Salvation is a Free Gift.
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i think they feel some guilt then confess when they realize they sinned because thier heart is repenting when they become conscious of it . and he promised to forgive and cleanse it away
“If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.”
1 John 1:9-10 KJV
when we realize we’ve sinned we should just deal with him now so it doesn’t have to be later
“Some men's sins are open beforehand, going before to judgment;
and some men they follow after.”
1 Timothy 5:24 KJV
You missed the whole point of my last few posts. I don't confirm or deny anything about TULIP or Calvinism. I shared with you the condition of fallen man,as well as how that relates to belief and faith.
If you disagree with what I posted, feel free to share your position. But if you are going to label my position rather than discuss ideas, I know you aren't really interested in ideas that you don't already hold. If that's the case, I also have no interest in proceeding.
That said, Jesus Himself said that all the Father had given Him will come to Him that He will not cast them away, but raise them up on the last day...John 6:37-39. I believe these are those spoken of in Ephesians 1:4 as chosen in Him before the foundation of the world.
I don't see in scripture God choosing anyone for death or destruction.
Your position on the state of fallen man is the same as the calvinist position, is it not? If it is, you affirm the T of TULIP. Of you do not, then you deny the T of TULIP. I'm not calling YOU a calvinist. I am merely identifying your position on the T doctrine of Tulip as the same as calvinism. Are you saying it differs from calvinism. If so, how does it differ?
Are you of the opinion that before creation God is able to choose specific future persons that He will exclusively save, and He would not be deliberately choosing not to save the rest?
I've told you what I believe and why based on scripture. You want to talk about Calvinism. I'm discussing what scripture says. I'm not discussing Calvinism. Yet you continue to relate my beliefs to Calvin. Why don't you compare my beliefs to Jesus?
This has been my point all along. I don't care what Calvin said. I do care what scripture says. I'm not here to confirm or deny Calvinism. A discussion of Calvinism generally leads to dissent. A discussion of scripture might just discover some truth.
Can you rephrase this?
I am certainly of the opinion that God is able to do anything. But I don't think you are asking what God is able to do, but what He has done.
But you said, "Both involve a reality of sin and hell." I just don't think they do, necessarily.
When one is struck with the fear of God, and I am not talking about reverence, but when they experience
the conviction of the Holy Spirit of their sinful state before Him, and suddenly know that the God they have
denied their whole life is real and has all power and knowledge, fear and trembling is an expected outcome...
When I was speaking about the reality of sin and hell, I was referring to someone as Agrippa who trembled after hearing Paul's exhortation. I wasn't equating that with a prick of the conscience that sometimes accompanies the occasion of sin. All of my comments were related to Agrippa.
PaulThomson said:
Are you of the opinion that before creation God is able to choose specific future persons that He will exclusively save, and He would not be deliberately choosing not to save the rest?
Why do you think he would not be deliberately choosing to not save the rest?
If someone who hears the gospel does not choose to follow Christ, are they de facto choosing not to follow Christ? If the biscuits on a plate are all different and I can choose as many different kinds of biscuits as I want from the plate, and I choose six but leave six others, did I not choose to leave the six I passed over? If God is not choosing to save some, how is He not de facto choosing not to save them?
Are you of the opinion that before creation God is able to choose specific future persons that He will exclusively save, and He would not be deliberately choosing not to save the rest?
So, your answer to my question is "Yes." You are certainly of the opinion that God is able to choose specific future persons that He will exclusively save, and He would not be deliberately choosing not to save the rest.
Why do you think he would not be deliberately choosing to not save the rest?
If someone who hears the gospel does not choose to follow Christ, are they de facto choosing not to follow Christ? If the biscuits on a plate are all different and I can choose as many different kinds of biscuits as I want from the plate, and I choose six but leave six others, did I not choose to leave the six I passed over? If God is not choosing to save some, how is He not de facto choosing not to save them?
Maybe you are a stealth calvinist: someone who agrees in principle with calvinist TULIP doctrines by tries to obfuscate the fact that they agree with calvinist TULIP doctrine. Or maybe you do not agree with one or more of the calvinist distinctives of TULIP.
I am interested in which is the case here.
I'm still thinking on it but, I'm leaning toward not necessarily, although I can see why you would adopt the opinion.
For example, God might have chosen to save all who believe but that could be equivalent to not choosing those who do not.... and so I'm still trying to figure my bearings within that equation...
You asked is He able. Since God is able to do anything, my answer is yes. That's different than did He. But I have a question for you you? In Genesis 3:16, when God speaks to the woman and tells her that He will multiply her sorrow and conception, what is entailed in the increase of conception?
Are you speaking exclusively of Christians here? I was speaking of people who
experience the conviction that brings knowledge of God to an unbeliever...
As in, they suddenly realize that the God they have denied most of their life truly does exist.
That surely engenders fear, which the Bible says is the beginning of wisdom.
And I'm interested in scripture, not Calvin. Like many here, you are more interested in learning about what someone believes than what scripture teaches. It's called CDS.
Indeed I was and usually am. And yes indeed . The first time my daddy whooped me with a switch , that engendered a fear too . Dad's are to be feared by their children in a reverent way where as we aren't afraid of dad but also we understand not to make him mad he's bigger and tougher and will absolutely use a switch when necessary ( I was playing with Dynomite and my cousin ratted me out ) still recall it
That's an interesting text. I had not noticed that phrasing before.
I would suggest that before sin came into the world and death through sin, the population of the planet could have progressed quite adequately with a child every century or every decade. But now people would be dying off from old age and from diseases and animal attacks and murders etc. So God had to make women have more children faster. And, of course, more children and more of them dying would mean more grief for mothers.
Why do you ask? What do you think?