Tithing...
- Thread starter 88
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
If only folks would simply believe the scriptures.....
I believe that since Jesus receives tithes, it means he wants tithes, to me obviously for our sakes, not his.
Jesus is receiving tithes, so I want to keep yielding it up through my local church. Like you, my wife and I have been faithful with the tithe most of our 50 marriage years, and have never lacked in anything.
Jesus also loves a cheerful giver of offerings according to what's placed in my heart to give above the tithe. The offerings are spread among several ministries that emphasize evangelism.
The Pharisees were not typically farmers, yet tithed things like spices they purchased, and pitched coins loudly into the temple boxes. Would God give the tithe blessing to a wealthy attorney who doesn't have a corn harvest to tithe, so excuses himself? Would he be excused from supporting the temple and priests because all he has is gold? I doubt it. The Levites could visit anyone in Israel to collect tithes and offerings, certainly not leaving the wealthy off their list.
There is nothing in the Bible to declare an end to tithing, which began long before the Law commanded it. The OT ends with a promise to tithers, which had no expiration date. The blessing is the same that Abraham enjoyed. There is likewise no expiration for offerings. There was no requirement that offerings be strictly of agri products actually grown on your own land. A vase could be declared holy to the Lord by a household, then tithed or offered, it's value determined by the priest.
I've learned through the years that persistent tithers are the blessed members who gladly make offerings too, unafraid to obey this major principle that is the root of holy prosperity. Rarely have I seen a blessed wealthy person who would dare oppose tithing. The wealthiest among our churches are carrying a major financial load, making up for those who worship their bank accounts too much to be generous with it. They don't complain, seeing they have rule over 90% of their wonderful bounty.
What saddens me is the modern resentment of preachers who need full support of their congregations. That's in spite of 1 Cor 9:13 Do[FONT="] ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar?[/FONT][FONT="]14 Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.[/FONT]
So why would someone ignore that, denying that minister the benefit of a congregational tithe that should be no less a living to count on than the old priesthood? Those old priests didn't settle for whatever people preferred to give, and neither should a gospel minister have to depend on less than tithes, and be further blessed with cheerful offerings in addition to tithes.
If any remain convinced tithes are only possible from farming, then I recommend those people become farmers right away. Otherwise, enjoy the benefits in economies that have a tiny minority of farmers, as was in ancient Israel.
Consider that if tithing 10%, there remains 90% to pay bills with. Not having ability to pay necessary expenses like utilities suggests a lack of financial management. Several of our businessmen and women help with financial counselling of church members. We look at checkbook logs, or go over their online record, always finding spending problems, like eating out too much, too much entertainment, buying new cars when a used car is wiser to own, living off credit cards to keep up with the Jones's lifestyle, keeping a boat in the yard which rarely gets used (sell it), and any of hundreds of other reasons people fail financially even when earning well. We had a lady frequently asking for bill paying help. She got the flu and needed help from our ladies, who found that the woman had over 100 parakeets to care for. She couldn't resist buying them, would not sell one. Pet poor.
Those of us living by faith need to ask God for help to do the things he wants us to do, rather live in denial of how God chose to bless his people financially. Try not to bring neighbors to the point of saying you need to sell parakeets, or whatever you are blessed with.
Melchizedek is a type of Christ; the Scripture does not say that he is Christ. Beginning your post with "if people would simply believe the scriptures" is humorous given this is what you write immediately after.
Nor is there anything to declare an end to stoning, but we don't do that today. The absence of a specific abrogation does not invalidate the overall abrogation of the Law as explained in Romans, Galatians and Hebrews. There were examples of tithing before the Law, but there was no clear commandment (as there was with circumcision). Abraham tithed war spoils and kept nothing; Jacob bargained with God for abundant blessing and there is no record that he gave tithes of anything. In Malachi, God was speaking to priests, not to the people... read the context carefully.
As to the rest of your post, don't make the mistake of assuming that people who don't "tithe" (as you understand it) don't give to support the work of ministry... even generously.
Where in Scripture do we see tithing done on anything other than agricultural or livestock?
You don't have 90% left unless you are cheating. 3 types of tithes were taught in the O.T., not one. It may have been 23 1/3% or 30%.
Abraham tithed war spoils and kept nothing. In Numbers, look how war spoils were handled...Melchizedek is a type of Christ; the Scripture does not say that he is Christ. Beginning your post with "if people would simply believe the scriptures" is humorous given this is what you write immediately after.
Nor is there anything to declare an end to stoning, but we don't do that today. The absence of a specific abrogation does not invalidate the overall abrogation of the Law as explained in Romans, Galatians and Hebrews. There were examples of tithing before the Law, but there was no clear commandment (as there was with circumcision). Abraham tithed war spoils and kept nothing; Jacob bargained with God for abundant blessing and there is no record that he gave tithes of anything. In Malachi, God was speaking to priests, not to the people... read the context carefully.
As to the rest of your post, don't make the mistake of assuming that people who don't "tithe" (as you understand it) don't give to support the work of ministry... even generously.
Eleazar the priest said to the men of battle who had gone out to war, “This is the regulation in the Instruction that the Lord commanded Moses: Gold, silver, copper, iron, tin, and lead— anything that can withstand fire—you will put through the fire and it will be clean. It will also be purified with the water of purification. Anything that isn’t able to withstand fire, you will immerse in water. You must wash your clothes on the seventh day and you will be clean. Afterward you may enter the camp.” The Lord said to Moses: You, Eleazar the priest, and the leaders of the community’s households must take an inventory of the valuable property and the captives, both human and animals, and divide the valuable property between the warriors who went into battle and the entire community. You will offer as tribute to the Lord from each warrior who went into battle one living being in five hundred, whether human, oxen, donkeys, or flocks. Take it from the warriors’ half and give it to Eleazar the priest as a gift offering to the Lord. But from the Israelites’ half you will take one out of every fifty, whether from human, oxen, donkeys, or flock—all the animals. You will give them to the Levites who carry out the duties of the Lord’s dwelling. -Numbers 31:21-31
Paul took up collections for the poor. The people in acts got together and sold all they had and shared. Preachers are due their wages. All we own belongs to God and we are called to be stewards of it. Have you read anything in the New Testament about people building a large building for worship with huge sounds ? You are a steward of all the money God has given you. Use it in a way which glorifies God, caring for the poor and orphans and widows and those who are in need. If you feel your church is a better steward of that money, give it to them. If you feel your pastor needs money for a home or bread, give it to them.
If you give in faith , God rewards you. If you feel tithing in faith caused you a financial blessing, it was faith in God which gave you this blessing not tithing. 100% of your money belongs to God. consider the poor, worship in truth and spirit, seek the things above, not looking to God as a financial genie but lay up for yourselves treasure in heaven! You yourselves know how generous your heart is. Cultivate loving God and such small matters as giving will be nothing at all, for from the largess your heart you will give Life itself beyond all measure and capacity of your own.
If you give in faith , God rewards you. If you feel tithing in faith caused you a financial blessing, it was faith in God which gave you this blessing not tithing. 100% of your money belongs to God. consider the poor, worship in truth and spirit, seek the things above, not looking to God as a financial genie but lay up for yourselves treasure in heaven! You yourselves know how generous your heart is. Cultivate loving God and such small matters as giving will be nothing at all, for from the largess your heart you will give Life itself beyond all measure and capacity of your own.
DOUBLE TITHING-----my pastor practiced double tithing----as a new pastor in the 1950's many pastors and churches were struggling in his group---he was taught by an older wise minister to double tithe-----well---he was blessed---his ministry was blessed---he pastored that church for almost 50 years----one of the conferences I attended had people in the 51% club---they gave 51% of their income to God----there were a couple of testimonies of giving 90%---they asked one of them how could you live on 10%-----he said he still had a million dollars a year left after giving...
Hear hearWonder if Brother Yet is seeing all of this as a "Guest?"
Miss ya Brother...........
(in case he is)
I remember and fondly think of Yet from time to time...Somebody new ended a post with "smiles" and I wondered if it was him
Remember how he used to do that?
I even went and searched out some of his old threads to see what his age was, as I
had forgotten... the new person was also an old fogie like us haha, well, a little older
actually, I think the age said something like seventy one, and Yet was only 66 so I
thought they were probably not the same person after all.. though ya never know
had forgotten... the new person was also an old fogie like us haha, well, a little older
actually, I think the age said something like seventy one, and Yet was only 66 so I
thought they were probably not the same person after all.. though ya never know
Well, if one is going to use O.T. standards, then your pastor was getting closer to correct than most!
There were 3 types of tithes in O.T. times. In addition, first fruits and offerings were made.
While your pastor did better than I typically hear in following O.T. law(e.g. Mal 3:10), he was still 1 tithe short.
Did he give the tenth of everything that went under the rod(look at my signature line for an explanation)? Did he eat any of his tithes? How did he handle the Year of Jubilee?
There are several of us taking on the tithing teaching. (and supporting grace giving)Wonder if Brother Yet is seeing all of this as a "Guest?"
Miss ya Brother...........
(in case he is)
Hopefully that brings him joy.
Seems to me he was pretty anti organized church, though? On that I disagree.
(Sorry for the repeat post, computer glitch.)
Aside from our financial tithe, let's just say we give away A LOT of figs, cucumbers and eggs!
I'm going off the post you wrote:
We tithe every month. 10% off the gross.
More importantly, we "tithe" our lives every week we go by the offering basket before we place anything monetary in it. We give the very best that we have: a humble and thankful heart and life.
10% off the gross is not 3 types of tithes being paid.
We give the very best that we have Compare this to the Scripture verse in my signature line.
On a side note, and not to be sarcastic, but being a coin collect, how does one give the very best one has when it comes to money? Are the bills all crisp or are the coins in MS70 condition, possibly proof? How does that work?
First off, I'd like to point out that your Scripture from Leviticus 27 is a different kind of tithe than a standard one. Leviticus is talking about special vows and gifts. Otherwise....
We give 10% of my gross paycheck right off the bat. But in addition to that, there are various other offerings, especially from the agriculture on our property (figs, eggs, veggies, etc.)
And the "best" of money isn't always a quality thing. For those with an agricultural tithe, it does mean as perfect an offering (animal, grain, etc.) as possible. But when it comes to money, it has nothing to do with quality, rather the first.
Hope that helps some.
First off, I'd like to point out that your Scripture from Leviticus 27 is a different kind of tithe than a standard one. Leviticus is talking about special vows and gifts. Leviticus 27 is discussing vows up to the last part, where it then goes into the topic of tithes. What you are referring to as a "non standard" tithe was one of three mandatory(for those in the agricultural and livestock occupations) tithes, known as the Levitical tithe. Notice the text doesn't suggest it was optional tithe for those who were in the livestock/agricultural professions.
We give 10% of my gross paycheck right off the bat. But in addition to that, there are various other offerings, especially from the agriculture on our property (figs, eggs, veggies, etc.) So back to my original question, then, of why one type of tithe but not the others?
And the "best" of money isn't always a quality thing. For those with an agricultural tithe, it does mean as perfect an offering (animal, grain, etc.) as possible. Offerings and tithes are two different subjects. What Biblical teaching on tithing mandates the "perfect" of your crop/livestock?
But when it comes to money, it has nothing to do with quality, rather the first. Based on what Biblical teaching?
Is it a sin when you do not have to tithe on? Example, one has no property or agri- produce and what he has is earning money or a paycheck from his job. Do one need to convert them to animals, livestock or vegetables for him to exercise the 3 tithes?
Thank you.
Thank you.
I just make it a simple 10% on everything--- if someone gives me a cow---I figure the value and pay 10%-----over 40- years I have tried both----tithing and not tithing-----just want people to be blessed----in these last days we need to fund the spread of the Gospel---the Church I was visiting last year had people tithing 51% and some up to 90% voluntarily--they asked him how can you live on 10%---he said he had no trouble living on a million a year ...