There will be no Rapture!!!
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Paul only states after the AC is revealed, which we know is after Mid-Point.
I personally believe no one, not even you, are taking into consideration why WE are HAPPY if we wait till one thousand three hundred and thirty-five days. 1,335 days, puts us between Mid-Point Trib and going into year 4 of the 7 year Trib.
I personally believe no one, not even you, are taking into consideration why WE are HAPPY if we wait till one thousand three hundred and thirty-five days. 1,335 days, puts us between Mid-Point Trib and going into year 4 of the 7 year Trib.
[re: 2Th2]
No, verses 1 & 2 make the case very well on their own.
Verses 3-8a then has Paul repeating the proper SEQUENCE, between those two distinct things, THREE TIMES... (making it abundantly clear.)
No one has to go anywhere else... unless they misdefine (as is commonly done) the phrase "the day of the Lord" (v.2); which just by simply looking back at Paul's words in 1Th5:1-3 clears up that matter, soundly.
[as I've pointed out numerous times throughout this thread]
No, verses 1 & 2 make the case very well on their own.
Verses 3-8a then has Paul repeating the proper SEQUENCE, between those two distinct things, THREE TIMES... (making it abundantly clear.)
No one has to go anywhere else... unless they misdefine (as is commonly done) the phrase "the day of the Lord" (v.2); which just by simply looking back at Paul's words in 1Th5:1-3 clears up that matter, soundly.
[as I've pointed out numerous times throughout this thread]
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To be clear, I am NEITHER "Calvinist" NOR "Arminianist".
So there's that.
["pre-trib rapture" doctrine is NOT exclusively held by Calvinists... people of all stripes hold to it... So it is not accurate to intimate that it is exclusively (or even "mostly") Calvinist doctrine. NOT SO!! (red herring, much?? )]
So there's that.
["pre-trib rapture" doctrine is NOT exclusively held by Calvinists... people of all stripes hold to it... So it is not accurate to intimate that it is exclusively (or even "mostly") Calvinist doctrine. NOT SO!!
(red herring, much?? )]
Jesus spoke about it in John 14:1-4. Let not your heart be troubled ye believe in God, believe also in me. In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myslef, that where I am, there ye may be also And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.
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^ @The_Watchers_2017 's Post #1067,
Many people mistakenly think the text states "the departure AND the man of sin be revealed FIRST"...
... and consequently incorrectly conclude that this (supposed) "be revealed FIRST" is thus saying "the rapture [of verse 1]" then must come "AFTER" that.
But this is to inject a meaning not being conveyed in Paul's words...
... by rearranging the text, and also by [incorrectly] PRESUPPOSING that the subject of the "false claim in verse 2" (the earthly-located DOTL time-period) is the SAME Subject as Paul's VERSE 1 SUBJECT ("our Rapture [IN THE AIR]"), which is it NOT.
Many people mistakenly think the text states "the departure AND the man of sin be revealed FIRST"...
... and consequently incorrectly conclude that this (supposed) "be revealed FIRST" is thus saying "the rapture [of verse 1]" then must come "AFTER" that.
But this is to inject a meaning not being conveyed in Paul's words...
... by rearranging the text, and also by [incorrectly] PRESUPPOSING that the subject of the "false claim in verse 2" (the earthly-located DOTL time-period) is the SAME Subject as Paul's VERSE 1 SUBJECT ("our Rapture [IN THE AIR]"), which is it NOT.
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Nothing happens mid-point. The AC is active from the beginning. The Falling away happens because of the Ac because they fall away from Christ to the AC.
There isn't a 1335 days in NT prophecy. Christ said the trib would be shortened. It's no longer 7 years but only half of that, a total of 452 months and nothing happens in the middle of it especially not the rapture.
There isn't a 1335 days in NT prophecy. Christ said the trib would be shortened. It's no longer 7 years but only half of that, a total of 452 months and nothing happens in the middle of it especially not the rapture.
^
2) liars saying "the day of the Lord [the Trib]" IS PRESENT / IS ALREADY HERE [PERFECT INDICATIVE; transitive verb in Grk]
3) that day (the DOTL / TRIB, from verse 2) will not "BE PRESENT" without the man of sin; they are inextricably connected... the TRIB is the "IN HIS TIME" (v.6); and the "IN THE NIGHT" (1Th5:1-3, etc... in that passage).
There is no way "the day of the Lord IS PRESENT" (as the falsehood claimed) without the presence [G3952] of "the man of sin" (v.9a,8a)
2) liars saying "the day of the Lord [the Trib]" IS PRESENT / IS ALREADY HERE [PERFECT INDICATIVE; transitive verb in Grk]
3) that day (the DOTL / TRIB, from verse 2) will not "BE PRESENT" without the man of sin; they are inextricably connected... the TRIB is the "IN HIS TIME" (v.6); and the "IN THE NIGHT" (1Th5:1-3, etc... in that passage).
There is no way "the day of the Lord IS PRESENT" (as the falsehood claimed) without the presence [G3952] of "the man of sin" (v.9a,8a)
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but here is Paul, including himself, in the Rapture AFTER the AC is revealed.
that can only mean, Paul, doesn't believe in pre-trib Rapture, because Paul, would definitely meet the standards for that Rapture [Dead in Christ], if pre-trib were true.
But Paul only writes about the Rapture he will FACTUALLY be in, the one that happens AFTER the AC is revealed.
that can only mean, Paul, doesn't believe in pre-trib Rapture, because Paul, would definitely meet the standards for that Rapture [Dead in Christ], if pre-trib were true.
But Paul only writes about the Rapture he will FACTUALLY be in, the one that happens AFTER the AC is revealed.
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Neither.
See again my Post #1060 - https://christianchat.com/threads/there-will-be-no-rapture.212356/post-5149680
... where I'd said, among other things, that I am NEITHER "Calvinist" NOR "Arminianist"
See again my Post #1060 - https://christianchat.com/threads/there-will-be-no-rapture.212356/post-5149680
... where I'd said, among other things, that I am NEITHER "Calvinist" NOR "Arminianist"
