Support your Local Jew!

[xuanvuive2013]

[video=youtube;T_5X1nM5VDw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_5X1nM5VDw[/video]

 

[zone]

some confused people may say this on this forum, but Dispensationalism does not preach this. The current "program" requires Jews to accept Christ as Lord, or be rejected themselves. It preaches a separate "program" for the ancient Jews, and a separate "program" for future Jews(in the Millennium Period).

I think you are confused about what Dispensationalism really is.... read some actual writings from Ryrie. The people defending Dispensationalism are not doing a good job, because they have no idea what they are saying that they believe.

no LT.
not confused at all about what dispensationalists teach.
we can start a thread specifically for that. i am reasonably familiar with it...every detail.

here's the problem:

"The current "program" requires Jews to accept Christ as Lord, or be rejected themselves. It preaches a separate "program" for the ancient Jews, and a separate "program" for future Jews(in the Millennium Period)."

huh? separate program for ancient jews?
were they not saved by faith in God's promises, by His Mercy and Grace, by election?

a separate program for future jews? (The Millennium?)

what was wrong with this AGE - The Messianic Age - where they have heard the Gospel.....and accepted or rejected?

they need a separate dispensation AFTER THE DAY OF JUDGMENT?

what's the Millennium FOR?

you really have to document this in Scripture...sooner or later.
it's a myth.
unless you can prove it from the bible.

what does paul mean by this (if he knew the jews had a separate dispensation coming)?:


Romans 10
1Brothers,a my heart’s desire and prayer to God for them is that they may be saved. 2For I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge. 3For, being ignorant of the righteousness of God, and seeking to establish their own, they did not submit to God’s righteousness. 4For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.b

The Message of Salvation to All
5For Moses writes about the righteousness that is based on the law, that the person who does the commandments shall live by them. 6But the righteousness based on faith says, “Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’” (that is, to bring Christ down) 7or “‘Who will descend into the abyss?’” (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead). 8But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith that we proclaim); 9because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. 11For the Scripture says, “Everyone who believes in him will not be put to shame.” 12For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, bestowing his riches on all who call on him. 13For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

14How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard?c And how are they to hear without someone preaching? 15And how are they to preach unless they are sent? As it is written, “How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the good news!” 16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed what he has heard from us?” 17So faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ.

18But I ask, have they not heard? Indeed they have, for

“Their voice has gone out to all the earth,
and their words to the ends of the world.”

19But I ask, did Israel not understand? First Moses says,

“I will make you jealous of those who are not a nation;
with a foolish nation I will make you angry.”

20Then Isaiah is so bold as to say,

“I have been found by those who did not seek me;
I have shown myself to those who did not ask for me.”

21But of Israel he says, “All day long I have held out my hands to a disobedient and contrary people.”

 

[Praus]

Is it wrong for the US to support Israel because they live in unbelief?

I'm the US and I support Israel for several reasons, none of which is "because they live in unbelief".

What does flesh/skin have to do with anything?

Matt 7:6 ¶ Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

BradC, we already know your opinion of "flesh/skin".

If you are really one of the righteous or one of the upright, then why have you sided with adulterous teachers twice in one week?

Is it wrong for Christians to identify with the US in their support of Israel against those who hate them and are their enemies?

שְׁמַע יִשְׂרָאֵל

שְׁמַע יִשְׂרָאֵל

[video=youtube;X9V_0h67G9c]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6pgg7khyYU[/video]


Shˁma Yisrael by Sarit Hadad

When the heart cries
only God hears
The pain rises out of the soul
A man falls down before he sinks down
With a little prayer (he) cuts the silence

Shma (Hear) Israel my God,
you're the omnipotent
You gave me my life,
you gave me everything

In my eyes a tear,
the heart cries quietly
And when the heart is quiet,
the soul screams

Shma (Hear) Israel my God,
now I am alone
Make me strong my God;
make it that I won't be afraid

The pain is big,
and there's no where to run away
End it because I can't take it anymore
(make the end of it because I have no more energy left within me)

When the heart cries,
Time stands still
All of a sudden, the man sees his entire life
He doesn't want to go to the unknown
He cries to his God right before a big fall

 

[zone]

If we support people who hate Jesus Christ just because of their ethnicity, then we love a persons skin/flesh over Jesus Christ !

That is Idolatry !

yes..it is.
treasonous idolatry as well.
(applies to all unbelievers...not just jews).
though xtians idolizing judaism or jewish beliefs or practices or culture BECAUSE they fear being cursed by God per: corruption Gen 12 OR because they have invented the Ultimate Replacement Theology:

JESUS AS GOD'S PLAN replaced by the Jewish State in the ME.

 

[BradC]

Back to the blame-shifting and drip, drip of guilting in lieu of Biblically supporting one's opinion.

Weird. . .red herring.

The request was not for you but go ahead and answer it if you like. Should we commend the people of Israel for the fruitfulness that has flourished in their land or do we ascribe evil to them to nullify their accomplishments? Simple question for anyone if they want to answer instead of analyzing the request.

 

[zone]

The request was not for you but go ahead and answer it if you like. Should we commend the people of Israel for the fruitfulness that has flourished in their land or do we ascribe evil to them to nullify their accomplishments? Simple question for anyone if they want to answer instead of analyzing the request.

they stole the land - ethnically cleansing semites who dwelt there in peace for 1500 years caring for the land.
they stole the resources and they continue to expand despite the settlement being declared ILLEGAL.
they bulldoze 500 year old olive groves.
they bulldoze arab houses.
they could not have had "the fruitfulness that has flourished in their land" without American money in the billions assisting.

they are there are Christ-rejectors; oppressing the people who were there when they arrived?....and you say God is blessing that?

no...America is Blessing "that" because they got sucker punched by a simple rewrite of Genesis 12:3.

how are those blessings working out for America?
did God forget?

 

[zone]

“Rabbi Ovadia Yosef, the religious scholar and spiritual leader of Israel's Sephardic Jews who transformed his downtrodden community of immigrants from North Africa and Arab nations and their descendants into a powerful force in Israeli politics, died on Monday... Yosef was often called the outstanding Sephardic rabbinical authority of the century. His prominence helped boost the confidence of his community, which makes up roughly half of Israel's population...” - AP Oct 7

......

“An eminent rabbi who heads Israel's third biggest political party sparked an uproar in Israel for saying that 6 million Jews perished in the Holocaust because they were reincarnations of sinners. Rabbi Ovadia Yosef was speaking in his weekly Saturday night sermon that is broadcast over the party’s radio stations and is beamed overseas by satellite. He said the six million Holocaust victims ‘were reincarnations of the souls of sinners, people who transgressed and did all sorts of things that should not be done. They had been reincarnated in order to atone.’ [Associated Press, Aug. 6, 2000].

Yehoshua Mashav told Israel Radio that “in plain language (Rabbi) Yosef was saying that Hitler...‘was simply the messenger of God sent to give the Jewish people their just desserts.” [The Independent (UK), Aug. 6, 2000].

“May the Holy Name visit retribution on the Arab heads, and cause their seed to be lost, and annihilate them. It is forbidden to have pity on them. We must give them missiles with relish, annihilate them. Evil ones, damnable ones.” [2001 Passover sermon. Cf. Haaretz, April 12, 2001].


is there an excuse for this?
what would that excuse be?

there's a reason for it - The Babylonian Talmud teaches it.
does anything excuse it?

is it likely to engender goodwill?
is goodwill the desire?


“Goyim were born only to serve us. Without that, they have no place in the world – only to serve the People of Israel...With gentiles, it will be like any person – they need to die, but [God] will give them longevity. Why? Imagine that one’s donkey would die, they’d lose their money. This is his servant... That’s why he gets a long life, to work well for this Jew. Why are gentiles needed? They will work, they will plow, they will reap. We will sit like an effendi and eat. That is why gentiles were created.” [Jerusalem Post, October 18, 2010].

Re: Support your Local Jew!

support Rabbi Ovadia Yosef?

just yes or no.

 

[BradC]

We have been patient and have tried to reason with them and we hoped for the best. At this stage I am going to leave them to their own devises and what they have convinced themselves to be the truth. My personal opinion is that they are naturally minded toward the things of God with prejudice and that has influenced how they believe.

 

[zone]

We have been patient and have tried to reason with them and we hoped for the best. At this stage I am going to leave them to their own devises and what they have convinced themselves to be the truth. My personal opinion is that they are naturally minded toward the things of God with prejudice and that has influenced how they believe.

and some have been patient with dispensationalist heresies.
who do not know the things of God.
they know the things they were taught by false teachers.

and they persist in spite of being shown.

hardened in unbelief.
believing false doctrine (and teaching it) is a serious matter.
one that leads to a sorry state.

repent dear friend.
i know a way out of dispnsationalism - if you ever realize you're in trouble.
past insults are forgiven.
PM me if you want help.
if not, can't help you...and will continue to stand against your false doctrine.
in the hope God in His goodness will lead you to repentance.

don't delay.
back on ignore - for both our sakes.

 

[Praus]

The article I posted is not a "personal opinion"...it is your "personal opinion" that it is...because it doesn't "line up" with your antisemitic rhetoric.

The article you posted is deceptive Messianic propaganda.

THE NAZIFICATION OF LIBERAL CHRISTIANITY..

The Christian document is pure anti-Semitism, since it presents the Jews as stateless beings.

There Is No New Anti-Semitism | BaltimoreChronicle.com

The Baltimore Chronicle
OPED:

There Is No New Anti-Semitism
by RABBI MICHAEL LERNER

The New York Times reported on January 31 about the most recent attempt by the American Jewish community to conflate intense criticism of Israel with anti-Semitism. In a neat little example of slippery slope, the report on "Progressive Jewish Thought and the New Anti-Semitism," written by Alvin H. Rosenfeld, moves from exposing the actual anti-Semitism of those who deny Israel's right to exist—and hence deny to the Jewish people the same right to national self-determination that they grant to every other people on the planet—to those who powerfully and consistently attack Israel's policies toward Palestinians, see Israel as racist the way that it treats Israeli-Arabs (or even Sephardic Jews), or who analogize Israel's policies to those of apartheid as instituted by South Africa.

...

What the Jewish establishment organizations have done is to make invisible the strong roots in Judaism for a different kind of policy. The most frequently repeated injunction in Torah are variations of the following command: "Do not oppress the stranger (the 'other'). Remember that you were strangers in the land of Egypt." Instead, the Jewish establishment has turned Judaism into a cheer-leading religion for a particular national state that has a lot of Jews, but has seriously lost sight of the Jewish values which early Zionists hoped would find realization there.

 

[jahsoul]

they stole the land - ethnically cleansing semites who dwelt there in peace for 1500 years caring for the land.
they stole the resources and they continue to expand despite the settlement being declared ILLEGAL.
they bulldoze 500 year old olive groves.
they bulldoze arab houses.
they could not have had "the fruitfulness that has flourished in their land" without American money in the billions assisting.

they are there are Christ-rejectors; oppressing the people who were there when they arrived?....and you say God is blessing that?

no...America is Blessing "that" because they got sucker punched by a simple rewrite of Genesis 12:3.

how are those blessings working out for America?
did God forget?

I tried to like this more than once...wasn't happening that but is as much truth as you can get about the plot of land over there. If Genesis 12:3 held true, why is the United States is such debt. Why is the country leaning all the way into sin? Or what about that verse that they would be lenders and not borrowers? Because they live in a place they call Israel doesn't make them the Children of Israel nor the seed of Abraham. Why is that so hard to comprehend?

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

they stole the land - ethnically cleansing semites who dwelt there in peace for 1500 years caring for the land.

semites dwelling in peace... Muslim conquest of the Levant - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

more semites dwelling in peace... Siege of Jerusalem (1187) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

still more semites dwelling in peace... Siege of Acre (1291) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

one last example of semites dwelling in peace... 1834 Arab revolt in Palestine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

and now back to your regularly scheduled 'research'...

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

they stole the resources and they continue to expand despite the settlement being declared ILLEGAL

deferring to 'international law' now? what happened to global government being a plot by the bad guys?

inconsistency strikes again...

 

[jahsoul]

deferring to 'international law' now? what happened to global government being a plot by the bad guys?

inconsistency strikes again...

Wouldn't your views regarding stealing resources and expansion negate the links you just posted?

 

[Ukorin]

I want to talk about this issue, but this thread is looking far too toxic. I have another thread focused on the theology, not prejudice. http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...view-scripture-dividing-people-scripture.html

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

Wouldn't your views regarding stealing resources and expansion negate the links you just posted?

i don't think any of my posts endorsed 'stealing resources and expansion'...i was just pointing out the hilarious irony of a certain conspiracy theorist appealing to international law...

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

In a neat little example of slippery slope, the report on "Progressive Jewish Thought and the New Anti-Semitism," written by Alvin H. Rosenfeld, moves from exposing the actual anti-Semitism of those who deny Israel's right to exist—and hence deny to the Jewish people the same right to national self-determination that they grant to every other people on the planet—to those who powerfully and consistently attack Israel's policies toward Palestinians, see Israel as racist the way that it treats Israeli-Arabs (or even Sephardic Jews), or who analogize Israel's policies to those of apartheid as instituted by South Africa.

what about when their attacks on israel's policies are false or completely one sided? or what about when their proposals would almost certainly result in the end of israel's identity as a jewish state? can we call it antisemitism then?

 

[Hizikyah]

I think we need to seperate Khazars from Yahdai (Jews).

Khazars are non Hebrew blood who converted to Judaisim, aka the Talmud of the Pharisees.

Revelation 2:9, "I know your works, and tribulation, and poverty (but you are rich), and I know how you are slandered by those who say they are Yahdaim, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan."

Real Yahdai (Jews) are blood Hebrews

Malakyah 3:6, "For I am Yahweh, I change not; therefore you sons of Yaaqob are not consumed."

Revelation 7:4-5, "And I heard the number of those who were sealed: And there were sealed 144,000 of all the tribes of the children of Israyl. Of the tribe of Yahdah (Judah) were sealed 12,000..."

 

[LT]

I think we need to seperate Khazars from Yahdai (Jews).

Khazars are non Hebrew blood who converted to Judaisim, aka the Talmud of the Pharisees.

Revelation 2:9, "I know your works, and tribulation, and poverty (but you are rich), and I know how you are slandered by those who say they are Yahdaim, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan."

Real Yahdai (Jews) are blood Hebrews

Malakyah 3:6, "For I am Yahweh, I change not; therefore you sons of Yaaqob are not consumed."

Revelation 7:4-5, "And I heard the number of those who were sealed: And there were sealed 144,000 of all the tribes of the children of Israyl. Of the tribe of Yahdah (Judah) were sealed 12,000..."

You know that Caleb was not born Hebrew, but was considered an Israelite... he was a Kenizzite, which is a tribe of Edom. Caleb was a convert!
There were provisions in the Mosaic Law for gentiles to convert.

 

[xuanvuive2013]

I think we need to seperate Khazars from Yahdai (Jews).

Khazars are non Hebrew blood who converted to Judaisim, aka the Talmud of the Pharisees.

Khazars are cute and sweet.

[video=youtube;HUbO6ZgDAdA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HUbO6ZgDAdA[/video]​