Ever wonder Why?….

[Magenta]

Nope, I NEVER said evil is good.

I said it is good that God created evil so that He can give us a choice….
Good or Evil… Life or Death… Light or Darkness…

Man already had a choice. The evil was in the disobedient choice he made, not the tree.

God quite simply did not create evil. He does, however, define it. Just as He defines goodness.

 

[Magenta]

Eve was deceived… she believed evil was good.

Yes, Eve was deceived. I have said that already... And this, too:

She believed the lie of Satan.

“You will not surely die."

There is absolutely nothing in the text suggesting the
tree of the knowledge of good and evil was in itself evil.

Quite the opposite. Scripture affirms that which God created was good, and very good.

 

[Niki7]

Eve was deceived… she believed evil was good.

The Bible does not say that. You believe the tree God planted in the garden was evil but the Bible does not say that either.

It's you. YOU believe evil is good and have said so over and over.

"Niki7, post: 5100454, member: 321629"]"Lafftur, post: 5099536, member: 254930"]The Truth is that God DID create evil and it is GOOD that He did

"Lafftur, post: 5100067, member: 254930"]It was GOOD that God created evil because it gave us a CHOICE.

"Lafftur, post: 5100067, member: 254930"]It was GOOD that God created evil because it gave us a CHOICE.

"Lafftur, post: 5100113, member: 254930"]God created evil for OUR GOOD

"Lafftur, post: 5100097, member: 254930"]God created Evil for our GOOD.

You state that everything God made was good (which is biblical) but then you also declare over and over that God created evil.

That, is YOU saying that evil is good because God created it.

"Lafftur, post: 5099536, member: 254930"]Everything God made is good and has been made for His Plan and Purposes.

I don't think you understand the repercussions of saying God created evil.

 

[Niki7]

At this point, I believe the op has understood what is being said regarding her belief that God created evil.

She may even begin to think she could be wrong...I don't know.

I am done for now in my replies but that does not mean I am done with the thread.

I just sense something here I prefer not to deal with at the moment.

 

[Lafftur]

Where did God say everything I have created is good, except the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. That thing is evil. Nowhere. That is simply not in the Bible. You seem to be taking more and more liberty with what scripture actually states. That, is opening the door for even more error and wrong teaching.

So it seems you are saying woe to God. You sure are confused.

I would not normally continue in a thread where the op was so dead set on being right the more they got things wrong, but in this case I persist because the belief that God created evil is egregious to the point it can alter a person's perception and understanding of their Creator.

We have a small taste of that right here in this post by the op who is now stating that the tree God created was evil when the Bible states EVERYTHING God created He called good.

This brings us back to the fact that saying God created evil is calling evil good. Which a blind person can understand to be a lie that may cause people to respond 'then sin is not really my fault. God caused it.'

Does anyone else see the progression in error here? It is becoming more noticeable IMO.

It was GOOD that God created evil because it gave us a CHOICE. God had to give us a CHOICE. God did create evil, God did create Death when He created the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil... God created a CHOICE for us.... LIFE or DEATH.

God HAD to do it. However, God hates evil and will completely destroy it when He accomplishes and finishes what He started...

ALL THAT GOD DOES IS FOR OUR GOOD.... even creating a CHOICE for us. Love MUST have a choice.

 

[Magenta]

It was GOOD that God created evil because it gave us a CHOICE. God had to give us a CHOICE. God did create evil, God did create Death when He created the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil... God created a CHOICE for us.... LIFE or DEATH.

God HAD to do it. However, God hates evil and will completely destroy it when He accomplishes and finishes what He started...

ALL THAT GOD DOES IS FOR OUR GOOD.... even creating a CHOICE for us. Love MUST have a choice.

What makes you think Adam and Eve did not have a choice before choosing to disobey? .

 

[Cameron143]

*Raises hand* I have a question. Given Adam and Eve's disobedience, with Eve having been deceived
while Adam was not, and also being told that bondage to sin is due to man's fear of death, why did
Adam and Eve not just eat from the Tree of Life? Some say Satan's lie was that they would be like God
in knowing good and evil, but God agreed with that assessment, so that was not Satan's lie. Satan's lie
was they would not surely die, whereas God had said they would if they ate from the totkog&e.
Another question that comes out of this one is, why do people continue to promote this lie,
the lie at the heart of the fall of man and corruption of all creation?

Ok. First, put your hand down. I'm pretty sure you did, but just in case.
Second, as you know, God hasn't given us all the answers. So while it's a worthwhile exercise to consider every question, coming to the "ultimate" answer is often impossible. Where I think many err is that they aren't ok with the fact that there are secret things of the Lord and God hasn't made everything apparent. It's ok to say this is my best understanding but scripture isn't definitive on the subject.
This leads to the third point...I don't think most people are lying, but just wrong in their understanding and resistant to change. I have had to ask myself on many occasions if I believe something because that's what I've always believed or because I humbly searched out a matter. Knowing my own propensity to do so, I usually make allowance for others.
Having said all that, I'm not sure why Adam and Eve didn't eat of the Tree of Life. Perhaps the effect of sin on their minds kept this from occurring to them. We do know that God didn't want them to remain in that estate and live forever.

 

[Lafftur]

At this point, I believe the op has understood what is being said regarding her belief that God created evil.

She may even begin to think she could be wrong...I don't know.

I am done for now in my replies but that does not mean I am done with the thread.

I just sense something here I prefer not to deal with at the moment.

No, I do not think I am wrong.

However, I do think that you think I am wrong.

 

[Lafftur]

What makes you think Adam and Eve did not have a choice before choosing to disobey? .

When did I ever say that? Both of those trees were in the garden BEFORE Adam and Eve were created.

All trees were made on the 3rd Day. Adam and Eve were created on the 6th Day.

 

[Magenta]

When did I ever say that? Both of those trees were in the garden BEFORE Adam and Eve were created.

All trees were made on the 3rd Day. Adam and Eve were created on the 6th Day.

You have said a number of times that God created evil in order to give A&E a choice.

Obviously it seems apparent you miss the fact that they already did have a choice.

Now here you say the trees were part of God's creation before man was created, and we
know that God had proclaimed His creation good, so how can you call the totkog&e evil?

 

[Beckie]

*Raises hand* I have a question. Given Adam and Eve's disobedience, with Eve having been deceived
while Adam was not, and also being told that bondage to sin is due to man's fear of death, why did
Adam and Eve not just eat from the Tree of Life? Some say Satan's lie was that they would be like God
in knowing good and evil, but God agreed with that assessment, so that was not Satan's lie. Satan's lie
was they would not surely die, whereas God had said they would if they ate from the totkog&e.
Another question that comes out of this one is, why do people continue to promote this lie,
the lie at the heart of the fall of man and corruption of all creation?

 

[Bob-Carabbio]

…why Jesus Christ had to die… why there was no other way?

Good questions for Jesus, when you get together later (if you're Born Again).

The only information we have is that it takes BLOOD to wash away SIN (Heb 9:22), and the blood of LIVESTOCK can't do the job (Heb 10:4), because it only "Covers" SIN temporarily. The Blood sacrifice has to be HUMAN, and has to be PERFECT in God's sight. Of course, the ONLY HUMAN that met those qualifications was Jesus. and so HE became the SIN OFFERING (Isa 53:10).

WHY did it HAVE TO BE THAT WAY? God knows, I don't. I'll ask later (if I even have to).

 

[Magenta]

Ok. First, put your hand down. I'm pretty sure you did, but just in case.
Second, as you know, God hasn't given us all the answers. So while it's a worthwhile exercise to consider every question, coming to the "ultimate" answer is often impossible. Where I think many err is that they aren't ok with the fact that there are secret things of the Lord and God hasn't made everything apparent. It's ok to say this is my best understanding but scripture isn't definitive on the subject.
This leads to the third point...I don't think most people are lying, but just wrong in their understanding and resistant to change. I have had to ask myself on many occasions if I believe something because that's what I've always believed or because I humbly searched out a matter. Knowing my own propensity to do so, I usually make allowance for others.
Having said all that, I'm not sure why Adam and Eve didn't eat of the Tree of Life. Perhaps the effect of sin on their minds kept this from occurring to them. We do know that God didn't want them to remain in that estate and live forever.

I believe Scripture is rather definitive on this subject. Adam and Eve were of the natural world.
The natural man is enmity/hostile to God. Being of the natural world, they had a mind of flesh, and
an uncircumcised heart. The mind of the flesh is hostile to God: It does not submit to God’s law, nor
can it do so. While Eve was deceived, Adam was not. Yet both sinned. God knew this would happen.

Further, Eve was deceived by the lie of Satan, which was that they would not die.
That very same lie is promoted to this very day. Ah, this is the lying issue. Hmmmm.

I am not sure why you bring up the matter of people lying. Is it because I have called people out for lying in other
threads? I cannot help but find it odd, peculiar, funny even, that people imagine things not in evidence and then
post their imaginings as if they were facts. You can say one thing and someone will claim you said something else,
didn't say what you actually did, or that it can only mean such-and-such. People do lie. And repeatedly. I could give
examples, but to what end? Bearing false witness is a serious matter. I do not think this should be soft peddled. It is
different than simply being wrong in their interpretation of Scripture, being resistant to change, and therefore unteachable.

 

[Lafftur]

You have said a number of times that God created evil in order to give A&E a choice.

Obviously it seems apparent you miss the fact that they already did have a choice.

Now here you say the trees were part of God's creation before man was created, and we
know that God had proclaimed His creation good, so how can you call the totkog&e evil?

Perhaps it’s time you stop asking me why God put the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and EVIL in the garden and you ask God why He did it?

 

[Magenta]

Perhaps it’s time you stop asking me why God put the Tree of the Knowledge
of Good and EVIL in the garden and you ask God why He did it?

I never asked you that question. Why do you pretend I did?

 

[Cameron143]

I believe Scripture is rather definitive on this subject. Adam and Eve were of the natural world.
The natural man is enmity/hostile to God. Being of the natural world, they had a mind of flesh, and
an uncircumcised heart. The mind of the flesh is hostile to God: It does not submit to God’s law, nor
can it do so. While Eve was deceived, Adam was not. Yet both sinned. God knew this would happen.

Further, Eve was deceived by the lie of Satan, which was that they would not die.
That very same lie is promoted to this very day.

I am not sure why you bring up the matter of people lying. Is it because I have called people out for lying in other
threads? I cannot help but find it odd, peculiar, funny even, that people imagine things not in evidence and then
post their imaginings as if they were facts. You can say one thing and someone will claim you said something else,
didn't say what you actually did, or that it can only mean such-and-such. People do lie. And repeatedly. I could give
examples, but to what end? Bearing false witness is a serious matter.I do not think this should be soft peddled. It is
different than simply being wrong in their interpretation of Scripture, being resistant to change, and therefore unteachable.

I brought up lying because you did in the previous post. And if you believe someone is lying and feel compelled to call them on it, that is yours or anyone else's prerogative. What I find happening in many cases is just a misunderstanding of either terminology or doctrine. But calling someone a liar is a serious charge. It means they are deliberately trying to deceive. Someone can earnestly be defending something they believe even if untrue and not be deliberately deceptive. Personally, I share to the point that I feel I'm being heard and then leave the results to God.

 

[Magenta]

I brought up lying because you did in the previous post. And if you believe someone is lying and feel compelled to call them on it, that is yours or anyone else's prerogative. What I find happening in many cases is just a misunderstanding of either terminology or doctrine. But calling someone a liar is a serious charge. It means they are deliberately trying to deceive. Someone can earnestly be defending something they believe even if untrue and not be deliberately deceptive. Personally, I share to the point that I feel I'm being heard and then leave the results to God.

I did not realize you were referring to the lie of Satan that gets so often repeated.
I took it to mean something else. Still, Satan lied, and it is repeated. Over and over.
I thought you were referring to people misrepresenting themselves and others
in their conversations. I am fairly clear on the reasons why people lie: pride.
People do try to deliberately deceive. <= I am not speaking of doctrinal issues.

 

[Lafftur]

I never asked you that question. Why do you pretend I did?

Because that question is what our discussion is boiling down to… and it would absolutely be better if you asked God Himself instead of me.

Why did God put the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and EVIL in the garden?

 

[Magenta]

Because that question is what our discussion is boiling down to… and it would absolutely be better if you asked God Himself instead of me.

Why did God put the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and EVIL in the garden?

I already posted what the discussion boils down to for me. I have asked the questions, and also given my
answers. That is aside from the fact of trying to convince you that your beliefs around this are not Biblical.

That is to say: God did not create evil, for our good, or any other reason. Man is responsible for evil.

Neither do I need to ask the question that you are asking. I never asked you, either. Stop pretending I did.

 

[ResidentAlien]

Why He put the tree there isn't the important question. The real question is why He told them not to eat of it.