"What Will Hell...
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Wrong. The Lord speaks much about the eternal punishment of those who take the mark in Revelation.
The Lake of Fire is a place of eternal torment.
Revelation 14
9And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, 10The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: 11And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
All that reject Jesus' offer of Salvation shall be cast into the Lake of Fire.
Revelation 20:15 “And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.”
Revelation 21:8 “But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.”
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Re: What will Hell be like?
Seeing as how nobody down there has any more reason to be civil, then I
think we can expect to be ill treated in their world.
Also, folks down there are deprived of the regeneration spoken of per John
3:3-8 so they are there as they were here. Well; human nature tends to
deteriorate, sort of like the decay experienced by road kill and spoiled fruits
and vegetables. I'd expect that the lost get badder and baddder and badder
as time goes on so that even a saint like Mother Teresa would eventually
become so evil that her conduct in Hell would be disturbing to behold.
And then; according to Matt 7:21-23, not everyone talking the talk will make
the cut.
Well; I would not want to be one of them because they will surely be
mocked cruelly and without mercy by some of the netherworld's unruly
crowd. I can just hear their giggling and their taunts:
Hey Christian! How's about sharing the gospel with us ay? Tell us about the
love of God and how that's working for ya. Awwwww-Haw-Haw-Haw-
Hawwwwwwwww!
I'd rather end up in Hell as a Bernie Madoff than a failed Christian because
ol' ponzi schemer Bernie is sure to be given far more respect down there
than a bible thumper.
_
Re: What will Hell be like?
Seeing as how nobody down there has any more reason to be civil, then I
think we can expect to be ill treated in their world.
Also, folks down there are deprived of the regeneration spoken of per John
3:3-8 so they are there as they were here. Well; human nature tends to
deteriorate, sort of like the decay experienced by road kill and spoiled fruits
and vegetables. I'd expect that the lost get badder and baddder and badder
as time goes on so that even a saint like Mother Teresa would eventually
become so evil that her conduct in Hell would be disturbing to behold.
And then; according to Matt 7:21-23, not everyone talking the talk will make
the cut.
Well; I would not want to be one of them because they will surely be
mocked cruelly and without mercy by some of the netherworld's unruly
crowd. I can just hear their giggling and their taunts:
Hey Christian! How's about sharing the gospel with us ay? Tell us about the
love of God and how that's working for ya. Awwwww-Haw-Haw-Haw-
Hawwwwwwwww!
I'd rather end up in Hell as a Bernie Madoff than a failed Christian because
ol' ponzi schemer Bernie is sure to be given far more respect down there
than a bible thumper.
_
Are you telling me and everyone, that God (the source of life), will keep people alive to torture them for eternity?
I believe God is Just, and merciful.
When I am preaching I often have to correct false assumptions and explain these things even to atheists and non-believers. I have heard before "I'm not a Christian because a God who would torment a non-believer forever isn't a religion I want to be a part of..." or something said to that effect.
Turns out, that's not what God does and there are over two dozen verses that prove it. Giving people the truth about hell and immortality is a very refreshing experience for people and attracts people to Christ.
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God has a passion for mercy; but it's not His only passion.
• Rom 11:22 . . Behold then the kindness and severity of God
The human condition is so bad, so corrupt, and so hopeless that only the
death of God's sole descendant is adequate to rescue everybody from the
lake of fire depicted at Rev 20:10-15 where numbers of folks will be
terminated with extreme prejudice by a mode of death akin to a foundry
worker falling into a kettle of molten iron.
Now, who in their right might mind can look at that scene and not come
away with the opinion that it depicts a very cruel and unusual punishment?
Why not just put folks down with an injection so that they softly and gently
fall asleep never to wake up? Wouldn't that be nicer, more humane? Yes that
would be nicer and more humane; but would it satisfy God?
Adam started out in the image of God. So at first, his sense of right and wrong
was in agreement with his creator's sense of right and wrong. Then came the
forbidden fruit incident when Adam's original sense of right was lost and his
conscience became that of a tin god.
Well; that's why many of us cannot appreciate our maker's justice. If we did,
we wouldn't be criticizing Him for the way He intends to punish folks.
Instead, we'd be cheering Him on; like this:
• Rev 16:5-7 . .Then I heard the angel in charge of the waters say: You are
just in these judgments: You who are, and who were; the Holy one,
because you have so judged . . .Yes, Lord God Almighty, true and just are
your judgments.
* The "Holy one" is none other than God's descendant, i.e. the sweet little
babe away in a manger will be presiding at the great white throne event.
• John 5:22-23 . . Moreover, the Father judges no one, but has entrusted all
judgment to the Son, that all may honor the Son just as they honor the
Father.
• Acts 17:31 . . He has set a day when He will judge the world with justice
by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by
raising him from the dead.
_
God has a passion for mercy; but it's not His only passion.
• Rom 11:22 . . Behold then the kindness and severity of God
The human condition is so bad, so corrupt, and so hopeless that only the
death of God's sole descendant is adequate to rescue everybody from the
lake of fire depicted at Rev 20:10-15 where numbers of folks will be
terminated with extreme prejudice by a mode of death akin to a foundry
worker falling into a kettle of molten iron.
Now, who in their right might mind can look at that scene and not come
away with the opinion that it depicts a very cruel and unusual punishment?
Why not just put folks down with an injection so that they softly and gently
fall asleep never to wake up? Wouldn't that be nicer, more humane? Yes that
would be nicer and more humane; but would it satisfy God?
Adam started out in the image of God. So at first, his sense of right and wrong
was in agreement with his creator's sense of right and wrong. Then came the
forbidden fruit incident when Adam's original sense of right was lost and his
conscience became that of a tin god.
Well; that's why many of us cannot appreciate our maker's justice. If we did,
we wouldn't be criticizing Him for the way He intends to punish folks.
Instead, we'd be cheering Him on; like this:
• Rev 16:5-7 . .Then I heard the angel in charge of the waters say: You are
just in these judgments: You who are, and who were; the Holy one,
because you have so judged . . .Yes, Lord God Almighty, true and just are
your judgments.
* The "Holy one" is none other than God's descendant, i.e. the sweet little
babe away in a manger will be presiding at the great white throne event.
• John 5:22-23 . . Moreover, the Father judges no one, but has entrusted all
judgment to the Son, that all may honor the Son just as they honor the
Father.
• Acts 17:31 . . He has set a day when He will judge the world with justice
by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by
raising him from the dead.
_
Moses and the Prophets testify of Jesus, but people weren't listening to them. When Jesus the Messiah came they didn't hear Jesus and when Jesus rose from the dead they still weren't hearing him.
My theory about what the point of this story is and what Abraham said is to look harder at the scripture because they were believing things that weren't even in the scripture to begin with. The rich man didn't even know that what Abraham was telling him couldn't be found even if his brothers read Moses and the Prophets front to back a million times.
But what they would have found is that Jesus the Messiah is in Moses and the Prophets. If they would just look more they would see it.
Acts 10
43All the prophets testify about him that everyone who believes in him receives forgiveness of sins through his name.”
What things?
What was Abraham telling him that couldn't be found in M&P?
All I know is that God said the wages of sin is death and the first lie that the serpent/devil told Eve was that she would not die if she ate the fruit from the tree of knowledge of good and evil...
I choose to believe what God said and Jesus referred to death as a sleep and when I am asleep I am not conscience of anything going on around me so I don't believe that when you die you go to heaven or hell but that you are asleep in the grave until Jesus comes again.
I don't believe in hell where people are burning there now and had the unfortunate place of being born before me and having to burn for their sins much longer than someone who dies after they do where is the fairness of that? Or that my loved ones can see me going through bad things on earth and be joyful in heaven.
I don't believe in a vengeful God who is waiting for us to mess up so we can burn for eternity.
I believe what God said the wages of sin is death. In Malachi 4:3 Then you will trample the wicked, for they will be ashes under the soles of your feet on the day I am preparing,” says the LORD of Hosts. So if the wicked will be ashes underfoot they are dead and not eternally burning in hell. The wicked will be gone forever which is eternity and sin will never rise again after the second coming of Jesus.
I choose to believe what God said and Jesus referred to death as a sleep and when I am asleep I am not conscience of anything going on around me so I don't believe that when you die you go to heaven or hell but that you are asleep in the grave until Jesus comes again.
I don't believe in hell where people are burning there now and had the unfortunate place of being born before me and having to burn for their sins much longer than someone who dies after they do where is the fairness of that? Or that my loved ones can see me going through bad things on earth and be joyful in heaven.
I don't believe in a vengeful God who is waiting for us to mess up so we can burn for eternity.
I believe what God said the wages of sin is death. In Malachi 4:3 Then you will trample the wicked, for they will be ashes under the soles of your feet on the day I am preparing,” says the LORD of Hosts. So if the wicked will be ashes underfoot they are dead and not eternally burning in hell. The wicked will be gone forever which is eternity and sin will never rise again after the second coming of Jesus.
.
Although many details pertaining to the afterlife are missing in the Old
Testament, Moses and the prophets wrote quite a bit about retribution.
Torah-trained Jews have always known something was in the works. For
example:
• Ex 34:6-7 . . Then The Lord passed by in front of Moses and proclaimed:
The Lord, The Lord God, compassionate and gracious, slow to anger, and
abounding in loving-kindness and truth; who keeps loving-kindness for
thousands, who forgives iniquity, transgression and sin; yet He will by no
means leave the guilty unpunished: visiting the iniquity of fathers on the
children and on the grandchildren to the third and fourth generations.
Now the big problem with the rich man's brothers wasn't related to knowing:
their problem was related to hearing-- common among the Jews.
• Matt 13:15 . . For this people's heart has become calloused; they hardly
hear with their ears, and they have closed their eyes. Otherwise they might
see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their hearts and
turn, and I would heal them.
The writer to the Hebrews said something like that too in 5:11.
"Concerning him we have much to say, and it is hard to explain, since you
have become dull of hearing."
The Greek word for "dull" means lazy, i.e. indifferent. (cf. Heb 6:12)
_
Although many details pertaining to the afterlife are missing in the Old
Testament, Moses and the prophets wrote quite a bit about retribution.
Torah-trained Jews have always known something was in the works. For
example:
• Ex 34:6-7 . . Then The Lord passed by in front of Moses and proclaimed:
The Lord, The Lord God, compassionate and gracious, slow to anger, and
abounding in loving-kindness and truth; who keeps loving-kindness for
thousands, who forgives iniquity, transgression and sin; yet He will by no
means leave the guilty unpunished: visiting the iniquity of fathers on the
children and on the grandchildren to the third and fourth generations.
Now the big problem with the rich man's brothers wasn't related to knowing:
their problem was related to hearing-- common among the Jews.
• Matt 13:15 . . For this people's heart has become calloused; they hardly
hear with their ears, and they have closed their eyes. Otherwise they might
see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their hearts and
turn, and I would heal them.
The writer to the Hebrews said something like that too in 5:11.
"Concerning him we have much to say, and it is hard to explain, since you
have become dull of hearing."
The Greek word for "dull" means lazy, i.e. indifferent. (cf. Heb 6:12)
_
Immortality is an intrinsic attribute of man's soul. It is not God's desire that any soul should choose to spend eternity in a state of rebellion against Him. To cast God's loving gift of His only begotten Son back in His face is an act worthy of eternal damnation. All men make a choice who they will serve. There is no middle ground.
2 Peter 3:9
“The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.”
Men choose their eternal destiny.
Runningman said:
The Rich Man and Lazarus is a story meant to convey a point.
The rich man posited that if his brothers had just had a little more information, then their hearts would be changed, and they would seek the Lord. The point is made that it is faith, not more information, that saves.
This fact is proven by the Revelation account of the followers of antichrist who encounter firsthand the demonstration of God's wrath and power. Their mocking and cursing only accelerates. More "infomation" only serves to further harden their hearts.
The Rich Man and Lazarus is a story meant to convey a point.
The rich man posited that if his brothers had just had a little more information, then their hearts would be changed, and they would seek the Lord. The point is made that it is faith, not more information, that saves.
This fact is proven by the Revelation account of the followers of antichrist who encounter firsthand the demonstration of God's wrath and power. Their mocking and cursing only accelerates. More "infomation" only serves to further harden their hearts.
Ecclesiastes 9:5 For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing. They have no further reward, because the memory of them is forgotten. 6Their love, their hate, and their envy have already vanished, and they will never again have a share in all that is done under the sun.…
Malachi 4:3 Then you will trample the wicked, for they will be ashes under the soles of your feet on the day I am preparing,” says the LORD of Hosts.
God's word plainly states the dead know nothing no living awareness, their feelings are gone and if the wicked are ashes under our feet the wicked have burned up and they are eternally destroyed.
.
Ecclesiastes is the Bible's fun book because it's chock full of normal thinking
instead of religious dogma. Ecclesiastes requires very little interpretation as
anybody who's been around the block a time or two can easily relate to its
thoughts.
Solomon composed his comments from the perspective of a philosophical
man who's understanding of life and the hereafter is moderated by empirical
evidence and the normal round of human experience. It's a handy book of
the Bible for showing that not all religious people are kooks with their heads
in the clouds and unable to see things as they are through the eyes of
normal people.
Just a word of caution: According to Matt 12:42, Luke 11:31, John 1:1-14,
and Col 2:3; Christ trumps Solomon, so beware of using proof texts from
Ecclesiastes to refute, moderate, and/or water down Christ's teachings
related to the afterlife.
In addition: Christ is the voice of God (John 3:34, John 8:26, John 8:28,
John 12:49, John 14:24) whereas there is not the slightest textual evidence
in the book of Ecclesiastes that Solomon was anybody's voice but his own
when he wrote it.
To my knowledge, Solomon had never seen the afterlife for himself, viz: he
wasn't an expert witness; whereas Christ had seen the afterlife for himself
and knew what he was talking about.
• John 3:31-32 . . He who comes from above is above all, he who is of the
earth is from the earth and speaks of the earth. He who comes from heaven
is above all. What He has seen and heard, of that he bears witness.
Christ is also highly recommended, whereas to my knowledge, Solomon
isn't.
• Matt 17:5 . . This is my Son, the beloved, whom I have approved; listen to
him.
So then, when encountering remarks in the book of Ecclesiastes that are out
of step with Christ's teachings in the New Testament; my unsolicited
spiritual counseling is to ignore Solomon and go with the wisdom of "my
Son".
• John 8:12 . . I am the light of the world. He that follows me will by no
means walk in darkness, but will possess the light of life.
FAQ: Doesn't the apostle Paul say that all Scripture is God breathed?
REPLY: There is a difference between inspiration and dictation.
Solomon was no doubt inspired to record his personal world view in the Bible,
but we shouldn't assume his world view quotes God word for-word the way
Christ does.
_
Ecclesiastes is the Bible's fun book because it's chock full of normal thinking
instead of religious dogma. Ecclesiastes requires very little interpretation as
anybody who's been around the block a time or two can easily relate to its
thoughts.
Solomon composed his comments from the perspective of a philosophical
man who's understanding of life and the hereafter is moderated by empirical
evidence and the normal round of human experience. It's a handy book of
the Bible for showing that not all religious people are kooks with their heads
in the clouds and unable to see things as they are through the eyes of
normal people.
Just a word of caution: According to Matt 12:42, Luke 11:31, John 1:1-14,
and Col 2:3; Christ trumps Solomon, so beware of using proof texts from
Ecclesiastes to refute, moderate, and/or water down Christ's teachings
related to the afterlife.
In addition: Christ is the voice of God (John 3:34, John 8:26, John 8:28,
John 12:49, John 14:24) whereas there is not the slightest textual evidence
in the book of Ecclesiastes that Solomon was anybody's voice but his own
when he wrote it.
To my knowledge, Solomon had never seen the afterlife for himself, viz: he
wasn't an expert witness; whereas Christ had seen the afterlife for himself
and knew what he was talking about.
• John 3:31-32 . . He who comes from above is above all, he who is of the
earth is from the earth and speaks of the earth. He who comes from heaven
is above all. What He has seen and heard, of that he bears witness.
Christ is also highly recommended, whereas to my knowledge, Solomon
isn't.
• Matt 17:5 . . This is my Son, the beloved, whom I have approved; listen to
him.
So then, when encountering remarks in the book of Ecclesiastes that are out
of step with Christ's teachings in the New Testament; my unsolicited
spiritual counseling is to ignore Solomon and go with the wisdom of "my
Son".
• John 8:12 . . I am the light of the world. He that follows me will by no
means walk in darkness, but will possess the light of life.
FAQ: Doesn't the apostle Paul say that all Scripture is God breathed?
REPLY: There is a difference between inspiration and dictation.
Solomon was no doubt inspired to record his personal world view in the Bible,
but we shouldn't assume his world view quotes God word for-word the way
Christ does.
_
