Why I now believe that salvation can be lost.

[Margo74]

Q. Can eternal life be lost?
A. Not sure, let's see

Rom 5:18So then, just as one trespass brought condemnation (eternal death) for all men, so also one act of righteousness brought justification and life (eternal life) for all men.

But in the end, very few men partake this eternal life, what happened to the rest? Did they lose the eternal life?! How can something eternal be lost?!

I'm not saying eternal life can be lost but everything good from God remains unto us a promise we work towards and we are assured to partake if we emerge victorious in the end. As much as all the work was done in the past, it remains a promise to us.

An OSAS person is the one that likes quoting these promises and applying them now.

Anything can be lost, including eternal life. Salvation is eternal life IF we believe, love, obey, repent when we disobey. Any of the following can cause us to lose the gift of eternal life - losing faith and not regaining it; stop loving Jesus Christ and never start loving Him again; disobey Christ's two great commandments and refuse to repent for doing so. Our choice by free will and our consequence.

 

[BillG]

Many folks here say exactly that. Beware.

I have seen many on here say that and genuinely believe they do not sin.

When you challenge with sins of omission they counter with I unknowingly sin so that does not count.

For me no one has an excuse for sinning.

In my prayer times I ask God "Have I sinned today that I'm not aware was a sin?

It's amazing, humbling and heartbreaking when he reveals that.
And boy he does he.
I would much rather know than not know.
That's how we grow to become more like Jesus.

My prayer times do not normally go down the line of confessing sins already committed.

I tend to confess then straight away and if I don't I ain't a happy chappy.
Then I fess up at the start of my prayer time.

 

[Margo74]

That’s the Word of God. Romans 5:8. Take it up with God if you have a problem.

lol .. isn't it amazing how many of us have selective hearing with each other and many of us even with God .. He speaks but do we listen or when He speaks, do we hear only what we wish to hear ..

 

[Noose]

Anything can be lost, including eternal life. Salvation is eternal life IF we believe, love, obey, repent when we disobey. Any of the following can cause us to lose the gift of eternal life - losing faith and not regaining it; stop loving Jesus Christ and never start loving Him again; disobey Christ's two great commandments and refuse to repent for doing so. Our choice by free will and our consequence.

I personally think eternal life is eternal but now are working towards it.

1 Pet 1:3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! By His great mercy He has given us new birthb into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4and into an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, reserved in heaven for you, 5who through faith are shielded by God’s power for the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time.

 

[Margo74]

I have seen many on here say that and genuinely believe they do not sin.

When you challenge with sins of omission they counter with I unknowingly sin so that does not count.

For me no one has an excuse for sinning.

In my prayer times I ask God "Have I sinned today that I'm not aware was a sin?

It's amazing, humbling and heartbreaking when he reveals that.
And boy he does he.
I would much rather know than not know.
That's how we grow to become more like Jesus.

My prayer times do not normally go down the line of confessing sins already committed.

I tend to confess then straight away and if I don't I ain't a happy chappy.
Then I fess up at the start of my prayer time.

I try, too, to confess and profess sorrow and repentance each time I sin. If we are really in turn with God and His Will and Commandments, we know when we sin and we know if we are sorry and repent or not. Some of my sins have been daily and one in particular was very persistant but I kept on expressing sorrow and repentance and in asking for help. Finally, that sin is on its way out.

 

[BillG]

That’s the Word of God. Romans 5:8. Take it up with God if you have a problem.

Romans 5:8-11
8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. 9 Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him. 10 For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. 11 And not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received the reconciliation.

Romans 5:1-2

Faith Triumphs in Trouble
1 Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, 2 through whom also we have access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

Justified by faith and access to the Father by this faith into this grace.

According to some that is not enough.

 

[Margo74]

I personally think eternal life is eternal but now are working towards it.

1 Pet 1:3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! By His great mercy He has given us new birthb into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4and into an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, reserved in heaven for you, 5who through faith are shielded by God’s power for the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time.

The gift is for eternal life but you must first accept the gift and then keep it. You and only you can make the choice to accept the gift and you and only you can choose to keep it by starting and then continuing in believing, loving, obeying, and repenting when you disobey. God offered ALL the gift of eternal life but He will never FORCE anyone to accept it or to keep it if they accept it. What would be the point of forcing anyone?

 

[stonesoffire]

Believing in Christ means believing his perfect life, his death on the cross and his resurrection. It also means surrendering to him, which yes, means loving others. Loving others is not a work, it is a fruit.

I agree. The fruit is the result of being one with Him, covered by Him, and the focus of our life.

 

[Noose]

You’re deliberately twisting what I said. You said loving others is a work and I said loving others is a fruit. Now how about leaving the Garden of Eden and coming to the grace of the cross and empty tomb.

And you misunderstood me.
A command is to be obeyed and not to expose the fruit in you. But okay, let's call it a fruit then.

 

[notuptome]

Yes I am zealous through the Holy Spirit for the gospel.
And it is you who knows not the gospel preached by Jesus and the Apostles.
It is you who denies the scriptures and states that the Pentecostal Christian faith and doctrine of the first church is
no longer applicable nor true.
The epistle to Titus is not written to any Roman Catholics, nor to any Eastern Orthodox believers, nor to any Protestants, and it
definitely wasn't written to any U.S. version of Christianity, - the epistle of Titus was written to the Pentecostal Spirit-filled churches
of the NT where all started with Acts 2:38 and all disciples spoke in tongues as the sign of their baptism of the Holy Spirit.

Your dearth of bible understanding is obvious. Titus was written by the Holy Spirit for the profit of all who read and receive it.

There is no such thing as Pentecostal gospel. Pentecost was and remains a Jewish feast day.

Jesus will hold me fast. I can never be lost because Jesus holds me fast. Jesus purchased me at awful cost and I am His precious possession. My Savior loves me so He will never let me go.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Margo74]

Romans 5:8-11
8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. 9 Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him. 10 For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. 11 And not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received the reconciliation.

Romans 5:1-2

Faith Triumphs in Trouble
1 Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, 2 through whom also we have access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

Justified by faith and access to the Father by this faith into this grace.

According to some that is not enough.

Accept the gift and then ENDURE in faith, love, obedience, and repentance in disobedience and then and only then will eternal salvation be/remain eternal. Like any gift given us, we accept or reject it and if we accept it, we keep it forever or we misplace it but find it again and keep it (aka repenting when we sin) or we throw it away and go our own way and no longer God's Way. Our choice - our consequence.

 

[BillG]

I try, too, to confess and profess sorrow and repentance each time I sin. If we are really in turn with God and His Will and Commandments, we know when we sin and we know if we are sorry and repent or not. Some of my sins have been daily and one in particular was very persistant but I kept on expressing sorrow and repentance and in asking for help. Finally, that sin is on its way out.

Amen sister.

And I know our Father will fully deliver you from this.

His timing is perfect.

If we are aware of it and want to be released from it then that is a great place to be in.

That may seem a bit weird to say but it means we want to be like Jesus.
Walk as children of our Father.

If God were to deal with stuff straight away then what use would we be to those he will give us to help?

We would not be any use.

Romans 8:28-30
28 And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose. 29 For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30 Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified.

Which leads to

Ephesians 2:8-10
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.

For good works that we will walk in.

 

[Margo74]

Your dearth of bible understanding is obvious. Titus was written by the Holy Spirit for the profit of all who read and receive it.

There is no such thing as Pentecostal gospel. Pentecost was and remains a Jewish feast day.

Jesus will hold me fast. I can never be lost because Jesus holds me fast. Jesus purchased me at awful cost and I am His precious possession. My Savior loves me so He will never let me go.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Right, Jesus WILL NEVER LET GO .. BUT you can let go and walk away and later return aka repent or never return aka never repent. JESUS will hold your hand IF you let Him but you can pull your hand away.

 

[Margo74]

Amen sister.

And I know our Father will fully deliver you from this.

His timing is perfect.

If we are aware of it and want to be released from it then that is a great place to be in.

That may seem a bit weird to say but it means we want to be like Jesus.
Walk as children of our Father.

If God were to deal with stuff straight away then what use would we be to those he will give us to help?

We would not be any use.

Romans 8:28-30
28 And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose. 29 For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30 Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified.

Which leads to

Ephesians 2:8-10
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.

For good works that we will walk in.

Yes, I know He will deliver me coz I am repenting each time and doing so genuinely and the repentance brings forgiveness and full restoration of my life with and in Christ and it gives strength of healing so that I can and do persevere in trying and in seeing that such is slowly but steadily and surely paying off. Repenting genuinely and God knows how genuine it is as He reads our hearts will always work.

 

[BillG]

And you misunderstood me.
A command is to be obeyed and not to expose the fruit in you. But okay, let's call it a fruit then.

Galatians 5:22
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,

 

[notuptome]

Right, Jesus WILL NEVER LET GO .. BUT you can let go and walk away and later return aka repent or never return aka never repent. JESUS will hold your hand IF you let Him but you can pull your hand away.

Wrong. Very wrong. The butterfly cannot go back to the caterpillar. The Christian cannot go back to the heathen.

You must contemplate the love of Christ and all that He did for us. We cannot save ourselves and we cannot unsave ourselves. We have only our sanctification at stake not our salvation.

2 Cor 5:21 demonstrates the gift of Christ and 2 Cor 5:17 illustrates the change Christ produces in our lives.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[calibob]

That remind me of an old AA motto; "You can pickle a cucumber but you can't turn a pickle into a cucumber."

So what's blasphemy of the Holy Spirit and why is it the only unforgivable sin?

 

[Noose]

The gift is for eternal life but you must first accept the gift and then keep it. You and only you can make the choice to accept the gift and you and only you can choose to keep it by starting and then continuing in believing, loving, obeying, and repenting when you disobey. God offered ALL the gift of eternal life but He will never FORCE anyone to accept it or to keep it if they accept it. What would be the point of forcing anyone?

If on your part, you have to do anything, even yawning let alone accepting and believing, then the gift is not free, is it?
You are not a sinner because of what you do but what Adam did, and you are also not justified because of what you do but what Christ did - this is what free means.

 

[BillG]

Your dearth of bible understanding is obvious. Titus was written by the Holy Spirit for the profit of all who read and receive it.

There is no such thing as Pentecostal gospel. Pentecost was and remains a Jewish feast day.

Jesus will hold me fast. I can never be lost because Jesus holds me fast. Jesus purchased me at awful cost and I am His precious possession. My Savior loves me so He will never let me go.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

I see you are responding to waggles.

Ah but can you evidence what you say above by talking in tongues?

If not you can manufacture it.

So let's start.

Say slowly

She will come on a Honda.

Then speed it up a bit till you get to the the speed where it sounds like.

Shewillcomeonahonda.

Try it with

I will have a shandy.

Then tongues will follow normally as the mind gets used to it.

It makes my blood boil it really does.

I went to a Christian gathering many years ago.
I was struggling and I went forward for prayer.

The person who came to me listened which is good.

Then he asked me "Do you speak in tongues?
I said no.
He then said and this is true.

"If you don't speak in tongues it's evidence that you are not saved, would you like to?

I said no and left as quick as rabbit down a rabbit hole.

I carried that with me for a long time.
For many years I thought I was not saved.
I found myself seeking tongues more than anything else.

Now I know that tongues is a gift, not a right of passage unto salvation.

I have no problems with tongues today.
I am not a cessationlist.

I believe the gifts in the early church are still for today
But we cannot and should not manufacture them.

It's a gift.

1 Corinthians 13:1

The Greatest Gift
1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I have become sounding brass or a clanging cymbal.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

Rev 14:
12Here is a call for the endurance of the saints who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

13And I heard a voice from heaven telling me to write, “Blessed are the dead—those who die in the Lord from this moment on.”

“Yes,” says the Spirit, “they will rest from their labors, for their deeds will follow them.”

You have a lot to do and when you die, you shall rest from your deeds.

Eph 2:10, For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus (born again spiritually) unto good works. No good works before being born again, only after we are born again. We have a lot of work to do to maintain our relationship with God, but that is all after we have been born again, no works to initially get our relationship with him.