Saved by Water
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To be a "distihct individual" means they are separate. But you refuse to accept the reality of that.
It seems you don't really grasp what you are arguing for.
The Father is distinct from the Son in that the Father is a Spirit without flesh and the Son is the same Spirit dwelling in flesh.
Because they are the same Spirit, they are the same Person.
But because one is in flesh and the other isn't, they are distinctly different.
What about this doctrine is reprehensible to you?
I proved they are the same. You just don't want to accept it.No, "distinct" has a distinctly different connotation than "separate".
"Separate" is a synonym of "distinct".
your theological theory has Jesus wearing 3 hats, and talking to Himself. That is absurd.
The FACT that the Father speaks from heaven to His Son, in the water, on the mountain proves they are separate.
Or go ahead and believe that Jesus is an accomplished ventroloquist.
No, I do not believe in Jesus wearing three hats.I proved they are the same. You just don't want to accept it.
your theological theory has Jesus wearing 3 hats, and talking to Himself. That is absurd.
And you have not proven that "distinct" exactly means "separate".
I contend that there is a "distinct" connotation concerning each word.
And God (the Holy Ghost) does in fact talk to God (the Father), (Romans 8:26-27). And, you would do well to believe in one God (James 2:19).
Sure. One Spirit wearing 3 hats, and throwing His voice to appear to come from the sky. Sure.The Father is distinct from the Son in that the Father is a Spirit without flesh and the Son is the same Spirit dwelling in flesh.
Because they are the same Spirit, they are the same Person.
Jesus wearing 3 hats, talking to Himself, throwing His voice to appear someone else is talking to Him.But because one is in flesh and the other isn't, they are distinctly different.
What about this doctrine is reprehensible to you?
Are you getting the picture yet?
Go ahead and google search the words. Separate is a synonym for distinct.No, I do not believe in Jesus wearing three hats.
And you have not proven that "distinct" exactly means "separate".
You can contend anything you want.I contend that there is a "distinct" connotation concerning each word.
What you have, though, is Jesus wearing 3 hats, talking to Himself, and throwing His voice to appear coming from another place.
Sure. One Spirit wearing 3 hats, and throwing His voice to appear to come from the sky. Sure.
Jesus wearing 3 hats, talking to Himself, throwing His voice to appear someone else is talking to Him.
Are you getting the picture yet?
It would be more like one hat (the flesh of Jesus) and the Father wearing no hat before He is incarnated; and no hat after He is released back to Himself in Luke 23:46.
Once the Father becomes Jesus, He does not go back to being the Father. From there, He is released back into eternity as the Holy Ghost (His forever-more state). He does not go back to being the Father after He becomes the Holy Ghost; at that point He is for ever the Holy Ghost.
My contention is that God Himself descended into time and took on an added nature of human flesh (1 Timothy 4:16 (kjv)).
Not 1/3 of God; and not a 2nd God.
Nope.You can contend anything you want.
What you have, though, is Jesus wearing 3 hats, talking to Himself, and throwing His voice to appear coming from another place.
For the purposes of understanding the Trinity (which is not allowed for in your dictionary), "separate" has a "distinct" connotation from "distinct"Go ahead and google search the words. Separate is a synonym for distinct.
The FACT that the Father speaks from heaven to His Son, in the water, on the mountain proves they are separate.
No; it proves that they are distinct.
FreeGrace2 said:
Sure. One Spirit wearing 3 hats, and throwing His voice to appear to come from the sky. Sure.
Jesus wearing 3 hats, talking to Himself, throwing His voice to appear someone else is talking to Him.
Are you getting the picture yet?
I did some internet searching, and found that TD Jakes, a former oneness type, finally came to his senses and embraces the Trinity.
Sure. One Spirit wearing 3 hats, and throwing His voice to appear to come from the sky. Sure.
Jesus wearing 3 hats, talking to Himself, throwing His voice to appear someone else is talking to Him.
Are you getting the picture yet?
No, it wouldn't be like that at all. Not even close.It would be more like one hat (the flesh of Jesus) and the Father wearing no hat before He is incarnated; and no hat after He is released back to Himself in Luke 23:46.
Are you actually listening to yourself here? "once the Father BECOMES Jesus"??? What in the world?Once the Father becomes Jesus, He does not go back to being the Father.
This is just over the top absurdity.From there, He is released back into eternity as the Holy Ghost (His forever-more state). He does not go back to being the Father after He becomes the Holy Ghost; at that point He is for ever the Holy Ghost.
I think you are just beyond confused.My contention is that God Himself descended into time and took on an added nature of human flesh (1 Timothy 4:16 (kjv)).
Not 1/3 of God; and not a 2nd God.
I did some internet searching, and found that TD Jakes, a former oneness type, finally came to his senses and embraces the Trinity.
Dream on.For the purposes of understanding the Trinity (which is not allowed for in your dictionary), "separate" has a "distinct" connotation from "distinct"
FreeGrace2 said:
The FACT that the Father speaks from heaven to His Son, in the water, on the mountain proves they are separate.
Go ahead. Really. Any time.
You don't seem to even know what you are arguing.
The FACT that the Father speaks from heaven to His Son, in the water, on the mountain proves they are separate.
Explain how Jesus and His Father are One, when His Father spoke to Him from heaven while Jesus was IN the water and ON the mountain.No; it proves that they are distinct.
Go ahead. Really. Any time.
You don't seem to even know what you are arguing.
Are you actually listening to yourself here? "once the Father BECOMES Jesus"??? What in the world?
It is sound doctrine to believe that God was manifest in the flesh (1 Timothy 3:16 (kjv)).
Not 1/3 of God; and not a 2nd God
This is just over the top absurdity.
The preaching that brings salvation is foolishness to those who are perishing (1 Corinthians 1:18,21).
I did some internet searching, and found that TD Jakes, a former oneness type, finally came to his senses and embraces the Trinity.
I am also of the same kind; for I believe in the Trinity.
Explain how Jesus and His Father are One, when His Father spoke to Him from heaven while Jesus was IN the water and ON the mountain.
Go ahead. Really. Any time.
You don't seem to even know what you are arguing.
First off, Jesus and the Father are one, according to holy scripture (John 10:30).
As for the explanation that you are looking for;
I consider that it is the nature of One who dwells in eternity that He will never cease to dwell in eternity; even if He were to descend into time in order to take on an added nature of human flesh.
Try to think of how the dissonance between eternity and time allows for God to be both in heaven, as an eternal Spirit (Isaiah 57:15) and on earth at the same time (see John 3:13 (kjv)).
I believe that God the Father lives one eternal moment and then descends into time to take on an added nature of human flesh,
Eph 3:11, According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:
The same Spirit who inhabits eternity (Isaiah 57:15) descended into time and took on an added nature of human flesh (1 John 4:1-3, 2 John 1:7). For there is one Spirit who is God (John 4:24, Ephesians 4:4). And Jesus is God; so He is that Spirit...albeit come in the flesh.
Jesus therefore exists both in heaven; as a Spirit without flesh; and on earth; as the same Spirit dwelling in human flesh.
Of course, there is a distinction; so that Jesus as a Spirit without flesh even has a different name (Jehovah); while the same Spirit in flesh has a name that means "Jehovah is salvation."
According to the creeds, Tritheists are counted as heretics who do not have salvation.Dream on.
So, you reject my definition of "distinct" at your own spiritual and possibly even eternal, peril.
If you think Jesus is saying that He and the Father are the same Person, you have no discernment.
You can have your oneness movement theories.
Your disagreement is with God's word .......not me.
Peace.
FreeGrace2 said:
The FACT that the Father speaks from heaven to His Son, in the water, on the mountain proves they are separate.
Explain how Jesus and His Father are One, when His Father spoke to Him from heaven while Jesus was IN the water and ON the mountain.
Go ahead. Really. Any time.
You don't seem to even know what you are arguing.
Easily.....God can and has manifested Himself in as many ways as He wishes, in as many places as He chooses, in as many formats as He wishes and ..... all at the same time.
At times...I wonder if some of us forget that we are speaking of THE GOD. This thread is an example of such.
FreeGrace2 said:
Are you actually listening to yourself here? "once the Father BECOMES Jesus"??? What in the world?
That would allow your conversations with self.
Genesis 1 alone refutes your view.
26 Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals, and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”
Your god is schizoprenic.
Are you actually listening to yourself here? "once the Father BECOMES Jesus"??? What in the world?
Your comment has no relevance to my comment. You need to prove your statement "one the Father GECOMES JESUS". That's not biblical.It is sound doctrine to believe that God was manifest in the flesh (1 Timothy 3:16 (kjv)).
You admit there are 3 Persons. That proves they are separate. You can't have 3 Persons in one "self" unless you include schizophrenia.Not 1/3 of God; and not a 2nd God
That would allow your conversations with self.
No, more like schizophrenia.I am also of the same kind; for I believe in the Trinity.
Not the way you presume.First off, Jesus and the Father are one, according to holy scripture (John 10:30).
So your One is in several places. Have you actually thought through your theory?As for the explanation that you are looking for;
I consider that it is the nature of One who dwells in eternity that He will never cease to dwell in eternity; even if He were to descend into time in order to take on an added nature of human flesh.
Try to think of how the dissonance between eternity and time allows for God to be both in heaven, as an eternal Spirit (Isaiah 57:15) and on earth at the same time (see John 3:13 (kjv)).
I believe that God the Father lives one eternal moment and then descends into time to take on an added nature of human flesh,
Eph 3:11, According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:
The same Spirit who inhabits eternity (Isaiah 57:15) descended into time and took on an added nature of human flesh (1 John 4:1-3, 2 John 1:7). For there is one Spirit who is God (John 4:24, Ephesians 4:4). And Jesus is God; so He is that Spirit...albeit come in the flesh.
Jesus therefore exists both in heaven; as a Spirit without flesh; and on earth; as the same Spirit dwelling in human flesh.
Your explanation doesn't work.Of course, there is a distinction; so that Jesus as a Spirit without flesh even has a different name (Jehovah); while the same Spirit in flesh has a name that means "Jehovah is salvation."
Genesis 1 alone refutes your view.
26 Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals, and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”
Your god is schizoprenic.
I don't care about the opinions of men. I care highly about what Scripture says. And I believe your views are unbiblical.According to the creeds, Tritheists are counted as heretics who do not have salvation.
I face no peril. I know whom I have believed and am persuaded that He is able to keep that which I've committed to Him for that day.So, you reject my definition of "distinct" at your own spiritual and possibly even eternal, peril.
2 Tim 1:12