Replacement theology? Yes or No.

[Beekeeper]

Isa 11:11
And it shall come to pass in that day, that the Lord shall set his hand again the ***second time*** to recover the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria, and from Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea.

Isa 11:12
And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.

Fulfilled on the day of Pentecost, Acts 2.

 

[Beekeeper]

One in Christ
Eph 2:11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;

Eph 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

Eph 2:14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

Eph 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

Eph 2:16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

Eph 2:17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.

Eph 2:18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

Eph 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;

So Gentiles believers who were once strangers to the commonwealth of Israel are now one with Jewish believers in Christ. There is no middle wall of partition between them and they are not foreigners, fellow citizens in the household of God.
ISRAEL of God?
One olive tree?
One kingdom?

 

[Beekeeper]

Moses wrote:

• Israel will be exiled
• scattered worldwide
• despised among nations
• yet preserved
• then restored back to their land
• and spiritually renewed

This is 2,500 years before 1948.

And you did not even bother to mention the second temple restoration.
Wow!

 

[Beekeeper]

Zec 12:2
Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of trembling unto all the people round about, when they shall be in the siege both against Judah and against Jerusalem.

Zec 12:3
And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people: all that burden themselves with it shall be cut in pieces, though all the people of the earth be gathered together against it.

Zec 12:4
In that day, saith the LORD, I will smite every horse with astonishment, and his rider with madness: and I will open mine eyes upon the house of Judah, and will smite every horse of the people with blindness.

Zec 12:5 (DID NOT HAPPEN IN 70AD)
And the governors of Judah shall say in their heart, The inhabitants of Jerusalem shall be my strength in the LORD of hosts their God.

"DID NOT HAPPEN IN 70 AD"
Correct.
These things happened in the early days after Zerubabbels's return to Jerusalem.
The walls were not built and the remnant was small and apparently vulnerable.
God protected them in a miraculous way against many cruel enemies.
The inhabitants of Judah lived outside the city, and were exalted in defending it.

 

[Beekeeper]

The fact is that Jesus and Paul CLEARLY indicated a "gentile Church gap" between the 69th and 70 week of Daniel.
And that's where we are at now.

That GAP story about Daniel 9:24-27 has got to be the weirdest interpretation I have come across.
Surely it defeats the purpose of a prophesy with a timeline (70 weeks or 490 years) if there is a unspecified gap between the 69th and the 70th week.
The messiah is cut off AFTER 69 weeks, ie in the seventieth week.

So who made Jerusalem desolate?
Not the Romans, they just destroyed it.
God made Jerusalem desolate, and the abomination was the killing of Jesus.

 

[James456]

'Partial preterist' - where do you draw the line?

Where does it cross over into full preterism?

Where does it cross over into historicism?

Preterists I've come across believe, when Jesus said the world will see horrors unequalled since its creation and will never be seen again, they relate this to 70AD.
Though what happened then was horrific, how does it compare to the second world war for example? Fifty million dead, six million Jews gassed to death, babies used for bayonet practice in Russia, two atomic bombs set off and the horrors they inflicted.
And did what happened in 70AD result in the sun and moon not shining on one third of the earth? One third of the land and trees were burned up? I don't think so

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Your whole post makes sense to my understanding, but I have re-posted this part because it addresses a matter that I have only recently started paying attention to.
How many prophetic experts could ever have guessed that John the Baptist was the fulfillment of the last prophesy of the OT, had Jesus not told them?
This should serve to humble us when we think we "know" prophesy.

When Abraham and Sarah concluded that they needed to have a son from Hagar they behaved like many who interpret prophesy in this day.

Well put I’ve been here a few years and nonone has ever pointed to how ishmael was conscieved through sarias idea rather than waiting for Gods promise ! I love Paul’s allegory of Abraham’s two sons ( the two covenants ) galtians 4:21-31.

Yes John the Baptist is foretold many times in prophecy if we look at prophecy from a gospel perspective we begin to be guided back to prophecy what I mean is like this

“In those days came John the Baptist, preaching in the wilderness of Judæa, and saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand. For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Isaiah, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, Make his paths straight. And the same John had his raiment of camel's hair, and a leathern girdle about his loins; and his meat was locusts and wild honey.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭3:1-4‬ ‭

we can then look back to Isaiah and see what the gospel is talking about

“Comfort ye, comfort ye my people, saith your God. Speak ye comfortably to Jerusalem, and cry unto her, that her warfare is accomplished, that her iniquity is pardoned: for she hath received of the LORD's hand double for all her sins. The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the LORD, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Every valley shall be exalted, and every mountain and hill shall be made low: and the crooked shall be made straight, and the rough places plain: and the glory of the LORD shall be revealed, and all flesh shall see it together: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭40:1-5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God; The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, Make his paths straight. John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭1:1, 3-4‬ ‭

just like Malachi 3

“Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me: ( John )

and the Lord, whom ye seek, shall suddenly come to his temple, even the messenger of the covenant, whom ye delight in: behold, he shall come, ( Jesus ) saith the LORD of hosts.”
‭‭Malachi‬ ‭3:1‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God; As it is written in the prophets, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, Which shall prepare thy way before thee.

John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.

….And it came to pass in those days, that Jesus came from Nazareth of Galilee, and was baptized of John in Jordan. And straightway coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens opened, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon him: and there came a voice from heaven, saying, Thou art my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭1:1-2, 4, 9-11‬ ‭KJV‬‬

here jesus weaves both of those prophecies regarding Malachi 3 and 4 to John

“And as they departed, Jesus began to say unto the multitudes concerning John, What went ye out into the wilderness to see? A reed shaken with the wind? But what went ye out for to see? A prophet? yea, I say unto you, and more than a prophet. For this is he, of whom it is written, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, Which shall prepare thy way before thee.( Malachi 3) For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.

And if ye will receive it, this is Elijah, which was for to come. He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭11:7, 9-10, 13-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬


“But I say unto you, That Elijah is indeed come, and they have done unto him whatsoever they listed, as it is written of him.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭9:11-13‬ ‭KJV‬‬

If we look closer it begins to be revealed at johns birth prophecy

“But the angel said unto him, Fear not, Zacharias: for thy prayer is heard; and thy wife Elisabeth shall bear thee a son, and thou shalt call his name John. And thou shalt have joy and gladness; and many shall rejoice at his birth. For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink; and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother's womb.

And many of the children of Israel shall he turn to the Lord their God. And he shall go before him in the spirit and power of Elijah, to turn the hearts of the fathers to the children, and the disobedient to the wisdom of the just; to make ready a people prepared for the Lord.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭1:13-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD: and he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.”
‭‭Malachi‬ ‭4:5-6‬ ‭

Even things like this speak the same

“And they answered him, He was an hairy man, and girt with a girdle of leather about his loins. And he said, It is Elijah the Tishbite.”
‭‭2 Kings‬ ‭1:8‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“John had his raiment of camel's hair, and a leathern girdle about his loins”


The Bible is incredibly repetetive prophecy and later fulfillment …. But not always how the people expect it to be fulfilled

“But I say unto you, That Elijah is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭17:12‬ ‭KJV‬‬


If we listen to Jesus and his apostles the Old Testament becomes far less mysterious and confusing.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

That GAP story about Daniel 9:24-27 has got to be the weirdest interpretation I have come across.
Surely it defeats the purpose of a prophesy with a timeline (70 weeks or 490 years) if there is a unspecified gap between the 69th and the 70th week.
The messiah is cut off AFTER 69 weeks, ie in the seventieth week.

So who made Jerusalem desolate?
Not the Romans, they just destroyed it.
God made Jerusalem desolate, and the abomination was the killing of Jesus.

amen

“But last of all he sent unto them his son, saying, They will reverence my son. But when the husbandmen saw the son, they said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and let us seize on his inheritance. When the Lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen? They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons.

…Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭21:37-38, 40-41, 43‬ ‭KJV‬‬

the last abomination they commited was rejecting accusing binding besting. Spitting upon convicting and torturing and condemning the lord for of all things ….. blasphemy.

Before that they rejected persecuted and killed the prophets he had sent calling them to repentance as well.

“O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭23:37-38‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised again the third day.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭16:21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

That GAP story about Daniel 9:24-27 has got to be the weirdest interpretation I have come across.
Surely it defeats the purpose of a prophesy with a timeline (70 weeks or 490 years) if there is a unspecified gap between the 69th and the 70th week.
The messiah is cut off AFTER 69 weeks, ie in the seventieth week.

So who made Jerusalem desolate?
Not the Romans, they just destroyed it.
God made Jerusalem desolate, and the abomination was the killing of Jesus.

Daniel was petitioning God about the restoration of Jerusalem and its temple

Now therefore, O our God, hear the prayer of thy servant, and his supplications, and cause thy face to shine upon thy sanctuary that is desolate, for the Lord's sake. O my God, incline thine ear, and hear; open thine eyes, and behold our desolations, and the city which is called by thy name: for we do not present our supplications before thee for our righteousnesses, but for thy great mercies. O Lord, hear; O Lord, forgive; O Lord, hearken and do; defer not, for thine own sake, O my God: for thy city and thy people are called by thy name. Daniel 9:17-19​

​

God confirmed that Jerusalem would be rebuilt, and also revealed the timeline for the fulfillment of all promise and prophecy to Israel. Israel's transgressions were to be finished, the power of sin would be ended, reconciliation for iniquity would be accomplished, everlasting righteousness would be established, vision and prophecy would be sealed up (fulfilled), and the most holy, ie, Christ, the true temple of God, would be anointed, which all happened in the 70th week.

Jesus prophesied the end of the natural order, yet Christians infected with the dispensational mind-pathogen are compelled through weak faith to disbelieve that and make the 70th week about themselves (saying it pertains to their time) and physical things, rather than eternal and spiritual things, which were the whole point of the Gabriel's vision: the heavenly temple and Jerusalem that endure matter, whereas their temporary earthly shadows don't and would be destroyed to make way for the new.

Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father. Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews. But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. John 4:21-24​

​

 

[cv5]

That GAP story about Daniel 9:24-27 has got to be the weirdest interpretation I have come across.
Surely it defeats the purpose of a prophesy with a timeline (70 weeks or 490 years) if there is a unspecified gap between the 69th and the 70th week.
The messiah is cut off AFTER 69 weeks, ie in the seventieth week.

So who made Jerusalem desolate?
Not the Romans, they just destroyed it.
God made Jerusalem desolate, and the abomination was the killing of Jesus.

Wrong. Allllll wrong lol. The historicists don't know their history huh? Preterists are likewise Biblically illiterate.

Fortunately, I do know ancient near east history, and do understand what the abomination that maketh desolate ACTUALLY means.

******************************************************************************************

Dan 11:31
And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.

The verse is describing the single most traumatic event in Jewish religious history before Rome — the desecration of the Temple by Antiochus IV Epiphanes.


Who is being described?

Daniel 11:21–35 is one of the most detailed predictive prophecies in the entire Bible. It tracks the Seleucid–Ptolemaic wars and then zooms in on one ruler:


Antiochus IV Epiphanes


He ruled the Seleucid Empire from 175–164 BC and deliberately tried to erase Judaism.


What did he do to the Temple?

In 167 BC, Antiochus issued decrees that:

• Banned circumcision
• Banned Torah reading
• Banned Sabbath observance
• Banned Temple sacrifice

Then he did something even worse.


He entered the Jerusalem Temple and:

• Stopped the daily (tamid) sacrifice
• Erected a pagan altar
• Sacrificed pigs on it
• Dedicated it to Zeus

This is exactly what Daniel 11:31 describes:

“They shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.”​

The “abomination” was an idol altar of Zeus standing on or over the Jewish altar.


Why was it called “abomination”?

In Hebrew:


שִׁקּוּץ (shiqquts) = something filthy, idolatrous, ritually disgusting


To put a pagan god and pig sacrifice in the Temple was the ultimate abomination — spiritual defilement, not just political occupation.


Is this recorded outside the Bible?

Yes — in multiple independent sources:

• 1 Maccabees 1:54
• 2 Maccabees 6
• Josephus – Antiquities of the Jews
• Greek Seleucid records

All say the same thing:

Antiochus erected a pagan altar to Zeus in the Temple and sacrificed swine on it.​

What happened next?

This triggered the Maccabean Revolt.


Within 3 years, Jewish rebels recaptured Jerusalem, cleansed the Temple, and restored the sacrifices in 164 BC — an event still celebrated today as Hanukkah.


The abomination was removed.


Why this matters prophetically

You’ve correctly identified something many people miss:


Daniel 11 is not vague — it is precise history.


The first “abomination of desolation” was:

Antiochus IV Epiphanes in 167 BC​

Later, Jesus refers to this event as a type — a pattern that would be repeated again at the end of the age.


But Daniel 11:31 itself?
It is 100% Antiochus.

*********************************************************************************************************************
And here is the FUTURE abomination of desolation that Jesus spoke about.
An idol set up in the Temple in the holy place.
None of this happened in 70AD, the Temple was dismantled to the dirt.

That's right, (physical) Temple in Jerusalem, idol, holy place part 2.

Dan 12:11
And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

Mat 24:15
“Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,' spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place” (whoever reads, let him understand),

Mar 13:14
“So when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,' spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not” (let the reader understand), “then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.

 

[cv5]

Your whole post makes sense to my understanding, but I have re-posted this part because it addresses a matter that I have only recently started paying attention to.
How many prophetic experts could ever have guessed that John the Baptist was the fulfillment of the last prophesy of the OT, had Jesus not told them?
This should serve to humble us when we think we "know" prophesy.

When Abraham and Sarah concluded that they needed to have a son from Hagar they behaved like many who interpret prophesy in this day.

Does it? Seems unlikely. Fortunately, you have the opportunity to repent and correct your awful unbiblical pretentions.

*************************************************************************

Mat 17:10
And his disciples asked him, saying, Why then say the scribes that Elias must first come?

Mat 17:11
And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things. (really! when? Certainly not 33AD (see Acts 3:21) , nor 70AD nor 135AD).

Mat 17:12
But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them.

Act 3:21
“whom heaven must receive until the times of restoration of all things, which God has spoken by the mouth of all His holy prophets since the world began.

Mal 4:5
Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet
Before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD (THAT WHICH STARTS AT THE 70TH WEEK TRIBULATION!)

***************************************************************************************************
Where Elijah appears in Revelation

The passage is Revelation 11:3–12 — the Two Witnesses who prophesy for 1,260 days.


John describes them this way:

“These are the two olive trees and the two lampstands that stand before the Lord of the earth.” (Rev 11:4)​

This is taken straight from Zechariah 4, but their powers come from Elijah and Moses.


Elijah’s signature power

Revelation 11:5 says:

“If anyone wants to harm them, fire proceeds from their mouth and devours their enemies…”​

This mirrors exactly what Elijah did in:


1 Kings 18 and 2 Kings 1
where fire falls from heaven and consumes the soldiers sent to arrest him.


🌧 Elijah stopped the rain

Revelation 11:6:

“They have power to shut heaven, that no rain falls in the days of their prophecy…”​

This is Elijah in:


1 Kings 17:1

“There shall not be dew nor rain these years, except by my word.”​

Moses + Elijah

The same verse also says they:

“…turn waters into blood and strike the earth with plagues…”​

That is Moses (Exodus), so the Two Witnesses are Moses-type and Elijah-type.


But the Elijah side is unmistakable:

• Fire from heaven
• Drought
• Prophetic confrontation of kings
• Persecuted, hunted, yet untouchable

Why Elijah?

Because of Malachi 4:5:

“Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the great and terrible day of the Lord.”​

Jesus said John the Baptist fulfilled this in type (Luke 1:17),
but Revelation shows the final Elijah-type appearing before the Day of the Lord.


🕊 What this means

The Two Witnesses are not random prophets.


They are the final prophetic replay of:


OT Prophet Revelation Role Moses Plagues, blood, judgments
Elijah Fire, drought, confrontation

They stand before the final “Pharaoh” and final “Ahab” of the Beast system.


Why this matters per Daniel studies

Just as:

• Antiochus was a type of the final Antichrist

So:

• Elijah is replayed again
• Moses is replayed again
• Exodus is replayed again

Revelation is not new — it is the Bible’s greatest remix.


If you’d like, I can show you how the Two Witnesses line up with Daniel 12’s 1,260 days or how John the Baptist fits between Elijah and Revelation.

 

[cv5]

Preterists I've come across believe, when Jesus said the world will see horrors unequalled since its creation and will never be seen again, they relate this to 70AD.
Though what happened then was horrific, how does it compare to the second world war for example? Fifty million dead, six million Jews gassed to death, babies used for bayonet practice in Russia, two atomic bombs set off and the horrors they inflicted.
And did what happened in 70AD result in the sun and moon not shining on one third of the earth? One third of the land and trees were burned up? I don't think so

Right. Sure its a low view of scripture, but its also tragic and horrific biblical illiteracy on a grand scale.
Mostly as a result of an attitude of despising the "elder brother" Israel.
Denying defying dismissing hating the fact of God's love for the elder brother is nothing I want to associate with.
On the contrary, we should be glad and make merry for his certain and ultimate redemption.

Remember this parable all of you preterists and historicists? Don't let it happen to you in reverse.

[Luk 15:28-32 KJV]
28 And he was angry, and would not go in: therefore came his father out, and intreated him.
29 And he answering said to [his] father, Lo, these many years do I serve thee, neither transgressed I at any time thy commandment: and yet thou never gavest me a kid, that I might make merry with my friends:
30 But as soon as this thy son was come, which hath devoured thy living with harlots, thou hast killed for him the fatted calf.
31 And he said unto him, Son, thou art ever with me, and all that I have is thine.
32 It was meet that we should make merry, and be glad: for this thy brother was dead, and is alive again; and was lost, and is found.

 

[HeIsHere]

In any case, I think you missed the point - that [what is now called historicism] was the truth before the two extremes were invented.

Poisoning the well is not a valid rebuttal.
And there were others before him if you do the research.

Historicism has its own internal problems.

Arguments against the validity of historicist eschatology include:


1) Failure to Account for Original Context (same problem as Dispenstationalism)

2) Subjectivity and Lack of Consensus

• Arbitrary Interpretations: Critics argue that historicism allows for too much flexibility, leading to wildly different historical identifications for the same prophetic symbols.
• Constant Revision: As historical events unfold, historicist interpretations must be continually updated or revised, suggesting the interpretations are driven more by current events than by clear scriptural evidence.
• Failure of Prediction: Many historicist interpretations have failed over time, undermining confidence in the method
  

(Note I am in complete agreement this synopsis by Gemini because it is true.)

 

[HeIsHere]

On the contrary, we should be glad and make merry for his certain and ultimate redemption.

They can be saved just like everyone else, at any time, when they so choose to believe the Good News of Christ Jesus.

 

[cv5]

They can be saved just like everyone else, at any time, when they so choose to believe the Good News of Christ Jesus.

That's right. Not only is it right, its THE ENIRE POINT AND REASON for the Day of the Lord!
"IN THAT DAY"

What's wrong is preterism, historicism, and their ilk.
Which I have proven wrong in devastating overwhelming fashion without even breaking a sweat.
It becomes effortless if you actually care to read and understand your bible.

**********************************************************************

“in that day” (Hebrew bayyōm hahû’) is not just a time marker; it is a technical prophetic phrase for the moment when Israel is broken, repents, and is finally redeemed by her Messiah.


Here are the clearest passages where “in that day” is explicitly tied to Israel’s repentance, cleansing, and restoration.


1) National Repentance
Zechariah 12:10

“And I will pour on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem the Spirit of grace and supplication; then they will look on Me whom they pierced. They will mourn for Him…”​

This is Israel seeing their Messiah and repenting.


2) Cleansing from Sin
Zechariah 13:1

“In that day a fountain shall be opened for the house of David and for the inhabitants of Jerusalem, for sin and for uncleanness.”​

Repentance (12:10)
→ Cleansing (13:1)


This is atonement language — Israel is spiritually washed.


🕊 3) Idolatry Removed
Zechariah 13:2

“In that day… I will cut off the names of the idols from the land… and also remove the prophets and the unclean spirit.”​

Israel becomes spiritually pure again.


4) Messiah Reigns in Jerusalem
Zechariah 14:9

“And the LORD shall be King over all the earth. In that day it shall be: ‘The LORD is one, and His name one.’”​

This is the Messianic Kingdom.


🛡 5) Jerusalem Protected
Zechariah 12:8

“In that day the LORD will defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem…”​

This happens during their repentance — God defends them as they turn to Him.


6) Israel Regathered
Isaiah 27:12–13

“In that day the LORD will thresh… and you will be gathered one by one, O children of Israel…​

And in that day a great trumpet will be blown… and they shall worship the LORD in Jerusalem.”​

This is repentant Israel returning to worship.


7) Spiritual Healing
Isaiah 30:26

“In that day… the LORD binds up the bruise of His people and heals the stroke of their wound.”​

God heals Israel after discipline.


8) Sin Judged, People Purified
Malachi 3:2–4

“He is like a refiner’s fire… He will purify the sons of Levi… Then the offering of Judah and Jerusalem will be pleasing to the LORD.”​

This describes repentant Israel offering righteous worship again.


These passages are crucial

“In that day” = the moment when Israel finally says yes to her Messiah.


It always follows this pattern:


Step What happens 1Israel is in distress2Messiah appears3Israel repents4Israel is cleansed5Messiah reigns

That is exactly what Zechariah 12–14 lays out in sequence.

Isaiah 11:10–12

“In that day the Root of Jesse shall stand as a banner to the peoples…​

He will gather the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.”​

Messiah reigns
→ Israel is regathered worldwide
→ This has never happened in history before.

Zephaniah 3:14–17

“Sing, O daughter of Zion…​

In that day it shall be said to Jerusalem: ‘Fear not… the LORD is in your midst.’”​

God physically dwells among Israel.

Jeremiah 3:17

“At that time Jerusalem shall be called the throne of the LORD, and all nations shall gather to it.”​

This is the Messianic Kingdom centered in Jerusalem.

Zechariah 12:6–8

“In that day I will make the governors of Judah like a firepan…​

The LORD will defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem.”​

This is Israel winning against overwhelming odds.

Zechariah 14:16

“Everyone who is left of all the nations… shall go up year after year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the Feast of Tabernacles.”​

Gentile nations worship God in Jerusalem.

Isaiah 30:26

“In that day… the LORD binds up the bruise of His people and heals the wound inflicted by His blow.”​

Israel emerges healed after Tribulation.

Isaiah 35:1–2

“The wilderness and the desert shall rejoice… they shall see the glory of the LORD.”​

The land of Israel becomes fertile again.

 

[cv5]

That's right. Not only is it right, its THE ENIRE POINT AND REASON for the Day of the Lord!
"IN THAT DAY"

What's wrong is preterism, historicism, and their ilk.
Which I have proven wrong in devastating overwhelming fashion without even breaking a sweat.
It becomes effortless if you actually care to read and understand your bible.

**********************************************************************

“in that day” (Hebrew bayyōm hahû’) is not just a time marker; it is a technical prophetic phrase for the moment when Israel is broken, repents, and is finally redeemed by her Messiah.


Here are the clearest passages where “in that day” is explicitly tied to Israel’s repentance, cleansing, and restoration.


1) National Repentance
Zechariah 12:10

“And I will pour on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem the Spirit of grace and supplication; then they will look on Me whom they pierced. They will mourn for Him…”​

This is Israel seeing their Messiah and repenting.


2) Cleansing from Sin
Zechariah 13:1

“In that day a fountain shall be opened for the house of David and for the inhabitants of Jerusalem, for sin and for uncleanness.”​

Repentance (12:10)
→ Cleansing (13:1)


This is atonement language — Israel is spiritually washed.


🕊 3) Idolatry Removed
Zechariah 13:2

“In that day… I will cut off the names of the idols from the land… and also remove the prophets and the unclean spirit.”​

Israel becomes spiritually pure again.


4) Messiah Reigns in Jerusalem
Zechariah 14:9

“And the LORD shall be King over all the earth. In that day it shall be: ‘The LORD is one, and His name one.’”​

This is the Messianic Kingdom.


🛡 5) Jerusalem Protected
Zechariah 12:8

“In that day the LORD will defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem…”​

This happens during their repentance — God defends them as they turn to Him.


6) Israel Regathered
Isaiah 27:12–13

“In that day the LORD will thresh… and you will be gathered one by one, O children of Israel…​

And in that day a great trumpet will be blown… and they shall worship the LORD in Jerusalem.”​

This is repentant Israel returning to worship.


7) Spiritual Healing
Isaiah 30:26

“In that day… the LORD binds up the bruise of His people and heals the stroke of their wound.”​

God heals Israel after discipline.


8) Sin Judged, People Purified
Malachi 3:2–4

“He is like a refiner’s fire… He will purify the sons of Levi… Then the offering of Judah and Jerusalem will be pleasing to the LORD.”​

This describes repentant Israel offering righteous worship again.


These passages are crucial

“In that day” = the moment when Israel finally says yes to her Messiah.


It always follows this pattern:


Step What happens 1Israel is in distress2Messiah appears3Israel repents4Israel is cleansed5Messiah reigns

That is exactly what Zechariah 12–14 lays out in sequence.

Isaiah 11:10–12

“In that day the Root of Jesse shall stand as a banner to the peoples…​

He will gather the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.”​

Messiah reigns
→ Israel is regathered worldwide
→ This has never happened in history before.

Zephaniah 3:14–17

“Sing, O daughter of Zion…​

In that day it shall be said to Jerusalem: ‘Fear not… the LORD is in your midst.’”​

God physically dwells among Israel.

Jeremiah 3:17

“At that time Jerusalem shall be called the throne of the LORD, and all nations shall gather to it.”​

This is the Messianic Kingdom centered in Jerusalem.

Zechariah 12:6–8

“In that day I will make the governors of Judah like a firepan…​

The LORD will defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem.”​

This is Israel winning against overwhelming odds.

Zechariah 14:16

“Everyone who is left of all the nations… shall go up year after year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the Feast of Tabernacles.”​

Gentile nations worship God in Jerusalem.

Isaiah 30:26

“In that day… the LORD binds up the bruise of His people and heals the wound inflicted by His blow.”​

Israel emerges healed after Tribulation.

Isaiah 35:1–2

“The wilderness and the desert shall rejoice… they shall see the glory of the LORD.”​

The land of Israel becomes fertile again.

"His people" "the land" "Jerusalem" "daughter of Zion" "O children of Israel"

And the preterists and historicists cannot simply read the text?
Or is the problem RECEIVING/ACCEPTING what the text actually says?

I think the latter.

 

[cv5]

Be careful what you disagree with - if it should happen to be the truth.

In other words, try not to disagree with truth - be very careful lest you do.

No, its definitely not the truth. Never was never will be.

******************************************************************************************

Let’s compare Matthew 24 side-by-side with the Old Testament “IN THAT DAY” passages to see how tightly they lock together.


Once you see this, you realize Matthew 24 is not new prophecy — it is a precision mosaic of the prophets.


What Jesus is doing in Matthew 24

When Jesus spoke the Olivet Discourse (Matthew 24–25), He did three things at once:

1. He quoted Daniel
2. He quoted Isaiah
3. He quoted Zechariah & Joel

All of them used the phrase “in that day” to describe Israel’s final crisis and rescue.


1) Great Tribulation

Jesus:

“Then shall be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world…”
— Matthew 24:21​

Daniel:

“There shall be a time of trouble such as never was since there was a nation…”
— Daniel 12:1​

Zechariah:

“Two-thirds shall be cut off and die… the third shall be refined through fire.”
— Zechariah 13:8–9​

These three are describing the same event.


🌩 2) Cosmic Collapse

Jesus:

“Immediately after the tribulation… the sun will be darkened, the moon will not give its light…”
— Matthew 24:29​

Joel:

“The sun shall be turned to darkness, and the moon to blood, before the great and terrible Day of the LORD.”
— Joel 2:31​

Isaiah:

“The stars… will not give their light… the earth will be shaken.”
— Isaiah 13:9–13​

3) The Messiah Appears

Jesus:

“Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven… and they will see the Son of Man coming…”
— Matthew 24:30​

Zechariah:

“They will look on Me whom they pierced and mourn…”
— Zechariah 12:10​

Same moment — Israel sees Him.


🕊 4) Israel Repents

Jesus:

“All the tribes of the earth will mourn.”
— Matthew 24:30​

Zechariah:

“They shall mourn for Him as one mourns for an only son.”
— Zechariah 12:10–14​

This is national repentance of Israel.


5) Israel Regathered

Jesus:

“He will send His angels… and they will gather His elect from the four winds.”
— Matthew 24:31​

Isaiah:

“In that day a great trumpet will be blown… and they shall come and worship the LORD in Jerusalem.”
— Isaiah 27:13​

Same trumpet. Same regathering.


The sequence is identical

Prophets (“In that day”) Jesus (Matthew 24) Israel besieged Jerusalem surrounded
Great slaughter Great tribulation Cosmic darkness Sun & moon dark
Messiah appears Son of Man appears
Israel mourns Tribes mourn
Israel gathered Elect gathered
Kingdom begins

Jesus did not reinterpret the prophets — He fulfilled their sequence.


This proves something huge

Matthew 24 is not about:

• the Church
• heaven
• a secret rapture

It is about:

Israel’s final crisis → Israel’s repentance → Israel’s Messiah → Israel’s Kingdom​

That is exactly what “IN THAT DAY” always meant in the Hebrew prophets.

 

[cv5]

What you are suggesting is true. Only, remember that the only literal fulfillment of the prophecy would occur in the valley where the scene takes place in the prophecy. Still - I do not know of any occasion when such a battle was recorded in history...

(So - your point is indeed well made.)

Passages where “IN THAT DAY” and “THE DAY OF THE LORD” describe the end-time judgment period that Jesus called the Great Tribulation.


Below is a comprehensive, Scripture-wide map.
These are the passages that define the time of global shaking, Israel’s siege, and God’s direct intervention.


THE DAY OF THE LORD — CORE JUDGMENT TEXTS

These passages explicitly use “Day of the LORD” to describe world-ending judgment.

Isaiah

• Isaiah 2:10–21 — Men hide in caves from God’s terror
• Isaiah 13:6–13 — Heavens shaken, earth moved, wrath poured out
• Isaiah 24:1–23 — Earth utterly broken, few survivors left
• Isaiah 34:1–8 — Global slaughter
• Isaiah 63:1–6 — Messiah treads the winepress of wrath

Joel

• Joel 1:15 — The Day of the LORD is destruction
• Joel 2:1–11 — God’s army devastates the land
• Joel 2:30–31 — Sun darkened, moon to blood
• Joel 3:2–16 — Nations judged in the Valley of Jehoshaphat

Amos

• Amos 5:18–20 — Darkness, not light
• Amos 8:9 — Sun goes dark at noon

Zephaniah

• Zephaniah 1:14–18 — Wrath, distress, trumpet, devastation
• Zephaniah 2:1–3 — Seek the LORD before it comes

Malachi

• Malachi 4:1–5 — Burning judgment before Elijah comes

“IN THAT DAY” — TRIBULATION PASSAGES

These use the phrase “in that day” to describe the same judgment period.

Isaiah

• Isaiah 2:11–21 — People hide in caves
• Isaiah 10:20–23 — Israel barely survives
• Isaiah 13:9–13 — Cosmic shaking
• Isaiah 24:21–23 — Kings punished
• Isaiah 27:1 — Leviathan destroyed

Jeremiah

• Jeremiah 30:5–7 — “The time of Jacob’s trouble”

Ezekiel

• Ezekiel 38:18–23 — God’s fury falls when Israel is invaded

Zechariah

• Zechariah 12:2–9 — Nations attack Jerusalem
• Zechariah 13:8–9 — Two-thirds die
• Zechariah 14:1–7 — Jerusalem captured, then God intervenes

Daniel

• Daniel 12:1 — “Time of trouble such as never was”

How they all connect

Every one of these texts fits this single timeline:

1. Israel surrounded
2. World in chaos
3. Cosmic signs
4. God pours out wrath
5. Nations judged
6. Messiah appears
7. Israel repents
8. Kingdom begins

This is what the prophets called:

“The Day of the LORD”
“In that Day”
“The time of Jacob’s Trouble”
“The Great Tribulation”​

They are the same event.

 

[cv5]

What you are suggesting is true. Only, remember that the only literal fulfillment of the prophecy would occur in the valley where the scene takes place in the prophecy. Still - I do not know of any occasion when such a battle was recorded in history...

(So - your point is indeed well made.)

So now we’ll connect Revelation 6–19 directly to the Old-Testament “Day of the LORD / In-That-Day” framework so we can see that Revelation is not inventing new ideas — it is organizing the prophets.


What Revelation 6–19 actually is

The book of Revelation is a chronological map of:

The Day of the LORD = the Great Tribulation​

Every seal, trumpet, and bowl is simply a different OT prophet being activated.


1) The Sixth Seal — Isaiah & Joel

Revelation 6:12–17

Sun darkened, moon like blood, people hide in caves.​

This is lifted directly from:


Isaiah 2:10–21
Joel 2:30–31


Same imagery. Same moment.
This is the announcement that the Day of the LORD has arrived.


2) Trumpets — Joel & Zephaniah

The trumpet judgments (Rev 8–9) come from:


Joel 2:1–11
Zephaniah 1:14–18

“A day of trumpet and alarm… devastation… fire devours before them…”​

The trumpets are God’s war horns.


3) Bowls — Isaiah & Ezekiel

Revelation 16 (bowls of wrath) is Isaiah + Ezekiel unleashed:


Isaiah 63:1–6
Ezekiel 38–39


God is now personally executing vengeance on the nations.


4) Armageddon — Zechariah

Revelation 16:16; 19:11–21


This is straight from:


Zechariah 14:1–7

“I will gather all the nations against Jerusalem… then the LORD will go forth and fight.”​

🕊 5) Israel Repents

Revelation 1:7; 19:11–15

“Every eye will see Him… those who pierced Him…”​

This comes from:


Zechariah 12:10


Israel sees Messiah and mourns.


6) The Kingdom Begins

Revelation 20–22


This is:


Isaiah 2:2–4; 11; 35; 65
Zechariah 14


Messiah reigns from Jerusalem over all nations.


What we have uncovered

Revelation does not replace the prophets.
It confirms them.


The prophets gave the content.
Revelation gives the timeline.


Everything we’ve been studying about:

• “in that day”
• the Day of the LORD
• Jacob’s Trouble
• Israel’s repentance

…is the backbone of Revelation 6–19.

 

[Lifted_by_the_word]

Game set match friend.....

Isa 11:11
And it shall come to pass in that day, that the Lord shall set his hand again the ***second time*** to recover the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria, and from Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea.

Isa 11:12
And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.

Isa 12:1
And in that day thou shalt say, O LORD, I will praise thee: though thou wast angry with me, thine anger is turned away, and thou comfortedst me.

Sorry,I still see spiritual Israel.The way I see it,and it's so simple that it blows my mind that some who we come to have a disagreement with on scripture/prophecy will resort to calling us antisemitic, or use the term replacement theology as a defense mechanism.
God's plan was to bring all things unto himself,that which was "fallen" or corrupted by sin.He reconciles all things onto himself through the blood of his cross.So in all things seen and unseen they will consist through him by spirit,water,blood
The law(water) was given to the Israelites of the OT, and in the NT the gentiles were were grafted in,or given the kingdom of heaven(blood.)
the Israelites and gentiles are as one like the covenants are as one.

And you can see the foreshadowing of all this through...the Israel of old!
Israel is set apart as a remnant of Gods greater plan to save man.
Within Israel itself is another remnant,who are the Levites.
Us Christians who go out and preach the word of God are like the Levites who were instructed to be as priests to the rest of Israel.
In fact this remnant within Israel is where the promise was fulfilled.God always has had a faithful remnant throughout history so he has kept his promise to his faithful remnant.
What was the remnant Levites inheritance?
God! he was their inheritance and it was given/restored to them through the Holy Spirit.