That the Savior of the world, the Messiah, the Christ, might come from one of its tribes.
Why did God choose Israel?
- Thread starter jsr1221
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kaylagrl
Guest
well God didn't simply 'choose Israel'. He chose Abraham. Then He chose Isaac because Isaac was Abraham's true son. Then He chose Jacob from before the womb as ONE of Isaac's sons.. The choice of Israel stemmed from that. And as Paul points out, He did not choose the whole of Israel. He chose the election of Israel. They are not all Israel who are Israel.
From Abraham onwards He chose some out of the whole.
Israel were not in fact all descendant of Jacob. They included descendants of the servant of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. They also included the mixed multitude who left Egypt with them (Ex 12.38) and any who joined them in the worship of YHWH. Thus Israel was a conglomerate nation. And God's promises were always to a remnant. A number of nations became 'Israelites' by force, including the Edomites under Hyrcanus, and the many Gentiles in Galilee under Aristobulus. They also contained many Gentile proselytes. So 'the Jews' in Jesus day were a mixed bag.
The coming of the Messiah had a huge effect on Israel. Those who rejected Him were cut off from Israel. The remnant who believed in Him formed the true Israel.(Rom 11.12-24; John 15.1-6). These were 'the election of Israel'.
When Gentile proselytes joined with Israel as believers in the Messiah they too were grafted into Israel. They became Israelites as proselytes had always done.
What were then seen as 'the Jews' were those whom God had rejected. They are no part of the true Israel of God.
From Abraham onwards He chose some out of the whole.
Israel were not in fact all descendant of Jacob. They included descendants of the servant of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. They also included the mixed multitude who left Egypt with them (Ex 12.38) and any who joined them in the worship of YHWH. Thus Israel was a conglomerate nation. And God's promises were always to a remnant. A number of nations became 'Israelites' by force, including the Edomites under Hyrcanus, and the many Gentiles in Galilee under Aristobulus. They also contained many Gentile proselytes. So 'the Jews' in Jesus day were a mixed bag.
The coming of the Messiah had a huge effect on Israel. Those who rejected Him were cut off from Israel. The remnant who believed in Him formed the true Israel.(Rom 11.12-24; John 15.1-6). These were 'the election of Israel'.
When Gentile proselytes joined with Israel as believers in the Messiah they too were grafted into Israel. They became Israelites as proselytes had always done.
What were then seen as 'the Jews' were those whom God had rejected. They are no part of the true Israel of God.
Of course the primitive, tribal Hebrews believed they were 'chosen' (or favoured) by their particular god.
So thought the Egyptians, the Romans, the Druids, the Vikings, the Incas, the Sioux, ancient Chinese, certain Australian aborigines, the Hindus, the Zulus and the Eskimos .... of their particular god or gods !
Just that the Hebrew myth has lingered longer. Doesn't make it factual.
So thought the Egyptians, the Romans, the Druids, the Vikings, the Incas, the Sioux, ancient Chinese, certain Australian aborigines, the Hindus, the Zulus and the Eskimos .... of their particular god or gods !
Just that the Hebrew myth has lingered longer. Doesn't make it factual.
With the singular distinction that their God is God.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
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kaylagrl
Guest
If you were a Christian you might have a different opinion. As Christians we go by what the Bible says. Since you dont consider the Bible factual, that would be your opinion of the Jews.
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kaylagrl
Guest
Quote "The coming of the Messiah had a huge effect on Israel. Those who rejected Him were cut off from Israel. "
Not according to Romans. Romans says the Jews are purposely blinded to the Messiah until the time of the Gentiles is complete. So there are Jews now who do not yet believe in Christ who will in the end come to him.
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kaylagrl
Guest
Last time I checked the Bible begins with the formation of the earth. There is no "before" God. Beginning and end.
Uhmm who wrote your first book of the bible?
What year?
Like I said before all "religions" there was Kemet.
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kaylagrl
Guest
Like I said, God created the universe,Hes the creator of all. If you dont believe that why are you here? We believe the Bible here and that God is the beginning and end. I think most agree Moses wrote Genesis and scholars place the authorship between 1440 and 1400 bc between the time Moses led the Israelites out of Egypt and his death.
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DesiredHaven
Guest
Religion can be shown before Moses
For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man:
but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
It doesnt say they spake by the will of man
Faith/ religion goes back as far as it is written in Abel
By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain,
by which he obtained witness that he was righteous,
God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.
It is God testifying of these things not man, even in Heb 10:15
Even the secular dictionaries makes faith synonymous with religion
And by faith Abel offered unto God
But then to say to that religion (or faith) that there was no faith (or religion) before Egypt because of who wrote the books, would be saying contrary to the fact that the holy men who spoke did so as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man:
but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
It doesnt say they spake by the will of man
Faith/ religion goes back as far as it is written in Abel
By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain,
by which he obtained witness that he was righteous,
God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.
It is God testifying of these things not man, even in Heb 10:15
Even the secular dictionaries makes faith synonymous with religion
And by faith Abel offered unto God
But then to say to that religion (or faith) that there was no faith (or religion) before Egypt because of who wrote the books, would be saying contrary to the fact that the holy men who spoke did so as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
Oh the education level
Maybe a little bit of etymology , word definitions and history would be benifial
I had a book about Santa clause I wonder if he's going to fly buy and drop off some presents this year.
Maybe a little bit of etymology , word definitions and history would be benifial
I had a book about Santa clause I wonder if he's going to fly buy and drop off some presents this year.
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kaylagrl
Guest
This is a place for Christian chat.If you dont believe dont mock those who do or you'll find yourself banned here pretty quickly. If God and Santa are the same to you you're in the wrong place. I can give you answers,history,etymology as long as your arms and you'll simply argue back that Im a simpleton to believe what I believe. So thats an effort in futility.If you dont believe, fine,but dont come in here bashing and mocking people that do,thanks.
That is true but that will be because they are again grafted into the true Israel, true believers in the Messiah, and become members of the true church of Jesus Christ. It is by becoming Christians that they will find life.
As Paul explains in Rom 9-11 the elect of God, both Jew and Gentile, will all be united in the olive tree which is the true Israel. (Jer 11.16). The 'all Israel' who will be saved consists of the election of Israel and the fullness of the Gentiles.
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kaylagrl
Guest
ps. What is your education btw? Not that it matters here since this is a discussion room. But please let us all know what education level you have? What you are an expert in.
K