Why Daniel's 70th week must be in the future

[Yahshua]

We are seeing the fruit of the preterists now, as so many are blind to what is happening with the plandemic.

I actually believe private interpretations and allegory to explain away Scripture is sin.

The anti- christ will come as a Global ruler, and force his mark.
Jesus will rule on a physical Throne, on Earth.

Preterists do not, and will not understand unfolding events because of their unBiblical interpretations.

To lay all my cards out on the table; I'm not a preterist (i.e. "all prophecies fulfilled in the past") but a historicist (i.e. "parts of prophecy being fulfilled throughout history up to today with more to go") and I believe everything we're seeing with this plandemic (note my Haiti post) is still a fulfillment of prophecy...everything's right on time.

I just also believe that the 70th week is already fulfilled. I don't believe an unfulfilled 70th week is necessary to make all other prophecies fit.

 

[Yahshua]

It sounds terribly like Sammy Davis Junior he is describing.
Why not?

"Part of show business is magic. You don’t know how it happens. "

 

[eternally-gratefull]

concerning this tribulation spoke of which Jesus said would occure after the AOD mentioned by Daniel

This is what Jesus said in Matt 24.

21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be. 22 And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the [c]elect’s sake those days will be shortened.

two things to think of.

1. Jerusalem was not around at the begining of the world
2. All flesh means all flesh. This was not possible in 70 AD, Even if every jew was killed. Flesh would still survive, (and did)

Also. Jesus told us how those days will be shortened.

29 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

As we can see

1. All the people of the Earth will see him coming
2. This is not a local event. It is not just those In Jerusalem.
3. It happens immediately following the great tribulation. Where Jesus said he must bring to a close or no flesh would survive.

Until the past few decades, it was not even possible to wipe out all flesh on earth. With the advent of modern day weapons. it is a possibility

 

[OldSage]

concerning this tribulation spoke of which Jesus said would occure after the AOD mentioned by Daniel

This is what Jesus said in Matt 24.

21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be. 22 And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the [c]elect’s sake those days will be shortened.

two things to think of.

1. Jerusalem was not around at the begining of the world
2. All flesh means all flesh. This was not possible in 70 AD, Even if every jew was killed. Flesh would still survive, (and did)

Also. Jesus told us how those days will be shortened.

29 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

As we can see

1. All the people of the Earth will see him coming
2. This is not a local event. It is not just those In Jerusalem.
3. It happens immediately following the great tribulation. Where Jesus said he must bring to a close or no flesh would survive.

Until the past few decades, it was not even possible to wipe out all flesh on earth. With the advent of modern day weapons. it is a possibility

Jesus is talking about two separate events EG

One is a localized event
16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:

The other is global

 

[OldSage]

in comparison to WW1 and WW2 the events of 70 AD was a picnic.

Jerusalem AD70 was like the first of many concentration camps, that is all.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Jesus is talking about two separate events EG

One is a localized event
16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:

The other is global

yes

the AOD is a local event

the great tribulation is a global event

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Jerusalem AD70 was like the first of many concentration camps, that is all.

the great tribulation will be greater than WW1 and WW2. that is hard for me to comprehend. But I believe God when he says it will happen.

 

[OldSage]

the great tribulation will be greater than WW1 and WW2. that is hard for me to comprehend. But I believe God when he says it will happen.

It's a sinful Futurist lie EG, based on what?
Based on lies about Daniel 9 and other scriptures.
I do believe Futurist teachers will be held accountable for conning the gullible

 

[ewq1938]

2. All flesh means all flesh.

No. He is speaks of the flesh of the elect who are alive when the Great Tribulation begins. If the Great Tribulation was going to last as long as it originally was intended to be, no elect would survive it so God changed the length of the Great Tribulation to be shorter than originally intended.

 

[ewq1938]

To lay all my cards out on the table; I'm not a preterist (i.e. "all prophecies fulfilled in the past") but a historicist (i.e. "parts of prophecy being fulfilled throughout history up to today with more to go")

That's also known as partial preterism vs. what is known as full preterism.

I reject both as a futurist. This means I believe all of the Olivet Discourse and most of Revelation are future events. PP generally believes most of these have been fulfilled and usually at or near 70AD.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

It's a sinful Futurist lie EG, based on what?
Based on lies about Daniel 9 and other scriptures.
I do believe Futurist teachers will be held accountable for conning the gullible

Well I believe people like you will be held accountable for trying to spiritualized prophesy and not taking Gods word at face value

But that is a straw man argument and totally worthless to Any conversation on these issues

So Let’s stick to what the word says and lay off the judgmental crap why don’t we

Dan 9 is But one of many prophetic passages if you are going to try interpret prophecy they Must be taken as a whole not By itself.

Jesus Mentioned Daniel 9. So what he says concerning this is relevant

Jesus said Flat out when you see the WOD run for then there will be great tribulation such has never been in the world and if it were not cut short no flesh would survive. So
Immediately after those days the world will see the son of Man coming in the clouds

Either take him literally. Or try to make him say something else. Which makes his whole Conversation meaningless

I chose to take him literally

 

[eternally-gratefull]

No. He is speaks of the flesh of the elect who are alive when the Great Tribulation begins. If the Great Tribulation was going to last as long as it originally was intended to be, no elect would survive it so God changed the length of the Great Tribulation to be shorter than originally intended.

No he said all Flesh would die
But for the sake of the elect he will
Cut it short

He did not say all the elect will die, why would you make it appear he said something he did not

 

[OldSage]

I was told that futurism was invented by the RCC (Ribera?)
Whether these accusations are true or not I have no idea, but that certainly
would line up with scripture;

Daniel 7 25 He will speak against the Most High and oppress his holy people and try to change the set times and the laws. The holy people will be delivered into his hands for a time, times and half a time.

Check - Did the RCC usurp God's authority?
Check - Did the Catholic Church persecute Jews?
Check - Did the RCC change the set times in Daniel?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I was told that futurism was invented by the RCC (Ribera?)
Whether these accusations are true or not I have no idea, but that certainly
would line up with scripture;

Daniel 7 25 He will speak against the Most High and oppress his holy people and try to change the set times and the laws. The holy people will be delivered into his hands for a time, times and half a time.

Check - Did the RCC usurp God's authority?
Check - Did the Catholic Church persecute Jews?
Check - Did the RCC change the set times in Daniel?

Actually historicism was most likely invented by the RCC when they changed the interpretation of prophecy from a more literal approach to a more symbolic approach. They reject futurism as you do
they are ammils in their thinking. Ie, they think as you all these prophecies are completed

 

[AandW]

I'm not sure I understand what you're getting at here. Are you citing this as a reason not to trust the account of Josephus regarding other historic testimony like the destruction of Jerusalem?


Isaiah 53:2
For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him.


Who knows what he actually looked like, but it would seem that as far as Josephus was concerned the Messiah wasn't a handsome man by the world standards, which fits the scripture above.

I am merely asking if he is wrong about Christ, and we already know he is a TRAITOR even to this very day, how much of his account would you find accurate VS making Rome happy about their conquest?

 

[AandW]

or this?

Josephus’ Description of Jesus
3. (63) Now, there was about this time Jesus, a wise man, if it be lawful to call him a man, for he was a doer of wonderful works-a teacher of such men as receive the truth with pleasure. He drew over to him both many of the Jews, and many of the Gentiles. He was [the] Christ; (64) and when Pilate, at the suggestion of the principal men amongst us, had condemned him to the cross, those that loved him at the first did not forsake him, for he appeared to them alive again the third day, as the divine prophets had foretold these and ten thousand other wonderful things concerning him; and the tribe of Christians, so named from him, are not extinct at this day.
The Antiquities of the Jews, Book 18, Chapter 3
From The Works of Josephus,
translated by William Whiston
Hendrickson Publishers, 1987

That was written [10 years before] he betrayed his own troups and Nation.

 

[OldSage]

Actually historicism was most likely invented by the RCC when they changed the interpretation of prophecy from a more literal approach to a more symbolic approach. They reject futurism as you do
they are ammils in their thinking. Ie, they think as you all these prophecies are completed

Well Futurism and Preterism are to me two stinking abominations from the pit of hell.
They fulfill Daniel 7:25 and I can well believe that the RCC created them

 

[AandW]

Because the city was razed to the ground. Men, women, children. All decimated. If many Jews didn't flee beforehand no one would've survived the initial blood-lust. There's testimony that during the siege food was cut off and so some even resorted to eating their children.

It's not about the number of deaths, it's about the severity of it all (intensity and duration). If there were only 30,000 people in a town and that entire town was slaughtered: men, women and children alike...with no quarter, no rest or surrendering allowed...and then the town burned with every building that survived the burning smashed to powder, that's considered a massacre.

Secondly, we need to remember that Daniel (as well as the disciples listening the Messiah during the Olivet Discourse) had no concern about "the world". They cared about what was going to happen TO THEM. Their concern was for their people. The Angel and The Messiah were speaking about the great suffering that would befall the Jews that wouldn't be matched "since there was a nation".

What nation of people has suffered (in intensity and duration) for hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of years, since they were expelled from their homeland, more than the Jews?

We have to acknowledge (though some might not want to) that throughout history there were many surviving Jews hated and mistreated by many gentile Christians & Catholics for "murdering the Christ"; also considered "heretics" and "judaizers" to both papal authority as well as to laity and royalty...kicked out of countries...blamed for diseases...and they were also the primary victims of the inquisitions. And on and on throughout history.

I am going to capitalize this for the importance of it...
THE JEWS GOT WHAT THEY DESERVED FOR BEGINNING A WAR THEY COULD NEVER WIN!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Well Futurism and Preterism are to me two stinking abominations from the pit of hell.
They fulfill Daniel 7:25 and I can well believe that the RCC created them

Futurism again was not invented by the RCC, it is the opposite of what the RCC believes

most people believe the RCC created the belief of fulfilled prophecy due to its extreme anti Semitic beliefs, ie, God is done with Israel

which is false

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I am going to capitalize this for the importance of it...
THE JEWS GOT WHAT THEY DESERVED FOR BEGINNING A WAR THEY COULD NEVER WIN!

Better yet

it was prophesied what they did would happen, and what the consequences they would suffer would happen