Are you a Trinitarian, and if so, can you defend the doctrine?
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The 2nd post before this one I am quoting would've given you my answer:
The Scribe calls God HE and HIM which indicates a Being. He specifies God is ONE and no other is beside Him. To have 3 Persons, they would be beside the ONE Person of God whom the Scribe is speaking about.
But the real kicker is Christ Himself. I absolutely believe Christ is the WORD! That means He is not the SON, but a direct internal/external Part of the One Person of God. I believe like the Church Fathers explained that the WORD and WISDOM were both BEGAT not as offspring, but for God's Holy Purpose.
But nonetheless, Christ, WHOM I believe is the WORD, therefore is GOD, confirmed that God is indeed ONE PERSON.
Had the Scribe been wrong, Christ, WHOM is God, would not hesitate to correct the Scribe, because He is GOD and made the Scribe. We are talking CREATOR to His Creation. No fear, no reason to do anything but to tell the Scribe the TRUTH.
And what does the CREATOR do to His Creation?
He confirms God is ONE PERSON.
To me, to ignore this fact reveals layers of mental issues, because you have believed a CREED over the Word of GOD and GOD HIMSELF!
If you pay attention to the "GRACE THEORISTS" around here, or in my view the "LICENSE TO SIN" crowd, they have basically removed the Law and the 10 Commandments from needing to be observed. I understand where the majority are coming from because we are in the "Grace Dispensation." But by removing the 10 Commandments, they can remove the fact that a SINGULAR ONE PERSON God in Commandment #1 said to have no other gods before ME (as singular as it gets)!
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I am loving how Mark 12 and John 4 and John 14:10 are being completely ignored. I've made at least 10 posts including these Scriptures references, because they are Biblical Truths, and they Are ultimately the Father speaking in all of them, and not a single person will touch them.
And you know why?
You have to literally DENY both GOD and the TRUTH by discrediting them would be why!
And You have to acknowledge that YOUR CREED is BLASPHEMOUS!
And you know why?
You have to literally DENY both GOD and the TRUTH by discrediting them would be why!
And You have to acknowledge that YOUR CREED is BLASPHEMOUS!
A key role of the son is to make the Father known
People knew the name Yahweh but were not being presented with accurate information about his nature, eg by the pharisees
Jesus therefore came as 'the image of the Father' to reveal his true identity and nature, and reveal the covenant relationship
So we can and really must look to Jesus to know who Yahweh is, just like those who followed him did
The Holy Spirit is God and has the role of indwelling and being the experience of God in us
One person that appears in different ways and can be seen in all three together or one on their own
When Jesus is seen on own his Father is greater than him, when he is seen as the Father, he is the Father!
God has no reason to conform to human logic just to make us happy which in the end the church kind of figured out when they called it a mystery... but post-renaissance mystery got rejected therefore removing the best way to perceive trinity!
People knew the name Yahweh but were not being presented with accurate information about his nature, eg by the pharisees
Jesus therefore came as 'the image of the Father' to reveal his true identity and nature, and reveal the covenant relationship
So we can and really must look to Jesus to know who Yahweh is, just like those who followed him did
The Holy Spirit is God and has the role of indwelling and being the experience of God in us
One person that appears in different ways and can be seen in all three together or one on their own
When Jesus is seen on own his Father is greater than him, when he is seen as the Father, he is the Father!
God has no reason to conform to human logic just to make us happy which in the end the church kind of figured out when they called it a mystery... but post-renaissance mystery got rejected therefore removing the best way to perceive trinity!
Sure you can. If you believe something, you should be able to state it regardless the outcome. I confronted an Admin on another site when I started a thread there about the hypostatic union. He said that Jesus was a good man who became God at His baptism. Prior to going to the cross, he ceased to be God, because God can not take sin upon Himself and die. He went to hell and was tortured in hell, was reborn in hell, defeated Satan and hell, took the keys of death and hell from him and paraded him in front of all his minions.
I confronted him with that heresy as that was a Kenneth Copeland(and others too) teaching. I called him out and told him he was a heretic. I knew I was going to get banned there, but the truth matters more than membership at any christian website.
By you being afraid to state your beliefs in fear of getting banned, it shows me two things.
1) You are a coward who chooses fellowship and acceptance over truth.
2) You need to reassess your belief here if you are not willing to state it openly for everyone to see.
You're on an unsustainable path is what I going about here. John 8:24 is YOU and @biker.
I confronted him with that heresy as that was a Kenneth Copeland(and others too) teaching. I called him out and told him he was a heretic. I knew I was going to get banned there, but the truth matters more than membership at any christian website.
By you being afraid to state your beliefs in fear of getting banned, it shows me two things.
1) You are a coward who chooses fellowship and acceptance over truth.
2) You need to reassess your belief here if you are not willing to state it openly for everyone to see.
You're on an unsustainable path is what I going about here. John 8:24 is YOU and @biker.
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J
yes i am sure thats exactly what thousands of men and women thought before they were burned alive in front of their friends, family and loved ones because they did not want to accept the trinity doctrine. i wonder what happened to their children? i guess we should be thankfull they didnt murder the children to.
you can try and bait me into this trap with all the ugly name calling you like, im not falling for it lol. if it bothers you that much i have an idea, take your complaint to the ones that make the rules.
?? no trinity in John 8 24.
you can try and bait me into this trap with all the ugly name calling you like, im not falling for it lol. if it bothers you that much i have an idea, take your complaint to the ones that make the rules.
?? no trinity in John 8 24.
There are a number of good Scriptures to cover the essence of the Trinity doctrine here:
http://bib.irr.org/biblical-basis-o...2XWq1YXRAfRgBJ1F_KupvTOtzrGdC-KiOk_lXfJ3IKevI
http://bib.irr.org/biblical-basis-o...2XWq1YXRAfRgBJ1F_KupvTOtzrGdC-KiOk_lXfJ3IKevI
Oneness theology is proven false by this analysis.
VI. The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit Are Each Someone Distinct from the Other Two (i.e., they are three “persons”)
A. Matt. 28:19
1. “the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit”: use of definite article before each personal noun indicates distinct persons unless explicitly stated otherwise; compare Rev. 1:17; 2:8, 26
2. The views that “Father” and “Son” are distinct persons but not the Holy Spirit, or that the Holy Spirit is not a person at all, or that all three are different offices or roles of one person, are impossible in view of the grammar (together with the fact that in Scripture a “spirit” is a person unless context shows otherwise).
3. Does singular “name” prove that the three are one person? No; cf. Gen. 5:2; 11:14; 48:6; and esp. 48:16. Thus, the word “name” can apply distinctly to each of the three (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit) and does not imply that they have only one name.
4. “Name” need not be personal name, may be title: Is. 9:6; Matt. 1:23.
B. Acts 2:38 and Matt. 28:19
1. Neither passage specifies that certain words are to be spoken during baptism; nor does the Bible ever record someone saying, “I baptize you in the name of....”
2. Those said to be baptized in the name of Jesus (whether or not the formula “in the name of Jesus” was used) were people already familiar with the God of the OT:
a. Jews: Acts 2:5, 38; 22:16
b. Samaritans: Acts 8:5, 12, 16
c. God-fearing Gentiles: Acts 10:1-2, 22, 48
d. Disciples of John the Baptist: Acts 19:1-5
e. The first Christians in Corinth were Jews and God-fearing Gentiles: Acts 18:1-8; 1 Cor. 1:13
3. Trinitarian formula for baptism (if that is what Matt. 28:19 is) was given in context of commissioning apostles to take the gospel to “all the nations,” including people who did not know of the biblical God
4. Cross-referencing Acts 2:38 and other Acts references to baptism “in Jesus’ name” with Matthew 28:19 to prove that Jesus is the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is hermeneutically flawed, since none of these passages is seeking to make such a point and none of them is claiming that baptism must be performed using a particular formula.
C. God the Father and the Son Jesus Christ are two persons
1. The salutations: Rom. 1:7; 1 Cor. 1:3; 2 Cor. 1:2; Gal. 1:3; Eph. 1:2; 6:23; Phil. 1:2; 1 Thess. 1:1; 2 Thess. 1:1, 2; 1 Tim. 1:1, 2; 2 Tim. 1:2; Tit. 1:4; Philem. 3; James 1:1; 2 Pet. 1:2; 2 John 3
2. Two witnesses: John 5:31-32; 8:16-18; cf. Num. 35:30; Deut. 17:6; 19:15
3. The Father sent the Son: John 3:16-17; Gal. 4:4; 1 John 4:10; etc.; cf. John 1:6; 17:18; 20:21
4. The Father and the Son love each other: John 3:35; 5:20; 14:31; 15:9; 17:23-26; cf. Matt. 3:17 par.; 17:5 par.; 2 Pet. 1:17
5. The Father speaks to the Son, and the Son speaks to the Father: John 11:41-42; 12:28; 17:1-26; etc.
6. The Father knows the Son, and the Son knows the Father: Matt. 11:27; Luke 10:22; John 7:29; 8:55; 10:15
7. Jesus our Advocate with the Father: 1 John 2:1
D. Jesus is not God the Father
1. Is. 9:6: “Father of eternity” means eternal; compare other names formed with word “father”: Abialbon, “father of strength” = strong (2 Sam. 23:31);Abiasaph, “father of gathering” = gatherer (Ex. 6:24); Abigail, a woman’s name (!), “father of exultation” = exulting (1 Chron. 2:16).
2. John 10:30
a. Jesus did not say, “I am the Father,” nor did he say, “the Son and the Father are one person.”
b. The first person plural esmen (“we are”) implies two persons.
c. The neuter word for “one” (hen) is used, implying essential unity but not personal unity.
d. John 10:30 in context is a strong affirmation of Christ’s deity, but does not mean that he is the Father.
3. John 5:43: Jesus’ coming in his Father’s name means not that he was the Father because he had the Father’s name, but that, while others come in their own name (or their own authority), Jesus does not; he comes in his Father’s name (on his Father’s authority).
4. John 8:19; 16:3: Ignorance of Jesus is indeed ignorance of the Father, but that does not prove that Jesus is the one he calls “My Father.”
5. John 14:6-11
a. Jesus and the Father are one being, not one person.
b. Jesus said, “I am in the Father,” not “I am the Father.”
c. The statement, “the Father is in me,” does not mean Jesus is the Father; compare John 14:20; 17:21-23.
6. John 14:18: An older adult brother can care for his younger siblings, thus preventing them from being “orphans,” without being their father.
7. Colossians 2:9: Does not mean that Jesus is the Father, or that Jesus is an incarnation of the Father; rather, since “Godhead” (theotês) means Deity, the state of being God, the nature of God, Jesus is fully God, but not the only person who is God. “The Godhead” here does not = the Father (note that Jesus is in the Father, John 10:38; 14:10, 11; 17:21), but the nature of the Father. See II.B.3.
8. The Father and the Son are both involved in various activities: raising Jesus (Gal. 1:1; John 2:19-22), raising the dead (John 5:21); 6:39-40, 44, 54, 1 Cor. 6:14), answering prayer (John 14:13-14; 15:16; 16:23), sending the Holy Spirit (John 14:16; 15:26; 16:7), drawing people to Jesus (John 6:44; 12:32), etc. These common works do prove that the two persons are both God, but not that Jesus is the Father
E. The Son existed before his Incarnation, even before creation
1. Prov. 30:4: This is not predictive prophecy; “prophecy” in 30:1 translates massa, which is rendered elsewhere as “burden.”
2. The Son created all things, requiring of course that he existed when he did so: See above, IV.E.1.
3. Jesus was “with” (pros or para) God the Father before creation: John 1:1; 17:5; pros in John 1:1 does not mean “pertaining to,” although it does in Hebrews 2:17; 5:1 (which use pros with ta).
4. Jesus, the Son of God, existed before John the Baptist (who was born before Jesus): John 1:15, cf. 1:14-18, 29-34.
5. Jesus, the Son, came down from heaven, sent from the Father, and went back to heaven, back to the Father: John 3:13, 31; 6:33; 38, 41, 46, 51, 56-58, 62; 8:23, 42; 13:3; 16:27-28; cf. Acts 1:10-11; cf. the sending of the Holy Spirit, John 16:5-7; 1 Pet. 1:12
6. Jesus, speaking as the Son (John 8:54-56), asserts His eternal preexistence before Abraham: John 8:58
7. The Son explicitly said to exist “before all things”: Col. 1:17, cf. 1:12-20
8. These statements cannot be dismissed as true only in God’s foreknowledge
a. We are all “in God’s mind” before creation; yet such passages as John 1:1 and John 17:5 clearly mean to say something unusual about Christ.
b. To say that all things were created through Christ means that He must have existed at creation.
c. No one else in Scripture is ever said to have been with God before creation.
9. Texts which speak of the Son being begotten “today” do not mean he became the Son on a certain day, since they refer to his exaltation at his resurrection (Acts 13:33; Heb. 1:3-5; 5:5; cf. Ps. 2:7; cf. also Rom. 1:4).
F. Jesus is not the Holy Spirit
1. The Holy Spirit is “another Comforter”: John 14:16; compare 1 John 2:1.
2. Jesus sent the Holy Spirit: John 15:26; 16:7.
3. The Holy Spirit exhibits humility in relation to, and seeks to glorify, Jesus (John 16:13-14).
4. The Son and the Holy Spirit are distinguished as two persons in Matt. 28:19.
5. The Holy Spirit descended upon Jesus: Luke 3:22.
6. Is Jesus the Holy Spirit?
a. 2 Cor. 3:17: the Spirit is here called “Lord” in the sense of being Yahweh or God, not Jesus (cf. v. 16, citing Ex. 34:34; cf. v. 17 in the Revised English Bible); note Acts 28:25-27, cf. Is. 6:8-10.
b. 1 Cor. 15:45: Jesus is “a life-giving Spirit,” not in the sense that he is the Holy Spirit whom he sent at Pentecost, but in the sense that he is the glorified God-man; and as God he is Spirit by nature. All three persons of the Trinity are Spirit, though there are not three divine Spirits; and only one person is designated “the Holy Spirit.”
c. Rom. 8:27, 34: the fact that two persons intercede for us is consistent with the fact that we have two Advocates (John 14:16; Rom. 8:26; 1 John 2:1).
d. John 14:18: Jesus here refers to his appearances to the disciples after the resurrection (compare 14:19), not to the coming of the Spirit.
e. Jesus and the Holy Spirit are both involved in various activities: raising Jesus (John 2:19-19-22); Rom. 8:9-11), raising the dead (John 5:21; 6:39-40, 44, 54, Rom. 8:9-11), dwelling in the believer (John 14:16; 2 Cor. 13:5; Col. 1:27), interceding for the believer (Rom. 8:26; Heb. 7:25), sanctifying believers (Eph. 5:26; 1 Pet. 1:2), etc. These works prove that the two persons are both God, but not that Jesus is the Holy Spirit.
G. The Father is not the Holy Spirit
1. The Father sent the Holy Spirit: John 14:15; 15:26.
2. The Holy Spirit intercedes with the Father for us: Rom. 8:26-27.
3. The Father and the Holy Spirit are distinguished as two persons in Matt. 28:19.
4. Is the Father the Holy Spirit?
a. Matt. 1:18; Luke 1:35: It is argued that the Holy Spirit is the Father of the incarnate Son of God; this argument ignores the fact that the “conception” is not a product of physical union between a man and a woman!
b. The Father and the Holy Spirit are both said to be active in various activities; the resurrection of Jesus (Gal. 1:1; Rom. 8:11), comforting Christians (2 Cor. 1:3-4; John 14:26), sanctifying Christians (Jude 1; 1 Pet. 1:2), etc. The most these facts prove is that the two work together; they do not prove the two are one person.
VI. The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit Are Each Someone Distinct from the Other Two (i.e., they are three “persons”)
A. Matt. 28:19
1. “the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit”: use of definite article before each personal noun indicates distinct persons unless explicitly stated otherwise; compare Rev. 1:17; 2:8, 26
2. The views that “Father” and “Son” are distinct persons but not the Holy Spirit, or that the Holy Spirit is not a person at all, or that all three are different offices or roles of one person, are impossible in view of the grammar (together with the fact that in Scripture a “spirit” is a person unless context shows otherwise).
3. Does singular “name” prove that the three are one person? No; cf. Gen. 5:2; 11:14; 48:6; and esp. 48:16. Thus, the word “name” can apply distinctly to each of the three (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit) and does not imply that they have only one name.
4. “Name” need not be personal name, may be title: Is. 9:6; Matt. 1:23.
B. Acts 2:38 and Matt. 28:19
1. Neither passage specifies that certain words are to be spoken during baptism; nor does the Bible ever record someone saying, “I baptize you in the name of....”
2. Those said to be baptized in the name of Jesus (whether or not the formula “in the name of Jesus” was used) were people already familiar with the God of the OT:
a. Jews: Acts 2:5, 38; 22:16
b. Samaritans: Acts 8:5, 12, 16
c. God-fearing Gentiles: Acts 10:1-2, 22, 48
d. Disciples of John the Baptist: Acts 19:1-5
e. The first Christians in Corinth were Jews and God-fearing Gentiles: Acts 18:1-8; 1 Cor. 1:13
3. Trinitarian formula for baptism (if that is what Matt. 28:19 is) was given in context of commissioning apostles to take the gospel to “all the nations,” including people who did not know of the biblical God
4. Cross-referencing Acts 2:38 and other Acts references to baptism “in Jesus’ name” with Matthew 28:19 to prove that Jesus is the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is hermeneutically flawed, since none of these passages is seeking to make such a point and none of them is claiming that baptism must be performed using a particular formula.
C. God the Father and the Son Jesus Christ are two persons
1. The salutations: Rom. 1:7; 1 Cor. 1:3; 2 Cor. 1:2; Gal. 1:3; Eph. 1:2; 6:23; Phil. 1:2; 1 Thess. 1:1; 2 Thess. 1:1, 2; 1 Tim. 1:1, 2; 2 Tim. 1:2; Tit. 1:4; Philem. 3; James 1:1; 2 Pet. 1:2; 2 John 3
2. Two witnesses: John 5:31-32; 8:16-18; cf. Num. 35:30; Deut. 17:6; 19:15
3. The Father sent the Son: John 3:16-17; Gal. 4:4; 1 John 4:10; etc.; cf. John 1:6; 17:18; 20:21
4. The Father and the Son love each other: John 3:35; 5:20; 14:31; 15:9; 17:23-26; cf. Matt. 3:17 par.; 17:5 par.; 2 Pet. 1:17
5. The Father speaks to the Son, and the Son speaks to the Father: John 11:41-42; 12:28; 17:1-26; etc.
6. The Father knows the Son, and the Son knows the Father: Matt. 11:27; Luke 10:22; John 7:29; 8:55; 10:15
7. Jesus our Advocate with the Father: 1 John 2:1
D. Jesus is not God the Father
1. Is. 9:6: “Father of eternity” means eternal; compare other names formed with word “father”: Abialbon, “father of strength” = strong (2 Sam. 23:31);Abiasaph, “father of gathering” = gatherer (Ex. 6:24); Abigail, a woman’s name (!), “father of exultation” = exulting (1 Chron. 2:16).
2. John 10:30
a. Jesus did not say, “I am the Father,” nor did he say, “the Son and the Father are one person.”
b. The first person plural esmen (“we are”) implies two persons.
c. The neuter word for “one” (hen) is used, implying essential unity but not personal unity.
d. John 10:30 in context is a strong affirmation of Christ’s deity, but does not mean that he is the Father.
3. John 5:43: Jesus’ coming in his Father’s name means not that he was the Father because he had the Father’s name, but that, while others come in their own name (or their own authority), Jesus does not; he comes in his Father’s name (on his Father’s authority).
4. John 8:19; 16:3: Ignorance of Jesus is indeed ignorance of the Father, but that does not prove that Jesus is the one he calls “My Father.”
5. John 14:6-11
a. Jesus and the Father are one being, not one person.
b. Jesus said, “I am in the Father,” not “I am the Father.”
c. The statement, “the Father is in me,” does not mean Jesus is the Father; compare John 14:20; 17:21-23.
6. John 14:18: An older adult brother can care for his younger siblings, thus preventing them from being “orphans,” without being their father.
7. Colossians 2:9: Does not mean that Jesus is the Father, or that Jesus is an incarnation of the Father; rather, since “Godhead” (theotês) means Deity, the state of being God, the nature of God, Jesus is fully God, but not the only person who is God. “The Godhead” here does not = the Father (note that Jesus is in the Father, John 10:38; 14:10, 11; 17:21), but the nature of the Father. See II.B.3.
8. The Father and the Son are both involved in various activities: raising Jesus (Gal. 1:1; John 2:19-22), raising the dead (John 5:21); 6:39-40, 44, 54, 1 Cor. 6:14), answering prayer (John 14:13-14; 15:16; 16:23), sending the Holy Spirit (John 14:16; 15:26; 16:7), drawing people to Jesus (John 6:44; 12:32), etc. These common works do prove that the two persons are both God, but not that Jesus is the Father
E. The Son existed before his Incarnation, even before creation
1. Prov. 30:4: This is not predictive prophecy; “prophecy” in 30:1 translates massa, which is rendered elsewhere as “burden.”
2. The Son created all things, requiring of course that he existed when he did so: See above, IV.E.1.
3. Jesus was “with” (pros or para) God the Father before creation: John 1:1; 17:5; pros in John 1:1 does not mean “pertaining to,” although it does in Hebrews 2:17; 5:1 (which use pros with ta).
4. Jesus, the Son of God, existed before John the Baptist (who was born before Jesus): John 1:15, cf. 1:14-18, 29-34.
5. Jesus, the Son, came down from heaven, sent from the Father, and went back to heaven, back to the Father: John 3:13, 31; 6:33; 38, 41, 46, 51, 56-58, 62; 8:23, 42; 13:3; 16:27-28; cf. Acts 1:10-11; cf. the sending of the Holy Spirit, John 16:5-7; 1 Pet. 1:12
6. Jesus, speaking as the Son (John 8:54-56), asserts His eternal preexistence before Abraham: John 8:58
7. The Son explicitly said to exist “before all things”: Col. 1:17, cf. 1:12-20
8. These statements cannot be dismissed as true only in God’s foreknowledge
a. We are all “in God’s mind” before creation; yet such passages as John 1:1 and John 17:5 clearly mean to say something unusual about Christ.
b. To say that all things were created through Christ means that He must have existed at creation.
c. No one else in Scripture is ever said to have been with God before creation.
9. Texts which speak of the Son being begotten “today” do not mean he became the Son on a certain day, since they refer to his exaltation at his resurrection (Acts 13:33; Heb. 1:3-5; 5:5; cf. Ps. 2:7; cf. also Rom. 1:4).
F. Jesus is not the Holy Spirit
1. The Holy Spirit is “another Comforter”: John 14:16; compare 1 John 2:1.
2. Jesus sent the Holy Spirit: John 15:26; 16:7.
3. The Holy Spirit exhibits humility in relation to, and seeks to glorify, Jesus (John 16:13-14).
4. The Son and the Holy Spirit are distinguished as two persons in Matt. 28:19.
5. The Holy Spirit descended upon Jesus: Luke 3:22.
6. Is Jesus the Holy Spirit?
a. 2 Cor. 3:17: the Spirit is here called “Lord” in the sense of being Yahweh or God, not Jesus (cf. v. 16, citing Ex. 34:34; cf. v. 17 in the Revised English Bible); note Acts 28:25-27, cf. Is. 6:8-10.
b. 1 Cor. 15:45: Jesus is “a life-giving Spirit,” not in the sense that he is the Holy Spirit whom he sent at Pentecost, but in the sense that he is the glorified God-man; and as God he is Spirit by nature. All three persons of the Trinity are Spirit, though there are not three divine Spirits; and only one person is designated “the Holy Spirit.”
c. Rom. 8:27, 34: the fact that two persons intercede for us is consistent with the fact that we have two Advocates (John 14:16; Rom. 8:26; 1 John 2:1).
d. John 14:18: Jesus here refers to his appearances to the disciples after the resurrection (compare 14:19), not to the coming of the Spirit.
e. Jesus and the Holy Spirit are both involved in various activities: raising Jesus (John 2:19-19-22); Rom. 8:9-11), raising the dead (John 5:21; 6:39-40, 44, 54, Rom. 8:9-11), dwelling in the believer (John 14:16; 2 Cor. 13:5; Col. 1:27), interceding for the believer (Rom. 8:26; Heb. 7:25), sanctifying believers (Eph. 5:26; 1 Pet. 1:2), etc. These works prove that the two persons are both God, but not that Jesus is the Holy Spirit.
G. The Father is not the Holy Spirit
1. The Father sent the Holy Spirit: John 14:15; 15:26.
2. The Holy Spirit intercedes with the Father for us: Rom. 8:26-27.
3. The Father and the Holy Spirit are distinguished as two persons in Matt. 28:19.
4. Is the Father the Holy Spirit?
a. Matt. 1:18; Luke 1:35: It is argued that the Holy Spirit is the Father of the incarnate Son of God; this argument ignores the fact that the “conception” is not a product of physical union between a man and a woman!
b. The Father and the Holy Spirit are both said to be active in various activities; the resurrection of Jesus (Gal. 1:1; Rom. 8:11), comforting Christians (2 Cor. 1:3-4; John 14:26), sanctifying Christians (Jude 1; 1 Pet. 1:2), etc. The most these facts prove is that the two work together; they do not prove the two are one person.
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Rob Bowman has a complete set of these proofs on each of the points regarding the Trinity here:
http://bib.irr.org/biblical-basis-o...2XWq1YXRAfRgBJ1F_KupvTOtzrGdC-KiOk_lXfJ3IKevI
http://bib.irr.org/biblical-basis-o...2XWq1YXRAfRgBJ1F_KupvTOtzrGdC-KiOk_lXfJ3IKevI
Rob Bowman has a complete set of Scriptural reasons for the subpoints of the Trinity doctrine here:
http://bib.irr.org/biblical-basis-o...2XWq1YXRAfRgBJ1F_KupvTOtzrGdC-KiOk_lXfJ3IKevI
There is one God.
This one God is the single divine being known in the OT as Jehovah or Yahweh (“the LORD”).
The Father of our Lord Jesus Christ is God.
The Son, Jesus Christ, is God.
The Holy Spirit is God.
The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are each someone distinct from the other two.
Conclusion: The Bible teaches the Trinity.
What difference does the doctrine of the Trinity make?
Using his Scripture proofs, you can easily defend the Trinity against heretical views of God's nature.
For instance, Oneness people deny this point: The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are each someone distinct from the other two.
Like I have said, heretical groups also distort church history to justify their claims and to support their boogeyman narrative of Constantine or the Roman Catholic church. The RC Church has doctrinal errors but the Trinity is not one of them.
http://bib.irr.org/biblical-basis-o...2XWq1YXRAfRgBJ1F_KupvTOtzrGdC-KiOk_lXfJ3IKevI
There is one God.
This one God is the single divine being known in the OT as Jehovah or Yahweh (“the LORD”).
The Father of our Lord Jesus Christ is God.
The Son, Jesus Christ, is God.
The Holy Spirit is God.
The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are each someone distinct from the other two.
Conclusion: The Bible teaches the Trinity.
What difference does the doctrine of the Trinity make?
Using his Scripture proofs, you can easily defend the Trinity against heretical views of God's nature.
For instance, Oneness people deny this point: The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are each someone distinct from the other two.
Like I have said, heretical groups also distort church history to justify their claims and to support their boogeyman narrative of Constantine or the Roman Catholic church. The RC Church has doctrinal errors but the Trinity is not one of them.
“The community of Jesus may have no false gods beside him, whether money (Matt. 6:24), the ‘belly’ (Phil. 3:19), or the cosmic powers (Gal. 4:8-11). They must serve him alone, do his will and remain faithful to him.”
Ibid.
So says NIDNTT. But is it true?
A reminder to our readers, “him” is a reference to “the one, only and unique God...the God whom Christians worship...the God of the fathers...the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob...the God of Israel...the God of Jesus Christ”.
Hence the importance of the question for us all, who and how many is the God of Jesus Christ?
Ibid.
So says NIDNTT. But is it true?
A reminder to our readers, “him” is a reference to “the one, only and unique God...the God whom Christians worship...the God of the fathers...the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob...the God of Israel...the God of Jesus Christ”.
Hence the importance of the question for us all, who and how many is the God of Jesus Christ?
Who is the God of Jesus?
a. the Father
b. the Trinity
How many persons is the God of Jesus?
a. 1
b. 3
a. The one, only and unique God = the God whom Christians worship = the God of the fathers = the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob = the God of Israel = the God of Jesus = the Father.
or
b. The one, only and unique God = the God whom Christians worship = the God of the fathers = the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob = the God of Israel = the God of Jesus = the Trinity.
a. the Father
b. the Trinity
How many persons is the God of Jesus?
a. 1
b. 3
a. The one, only and unique God = the God whom Christians worship = the God of the fathers = the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob = the God of Israel = the God of Jesus = the Father.
or
b. The one, only and unique God = the God whom Christians worship = the God of the fathers = the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob = the God of Israel = the God of Jesus = the Trinity.
I love how Matthew 28:19 is always used when in the Book of Mark and Luke's version is to do these in Jesus' NAME only.
And you know why I believe that's what Jesus actually said (Mark and Luke's version) to Matthew 28:19?
Because in the Book of Acts, Peter/Timothy/Paul and few others did not Baptize Matthew 28:19, they Baptized how Mark and Luke write it.
Almost makes one think that Matthew 28:19 was changed by Constantine like he changed the "Original Nicene Creed!"