting past it is very good.

The global death toll as of 07/07/2023 was in the neighborhood of 6,898,266
out of 691,207,603 cases roughly equaling a 99.8% survival rate. In other
words; the odds against losing your life from the virus are about 100 to 1

Of course folks down below no longer concern themselves with diseases;
they have a whole other world of problems to cope with; mostly thirst,
despair, and anxiety. I should think that finding a place to sit down would
occupy their thoughts quite a bit too.


Pop Clock Update: 3,131 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 183,417,111
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_
 

Webers.Home

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The New Testament often speaks of the afterlife by means of the Greek word
háidēs (a.k.a. Hades) which was doubtless borrowed from Hellenistic
influences prevalent in that day.


Hades was believed to be a conscious afterlife where everybody went when
they died regardless of age, race, gender, or religious preference; which of
course implies that not only was the rich man of Luke 16:19-31 in Hades but
so were Abraham and Lazarus; even Jesus did some time there. (Matt 12:40
& Acts 2:25 31)


Hades is sometimes thought to speak of people's graves, but the correct
Greek word for grave in the New Testament isn't Hades, it's actually
mnemeion (mnay-mi' on), for example:


Matt 27:52-53 . . And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the
saints which slept arose, and came out of the graves after his resurrection,
and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.


Matt 27:59-60 . . And when Joseph had taken the body, he wrapped it in a
clean linen cloth, and laid it in his own new tomb, which he had hewn out in
the rock: and he rolled a great stone to the door of the sepulcher, and
departed.


John 11:18 . . Then when Jesus came, he found that he had lain in the
grave four days already.


John 11:38 . . Jesus therefore again groaning in himself cometh to the
grave. It was a cave, and a stone lay upon it.


John 12:17 . . The people therefore that was with him when he called
Lazarus out of his grave, and raised him from the dead, bare record.


Those are only a smattering of examples from the New Testament where
grave is properly translated from mnemeion. Bible committees that render
Hades as grave do so arbitrarily, i.e. by interpretation rather than by
translation.


Pop Clock Update: 3,137 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 183,768,597
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_
 

Webers.Home

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1John 4:10 . . . God loved us when we didn't love Him, and sent His son as
an atoning sacrifice for our sins.

The Greek verb for love in that passage speaks of benevolence sans any
particular affection and/or fondness. This is the manner of love we're
required to extend to everyone regardless of whether we like them or not.

In a nutshell, the love expressed in sending Christ to die for God's enemies
was an act of gratuitous kindness, care, pity, courtesy, and sympathy which
should not be mistaken to indicate that He particularly likes any of us. In
point of fact, God most likely detests a pretty large number of people for
whom Christ died; yet He's not indifferent to their safety because God is
basically a neighborly sort of person. (Matt 5:44-48)

"He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the
sins of the whole world." (1John 2:2)

BTW: If perchance somebody hasn't done so already; take a moment to
speak with God about what His son has done for you.

You might begin by finding a private place to pray: anywhere quiet away
from people will do.

Cover your face with your hands, it will give you a sense of privacy; and
under your breath, share with God your concerns; tell Him you're worried:
you know you're a sinner and will likely never be any different. Then tell Him
you've heard His son died for the sins of the world. Tell Him you'd like to
take advantage of His son's death for your own sins.

* Be sure to thank God for His time. It won't make any difference but He
does appreciate courtesy.


Pop Clock Update: 3,144 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 184,178,664
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_
 

Webers.Home

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Zech 1:5 . .Where are your forefathers now? And the prophets, do they
live forever?

My parents are gone, and the great preacher Billy Graham; he's gone too.
My favorite rock and roll guitar player during the years I was a teen-ager
was Chuck Berry. He's gone. When I was a sophomore in high school, me
and a buddy went to see "The Blob" starring a rather unknown actor at the
time named Steve McQueen. He's gone. My eldest brother entered the
Catholic priesthood and anon became a Friar. He's gone. My bestest friend
ever, whom I'd known since the 2nd grade in elementary school back in
1951, is gone too; shot to death by law enforcement at only 37 years old.

There's hardly a month goes by without someone passing away that at one
time was very important to me; a constant reminder that nobody lives
forever and neither will I. At my current age of 79, and diagnosed with
esophageal cancer, I'll be passing away not too long from now. Most of my
life has already been lived and I'm in the home stretch; heading for the exit.
When I was a youngster, life's horizon seemed forever far away; but now,
looking at my deteriorating body, it seems I'm walking on the horizon's
edge.


Pop Clock Update: 3,149 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 184,471,569
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_
 

Webers.Home

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I would like it very much if my friends, associates, and loved ones down in
Hades were allowed visitor days in the afterlife because after they're
transferred to the lake of fire depicted at Rev 20:11-15, I may never get to
be with them ever again.

Christians are sometimes asked how they can possibly be happy in Heaven
while aware that their loved ones are imprisoned in an eternity of suffering.
Well; Rev 21:4 predicts there will neither sorrow nor tears in the future
cosmos, apparently made possible by starting over from scratch and leaving
all else behind, including memories of the past.

Rev 21:5 . . He who was seated on the throne said: I am making
everything new! Then he said: Write this down, for these words are
trustworthy and true.


Pop Clock Update: 3,159 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 185,057,379
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_
 

Webers.Home

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In the story told at Luke 16-19-31, the beggar Lazarus died and was carried
by angels to the afterlife. Curiously, the rich man's transportation isn't
specified.

One of the most disturbing scenes I've yet to observe in a Hollywood movie
occurs in "GHOST" starring Patrick Swayze and Demi Moore. When someone
marked for the wrong side of the afterlife passes away, these eerie
phantoms emerge, having the appearance of black oily smoke, uttering
awful moans, and drag their panic-stricken captives down into the ground.

I don't know if that's how the rich man in Luke's story was transported, but
if so; I can well imagine just how shocking and horrifying it must've been for
him at death to suddenly be able to see menacing spirit creatures
surrounding him with looks on their faces that could only convey but one
unmistakable intent; and I suspect those sinister beings had been hovering
around that poor man and stalking him every day and night of his entire life
without him knowing it and patiently waiting for the green light to take him
down.

So, I wonder if the angels that provided Lazarus transportation were not also
assigned as security to protect him from being shanghaied by something
similar to those dark mists.


Pop Clock Update: 3,174 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 185,936,094
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_
 

Webers.Home

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Matt 5:8 . . Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God.

A rough-hewn definition of "pure in heart" is when someone is the same on
the inside as they are on the outside; which is just the opposite of
dissembling; defined as: to put on a false appearance, i.e. conceal facts,
intentions, or feelings under some pretense.

Dissembling is a very common form of dishonesty which is practiced by just
about everybody at one time or another. Most of us do not always want
others to know what we are actually thinking and/or feeling about certain
things. The very opposite of that is transparency, which most of us want
from others, but prefer not to reciprocate with transparency of our own.

Here's a really good example of someone pure in heart.

"When Jesus saw Nathanael approaching, he said of him, "Here is a true
Israelite, in whom there is nothing false." (John 1:47)

Jesus was pure in heart too.

"No deceit was found in his mouth." (1Pet 2:22)

I think we may safely assume there are no exceptions to the sixth beatitude,
i.e. no one is exempt; sincerity and forthrightness aren't optional with God;
they're mandatory.

"Who may ascend into the hill of The Lord? And who may stand in His holy
place? He who has . . a pure heart . . he shall receive a blessing from The
Lord." (Ps 24:3-5)


Pop Clock Update: 3,179 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 186,228,999
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_
 

Webers.Home

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I obtain quite a bit of useful information from YouTube; for example how to
replace a microwave oven motor, resolve a computer issue, adjust an
electric guitar's intonation. and/or the proper way to position a lawnmower
for an oil change.

I also tour the world with YouTube, visiting amazing man-made wonders and
natural wonders too. I will likely never travel and get to see those wonders
for myself as they really are before I'm dead; but out ahead is coming a
one-thousand year era on Earth wherein I've no doubt there will be plenty of
opportunity to see everything in the next life that I missed in this one.

Rev 20:6 . . Blessed and holy are those who have part in the first
resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be
priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years.

I suspect that God is keeping a massive, fully comprehensive library that can
satisfy all my curiosity-- an archive of information far exceeding the contents
of the great library of Alexandria. For example: how did the ancient
Egyptians build the pyramids? How did the people of Easter Island move
those massive stone heads into position? Is there an end to space; and if so,
what's on the other side? Things like that; but also nature's secrets too. How
did nature fashion those remarkable rock formations in Utah? Or carve out
the Grand Canyon?

There are many mysteries like those that I sincerely hope to find answers to
some day. But people in Hell won't be allowed access to God's library. They
will never get answers to their deepest questions about the cosmos; nor be
allowed to travel to all the exotic places on Earth that they missed in this life
before passing on to the next.

Another benefit to the coming era is safety. I will have nothing to fear from
the animal kingdom like I do now, and plus; those of us who make the cut
will be immortal; so we won't fear heights, nor speed, nor any other risk. I
love to explore, but don't like to explore places that might cost me my life,
lose an eye, or put me in a wheel chair. Well; in the future, I'll be able to
explore every corner of the globe to my heart's content in perfect safety and
thoroughly enjoy myself without worrying about hazards associated with the
journey like piranha, head hunters, frost bite, hypothermia, violent storms,
hijackers, terrorists, bandits, and/or shipwreck.

One thing that prevents many of us from touring the world is old age. Well,
diminished capacity will never again be a factor dictating what I can eat and
drink, were I can go, nor whether I can make it.

Rev 20:5-6 . . But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand
years were finished. This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is he that
hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power.

People in Hell are not only in terrible discomfort, but they're also missing out
on the pleasures of adventure, discovery, and exploration; which are three
very stimulating activities that, just about everybody I've ever met would
agree, make one's existence worthwhile.


Pop Clock Update: 3,184 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 186,521,904
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_
 

Webers.Home

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Writing to the Christians in Colossi, the apostle Paul said:

"Do not lie to each other since you have taken off your old self with its
practices and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge
in the image of its Creator." (Col 3:9-10)

Humanity's original self began its created existence in the image of God
(Gen 1:26-27). In other words; Adam started off as an honest man. Clearly
then; dishonesty doesn't reflect the image of God, rather, it reflects the
Devil's image. (John 8:44)

The Greek word translated "renewed" basically means to renovate; defined
by Webster's defines as: (1) to restore to a former better state (as by
cleaning, repairing, or rebuilding), and (2) to restore to life, vigor, or
activity, i.e. revive.

The word appears in only one other place in the entire New Testament at
2Cor 4:16, which says:

"Though outwardly we are wasting away, yet inwardly we are being renewed
day by day."

Sometimes renovation requires demolition and beginning all over again from
scratch, In other words: total regeneration.

The Greek word translated "knowledge" basically refers to recognition, i.e.
acknowledgement, viz: discernment.

Reconstruction of one's innermost being-- especially the conscience --is
essential because humanity's intuitive knowledge of what's acceptable and
what's unacceptable is unreliable due to the forbidden fruit incident
portrayed in the third chapter of Genesis.

This relates to one of the tragedies of Hell. People down there never gave
God an opportunity to overhaul their spiritual condition; so now they're no
better as persons in the afterlife than they were in this life. After all is said
and done-- after the big judgment of Rev 20:11-15 is completed, and the
new cosmos of Rev 21:1 is up and running --Christ caps everything by
announcing:

"Let him who does wrong continue to do wrong; let him who is vile continue
to be vile." (Rev 22:10)

In other words: people who end up on the wrong side of things will remain
just as much in need of renovation there as they were here-- but it won't be
available.


Pop Clock Update: 3,197 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 187,283,457
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_
 

Webers.Home

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May 28, 2018
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Matt 22:36-40 . . Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
Jesus said unto him: Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and
with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great
commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor
as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

The Greek verb translated "love" doesn't necessarily imply either affection
and/or fondness. It's just as much about the way we treat our fellow men as
our personal feelings about them. This is the kind of love that we ought to
be extending to everyone-- friend, foe, family, and stranger alike. It's the
very same love that Jesus taught in Matt 5:44 which reads:

"You have heard that it was said: You shall love your neighbor, and hate
your enemy. But I say to you, love your enemies,"

In other words; you don't especially have to like your neighbors, you family,
and/or your enemies, but you do have to be benevolent, i.e. courteous,
kind, charitable, tolerant, patient, diplomatic, tactful, gentle, reasonable,
fair, deferential, cordial, genial, affable, sociable, helpful, thoughtful,
sympathetic, considerate, and cooperative, etc. And of course those all apply
to the way that people associate with God too because the same Greek verb
is used of loving God as loving one's neighbors and enemies.

The above tells me that quite a few people are on the road to Hell simply
because their manners are uncivil, and insufferable, with both God and Man,
viz: they not only aren't nice to their fellow men, but they aren't even nice
to God-- they don't care about marginalizing Him, tuning Him out, insulting
Him, chafing Him, and/or hurting His feelings. In other words: the most
important of all the commandments bounces off their thick skulls like a
banana thrown at a Russian tank.


Pop Clock Update: 3,204 days have elapsed since beginning the thread. If
the figures in post #1 are within reason, then something like 187,693,524
new arrivals have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since December 10,
2014.
_