Speaking in tongues

[garee]

First, I have addressed the "private interpretations" error repeatedly. 1 Peter 2:20 is NOT about privately interpreting Scripture.

Second, reasoning skills are completely distinct from understanding Scripture. Non-Christians can and do use reasoning skills, the same skills that Christians can and should use.

Third, I agree, the right understanding of spiritual things is available only to Christians by the Holy Spirit.

Fourth, the issue of "seeking signs as lying wonders" has been repeatedly addressed as well. You are off-base on this issue. Nobody here is advocating the "seeking of signs", so your repeated bleating about it is quite unnecessary.

The reasoning skills by which we can know or hear God as he gives us ears to hear are as it is wriiten .No ned to go above that which is written .Differences come by f different approaches , Some would say parables are not scripture as prophecy .While some would say they are limited to the ones that use the word parable. I would say parables are the signified language of God that he uses to hide the spiritual understanding from one and conceal it to another . The parables below uses that in respect to a kingdom of priest which typifies all believers sent from a foreign land as Ambassadors of Christ with the gospel .

He gives the honor to those like the noble Bereans (Acts17:10-12) who search the scriptures daily to see if what they hear is

The parable reads...

Proverbs 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.

 

[garee]

Fourth, the issue of "seeking signs as lying wonders" has been repeatedly addressed as well. You are off-base on this issue. Nobody here is advocating the "seeking of signs", so your repeated bleating about it is quite unnecessary.

Wherefore tongues are for a sign, "not to them that believe", but "to them that believe not": but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.1 Corinthians 14:22

It has been addressed yes but nothing concluded . If they are seeking what some call "sign gifts" (Charismaticism) needed to confirm the Holy Spirit is filling them( never full) . They would fall under the warning in respect to natural unconverted man (evil generation) .No such thing as sign gift. Signs are designed for those who rebel .Prophecy for those who believe God.

Matthew 12:39But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:

Luke 11:29And when the people were gathered thick together, he began to say, This is an evil generation: they seek a sign; and there shall no sign be given it, but the sign of Jonas the prophet.

The Jews who refused to hear prophecy mocking God required a sign before they would commit faith .They stumbled over the cross

For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom: But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness; 1 Corinthians 1:21-23

There are certain signs hid in parables that follow but not lead as that not required as evidence a person is being filling with the Holy Spirit. The evidence of believing prophecy is a new willing heart to do the will of God as he works in us to both will and perform His good pleasure

The Jews mocked prophecy making it to not effect with their oral traditions of men . They treated Jesus like a circus seal .Show us a trick, perform a miracle then we will beleive you are the Christ

Not walking by faith the unseen... but rather walking by sight as if the kingdom came by observation.

John 6:30They said therefore unto him, What sign shewest thou then, that we may see, and believe thee? what dost thou work?

John 4:48 Then said Jesus unto him, Except ye see signs and wonders, ye will not believe. ….commit faith

 

[Dino246]

The reasoning skills by which we can know or hear God as he gives us ears to hear are as it is wriiten .No ned to go above that which is written .Differences come by f different approaches , Some would say parables are not scripture as prophecy .While some would say they are limited to the ones that use the word parable. I would say parables are the signified language of God that he uses to hide the spiritual understanding from one and conceal it to another . The parables below uses that in respect to a kingdom of priest which typifies all believers sent from a foreign land as Ambassadors of Christ with the gospel .

He gives the honor to those like the noble Bereans (Acts17:10-12) who search the scriptures daily to see if what they hear is

The parable reads...

Proverbs 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.

You are completely overlooking the fact that the reasoning skills that I am addressing are for reasoning among humans, not between humans and God. God completely understands us before we speak or write, and He can understand us even when our thoughts are mixed up.

 

[Dino246]

Wherefore tongues are for a sign, "not to them that believe", but "to them that believe not": but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.1 Corinthians 14:22

It has been addressed yes but nothing concluded . If they are seeking what some call "sign gifts" (Charismaticism) needed to confirm the Holy Spirit is filling them( never full) . They would fall under the warning in respect to natural unconverted man (evil generation) .No such thing as sign gift. Signs are designed for those who rebel .Prophecy for those who believe God.

You missed my core statement:

Nobody here is advocating the "seeking of signs", so your repeated bleating about it is quite unnecessary.

 

[Dino246]

The reference was 2 Peter 1:20.

The sure word is God's interpretation or revelation called prophecy. Prophecy does not come by mans private interpretation as oral tradition of men. Every man has personal commentary of what they think the Holy Spirit is saying that could vary like fingerprints

We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts: Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.2 Peter 1:20

Its another reason why there must be heresies as men's opinions among us. God word, prophecy is law. The word heresy is the same word as sects or denominations. A group of men that carry the same kind of opinion.

For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it. For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.1Corinthians 11:18-20

The kingdom of God is not of this world or we would not need denominations .God's design .Most likely to prevent men killing each other. Like the Pharisees with Sadducees during the first century refomation, or Roman Catholic with the Orthodox sects who set aside there differences during the fifteenth century reformation.

There must be a division between the things of God and those of men .It's where the anti-christ (Satan) gets his foot in the door.

If we trusted Peter's private interpretation as a oral tradition of men we would in the end blaspheme the Holy name by which we are called. Peter was forgiven, but because the Son of man is no longer here we would be blaspheming the Holy Spirit, not forgivable

Peter's private interpretation below

Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee. But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the "things that be of God", but "those that be of men" Mathew 16:22-23

Yes, 2 Peter 1:20. Typo on my part; my apology.

I understand what you are saying. However, that verse is still not forbidding Christians from interpreting Scripture; it is simply about the origin of the prophetic message.

Where two people read the same Scripture and come to differing conclusions, one is incorrect (or at least incomplete). The other may also be incorrect. Neither person can justifiably claim, "Private interpretation is not permitted therefore you are wrong."

 

[shittim]

We are not to lean on our own understanding, but in ALL our ways acknowledge Him, and He will make our path straight.
Also, in John we are taught when Holy Spirit comes He will guide, speak and show.

 

[garee]

Yes, 2 Peter 1:20. Typo on my part; my apology.

I understand what you are saying. However, that verse is still not forbidding Christians from interpreting Scripture; it is simply about the origin of the prophetic message.

Where two people read the same Scripture and come to differing conclusions, one is incorrect (or at least incomplete). The other may also be incorrect. Neither person can justifiably claim, "Private interpretation is not permitted therefore you are wrong."

I did not suggest it forbid Christians from intreptreting scripture .Private interpretations are their own interpretation of what they think the scripture is teaching as we seek the approval of God according to his interpretation or revelation . We are not to seek the approval of men according to their private interpretation as a personal commentary. That kind of idea reveals the wile of the devil as the anti-Christ, another mediator other than Christ alone. Most likely the oral traditions of men called a law of the fathers that make prophecy God's word without effect

 

[CS1]

my apologies i must have been mistaken.
what happened to shrume btw?

I do not speak to others about members past or present . This is out of respect to them. and thier privcy

 

[lafiera]

they are a oneness group they do not hold to the trinity

UPCs don't hold to the trinity because the trinity isn't biblical God is one not three

 

[Dino246]

I did not suggest it forbid Christians from intreptreting scripture .Private interpretations are their own interpretation of what they think the scripture is teaching as we seek the approval of God according to his interpretation or revelation . We are not to seek the approval of men according to their private interpretation as a personal commentary. That kind of idea reveals the wile of the devil as the anti-Christ, another mediator other than Christ alone. Most likely the oral traditions of men called a law of the fathers that make prophecy God's word without effect

I understand what you wrote, but it is about as convoluted as it can be.

Respectfully, perhaps in future you could write in plain English?

 

[Dino246]

UPCs don't hold to the trinity because the trinity isn't biblical God is one not three

You are welcome to start a new thread on that subject. This thread is about speaking in tongues.

 

[lafiera]

A brother once asked me..."do you believe in the manifestations of the Spirit?" I replied YES...love joy, peace. What he meant of course was the barking and clucking that is all the rage these days.

What of the spiritual gifts. Well tongues is the easiest gift to fake...so it's popularity will be consistent with that. Miracles? raising the dead? Well those gifts are really HARD to fake...so you don't see those as much!

Desire the gifts that edify others....desire the life and fruit of the Spirit. Let God decide which gifts are required in a given situation and stop looking at what YOU have...think of the Body.

After all do you really care WHO has a certain gift...as long as the Body has it? Why would you want a gift? It is to be given away.

A river doesn't drink it's own water. A tree doesn't eat it's own fruit. So likewise a gift is not for YOU. A gift is meant to give away. When we see gifts in this way then God will entrust us with many gifts...in order to build up His body.

Hi

You are welcome to start a new thread on that subject. This thread is about speaking in tongues.

Yes it is about speaking in tongues but my response still holds .

 

[jaybird88]

UPCs don't hold to the trinity because the trinity isn't biblical God is one not three

please dont derail this thread, i would hate for them to have to go to one of the other fifty thousand tongue threads we have going.

 

[shittim]

Miracles and healing are happening where there is genuine faith, He is the same, yesterday, today, and forever.
The hold up of seeing and walking in the gifts is never up there, it is always down here.
Garee doesn't seem to have a heart knowledge, only a head knowledge. No offense intended.
I have never seen "barking and clucking" but then I don't go where He doesn't want me to go. Perhaps others with only an outward form of godliness have, and thus they expose themselves to these things.

 

[jameen]

Can someone explain to me the uniqueness of this gift of speaking in tongues which most congregations in my neighbourhood insist on acquiring? Is it in any way superior to or more edifying than other gifts?

There is a more superior gift than speaking in tongues.

The gift of prophesy

1 Cor 14:39 Therefore, brethren, desire earnestly to prophesy, and do not forbid to speak with tongues.

The main reason behind it:

14:30 For you can all prophesy one by one, that all may learn and all may be encouraged.

If you can speak in tongue but there is no interpreter then just keep quiet as mentioned in 1 Cor 14:27-28.

 

[shittim]

a prayer language enables G-d to put in your prayer what He would have you pray for that you may not be aware of in
your own knowledge, He always has the best plan for us.

 

[garee]

I understand what you wrote, but it is about as convoluted as it can be.

Respectfully, perhaps in future you could write in plain English?

With all respect to you .I enjoy the way you write.
Sorry my writing skills suffer . I dropped out of High school and always hated English until I became interested in spiritual matters .Hard to teach old dogs new tricks .Again sorry for he extra work.

Do you agree with the idea of sign gifts (Charismaticism) ?

 

[garee]

There is a more superior gift than speaking in tongues.

The gift of prophesy

1 Cor 14:39 Therefore, brethren, desire earnestly to prophesy, and do not forbid to speak with tongues.

The main reason behind it:

14:30 For you can all prophesy one by one, that all may learn and all may be encouraged.

If you can speak in tongue but there is no interpreter then just keep quiet as mentioned in 1 Cor 14:27-28.

Tongues are prophecy (Gods word the gospel) spoken in all the languages of the world. Before Pentecost when the Holy Spirit prophesied he would come into the world and pour out His Holy Spirit on men, woman and children. Jew and Gentile alike he did come .

Previosly he spoke in Hebrew alone . But some Jews made the word of God to no effect by the oral traditions of the fathers. Mocking God. So God promised them he would mock them with stammering lips. Yet they refused to beleive the word of God, prophecy.

The same sign of rebellion remains today.... it is still a sign against the unbelieving Jew

Joel 2:28-29 And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit.

He inspired a similar revelation as prophecy to Peter also


Acts 2:18And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:

 

[Dino246]

With all respect to you .I enjoy the way you write.
Sorry my writing skills suffer . I dropped out of High school and always hated English until I became interested in spiritual matters .Hard to teach old dogs new tricks .Again sorry for he extra work.

Do you agree with the idea of sign gifts (Charismaticism) ?

Thanks for the explanation. I will offer one suggestion: don't feel the need to put every bit of information into a sentence.

As for so-called "sign gifts", I believe that all the gifts listed in the Bible are operational today. However, I don't seek signs. Whether the gifts are evident in a way that makes their effects visible is irrelevant.

 

[CS1]

UPCs don't hold to the trinity because the trinity isn't biblical God is one not three

The topic here is not on the trinity and you are wrong in your understand of this Biblical Concept . I know this because you said

"God is one not three"

The concept of the " Trinity " is not God is three . God is Three in one three personification of God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit which are all Mentioned in the Bible God is God the Son is God and His Spirit is God UPC believe's this too,

they just think all three are Jesus and Jesus is speaking to Himself when HE is praying , Even at the Baptism of Jesus The Father Spoke, The Son was there and The Holy Spirit ascended On Jesus all three were recorded and John said I Witnesses it.

Only pride and ignorance would cause one to think they know all there is to know about the Divine Nature of God , we don't. That is why we approach with humbleness and reverently. We are all limited in our ability to know there is to know of God. The Trinity concept is biblical because it is a word used to describe and bring understand (limited) of the "GodHead " Which IS a word in the Bible.